Why women love bastards, rakes and players?

Sort of a flip side to the why men live b1tches thread.

 

Let's not talk about Nice guys VS Jerks here. The Jerks obviously win by a landslide. Let those of us who have a Y chromosome or who are attracted to those with two XX chromosomes analyze this objectively.

 

 

Given the choice between two physically equal men, one man who has his own house/condo/apartment, a good job/career, and is good and respectful; one man who lives in his friends basement, has no job except smoking and selling weed, and who has no respect for the woman....the woman will more often than not choose the dirt bag.

 

(Ladies if you are not this way then great. We know not all of you are that way but you are in the minority.)

 

Here's my take on it.

 

Women don't choose bastards because they are "real men who are assertive and make them feel secure and are a challenge" and all that.

 

Women, especially and particularly young women, choose bastardly Jerky bad boys because those men attract the most attention to themselves.

 

Bastards have everything that a emotionally immature mind thinks is important.

 

They have a sort of "high" social status among their age peers... dosen't matter that in the grand scheme they are a low class male. So long as on college or highschool campus it looks high status to people that age.

 

They appear to have "street smarts" or what looks like street smarts to people who don't know better. If he got arrested for selling a dime bag to an undercover cop he isn't street smart. Nice suburban girls who want a thug won't know the difference. Yet to an immature and inexperienced young woman looking for an exciting man one who has a record seems to have more street cred than one who has been acquitted or never got caught (not to mention the street smartest thing to do...abide by the law in the first place.)

 

They project a sense of confidence which can be attractive to women of any age. The problem is, in a bastard it's more like an unearned confidence, the arrogance of thinking that fixing up an 89 Ford Tempo and painting it lime green with Spreewell (spinner) rims and a bumping stereo is a big achievement. YET a decent guy with a brand new Lexus might get a sideways look.

 

Bastards treat women in a way that if someone treated their mother or sister that way... they would want to beat the guy up. They don't treat women with genuine respect. They may be good with the sweet talk and romancing but they are insincere. Many women think they can spot this...yet the same women always shun the actual sincere man for the one who's utterly faking it.

 

Have I missed anything? How many more reasons are their why soooo many women seem to choose bastardly dirt bags over decent hardworking respectful men?

Edited October 20, 2011 by Mrlonelyone

Why do you continue to try to use intellect to analyze the animal nature? Women want what they want because that's what their genes told them to want. Posting about it won't solve anything. Become a geneticist if you want to fix it...

Another one of these?

 

You're both essentially wrong.

 

The end

Genetics is only a part of it.

 

Humans are all 100% of us social creatures. What men and women both want out of a relationship, almost as much as sex, is a sense of increased social status.

 

Across cultures and times, even in cultures where arranged marriages and forced female virginity were the norm...the parents would choose a husband for their daughter who could increase or at least not decrease their social and economic capital.

 

In our youth culture USA since at least 1960's a Charles Manson like dirt bag would to young women seem to have great social standing. It's a false social standing, not so much a real seasoned carhill type alpha male...more of a loud mouthed noisy beta trying to look alpha. (If you like those terms at all I really don't.)

Another one of these?

 

You're both essentially wrong.

 

The end

 

1.) Not another one of these. Though I fear someone will make it one of those.

 

2.)If you don't choose bastards bravo for you being emotionally mature enough to spot real character and genuine confidence. You are in the 1% who don't need to make the mistakes we see soooooo many women on here make again, and again.

@imajerk

 

This thread isn't about me. This thread is more for all the women on here in the last few days who have been dumped shortly after having sex with bastards and the long term male virgins.

 

I am neither of those, read the text not just the title.

YET a decent guy with a brand new Lexus might get a sideways look.

 

What about a decent guy with a '97 Toyota Camry?

 

Forgive me for looking at this from a woman's perspective, but I'm very confused about the correlation between money and decency. You've never met a rich jerk? Or a decent middle-class guy?

 

I think your examples are rather extreme. Most women don't date criminals. They certainly don't go looking for criminals to date. I hate to tell you this, but you're not an expert on what women want and how women think. In fact, you're getting it all wrong.

@Cypress

 

The link between money and "decency" I am making has to do with two things.

 

How does he make the money?

 

For example, a drug dealer. I live in a rough around the edges suburban area of Chicago. In 20 years I have never known a drug dealer, gangbanger who did not have at least one girlfriend. Because they have money to take care of a woman. While he has decent money, he is not a "decent guy".

 

On the other hand, I have known many men who had good jobs yet could not find a woman. They were decent men who did not have to worry about that 1lb bag of weed when the cops pull them over...yet they were single.

 

Don't be so litteral about my examples. They are just examples I have seen in my life. Maybe the guy isn't a criminal...maybe he just is an unemployed shiftless schlub. However I have never known such a man who had real trouble finding girlfriends. While plenty of motivated, educated men are single and scouring OK Cupid and getting nothing. Is it so bad to ask why?

Given the choice between two physically equal men, one man who has his own house/condo/apartment, a good job/career, and is good and respectful; one man who lives in his friends basement, has no job except smoking and selling weed, and who has no respect for the woman....the woman will more often than not choose the dirt bag.

 

Really? Really? What a sad way to think.

Immature women tend to be attracted to what is popular and we live in a culture that idolizes thugs and bad asses. What is in is looking like Lil Wayne or one of the guys from the Jersey Shore so that is what immature women gravitate to. Also not to be sexist but women tend to care much more about being trendy than men after a certain age.

 

Of course for mature women none of this applies.

For example, a drug dealer. I live in a rough around the edges suburban area of Chicago. In 20 years I have never known a drug dealer, gangbanger who did not have at least one girlfriend. Because they have money to take care of a woman. While he has decent money, he is not a "decent guy".

 

Well, this explains your perspective a little. You happen to live in an area where a lot of guys are involved in some sort of questionable activity. Which means a lot of women aren't turned off by it, because they're used to it. It's "normal" to them. And I doubt it's the money they're attracted to. These guys are probably smooth talkers.

 

On the other hand, I have known many men who had good jobs yet could not find a woman. They were decent men who did not have to worry about that 1lb bag of weed when the cops pull them over...yet they were single.

 

Just because a guy has a good job and is a law-abiding citizen doesn't necessarily mean women will want to date him. Don't get me wrong, having a good job and obeying the law are great qualities, but what about everything else? Like his personality, his sense of humor, his social skills, his interests and hobbies, etc. That stuff is important.

 

Don't be so litteral about my examples. They are just examples I have seen in my life. Maybe the guy isn't a criminal...maybe he just is an unemployed shiftless schlub. However I have never known such a man who had real trouble finding girlfriends. While plenty of motivated, educated men are single and scouring OK Cupid and getting nothing. Is it so bad to ask why?

 

You want to know why? Because people date people they like and are attracted to. If I met a motivated, educated man and I wasn't attracted to him, I wouldn't want to date him. If I met an unemployed or drug-dealing man and I wasn't attracted to him, I wouldn't want to date him. Men should understand this. They wouldn't want to date someone they're not attracted to either.

Sort of a flip side to the why men live b1tches thread.

 

Let's not talk about Nice guys VS Jerks here. The Jerks obviously win by a landslide. Let those of us who have a Y chromosome or who are attracted to those with two XX chromosomes analyze this objectively.

 

 

Given the choice between two physically equal men, one man who has his own house/condo/apartment, a good job/career, and is good and respectful; one man who lives in his friends basement, has no job except smoking and selling weed, and who has no respect for the woman....the woman will more often than not choose the dirt bag.

 

(Ladies if you are not this way then great. We know not all of you are that way but you are in the minority.)

 

Here's my take on it.

 

Women don't choose bastards because they are "real men who are assertive and make them feel secure and are a challenge" and all that.

 

Women, especially and particularly young women, choose bastardly Jerky bad boys because those men attract the most attention to themselves.

 

Bastards have everything that a emotionally immature mind thinks is important.

 

They have a sort of "high" social status among their age peers... dosen't matter that in the grand scheme they are a low class male. So long as on college or highschool campus it looks high status to people that age.

 

They appear to have "street smarts" or what looks like street smarts to people who don't know better. If he got arrested for selling a dime bag to an undercover cop he isn't street smart. Nice suburban girls who want a thug won't know the difference. Yet to an immature and inexperienced young woman looking for an exciting man one who has a record seems to have more street cred than one who has been acquitted or never got caught (not to mention the street smartest thing to do...abide by the law in the first place.)

 

They project a sense of confidence which can be attractive to women of any age. The problem is, in a bastard it's more like an unearned confidence, the arrogance of thinking that fixing up an 89 Ford Tempo and painting it lime green with Spreewell (spinner) rims and a bumping stereo is a big achievement. YET a decent guy with a brand new Lexus might get a sideways look.

 

Bastards treat women in a way that if someone treated their mother or sister that way... they would want to beat the guy up. They don't treat women with genuine respect. They may be good with the sweet talk and romancing but they are insincere. Many women think they can spot this...yet the same women always shun the actual sincere man for the one who's utterly faking it.

 

Have I missed anything? How many more reasons are their why soooo many women seem to choose bastardly dirt bags over decent hardworking respectful men?

God is that really true? :confused:I must be part of the minority that would go for the guy with the job, house/apartment and car. I would hope most women wouldn't chose the dirtbag, but I'm sure there are plenty of women who would. Women with little self worth and self esteem.

I rarely see that the case except with maybe some very young girls

 

Maybe in the ghetto most women attracted to lowlfie thugs because their music and culture glorifies it but most grown women i know would easily take the good guy with a stable career

I rarely see that the case except with maybe some very young girls

 

Maybe in the ghetto most women attracted to lowlfie thugs because their music and culture glorifies it but most grown women i know would easily take the good guy with a stable career

Yeah I agree with this. Me and my girlfriends don't go for the dirtbags. We're in our 30's and 40's. I could see young, foolish girls doing it because they don't know any better, but most grown women want stability.

Why women love bastards, rakes and players?

 

The ones who do, who have spoken with me directly about this, including women married to such men, have said it is because they didn't/don't feel worthy of the love of a good man. This is generally an answer when I ask them why they remain with such men.

 

Pretty much the consensus has been that the men weren't perceived as bastards, rakes and players when they were wooing the woman. I can respect that because I've been woo'ed by bitches and emotional vampires too. The reason I didn't/don't stay with them is I feel worthy of a good woman. Still, no doubt, I've been sucked in too.

The ones who do, who have spoken with me directly about this, including women married to such men, have said it is because they didn't/don't feel worthy of the love of a good man. This is generally an answer when I ask them why they remain with such men.

 

Pretty much the consensus has been that the men weren't perceived as bastards, rakes and players when they were wooing the woman. I can respect that because I've been woo'ed by bitches and emotional vampires too. The reason I didn't/don't stay with them is I feel worthy of a good woman. Still, no doubt, I've been sucked in too.

NO SELF LOVE OR SELF WORTH is what it is. That's so sad:(

I would agree. What the experiences taught me is that one can never love such a person enough. The abyss is too deep and broad. Sometimes one must just let go.

 

The vast majority of this sampling have been abused or molested or raped. Traumatized.

Somehow I don't see a drug dealer having a great personality, great social skills, or having a great sense of humor.

 

What does his social skills go to? Being social enough to get high?

I have never known a drug dealer that struggled with his dating life.

It had been my observation that for some ladies, its the desire to "FIX" that man, to change him, to create or make him more then what he is at that moment. Some ladies "Fix" the man by encouraging him...the question is...is she encouraging him to be the thug, gangstah, or immoral being? Most Ladies in my small network of friends would decline to "support" this theory...reason is...they are in the mist of just this mindset. The difference is...they consider "white collar" crime more socially "acceptable", so what if their "elite" Hubby uses the company funds to buy the mrs a new gemstone...write it off as a company expense....Or to use the company limo to take his secretary for a rendevous to the beach one evening....

I think for the miniscule amount of ladies I have met in my life time ...(Lets face it none of us ladies has met even near .05% of the overall female gender in their lifetime...its just NOT possible!) Bottom line..its an insult though to make a blanket statement ( mine was just one of many observations) of x...y..z...reasons for what may or may not be the reasons...and until I meet the other 99.95% of the female population or inhabitants, I think I'll leave the speculation line open and allow for the mystery in life to remain.

Somehow I don't see a drug dealer having a great personality, great social skills, or having a great sense of humor.

 

You shouldn't stereotype drug dealers. They're people too.

I have never known a drug dealer that struggled with his dating life.

 

Lmao. That's actually a fact!!!

It is an issue of immaturity.

 

Which is ironic, because all the guys here seem to want women in their low 20s. But the women they are meeting in their low 20s are immature, and want bastards, rakes, and players. But the guys still insist that these are the women of highest "value". When they are actually just the youngest.

 

Immaturity all around.

Originally Posted by Woggle

I have never known a drug dealer that struggled with his dating life.

That's generally true for most criminals, simply because they have minimal inhibitions about taking what they want in the world and their skills are in taking it, not being concerned or reflective about the morality or legality of their taking. If one cares that little, people are really irrelevant as meaningful and valuable beings. They're just tools. Our prisons are bulging and just imagine how many criminals there are out there who've never been incarcerated, much less caught. Boggles the mind, and those are just the people who blatantly do illegal things, not touching at all upon the immoral and hurtful things which skate the edge of the law.

 

I see this as a perhaps non-purposeful extension of the negative attention cycle seen in children. Before and during socialization, children are pretty much selfish, self-involved beings. They do and say whatever they need to satisfy their id. If that includes negative behaviors, it does. To the extent those negative behaviors are rewarded with attention, it reinforces the concept and behavior pattern.

 

Why do some women find this negative-attention seeking behavior/anti-social behavior attractive? IME, they were modeled with it in their FOO (family of origin). It speaks to them as 'love' at an elemental level, largely out of their control. The drug dealer always has a date/GF because he (generally it's a he, interestingly) is an obvious focal point of attention; the law is looking for him, people want to buy his drugs, he is perceived to have money and power and can be dangerous. This appeals to the subset of women who are attracted to such dynamics. If the same man was instead laboring to find a cure for pancreatic cancer and being considered for a Nobel Prize, he wouldn't be on the radar screens of such women as an attractive man, even theoretically. He wouldn't exist to them. Heck, he could even be the quiet guy working the register at the local store where they buy their booze and cigarettes for that matter. He wouldn't register in their world.

 

There's someone for everyone. If one is not a bastard, rake or player, accept that a subset of women will never love one, never be attracted to one and one will not exist in those women's world, except perhaps as a curiosity to be played with occasionally and tossed back on the shelf. Recognizing such women and accepting them as incompatible is, IME, the key aspect of finding peace about such dynamics.

I think that women go for men with a dynamic personality....notice that I did not say a good one, just the one that is the life of the party. And yeah, money is important to some women. And I don't mean that's a bad thing if a woman feels that to an extent. After all, no wants someone that expects to be taken care of, man or woman.

 

As far as "the ghetto" goes, I have to believe in that case, because of poverty, the drug dealer is the most successful person in that area. I mean even if you make several hundred dollars a week, those guys make that in one day.

 

A man like that looks attractive to some girls, and I did say GIRLS because they are the ones that have all the trappings of success. Grown women recognize all that for what it is, and usually steer way clear.