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I want to date people who judge others based on more than just their first 2-3 texts. Not in the context where, if you don't come out thing-a-swingin', you're seen as low interest, or an indecisive person, or whatever else. No, this, to me, is just absurd, I'm sorry to say. What's even the point in wanting to date someone who can't even muster the patience to see what you have to say for more than two texts? Someone who's decided in their opinion of you based on 5 minutes of interaction? Someone who's supposedly so interested in me that they clung to me for an entire night while I was wasted and crying with my friend for her loss, but they can't see this one conversation through because the first words on her screen weren't "let's go out."

@Repentant Do you want to be right or do you want a date? We're not arguing with you because we want to "win." We're trying to show you a way to be more successful in your dating endeavors.

She didn't even give me the chance. C'mon, judging a person when they've had the space to give you so little based on which to judge them is patently absurd...

That's my point, it's barely been two texts, that's, like, 5 minutes total to type, send, receive, and read, we're five minutes into our interaction, five minutes which have been spread over three days, because she's taking an entire evolutionary age to reply with another 30-second line of text, which would then lead to a reply of my own, which would contain an invite to go out. That'd make it 10 minutes total, if one's a slow typer at that. I mean, seriously, if by putting the question third or fourth in line instead of first is enough to indicate a complete lack of interest on my part, then this genuinely kinda' scares me, I'll be perfectly honest... That's IF she had any interest to begin with, which, again, doubtful given how the situation is (not) progressing. Or, back to my first point, scary if she did have any interest, but this was enough to put her off. I agree with you, I'm not a person who oozes self-confidence by any means! But in this case in particular, the only reason why I hesitated at all was because the people who know her better than I do have told me she's a known flirt. I didn't want to rev up my engine for nothing. And it's not because I fear rejection, it's because I see no point in losing bets.

Yeah, after you basically showed her that you had no romantic interest in her and instead either wanted to be something like buddies or were just keeping her as an option, of course she eventually ghosted you.

Not at all. Everyone is telling you that you should have asked her out instead. Did you actually read what we wrote? Sorry, dude, but that’s just bullshit. She didn’t “flake”, she was understandably feeling disappointed that you didn’t ask her out. You really don’t understand that your hesitation has nothing to do with patience and everything to do with insecurity?

It was either that, or raw SMS, I don't touch Meta's stuff on principle.

But... like... that's what I've been saying, I was about to, but she pulled the ghost! I've been left on Seen for 30 hours now, what else could I do in this case?

This right here might seem like a small thing but it's actually big. You made a whole new social media entirely for this woman you hardly know, rather than just being straight and saying "oh cool I dont have insta unfortunately but Ill shoot you a whatsapp!" It seems like everything is bending over backwards to accommodate her, and you see yourself as almost an annoyance or inconvenience, to the point that you wait a week to text because you're scared texting quickly would bother or annoy her, when in fact its more likely she would just move on and forget the moment on the night out. Regardless of how interested or not this woman was that mindset will cause your problems.

I sort of knew you’d eventually say something like this. That’s exactly why I tried to point out to you that the way you view these things points to a lack of interest on your part. If you really liked that girl you’d be actively asking her out instead of stalling and over-analyzing her replies. Overthinking is unattractive because it is rightfully perceived as a lack of decisiveness and courage. Women don’t like men who play it safe and hide behind some made-up rules to justify their hesitation. As they say, fortune favors the brave.

Just to add my final two cents: I sent two texts, and everyone's behaving as though I've been spamming her with trivia for the past three days... She flaked after the first message, I'd say this is a clear indication she was just messing around on Saturday and I happened to be in the way. I'm sorry, but I can't agree with you. I most certainly wouldn't start pulling a fade on someone who's trying to spark a conversation with me and in whom I'm supposedly interested, lest we forget, just because their second text wasn't "let's go out." And if this is the style of the times, then no, thanks. I say again, patience is important to me, and this only goes to demonstrate a complete lack of such.

Fine, then I guess this whole thing isn't for me, because it sure as hell feels like a total mess. If you do too much too soon, it's bad. If you take your time, it's bad. If you do just enough, you find out you were barking up the wrong tree all along. It's just endless frustration with zero return on investment. Yep, think I'm done.

No, what’s ridiculous is that you keep texting her random stuff instead of asking her out. What “chance” could you possibly need beyond her flirtatious behavior, her giving you her number, and her actually taking the time to reply to your passive and hesitant messages?! Dude, we’re going in circles. And you still refuse to listen to what four different people are trying to tell you.

Oh, boy, am I!:)) But, to be fair, the only points I've overthought have been reaching out in the first place, and now this post-mortem:)) Everything else has been organic, "what I feel like doing" stuff. I do have control over my overthinking, usually use it more as an analytical tool when trying to dissect situations, otherwise I mostly go with my gut.

Your overthinking. Are you prone to that in other areas of your life?

I'm sorry, I'm not exactly sure to what aspect you're referring. Are you referring to my overthinking this whole thing?

Sorry for double-posting, I just remembered something which further goes to my point about it having been pretty clear that I'm interested: I made an Instagram account that very night, specifically to accommodate her - she mentioned she prefers Insta as her main tool for comms, and I begrudgingly made an account. Solely for her, no other interest in that platform whatsoever.

Oh, that means pretty much nothing around here... I understand what you're saying, but eeeveryone has an Insta around here, and eeeveryone shares their Insta. Same with phone numbers, except people don't usually bother with those, because they have Insta.

Exactly, we're two replies in, I didn't even get the chance to! C'mon, now, three texts each is not an unreasonably long starter conversation, nor a droning launch pad for asking out, this is ridiculous... Ok, this I understand is a "me and my rhythm" problem, got it! Dunno how I'll go about it, because it feels very forced, but ok! If I weren't interested in her, I wouldn't have bothered giving her my number/asking for hers, let alone reach out after three days trying to make conversation. Realistically speaking. As for the point about the flirting, as @ExpatInItaly has stated from the start, that can just as well mean absolutely nothing. And it most certainly seems to be the case, because, while I understand your point about how not launching directly into asking her out doesn't indicate a lot of outright and directed interest, I don't see how a well-meaning intro to a conversation would be enough to convince someone that there's no interest there. Seriously, it just seems like such an overreaction to me if that were the case. Like... you like the guy (in this case, if she had, indeed, flirted with me because she was interested in more than just warming herself up that night, that would have meant that she LIKED me given how much she did), maybe he's slower, maybe he's cautious, maybe he's had his fair share of crap and is trying to ease himself back into it... why kick away the hand he's extending before he even has time to complete the motion, let alone before you get to see what he's trying to do with it?

Woman here. I don't think I have ever, in my life, retraced the steps a man has taken in asking me out and thought, "Gee, he didn't show much intentionality behind Step 3. Get out of my DMs, dude."

Also, I want to point out that she gave you her number and her Insta, which she absolutely would not have done if she was not interested.

But you aren’t seeing where it goes. In order to see where it goes, you have to, as the bare minimum, to ask her out on a date. Because you sent her random messages instead of directly asking her out. Any woman I know would take it as lack of interest and move on. You totally don’t sound like you’re interested in her. Dude, if a girl were flirting in a bar like that with me and I were interested in her, I wouldn’t even wait a day. I’d most probably make a move right there and then. Or, at the very least, I’d ask her out the very next day.

Oh, then I'll have to recalibrate my understanding of the limits, thank you. To me, "just a drunk thing" means "I'll most likely never hear from or see that person again, unless by pure happenstance."

No, the fact that you are not asking for a date makes it much more likely it was a just drunk thing. It cements the idea that you're a guy who goes out and gets drunk and then flirts with whoever happens to be nearby. Then he sends a link to a random song, waits a few days, starts a wandering conversation... Sounds very much like a guy who is low interest and reaches out when he's bored.

Ok, yes, I understand that, but why not stick with it for more than a second and see where it goes, then? That's what I don't understand, and I'm sorry if I'm being thick, I'm genuinely not doing this intentionally: if she were that interested in me to begin with, then why not stick with the conversation for more than two text replies to see where it goes? Why would she drop it and ghost when I'm genuinely and (I hope) evidently interested in getting to know her? I get your point about it having been a drunk thing as well, but isn't the fact that I'm reaching out with more than a "hi, let's go out" indicative of precisely that it wasn't just a drunk thing? I'm genuinely asking these questions, I'm not trying to be a smart-butt.