Serious relationship with someone who speaks ESL?

[Pawstruck]

Hi all. Ran out of space in the title... I mean ESL to mean English as their Second Language. Here's the synopsis (I'll give the short version and you guys can ask questions if you want):

 

About two months ago, my wife of four years ended our marriage in a single night. No conversation at all, just a note. She had decided to have an affair, and to divorce me for this other man without even giving me the courtesy of a single sit-down. (The night before, I'd have said our marriage was pretty close to perfect; there were zero warning signs, and I'm not a moron).

 

Anyway. So that happened. Feel free to ask questions and/or make judgmental trolly remarks.

 

So I get onto a dating website about 3 weeks after without telling anyone. I figure everyone will give me the token, "It's too soon," "take time to heal, you nutjob," and "you're not ready for a relationship yet." Yeah, yeah.

 

Anyhow, the pith of the situation is this: I met a young lady who I find to be very attractive in every way. She's a Peruvian dentist (not a dental tech; a dentist) at age 24. The path to full dental credential in Peru is evidently a bit shorter than in the U.S. Unlike my ex-wife and I, this new girl shares several interests with me. She currently lives in Canada, about 8 hour's drive from me.

 

After some investigation (the word "catfish" comes to mind...), I think she's the real deal. Yes, I've video-chatted with her, and she's who she says she is. In fact, we've been talking on skype almost every night for about 2 weeks. I've scheduled a short weekend trip to go see her at the end of this month, because, f*** it, I do what I want.

 

Only one real question remains for me: English is her second language. Obviously, Spanish is native in Peru. (She also speaks Japanese which, while hot as hell, doesn't help me out much). Does anyone have experience or know someone with experience dating/marrying someone who speaks a different native tongue?

 

She speaks English quite proficiently, with some mistakes here and there of course. The thing is... well, let's just say that my profession is in academia, and basically requires me to speak and write with mastery. (Don't judge me based on how I write on a dating forum! Hah.) I'm also a very... philosophical-type thinker. I like to linger and think deeply.

 

Of course, my real wonder is whether or not we can have these kinds of deep conversations. So I gave it a few tries. While it's obvious that the girl is blindingly intelligent (her memory is incredible), some of it gets lost in translation. She's even admitted something I suspected: That she has more to say sometimes, but can't or doesn't want to because of the effort in converting it to English.

 

On this latter thought, I've encouraged her to try a bit harder.

 

Also, I am proficient with language in general (I learned Greek fairly easily), and have always been interested in Spanish since taking it in grade school. So I can learn Espanol, but probably not faster-than or as well-as she can learn English.

 

It's less of a dilemma and more of a "serious question." I have no idea what to expect. I love learning other cultures, and the idea of literally learning how to communicate together sounds romantic and intensely intimate. Unless, of course, it's a fantasy, and all we'll really get is confusion and frustration.

 

What I really care about, at this point in my life after such a huge betrayal, is a woman who is dedicated, caring, and self-aware. She seems to be all of those things... but I've never encountered a language barrier before!

 

Thoughts???

[mightycpa]

A characteristic of human communications is that ideas are expressed at the same rate universally.... however, the words of different languages express ideas at different rates, so languages that need more words to express ideas sound "fast" and languages that need fewer words to express ideas sound "slow".

 

This contributes to the difficulty, because you learn to express yourself in your native language, and that dictates the way that you learn to both think and speak.

 

That said, I know two people from decades of close personal experience, both of whom are not native English speakers. One cannot get an idea out edgewise - even today, I sometimes have no idea what in the world she's talking about. And she's my mother.

 

The other one has a funny way of expressing some thoughts, but she's quite thoughtful and while she does have some difficulty expressing her thoughts sometimes, she finds a way to communicate her ideas. Sometimes it is through an apt metaphor, sometimes, it takes on a somewhat frustrating back-and-forth effort. She's my mother-in-law.

 

The ideas generally won't be an issue, but you probably won't ever get the King's English, either.

[Gaeta]

What ESL has to do with your post?

 

English isn't my native language so yes I experience all the time dating people with a different native language.

 

You have to decide what is your top priority in a mate. Personally I don't need to have deep philosophical conversations with my mate. I have that with my friends or siblings that like me have a little analytic mind. If for you it's one of your top priority then with time her limitation will annoy you. Right now it doesn't because she is cute and mysterious but in 2-3 years down the road you might suffer from her language limitation.

 

Let me give you an example. One of my exs was English. His knowledge of the English language was impressive and he expressed himself very eloquently. When we met he thought my French accent was so cute and sexy. Fast forward 3 years and he'd say things to me like: Why the heck does it take you so long to explain something in English!! and he'd roll his eyes at me. He would correct my English and if he had to correct me more than once on the same mistake he'd sigh and show impatience.

 

So ya! if it's already a question mark for you chances are it will become a problem with time.

Edited February 6, 2015 by Gaeta

[Haydn]

Take the time to learn her language. I`ve done it with languages that are supposed to be impenetrable.

[Gaeta]

oops sorry just figured out the ESL.

It's very similar to the English Sign Language acronym.

 

See, I have been speaking English for 25 years and details like this escape me all the time.

[mightycpa]

oops sorry just figured out the ESL.

It's very similar to the English Sign Language acronym.

 

See, I have been speaking English for 25 years and details like this escape me all the time.

 

That was my first thought too. I was going to tell him that when deaf girls sign an orgasm, it is interesting, but not really as hot as hearing her say the same words.

[Pawstruck]

LOL mightycpa.

 

There seems to be a lot of mixed opinion on this question. I did do some research before just running here to make a brand new post on the topic. About half of the people say "It's no big deal, it's an obstacle that can be overcome," while others say something like, "thanks, but no thanks."

 

I suppose it also depends on a person's capacity to learn language.

 

By the way, I hate to be catty, but I did explain the "ESL" acronym in the very first line of my post. I understand the OP was long, but this would seem to be an issue of diligence rather than comprehension.

[Gaeta]

By the way, I hate to be catty, but I did explain the "ESL" acronym in the very first line of my post. I understand the OP was long, but this would seem to be an issue of diligence rather than comprehension.

 

You better get used to diligence and comprehension issues if you want to date this lady. I read your title, ESL meant 1 thing to me (English Sign Language). I read your first sentence and understood your lady was not a native English speaker, I continued reading expecting you tell us she is deaf.

 

You will come across these often and not only caused by language but also cause by cultural differences.

 

Are you sure you are ready for this? You already sound impatient to me.

[Ninjainpajamas]

I think it depends on the type of person you are and what kind of expectations you have in a romantic relationship.

 

For myself, I believe in a more...dare I say "spiritual" type of connection, basically it's something undefined but very apparent and magnetic. I am attracted to very strong intangible connections on a level that you just get with some people, a familiarity and comfort that hurdles over those uncomfortably "normal" obstacles quickly that you would otherwise expect to be present by default. It's something I know well within myself and feel strongly connected with and can sense in other potential romantic partners.

 

Therefore for myself, I see language as a mere tool of communication and not of the utmost importance. However I also feel the the same way about education...a means to an end, not the source of enlightenment and knowledge within itself.

 

I feel you are already being critical of her, despite her attempts of having to go through the additional channel and challenge of attempting to express herself articulately through a "foreign" language, which is obviously no easy task. I feel you should rather be enlightened or charmed, rather than dismissive...appreciative at the least.

 

It's often easy to underestimate and dismiss how difficult that can be be at times, in foiling attempts to not only translate your emotions into appropriate meanings but also conveying feelings themselves.

 

I think based on your "attitude" at this moment you are not an ideal match. You seem to be someone who prides himself on an asset she does not acquire merely by a roll of the dice on planet earth.

 

Not to say as an overly expressive person myself communication is not important, I find communication to be an essential tool in conveying my feelings and thoughts, so I can relate to that aspect of things and find it essential to be able to express myself within a relationship. However to me words are not the only tool, and there are certain things that words could ever explain but can be shown. I still struggle to articulate my deepest thoughts and emotions in a way that I feel they are felt instead of just read, and that I feel are satisfactory for my expectations.

 

Maybe you are not intending to be judgmental or offensive in your post, rather than just merely being naive and a bit dimwitted in your assessment. But it is a bit offensive to presume that her lack of perfection in a language could imply that she is less philosophically inclined and unable to share deep and meaningful thoughts other than having an elephant memory. Yes, she may lack the skills to articulate herself the way she intends to but that is not representative of who she would be if she were speaking her own native language.

 

I've dated women from different backgrounds/cultures, where they were speaking English as a second language. There can be confusion, there can be misunderstandings and there will be, there can be different expectations and interpretations of things not from just a communication level but from cultural as well, but for myself it's never really taken away from the relationship, for myself they are minor obstacles. However I do think it's an additional challenge you need to be open to and expect as a casual circumstance that may pop up from time to time, it does obviously take more effort in that respect than it would with a native English speaker growing up in the same culture, but that should IMO be something you already expect and basically embrace rather than be guarded with caution.

 

But you haven't even met the woman yet, you're a bit ahead of yourself in the dating picture side of things.

 

And it also goes without saying that was a screwed up thing that happened to you in your marriage.

[Pawstruck]

Are you sure you are ready for this? You already sound impatient to me.

 

Are you sure you're not just annoyed because I called you out on something? If she had an attitude like this every time I had to say "I'm sorry, but we've not understood each other" then yes, I could see it being an issue.

[mightycpa]

You better get used to diligence and comprehension issues if you want to date this lady. I read your title, ESL meant 1 thing to me (English Sign Language). I read your first sentence and understood your lady was not a native English speaker

 

this is when I got that ESL did not mean deaf. Nevertheless, I was able to work in the orgasm joke.

 

[Divasu]

Does anyone have experience or know someone with experience dating/marrying someone who speaks a different native tongue?

 

I know someone! My cousin's wife is from South America (Argentina, I think...) but she spoke no English when they met.

 

I recall when they first dated, they barely spoke two words with one another except calling each other "mi amore" back-and-forth.

 

They have been married a few years now (I believe she used Rosetta Stone to help her learn English and she can now speak English quite fluently). So, they made it through the language barrier.

[No Limit]

Don't worry about the language. English is my second/third language and, well, I guess it depends on how you speak too. I had no trouble at all communicating with people in London but when I met a random American at our local club he spoke in a way I could barely figure out at all (although he obviously understood me perfectly). Just don't make a face if she asks you to repeat something a little more slowly, and above all: talking louder isn't any help at all when repeating something!

 

As for the rest; geez, what a wife you had.

 

Had. Again, chemistry doesn't depend on language. Have fun with your maybe-new-GF.

[Eternal Sunshine]

I dunno. English is my second language and I don't have trouble expressing my deepest thoughts - so it is possible. I still make some grammar mistakes and perhaps don't always use the optimal word for something but then many native English speakers do the same.