I honestly don't understand why any BS would stay.

[NoC]

Please please explain to me why a BS would stay with a WS. Kids cannot be an excuse, so what is the reason to stay? Your WS has disrespected you in the worst possible way, and you decide to stay? Those who advocate R after DDay I have to disagree sorry. I think it shows a lack of self-respect no matter what justification you use. I'm a firm believer in walking away after any form of infidelity even an EA.

 

Discuss.

[toolforgrowth]

I agree with you 100%. However, not everybody sees things the way we do. And that's okay. Different strokes, and all.

 

I kicked my xWW out of my life faster than you could spell relief. But some WS's are genuinely remorseful and put out all the necessary work to safely reconcile. I believe they're very rare, but it can happen.

 

The path that's right for us isn't the path that's right for everybody.

[fellini]

I have never actually heard that their exists BS'S who are advocates of R.

 

Books on surviving infidelity, but not here in LS.

 

What I have read here, and experienced for myself is that the decision to R is extremely personal, based entirely on the case in question and a number of variables incomprehensible to most, and not on a general advocacy.

 

But I will grant you that while the the decision to R is entirely individual, the "infidelity is a deal breaker" value is one which for some reason, in LS, is considered not a personal one by many here and rather than being mere advice takes on a level of imposition. It's as if a BS who chooses to end a marriage has made the right choice, and those who do not, need to defend their choice.

 

Your discourse is an example of this. What is good for you is the what you expect from us all.

 

Not everyone here (example Badkarma) bullies BS'S who choose to R, but we all know what a deal breaking BS is up to when he starts to tell a BS about body parts, tongues, and sh**t like that in a WW'S vagina, and uses all kinds of aggressive talk in their posts to trigger the BS.

 

I think it would be fair to say that respect for those who divorced - even from those like myself who did not choose that route - is much higher than the reverse.

 

 

 

Please please explain to me why a BS would stay with a WS. Kids cannot be an excuse, so what is the reason to stay? Your WS has disrespected you in the worst possible way, and you decide to stay? Those who advocate R after DDay I have to disagree sorry. I think it shows a lack of self-respect no matter what justification you use. I'm a firm believer in walking away after any form of infidelity even an EA.

 

Discuss.

Edited January 20, 2015 by fellini

[Lula Belle]

There are different reasons for different BS's. Not an easy decision at all for many. And even out of those who initially stay, some go on to divorce anyways.

 

An affair is not just the sign of a broken relationship, but ultimately of a broken person. The WS chose to lie and sneak around and try to keep their family and have some on the side. For the BS, it often blows up their entire world when the facts come out. Because often the WS is doing a great job manipulating the BS. Realizing you married a cheater is devastating. And having to shake things up further in the aftermath may not be right for everyone. Moving? Selling the home? Everything else that goes along with it? It's complicated.

[fellini]

If I ever stayed because of the KIDS, it would be a reason, not an excuse.

 

Unless you have children of your own, unless you have an incredible relationship with these children, and unless you have been betrayed in the context of a good marriage, I wouldn't expect you to understand this.

 

And that's okay, I definitely don't need a stranger like you to tell me what is a reason or an excuse, how to be a father to my child, and you don't need me to tell you you should run if your SO cheats on you. Not one bit.

 

As an unmarried fatherless man I might even think like you - not necessarily for the same reasons. But I'm not. So I see the world through a different set of lenses and I'm cool with that. I love my life, I love my wife, and I love my daughter. I'll live with the pain she has inflicted upon us, because it's what I want, for myself. If one day I decide to get up and leave, I'll do that too. If you want to call that a lack of self-respect I think you need to reconsider what you mean by self-respect.

 

Self-respect is the most important thing I have going as I move through R.

 

 

 

Please please explain to me why a BS would stay with a WS. Kids cannot be an excuse, so what is the reason to stay? Your WS has disrespected you in the worst possible way, and you decide to stay? Those who advocate R after DDay I have to disagree sorry. I think it shows a lack of self-respect no matter what justification you use. I'm a firm believer in walking away after any form of infidelity even an EA.

 

Discuss.

Edited January 20, 2015 by fellini

[elaine567]

Please please explain to me why a BS would stay with a WS. Kids cannot be an excuse, so what is the reason to stay? Your WS has disrespected you in the worst possible way, and you decide to stay? Those who advocate R after DDay I have to disagree sorry. I think it shows a lack of self-respect no matter what justification you use. I'm a firm believer in walking away after any form of infidelity even an EA.

 

Discuss.

 

Because not all see infidelty as a deal breaker in the same way as you do.

 

Because some see marriage as an institution that survives, despite all.

 

Because some are co dependent, they see no life outside the marriage, so will tolerate anything thrown their way, no matter how bad it may be.

 

Because some are in denial, their wonderful spouse must have been seduced by the nasty OW/OM, so they see their spouse as a victim and not the perpetrator.

 

Because for some marriage is more about financial security, or a base for the children, than actual "love" or sexual fidelity. Some will put up with just about anything as long as the bills are paid.

 

Because some NEED to be married, their career, status, place in the community may hinge on the persona of the married, family man/woman.

 

Because some live happily in sexless marriages and are thus not put out greatly if the other strays for sex, there is no sexual jealousy complicating matters. The fact the WS cares enough to stay and reconcile is fine.

 

Because some BSs are also cheating, so are just so grateful that Dday took the heat off of them and onto their totally despicable, cheating partner!

[purplesorrow]

Both decisions are difficult. Both decisions take strength. My WH didn't just disrespect me, he disrespected himself and his realization of that is more punishment than I could ever inflict. He lives daily with the knowledge that he took away our innocence and has changed us forever. He knows he can never get that back no matter what he does. I can respect the fact that he has worked hard to regain his integrity and once again be a man that he is proud of. That he is anguished that man he thought he was didn't keep him from making life altering poor choices. I am proud of his work and progress. At the end of the day, this is my mirror. When I look in it, I like the reflection of a strong compassionate woman who's honor is still very much intact. Funny thing about that mirror, I only see me in it. Not you or society telling me what I should see. I chose to try to stay because I wanted to and because I could.

[No Limit]

I agree with you except for one point - kids are indeed the main reason people stay together, no matter how hopeless it seems. Or at least they convince themselves that that's their true reason.

[purplesorrow]

Because not all see infidelty as a deal breaker in the same way as you do.

 

Because some see marriage as an institution that survives, despite all.

 

Because some are co dependent, they see no life outside the marriage, so will tolerate anything thrown their way, no matter how bad it may be.

 

Because some are in denial, their wonderful spouse must have been seduced by the nasty OW/OM, so they see their spouse as a victim and not the perpetrator.

 

Because for some marriage is more about financial security, or a base for the children, than actual "love" or sexual fidelity. Some will put up with just about anything as long as the bills are paid.

 

Because some NEED to be married, their career, status, place in the community may hinge on the persona of the married, family man/woman.

 

Because some live happily in sexless marriages and are thus not put out greatly if the other strays for sex, there is no sexual jealousy complicating matters. The fact the WS cares enough to stay and reconcile is fine.

 

Because some BSs are also cheating, so are just so grateful that Dday took the heat off of them and onto their totally despicable, cheating partner!

 

Is this speculation or experience?

[SycamoreCircle]

Someone please do a quick rundown of all these abbreviations:

 

WW

BS

 

I know a few of them, but LS needs a decoder ring.

[waterwoman]

Please please explain to me why a BS would stay with a WS. Kids cannot be an excuse, so what is the reason to stay? Your WS has disrespected you in the worst possible way, and you decide to stay? Those who advocate R after DDay I have to disagree sorry. I think it shows a lack of self-respect no matter what justification you use. I'm a firm believer in walking away after any form of infidelity even an EA.

 

Discuss.

 

Discuss what? Your rather offensively simplistic opinion? Nothing to discuss really as you don't seem open to other POVs " I think it shows a lack of self-respect no matter what justification you use." So what's the point of trying to explain?

[Jesuischarlie]

After 4 D days BS said 'I will do whatever it takes to keep this family together'. She was using super glue. She saw it as a sacrifice I guess. But she lost her kids' respect and so did he. So was it worth it?

[No Limit]

Someone please do a quick rundown of all these abbreviations:

 

WW

BS

 

I know a few of them, but LS needs a decoder ring.

 

WW = wayward wife

BS = betrayed spouse

 

You're welcome.

[purplesorrow]

After 4 D days BS said 'I will do whatever it takes to keep this family together'. She was using super glue. She saw it as a sacrifice I guess. But she lost her kids' respect and so did he. So was it worth it?

 

Considering you assisted in helping her become a betrayed wife, your view of the situation is a little biased. And it doesn't matter what she chose, she couldn't force him to stay.

[fellini]

Hmmmm. After 4 days, i would have thought the WS would be saying: "I will do whatever it takes to keep this family together."

 

If I had been the one to say that, I'd say I misspoke: I was was always already doing everything that needed to be done to keep the family together, it was the WS who was not.

 

 

 

After 4 D days BS said 'I will do whatever it takes to keep this family together'. She was using super glue. She saw it as a sacrifice I guess. But she lost her kids' respect and so did he. So was it worth it?

[road]

Please please explain to me why a BS would stay with a WS. ..................................................... I'm a firm believer in walking away after any form of infidelity even an EA.

 

Discuss.

 

 

 

 

Ann Landers and Dear Abby both told their readers that wanted to know if they should divorce wrote the question that they need to ask themselves are you better off with them or without them in your life.

 

 

Which was a simple worded question. Though what was told to the reader that you have to take in weigh everything before you make the decision.

 

 

Your mindset does not allow for that. So pointing out the thought process in further detail is pointless because your mind is closed.

[gettingstronger]

I think you won't know what you would do until it happens to you-I know before it happened to me, I didn't judge my friends that decided to reconcile after their husbands infidelity, I just felt badly they were going through so much-

 

As for the notion the BS can MAKE the WS stay-thats just silly- reconciliation is a very difficult process, it takes lots of self reflection and its painful. Sure, there is hysterical bonding (crazy, amazing sex) but there is also lots of hard work and the conversations are gut wrenching-

[BetrayedH]

I chose to stay because I saw my WW's decision to have an affair as one that came from a broken place. I saw her as a broken person. And I loved her. I didn't see it as a time to abandon her and the marriage but as a time to help fix her and the marriage. I saw Dday as the 'bad times' that are mentioned in our vows and I wasn't quick to toss my marriage; I saw it as a time for me to step up.

 

I still do think of my wife as a broken person. And I think being broken is a forgivable offense. That said, my wife didn't see herself as broken and there's certainly nothing I can do to help fix her when that's the case; she would have needed to own that process.

 

What didn't help was that I was clearly a rookie about reconciling after infidelity. I didn't realize that my "soft" stance would encourage her to keep up the wayward behaviors (trickle-truthing, minimizing, breaking NC, etc). It also didn't help that my wife feigned remorse. The lack of accurate and complete information can put the BS at a real disadvantage.

 

Looking at it in hindsight, a lot of my motivation was also a form of damage control for me. While she'd been thinking of separation/divorce for a year or two, I got hit with it all out of the blue. I didn't just suddenly decide to embrace losing my wife, marriage, and kids when every decision I'd made for nearly 20 years had been about building a family. It takes time to process and my first instinct wasn't to toss the family but to save it.

 

Judge me for trying to reconcile if you like but frankly, I'm proud of that decision and stand behind it. I had a deep commitment to my wife and marriage and saw divorce as the last choice, not the first one. Ultimately, my wife was not truly remorseful and divorce became necessary. I don't regret that choice either. I just made a lot of mistakes inbetween and a lot of that was due to the lack of a handbook.

 

As for my self-respect, it has stayed intact. I made some decisions that I'm not proud of (I was broken in some ways as well) but the decision to attempt reconciliation is not one of my regrets. The reality is that my wife's infidelity was entirely about her and nothing to do with me. I think you'd be wise not to conflate the two issues.

[fellini]

Awesome. It's for posts like these that i haven't bailed on my commitment to continue through R, nor entirely give up on LS. Thanks for THAT!

 

 

I chose to stay because I saw my WW's decision to have an affair as one that came from a broken place. I saw her as a broken person. And I loved her. I didn't see it as a time to abandon her and the marriage but as a time to help fix her and the marriage. I saw Dday as the 'bad times' that are mentioned in our vows and I wasn't quick to toss my marriage; I saw it as a time for me to step up.

 

I still do think of my wife as a broken person. And I think being broken is a forgivable offense. That said, my wife didn't see herself as broken and there's certainly nothing I can do to help fix her when that's the case; she would have needed to own that process.

 

What didn't help was that I was clearly a rookie about reconciling after infidelity. I didn't realize that my "soft" stance would encourage her to keep up the wayward behaviors (trickle-truthing, minimizing, breaking NC, etc). It also didn't help that my wife feigned remorse. The lack of accurate and complete information can put the BS at a real disadvantage.

 

Looking at it in hindsight, a lot of my motivation was also a form of damage control for me. While she'd been thinking of separation/divorce for a year or two, I got hit with it all out of the blue. I didn't just suddenly decide to embrace losing my wife, marriage, and kids when every decision I'd made for nearly 20 years had been about building a family. It takes time to process and my first instinct wasn't to toss the family but to save it.

 

Judge me for trying to reconcile if you like but frankly, I'm proud of that decision and stand behind it. I had a deep commitment to my wife and marriage and saw divorce as the last choice, not the first one. Ultimately, my wife was not truly remorseful and divorce became necessary. I don't regret that choice either. I just made a lot of mistakes inbetween and a lot of that was due to the lack of a handbook.

 

As for my self-respect, it has stayed intact. I made some decisions that I'm not proud of (I was broken in some ways as well) but the decision to attempt reconciliation is not one of my regrets. The reality is that my wife's infidelity was entirely about her and nothing to do with me. I think you'd be wise not to conflate the two issues.

[DKT3]

Before I would always say "I would never take back a woman who cheats on me" hell women out number men almost 2-1 on earth why would I need a cheater?

 

Life is more complicated then that. Of course I divorced my wife, but having kids meant she would always be a part of my life. With that being said, as you spend time with this person you still see the things that you once loved (in my cased still loved) in their actions. Having the kids ask stuff like why don't you live with us, or why don't you love mommy can wear you down emotionally. Watching her do so much to change and coming a long way.

 

humans are flawed, because of that life isn't lineal. We have to take detours and do the best we can to find our way back down the right road. With TRUE understanding compassion and love cheating can be a catalyst to a better relationship, not one I would endorse, but one non the less.

 

At the end of the day, we all want to be loved, but truly loving someone means accepting their flaws being willing to work through their mistakes and being there for them when they fall.

[Friskyone4u]

There are so many people that will make the statement to the world and their spouse that infidelity is a deal breaker who when it happens to them cannot act on that statement. There are probably too many reasons to list but I guess kids, finances, fear of the unknown, and co dependency are among the major reasons.

If you have read the book Not Just Friends, it explains why when a woman has an affair it is more likely to be a deal breaker because she is usually emotionally involved to a much greater degree and checked out of the marriage. That would explain why we read thread after thread about the "fog" and breaking NC and still wanting to be friiends with OM that breakers up more marriages than the actual sex. Don't see too many men on here just miserable without OW once the sex stops.

To me , women are the much stronger sex in dealing with infidelity. It amazes me how many women, some of them SAHM with no viable means of support , stand strong and throw their husbands out or immediately go to the anger stage and set the boundaries for R. Despite the macho talk I keep reading threads from me who are doing the begging, pleading, and every other behavior that almost insures the WW will not respond and stop the affair.

Bottom line, don't make statement that you can t be sure you will stick to. The reaction to infidelity is one that speculation of what you would do hardly ever matches what actually happens

[elaine567]

hell women out number men almost 2-1 on earth .

 

where did you get that figure from?

Population, female (% of total) | Data | Table

[Sub]

In the weeks after D-Day, I swung dramatically from being set on D to wanting to show her as much love as possible to make it work. Once things settled down and I was able to gain perspective on the situation in its entirety, it came down to three things:

1. Want. It was what I wanted. I wanted her, at least the "her" that I knew, or the potential to be more. I guess it was out off spite, but once I became more self-reliant and emboldened by the **** that had just been thrown at me, I realized I didn't want other people's actions or screw-ups to affect what I wanted. So I went after it. Kind of a middle finger to the OM and the WW version of the woman I loved.

2. BECAUSE of the kid, not necessarily FOR the kid. We were/are great parents, and we have a great kid. I mean, an awesome kid. I watched him come into this world, and if we were never in love with each other again as H/W, I would always love her for the mother she is, and vice versa. (It's actually become a turn-on for both of us.) He was a stabilizing force for each of us when it looked bleak, kind of a bridge on our way back to each other.

3. The desire to trust her. We had been together 17 years, built a life, had a kid. I knew I would have some sort of relationship with her going forward. I felt the need to trust her again in some capacity. If I didn't R, and she went off with the OM, I don't think that would have happened.

[Confused48]

How about this:

 

Lets assume it was an otherwise happy marriage of an otherwise perfect couple. Lets assume that you have a 100% truly remorseful WS that is 100% NC with the fAP. The WS has done the hard work of finding the flaw in themselves that caused this to happen. Lets also say there has been no blame shifting and plenty of effort to repair the hurt caused in the manner tailored to be most effective to this BS and this situation.

 

Lets also assume that there are small children, parents, pets, houseplants, and a career/source of income that would all be irreparably harmed by a failure to reconcile.

 

Lets also assume that the BS is a very compassionate person, full of loving kindness toward everyone, resulting from a very good childhood. Lets also assume a very secure BS, that does not feel threatened themselves by the bad behaviour of their WS, does not feel second best to anyone in the WS life and so can truly put this incident into perspective.

 

In this case, and in many lesser combinations of the above factors, I can see a BS taking back a WS and to then go on to live as full and happy a married life as any other married couple. Certainly happier than a divorced person living alone.

 

I have not read the responses so forgive me if I am duplicating here.

[Midwestmissy]

I'm struggling deeply the last few days - trying to heal myself is not linear. I love my h, I have for almost 30yrs and I'm not 50 yet. He's the only man I've ever loved. Dated lots, had loads of fun with other men, but only loved this one and kept my vows. My decision isn't spiritual or anything. I'm not ready for this to be over. I battle between 'he ruined a 30 yr relationship' and 'maybe this is a big blip in an otherwise awesome relationship'. It's a lot of mental gymnastics. I also know that the a is over, the mow is gone and not coming back and my h wants to reconcile. Those are facts, if I was unsure about any of that, I might feel differently.

 

His a has gutted me. I'm trying to figure out what's best for me. I can see myself thriving without a husband, I'm very strong. But he didn't leave me for the ow, so I have a choice to stay or go. And right now, 4 mos after finding out the whole truth, 13 mos after the trickle truth started, I want to give the marriage a shot. Is that the right answer? Who knows. But it's where I am now. I've never felt pain like what I have, maybe that's clouding the judgment. I have kids who have begged me to try mc and try to make this work, and I promised them I would.

 

I always swore cheating was a deal breaker. Always. It's just another slice of humble pie I'm eating. Will h do the necessary work to heal the marriage? It's on him, and that will determine my path down the road.