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Since i am not out lesbian nobody knew.She is out and her family knew about me, brother and mother But we met 4 times snd each time we were together for like 3,4 days, but between that we talked every day. so not much ”live” meetings i know, but the connection was very deep.So it would not be a typical relationship either I guess

I suppose I also wonder why a married woman was even out like that so many times, all night, not coming home until the next morning. Maybe a one-off, I could see. But the fact she apparently was hanging out in bars like that so frequently would have raised an eyebrow for me in and of itself. They may well have seen it but simply didn't feel it was their place to bring it up to you. Sometimes nobody wants to volunteer to be the one in those hushed "Who's going to tell him?"-type conversations.

This still sounds ambiguous to me. How often did you spend time together in person, and did you consider yourselves a couple? Did others know you were together? I ask because it helps to give context to the current situation.

Hi, I'll try to keep it short. I've been with my partner for 9 years now. He's had this female friend for about 20 years he used to have a major obsession with her when he was younger (which he apparently says he doesn't anymore) A few years back after he lied again about messaging her and I found out he let me read all their messages, light flirty behaviour, at the start she asked what I was like and he said 'well she isn't you or this other girl he was obsessed with at the time' - He stopped the flirty behaviour, he still has a nickname for her for which I don't know why he can't just use her name. Anyway, yesterday again he was being protective over his phone and I know when he's lying, I called him out on it last night and he said he messaged her quite a few time over the past few months. I've told him before I'm not asking he never speaks to her again, though I would prefer he didn't (I had my last relationship and all this with other women and was glad to be done with it all) All I've said to him is to tell me when she messages and show me, he says he doesn't because he knows it will cause tension and he doesn't want a row, well it lead to one again last night by lying to me again. He's saying I'm being irritable and touchy over nothing, that he doesn't tell me because he knows I'll go off on one. I say lying is bad in relationships, I always tell him when people message me and he knows that.

Yes we have met in person.well we did say its a relationship but then she said ”you are still married this is not a relationship ”(when in fight)

So have you met in person? It sounds like you two were not in a relationship, if I am understanding this correctly. Is that right?

I hope you will, if you want to be in a relationship again some day. A serious relationship is not possible without trust. There is a huge difference between trusting a partner who hasn’t given you any reason to mistrust them and reluctantly agreeing to suspicious, boundary-disrespecting sexual activities, which is what happened in your case. She wanted to do porn films and she explicitly told you that she couldn’t be monogamous. She basically spelled out for you that she wanted to sleep with other men or was already doing that. This wasn’t about trust, it was about choosing to stay with someone who clearly wanted to have sexual adventures outside of your relationship. There are plenty of women out there who aren’t interested in that kind of stuff. There would be no reason to mistrust them if they show no signs of that tendency.

What can I say, I loved unconditionally, I trusted unconditionally. Never again. I look back now and there were signs everywhere, how my mates didn't see them too and say something to me I don't know. I guess I just treated her as I wanted to be treated. If I went out to a bar and then didn't make it home until 9am the next day because I crashed on a mates couch then that is exactly what happened. She never questioned me. I look back now and realize she did that so many times but from what I know now there's every chance she was with someone. I was just stupid I guess. I can picture in my mind now those times she walked through the door looking like she had been f**king all night but I just put it down to a hard night sleeping on a couch. I don't know what to say really, maybe I wasn't attentive enough and should have picked up on it. What I hate most about this is that I will never trust again. I don't want to be that person questioning a partner about where they've been because they're a couple of hours late home but I'm fearful that is who I've become.

Hi , I wrote more details, if you can read them? I tried to check up on her 2 times.She says she only wants to focus on her health now and not argue.She replies but short and takes like 2 hours.When i say can i call you ? She will say i am busy now/at the doctors/at work, we will speak later and then we never speak..she did not initiate so i am waiting to see if she will

We live in different European countries/2 hours flight I appreciate the feedback. To clarify,I was married to a man when we met! I realize now that my slow separation caused a lot of tension and made her feel like I wasn't being truthful. My divorce is finally finishing up now(in 2 weeks(, so the biggest hurdle is almost gone. However, our communication has become very strained because of that,it took too long time. After a heated argument during whole november and december, we stopped talking end of december. We had a phone call where she said really bad stuff,like she would expose me ,it is over now etc.She called 6 hours later to apology. And asked again next day how i was? In December 27th, she called me a liar for not reaching out anymore to her. We went on to have shallow messages every day but nothing deep ,it bothered me. So I asked her what are we now? then she immediately shut down when I tried to talk about it. Now, couple of days in, she only responds with short, polite answers and never initiates. I’m trying to figure out if she’s moved on or is this a way of her proving a point ? anything? I have decided not to write first to see if she will reach out, but I keep looking at my phone and it hurts so much

how did it go? did he ever contact you

I am glad he listened and you have a plan moving forward. As someone who has dabbled in the lifestyle you describe and been to these places on occasion, I still urge you to be cautious. You are not experienced with this yet and you might be surprised at what these places are actually like and how you will feel once you are there. I can tell you are getting a bit ahead of yourself and maybe have a fantasy idea of what goes on there and how you and he will manage it. It can be very exciting, of course. But it can also present complications that I see you aren't yet aware of or considering, so don't get too carried away before actually trying it. Don't go from zero to sixty all at once is my word of advice. Take small steps and figure out what you are both actually comfortable with in the moment. It's one thing to indulge in the fantasy. See how reality actually is for you and him once you start exploring and keeo perspective.

This is your answer, unforunately. When someone is sure they want you as a bigger part of their lives, they don't dodge these sorts of questions and leave doubts in your mind. You don't really say, but what is your relationship to her? Was she she your girlfriend? A friend? It's not clear how you two actually know each other, since you posted in this the LDR sub-forum. Is this someone you know in person?

And you never had any inking whatsoever thay she's been messing around behind your back for years? I ask because some cheaters are very good at hiding their behaviour, yes - however, the way you accepted her complete nonsense about her "acting" (until reality bodychecked you into the boards) makes me wonder if you have turned a blind eye to your gut at other times too.

We say "nice" often when we really mean "weak", someone who has no spine and will put up with anything really. I like the idea that you should connect with your ability to be a truly nice and giving person, and also connect with your ability to be vindictive and horrible while choosing not to act on it. That's why those people who say they are just "the nice guy" are so off-putting, because they're carrying around a lot of rage but have no ability to use it and process it in a healthy way. If you can connect with both like you say you can be nice when you want to and not so nice when its needed but not letting your anger control you to the point of being nasty or rude. It might be healthy to let loose a bit if someone has really screwed you over bad but usually people mean well and there's nothing a calm, firm and honest conversation won't fix. Thanks a lot! I would like to be able to apply it a bit better in my life haha but yes I feel I've picked up a few lessons along life's long and windy road.

I just want to start by saying I have the most amazing bf ever. He listened without judgment, well maybe a little judgment , and we’ve come up with a plan that wasn’t on my radar that I am very excited about. Basically three things, role playing, swingers clubs and I can see another female. We are going to role play. We’ve already got a years worth of ideas . Things like I go to a club, he comes an hour later and sweeps me off my feet. We go for a run separately and bump into each other as old friends, then end up in bed. Go out to dinner in a restaurant as work colleagues, have a laptop and be working on it together so it looks real then start flirting and kissing. He even wants to buy these toys where you control the vibration from a phone and I can wear them in public. It’s a fantasy of his to make me orgasm in inappropriate situations. I’ll never say no to a good orgasm. Just thinking up these wild ideas alone is such fun, I can’t imagine how living them out will be. The swingers club thing I said no to initially. I didn’t realize how they worked, it’s actually not throwing keys into a bowl and choose one, I was pretty naive there. But now I know I really really want this. We are NOT going to be with other people, this will purely be to watch and be watched. Walking around the party nearly naked and meeting people sounds like so much fun, but then to watch them have sex or them to watch us. This is me. This is what I wanted even if I didn’t realize it until now. Another woman. I have his blessing to find one or two regular partners I can see, he doesn’t want regular one night stands. It has rules of course but right now I don’t even want this as I’m so in love with the first two. Other things are off the table for now but not completely he said. We are just going down this path first. What I have learned from all this is something I never considered, that is that at times I want him to stop making love to me and just fk me. He doesn’t need to be gentle all the time and cuddle first, he can take control, rip my top, like literally rip it off, bend me over the car and just take what he wants, and don’t stop even if people are watching, that would just make it more exciting. I don’t know why this excites me but it does and if you double this down when he’s someone else during role playing or there’s others watching at a swingers club then I know I’m going to be one happy gf. So in the end I won’t be exploring missed experiences outside of our relationship but rather within it, except maybe at some stage with another woman because he just can’t be that for me I am genuinely excited. I love him so much, not just for these ideas but for listening to me, for understanding and not judging. I really do have the best bf. So glad I got guidance here, if I went in unprepared I might not have been so lucky.

Bump

If your gut is telling you that she's checked out or withdrawn from you, then she probably is. If she is not being clear with you using her words, then you have to look at her actions. You've tried to initiate conversations about where the relationship stands and whether she is interested in a future with you. If she just avoids the conversation and isn't responsive to you, then you have to assume that the answer is no, she doesn't want that. There is no sense in trying repeatedly with someone who isn't giving you anything back. Just take the hint and stop trying.

You need to initiate a conversation to find out if she's done with the relationship or simply shut down. Look, I think we need to talk about our relationship. I know you felt really hurt. And I also felt hurt ... and so on ... Sounds like she has withdrawn. Withdrawal is bad for a relationship but sometimes it doesn't always mean their feelings for you are over. You need to have a blunt conversation, blunt as in direct, not as in accusatory or loud. One thing that's missing here is YOUR hurt. She said very hurtful things. Why are you so eager to reconnect? Why do you feel it's your job to reconcile things? How safe (emotionally safe) do you feel around her? Sounds potentially one sided to me. Is this the larger dynamic in the relationship? You say she apologized for "the way she spoke." I can't tell if that's your language or hers. If it's hers, that's a fake apology. I apologize if the phrase I phrased my statements hurt your feelings.

No, these are things I'm learning now. I asked her to come clean to give some closure and I find out that plus many other things.

A red flag is what you call it. The whole being friends with the opposite sex has been a debatable topic. Under very particular and situational circumstances, you can be friends with them. Classmates is probably one of the extremely few I would say, and MAYBE (and a big maybe) in-laws. So long as you have no romantic feelings towards one and other (and it NEEDS to be mutual), then there's no problem. However, not the best idea because those feelings will come up if it isn't under the conditions laid out. If you considered this woman a friend and she doesn't consider you one and if she's been flirty, red flag. She has you blocked on social media but yet is flirty with you at the gym, red flag. She's married with 3 children and is flirty with you, red flag. You're good enough to give her attention at the gym, and that's it. Do not get involved with her, if you value your reputation. On top of that, if she's having problems in her marriage, I wouldn't even take what she's saying as gospel. I'd stay away from her. She sounds like she's more trouble than what she's worth. My oldest brother had an ex-wife, was divorced and had 2 kids (who she did NOT have custody of). He met her at work, and within a month after they met, they got engaged. During this time, she has butted heads with one of my brothers, accused me of liking the same sex, started fights, and created rifts between us and our friends. After my brother and his ex got married, she spent his money into oblivion, put him baby sitting duties constantly, created problems with the family, and accused my brother of emotional abuse and demanded other changes or else she'd leave him. We also found out during their 6 month marriage that she had an affair with one of his old friends from school and was involved with other types of promiscuous behavior with other men, so needless to say, they, ultimately, got divorced. This isn't to say this all women going through troubles in their marriage (or even if they got divorced) and have kids. However, it's always best to play it safe, and in this case, if she's still married, not considering you a friend, and has you blocked on social media, don't bother getting any closer to her. One other thing to consider is her husband, and he won't like it if his wife is flirting with other men. So from one guy to another, you'd be better off continuing to self improve. You don't need a red flag entering your life.

Yep, that's the first thing I've learnt through therapy, it's always better to be fair than to be nice. Fairness includes being nice to people who deserve it (and not being horrible with people who don't deserve it). And I completely agree, it's always the unaddressed issues which sink the ship. There's nothing to be ashamed of, everything can be discussed and solutions can always be found. But if we let things stew just beneath the surface, that pressure buildup will inevitably seek a release, which usually ends up as a mess. As a side note, your self-awareness is genuinely admirable and gives me hope for human beings in general. Thank you!

We had a very intense connection for years. Recently, we had a big argument where she was extremely angry and said very hurtful things. A few hours later, she called to apologize for the way she spoke. After that, communication resumed, but it became very superficial — short messages, no emotional depth, no initiative to talk properly, no calls. Just check-ins about health or daily things. When I tried to ask directly what we are and what she wants, she avoided answering. She would change the subject, say she’s tired, or say that right now she only cares about her health(she has health issues) I respect that she’s dealing with health issues, and I don’t expect emotional availability if she’s not capable. What hurts is the lack of clarity — staying in contact, but refusing to say whether there is a future, a relationship, or nothing at all. I asked for honesty, even if the answer was painful. Instead, I got avoidance. My question is: Is this a sign that she emotionally checked out but keeps contact for comfort? Or could this be emotional shutdown due to stress and health issues? I’m trying to understand whether this kind of behavior usually leads to reconnection later — or if it’s a sign that I should walk away to protect myself.

So you were aware of the fact she was cheating in the past but it was framed as experimentation and doing it as a favour to you? None of us know the ins and outs of your psychology or relationship dynamic so there probably isnt going to be an "answer" (even for you since you can't and probably don't want to ready her mind), but my read is that your boundaries got walked all over at some point and from there she just kept pushing them. It seems to be a pretty common thing when LTRs slowly erode. One partner is unhappy, they do something unreasonable and unfair, the other accepts it to appease them and smooth it over, the other loses respect and learns the unacceptable is now acceptable, etc. Of everything I've learned recently about love and relationships, it seems to me that boundaries are the absolute number one thing. So that might be something to focus on moving into the future, when you are ready to meet someone new. For now though I think you should focus entirely on healing and coming back to yourself. Try and live in the present and avoid ruminating too much on her or self-medicating with booze/substances etc.

You nailed it. When people show you who they are, believe them. Get out and go no contact. Let the lawyers handle any communication that needs to happen. Nothing good will come of interacting with her.