Refusal-Long time refused & considering leaving...

That's great FM! Sounds like you have both fallen in love again. That's much more exciting than simply loving someone.

Congrats... let's hope it lasts....

Am so frustrated !!

So I'm trying to get us at "weekly" maybe 2X a week....

We ML Mon. night but nothing since... nor the weekend before, but maybe Thurs. night of the week before...(It's easy to forget. She's caught me forgettin "we ML just the other night...")

Oh.... this weekend hasn't been "nothing..."

Got to the caressing of her breasts for an extended time -- for 2 NIGHTS IN A ROW -- which usually leads to going farther... but she started feeling uncomfortable with her back or something one night and got a headache the other night...

She's always "tired" and "not in the mood..."

Okay, one night this weekend I can understand. We both were tired from some physical activity around the home...

BUT....

Tried to cuddle with her tonight on the couch.

Get this stern reaction. "Don't do it..." I'm told... "No farther..."

Made a point to tell me months ago not to "...schedule sex" as that's un-romantic to her...

...so I don't "schedule" sex but try to get to that through the cuddling, but keep getting rebuffed.....

Seems like she's the one "controlling" or "scheduling" the sex...

My God, you are so freakin' NEEDY. Since when do men want to 'cuddle?' Jeez. I, too, would find it highly unappealing if I had to be peeling some needy whiner off of me every day like your wife is doing.

Seriously. Get a hobby or something and quit looking to your wife to make you feel 'whole.' Yuck.

My God, you are so freakin' NEEDY. Since when do men want to 'cuddle?' Jeez. I, too, would find it highly unappealing if I had to be peeling some needy whiner off of me every day like your wife is doing.

 

Seriously. Get a hobby or something and quit looking to your wife to make you feel 'whole.' Yuck.

Ditto.... I have not closely read this thread and only skim FM's posts, but that was pathetic..... Yes we want more sex, and do what we need to do to try and get it, but to have to read a post about your fondling habits in regards to foreplay????? Ewwwwww

FL, you are dealing with a woman... they are bound to be a bit volatile... Jokes apart, I think it was to be expected. Maybe, you got carried away because of your previous success and now she feels pressurized again... back off and start again, although you really must love her to put up with her inconsistent behaviour...

Maybe I need to show some Non-Chalance, as I often advise others in dating scenarios.

Roll over tonight in bed and act not interested, or even sleep elsewhere...

Be not so "willing" to cuddle with her the next a.m. and pretend things are fine....

She appears to be setting "the schedule" here and is "controlling" our LM. I'm a partner here too...

She appears to be setting "the schedule" here and is "controlling" our LM. I'm a partner here too...

Welcome to the club, FM... you have all my sympathy...

My God, you are so freakin' NEEDY. Since when do men want to 'cuddle?' Jeez. I, too, would find it highly unappealing if I had to be peeling some needy whiner off of me every day like your wife is doing.

 

Seriously. Get a hobby or something and quit looking to your wife to make you feel 'whole.' Yuck.

Ditto.... I have not closely read this thread and only skim FM's posts, but that was pathetic..... Yes we want more sex, and do what we need to do to try and get it, but to have to read a post about your fondling habits in regards to foreplay????? Ewwwwww

Prag, I only wrote about caressing her breasts. Okay, I should have only stated I was caressing her. It wasn't written to be erotic or titillating.

My God, you are so freakin' NEEDY.

 

Since when do men want to 'cuddle?'

Jeez. I, too, would find it highly unappealing if I had to be peeling some needy whiner off of me every day like your wife is doing.

 

Seriously. Get a hobby or something and quit looking to your wife to make you feel 'whole.' Yuck.

Since when do women not want their guy to cuddle them?

Though I wasn't a virgin (lost mine wayyyyyy too early in HS), treated women well and didn't press them for sex and had sex all of 2 separate times through my 20s before meeting my wife shortly after turning 30.

Thought I was a "good guy" towards women, who truly wanted a relationship over pleasing my strong sexual desires.

Am kind of regreting I didn't pursue women sexually and be a little more aggressive.... Some things held me back and you could guess what they were, as posted elsewhere...

.....so I think I kind of "deserve" some things in life. One of them is a loving wife.

Prag, I only wrote about caressing her breasts. Okay, I should have only stated I was caressing her. It wasn't written to be erotic or titillating.

 

Since when do women not want their guy to cuddle them?

 

Though I wasn't a virgin (lost mine wayyyyyy too early in HS), treated women well and didn't press them for sex and had sex all of 2 separate times through my 20s before meeting my wife shortly after turning 30.

Thought I was a "good guy" towards women, who truly wanted a relationship over pleasing my strong sexual desires.

 

Am kind of regreting I didn't pursue women sexually and be a little more aggressive.... Some things held me back and you could guess what they were, as posted elsewhere...

 

.....so I think I kind of "deserve" some things in life. One of them is a loving wife.

I'm not a cuddle freak, I prefer my sex hot,hard and spare me the so called romantic preambles, you want a piece of this? just say it flat out, spare me the so called sacrifice of cuddling.

LOL,I'm sorry FM but I've got to agree that I think you're being too clingy and let's face it, you are only cuddling in hopes that the wife will open her legs. you aren't really fooling anybody.

Not foreplay.

Sandpaper...

And yeah FM, it is likely that your wife has picked up on the whole cuddling=sex thing, which is leading to more resentment on her end. I sorta think that the whole sexually aggressive "get on your knees baby. And ready, steady, ****" won't work on her but at this point, it is worth a shot. Basically, there is a power imbalance in your sex life and you need to shift it more towards your end.

You two ever seen a sexual therapist? Might work out.

Am so frustrated !!

 

So I'm trying to get us at "weekly" maybe 2X a week

 

We ML Mon. night but nothing since... nor the weekend before, but maybe Thurs. night of the week before...(It's easy to forget. She's caught me forgettin "we ML just the other night...")

 

Oh.... this weekend hasn't been "nothing..."

 

Got to the caressing of her breasts for an extended time -- for 2 NIGHTS IN A ROW -- which usually leads to going farther... but she started feeling uncomfortable with her back or something one night and got a headache the other night...

 

She's always "tired" and "not in the mood..."

 

Okay, one night this weekend I can understand. We both were tired from some physical activity around the home...

 

BUT....

 

Tried to cuddle with her tonight on the couch.

Get this stern reaction. "Don't do it..." I'm told... "No farther..."

 

 

Made a point to tell me months ago not to "...schedule sex" as that's un-romantic to her...

...so I don't "schedule" sex but try to get to that through the cuddling, but keep getting rebuffed.....

Seems like she's the one "controlling" or "scheduling" the sex...

She is refusing cuddling because she recognizes it as a weak attempt to initiate sex.

Let cuddling be cuddling, and sex be sex. If the cuddling turns her on, let her initiate it sex. Until and unless she does, you are just cuddling.

When you want sex, go for sex! None of this weak caressing stuff. You don't have to be forceful, but you should be assertive, strong, confident. After a few days of cuddling (not attached to sex), she may respond positively to a more animalistic approach. A nibble on the ear and a naughty whisper, possibly .

FM wife must be in her early 50's and menopausal, FM has posted more than once about how his wife is clearly in physical pain when he enters her.He's ignored my comments about menopause and the need to explore good lubes etc. A menopausal woman who's not taking HRT is not going to want to go at it like a 22 yr old college girl, particularly if doing so causes her

actual physical pain

Well gee whiz. Even if this is true--why is it FM's responsibility, not his wife's, to ensure that she has a tube of KY jelly or goes to the doctor and gets a scrip for hormones if that's what she needs?

 

I thought this was the age of equality of men and women. Why the f*ck is the MAN responsible for the WOMAN'S failure to make sure she is medically prepared for marital sex?

 

Besides menopause doesn't explain why she has been such a b*tch about it. She just says "Don't touch me" not "Hey my p*ssy is sore, so get the can of bacon grease baby." Hell according to "Last Tango in Paris" all you really need to prepare for great sex is nail clippers and a stick of butter. *

 

*It's not clear whether Marlon used salted or unsalted. And perhaps it was actually margarine. Which brings up another issue--if FM's spouse's front door is creaking, why not go up the back alley?

For starters, hormones are strongly discouraged and have been for a long time as HRT has been shown to significantly increase a woman's risks for cancer.

Secondly, the OP is on this woman 24/7, if somebody was fawning and pawing all over me like that I'd be irritated as well.

As for your last suggestion, if somebody has zero sexual desire due to lack of hormones I kind of doubt offering to shove it up their backside instead is going to generate any reaction besides that of sheer terror.

FM wife must be in her early 50's and menopausal, FM has posted more than once about how his wife is clearly in physical pain when he enters her.He's ignored my comments about menopause and the need to explore good lubes etc. A menopausal woman who's not taking HRT is not going to want to go at it like a 22 yr old college girl, particularly if doing so causes her

actual physical pain

Has your wife seen her gyno FM? Or just any old doctor at all?

And if things are dry down there, there are a large number of "special" lubricants that will help. Google 'em. Seriously, unless your wife is masochistic, sandpaper sex probably won't be in her fun zone.

Of course, there is the possibility that she simply isn't into you anymore.

FM wife must be in her early 50's and menopausal, FM has posted more than once about how his wife is clearly in physical pain when he enters her.He's ignored my comments about menopause and the need to explore good lubes etc. A menopausal woman who's not taking HRT is not going to want to go at it like a 22 yr old college girl, particularly if doing so causes her

actual physical pain

Haven't ignored that. We use lubes.

Need to get her to a gynocologist, though.

Even the sex--when it does happen--doesn't sound like it's enjoyable.

Plain vanilla. In the past, we did woman on top, but have never done oral.

I do enjoy it but am trying to improve things so maybe I can give her some oral, as I did with some women in my late 20s before I met her -- had some "everything...but" sessions with a couple of virgins and a never-married non-virgin who had ltd. experience (but didn't want the emotional toll of consummation). I respected those women's stances but clearly wanted to go farther if allowed....

Don't necessarily need oral given to me, but I loved giving it....

We are not told what the reaction is by floridaredman when his wife is nasty to him.

...

This woman is just a b*tch and seriously needs to be put in her place. Unfortunately after all this time it doesn't sound like floridaredman is the one to do it.

...

I think the way to get through to this b*tch is

Well... I'm not going to refer to her that way, though I admit I had some less than positive thoughts toward her in the past...

Please don't refer to her that way...

Well... I'm not going to refer to her that way, though I admit I had some less than positive thoughts toward her in the past...

lol, FM, you are such a sweet man... seriously!

...so maybe I can give her some oral, as I did with some women in my late 20s before I met her -- had some "everything...but" sessions with a couple of virgins and a never-married non-virgin who had ltd. experience (but didn't want the emotional toll of consummation). I respected those women's stances but clearly wanted to go farther if allowed.... .

Wanted to edit this in earlier, but can't:

Yeah... I do regret not pressing some of them.

One did "offer" herself to me one night but I foolishly questioned her if that was what she really wanted....

Thought she may have had too much wine (we weren't intoxicated- I don't drink except for wine), plus I knew her stance and feared she might hold it against me for not showing some restraint (didn't want to look like I was taking advantage of her).

She told me she didn't want the emotional toll (and likely guilt as a Christian -- same here) if she let me enter... She was someone I could see myself marrying at the time... so I really was trying for a relationship over my sexual drive...

Yes, we did nearly "everything" else so looking back, likely wouldn't have been anything wrong with finishing....

We were human, were in a long-term committed and monogomous relationship.....

PLUS... No one could call me promiscuous... 2 sep. X through all of my 20s.... (@26)....

If I were single now I wouldn't likely be as "scared."

Hindsight is so clear, isn't it?

Sorry if TMI... but wanted to give a little look at my life in my 20s...

Now in in my late 40s, have a lot of regrets about not being as sexually agressive as I should have been...

I'll try to be quick.

I don't think she has a medical problem..

If George Clooney walked into the room and came onto her, you'd soon see how sexual your wife is capable of being... she's be gushing, flirting the lot.

Of course I am generalizing, she could have a medical/psychological problem. However there is a tendency IMHO to "medicalize" every issue.

If you are repulsed by blond hair and your wife has blond hair, it will make it hard for you two to have a fulfilling sex life. the hair will get in the way...

Women are no different, if something about you repulses her, either physically, mentally or emotionally she will not sleep with you.

If she's refusing "pity" or "keep-the-peace" sex and you don't even live in the same town, you have got a major problem.

You are not needy, you are normal; a man trying to solve a problem. no doctor or pill can solve. She's probably not sick, she just doesn't fancy you.

Either live with no sex, or discuss alternatives, then act, I wish you all the best.

(But do stop trying to make her comfortable, entice her, it probably makes her even more disgusted and is ultimately counterproductive)

Disengage mentally and physically, think about the future and how you want it, if you still want her and it sounds like you do, have a deep serious talk with her, it's a start...

lol a YEAR??? No sex for a year....starting from now? dont forget this has been going on for x amount of time already.

In as much as everyone is different I'm a little reticent about the "giving it time" thing. I've been there, I've witnessed others there and it never

seemed to go well...

Agreed...

We are not told what the reaction is by floridaredman when his wife is nasty to him.

That would make me really angry. There's ways of turning down sex without "rejecting" him entirely.This woman is just a b*tch and seriously needs to be put in her place. Unfortunately after all this time it doesn't sound like floridaredman is the one to do it. He is totally submissive to her domination.

 

Maybe, that's what he likes... maybe he's a sub "bragging" about his mistress...

 

I think the way to get through to this b*tch is to stop asking her for sex entirely, but at nighttime bring the laptop into bed with you, turn the lights off, find a good prono video, and jack off to it. Right in front of her.

If she gets angry about that just tell her "Listen you b*tch you are too much f*ckin' trouble to deal with just to get my nut off. Five minutes with Jenna Jameson is much more pleasant than dealing with your bullcr*p. But if you promise to be nice I will let you suck the Kleenex when I am done with it."

:lmao::lmao:

FM wife must be in her early 50's and menopausal, FM has posted more than once about how his wife is clearly in physical pain when he enters her.He's ignored my comments about menopause and the need to explore good lubes etc. A menopausal woman who's not taking HRT is not going to want to go at it like a 22 yr old college girl, particularly if doing so causes her actual physical pain

But why make excuses as though she's a child, she knows men need sex, her refusal to sort out the problem herself speaks volumes

Tried to cuddle with her tonight on the couch.

Get this stern reaction. "Don't do it..." I'm told... "No farther..."

 

This is not just about sexual incompatibility. This woman is a Grade AAA Nut Buster. Her favorite classical music is the "Nutcracker Suite." When she goes walking down the street, all the squirrels in the neighborhood go into a panic trying to hide their nuts. Just thinking about what the OP is going through is giving me a serious prostate enlargement. I feel like one of the bad guys in a Jackie Chan movie. :lmao:

Seriously, how could anyone actually devote any love to a woman like this? So cold...so very cold...colder than Jack Nicholson sitting in the maze at the end of "The Shining.":lmao::lmao::lmao:

 

I would probably get so mad at this woman I would just come out and tell her "Look I can't force you to have sex with me nor do I want you to but I do need to have sex with a woman and if you're not available I will find someone else."

Just how much of this woman's sh*t are you willing to eat, guy?

 

Perhaps he's a masochist and likes it...

 

This is one of the RARE occasions when I would not hold it against the guy if he reacted by having an affair.

Damn if anyone is entitled to it, this OP is.

Oh, so there ARE times when its okay??? Hmmmmm????

Made a point to tell me months ago not to "...schedule sex" as that's un-romantic to her...

...so I don't "schedule" sex but try to get to that through the cuddling, but keep getting rebuffed.....

Seems like she's the one "controlling" or "scheduling" the sex...

You know what else is un-romantic? A platonic marriage!

Scheduled sex is un-romantic, but no sex is better? Where is the romance in NO sex????? If it weren't so sad, it would be funny!

Since when do women not want their guy to cuddle them?

When they don't want to have sex with them, and they believe cuddling is an attempt at sex.

When they have anger or resentment toward their partner, and they don't want any intimacy (sexual intimacy or the emotional intimacy of non-sexual touch).

There are other reasons, too.

.....so I think I kind of "deserve" some things in life. One of them is a loving wife.

I don't know if "deserve" is the right word, but I am glad to hear you realize that you should not be settling for a cold wife.

Your big mistake, imo, is trying too long to make an unloving wife into a loving one. She can fake it for a while, but her true feelings seem to be that she doesn't earnestly want you sexually. She may love you in other ways, but not enough to have regular sex with you, or to suggest you get sexual intimacy outside the relationship.

Prag, I only wrote about caressing her breasts. Okay, I should have only stated I was caressing her. It wasn't written to be erotic or titillating.

 

Since when do women not want their guy to cuddle them?

 

.....

 

.....so I think I kind of "deserve" some things in life. One of them is a loving wife.

women don't want their guy to cuddle them if it's just a hurdle to get to sex. It doesn't generate heat, just irritation and resentment. For a guy, usually cuddling is just that. So I don't like cuddling that much before sex, but I do like it after.

Sex should be hot, steamy, necessary. The guy has to generate enough heat through sensuality to get her going. if you do that, you have no worries. If she's normal and has the capacity to like sex.

If she doesn't like sex or has no interest in it, nothing you do or don't do will change that. Ignore her, fawn all over her, the result will be the same. All you get to do is choose which you want to do and who you want to do it with.

If sex is a deal-breaker, or the lack of it for the rest of your life with her, then you just need to have the serious talk - ex. - I need a sex life that I can depend on, offer to go to counseling, whatever, but insist that it has to happen with some reliability and happiness and fun or you've got to move on. Then be prepared to do just that.

What isn't going to work for you at all is bird-dogging your wife for sex. It's a turn-off for almost every woman I know, and the ones that like it like that are using it for control.

She is refusing cuddling because she recognizes it as a weak attempt to initiate sex.

 

Let cuddling be cuddling, and sex be sex. If the cuddling turns her on, let her initiate it sex. Until and unless she does, you are just cuddling.

 

When you want sex, go for sex! None of this weak caressing stuff. You don't have to be forceful, but you should be assertive, strong, confident.

 

After a few days of cuddling (not attached to sex), she may respond positively to a more animalistic approach. A nibble on the ear and a naughty whisper, possibly .

This is very good insight, xxoo.

Regret not responding sooner.

Think I've been patient, cuddling with her every night but not always pressing for intimacy.

It's hard not to let my hands wander (outside her clothes on her chest). Oh, how I want to do that, but I get the same reaction.

Have consciously tried to stop the groping, but it's hard. May go a day or two not trying to caress her but then it's back to the old habits.

She did notice the change of me not having wandering hands, so that's good.

You know what else is un-romantic? A platonic marriage!

Agreed.

I don't know if "deserve" is the right word, but I am glad to hear you realize that you should not be settling for a cold wife.

 

Your big mistake, imo, is trying too long to make an unloving wife into a loving one. She can fake it for a while, but her true feelings seem to be that she doesn't earnestly want you sexually. She may love you in other ways, but not enough to have regular sex with you, or to suggest you get sexual intimacy outside the relationship.

We are doing a lot of cuddling. Almost every night.

Gotta disagree on the love part. We tell each other how much we love each other frequently in the cuddling, and I'm saying how I love her more often throughout the day.

Methinks it's something physically wrong with her. She has an appt. with a gynocologist soon.

May update more later.

Good for you exercising patience.

Have you read the 5 Love Languages?