The least painful...

[greengoddess]

My main question that runs through my head daily. What would be the least painful? Asking someone to leave who you are truly totally in love with and who is a great dad or staying with this man because you love him and would miss him terribly with the knowledge that you will never ever truly trust him again?

 

How do you decide? I have been dealing with this for a year now. Affair is supposedly over. He tells me how much he loves me and our family and he wants me. He comes home to me and our kids every day.

 

Then I find out that yes he does come home to me everyday and wes till have great sex and passion for one another but phone bill shows he has spoken with her EVERY single day 10 times a day. The only exception was our anniversary. She called him once.

 

All this time he has been lying to me. He says she is like a drug. That he just has this connection to her and they neeed to talk. Again he told me it is totally over for good. I don't believe him. How do you go from talking every single day ten times a day to nothing?

 

I love this man. Weve been married for 18 years. Weve had what i thought was a strong, loving marrriage. He reassures me and tells me to just love him and be happy. How can i be happy when i feel I am being lied to?

 

He asked me to talk to someone. To get help dealing with this and my trust issues. Trust issues? I never had a jealous thought before this. I trusted him totally. I feel if i talk to someone they will tell me to dump his ass. That I've been through too much. Too many hidden sneaky phone calls. Too many times.

 

It's like the big consolation is he comes home to me right after work every night. Well I don't want him if he spends that drive talking to her.

 

Back to my original question. I often think it may be less painful to ask him to leave but how? How do you ask someone you are totally in love with to leave? What do you say to the kids? Do I lie and say we don't love each other anymore? I love him. I don't trust him and fear I never will. Can I continue a life with someone I do not trust?

 

What will hurt less...

[Ladyjane14]

Then I find out that yes he does come home to me everyday and wes till have great sex and passion for one another but phone bill shows he has spoken with her EVERY single day 10 times a day. The only exception was our anniversary. She called him once.

 

All this time he has been lying to me. He says she is like a drug. That he just has this connection to her and they neeed to talk. Again he told me it is totally over for good. I don't believe him. How do you go from talking every single day ten times a day to nothing?

 

As long as he is in communication with the OW... he is STILL having an affair with her. It's as simple as that.

 

You feel like you have a tough choice to make, but in reality... if sharing your husband with another woman is totally unacceptable to you, the only choice available is to NOT share your husband. IOW, you have to draw that line in the sand, set it as a boundary... and be prepared to ENFORCE it. The only way to ultimately enforce a boundary with your spouse is to be WILLING to abandon the marriage if it becomes CLEAR that he will not comply.

 

Sending YOU out for counseling so that some therapist can tell you that you ought to trust a cheater at his word is just BABBLE. You see that don't you?

 

Anyway, I know it's not what you want to hear... but sometimes you have to be willing to END a marriage in order to allow it the possibility of being saved. Ultimatums come at a cost. You HAVE to be prepared to live with the consequences either way it goes, right? There's no way to predict the outcome when the odds are 50/50.

 

If I were you, I would insist on marriage counseling and him taking an active part in rebuilding the marriage. I would set my boundary at NO CONTACT EVER with the OW, and he'd need to be living with 100% transparency for the foreseeable future. And I mean... as long as it takes.

 

And honey, I'd cut him loose if he refused or if I busted him contacting her again. The path to healing does NOT include some third-wheel interloper involved in YOUR marriage. You'll not make even the first step toward healing until the affair is really over.

 

Think of it this way... 18 years is admittedly a long time. But so is 28. And so is 38.

Don't let someone else's poor choices DEFINE the meaning of YOUR LIFE.

[Ladyjane14]

What do you say to the kids? Do I lie and say we don't love each other anymore?

 

NEVER lie to your kids. You're at no obligation to damage the trust in YOUR relationship with them. Further IMHO, misinformation given to the children leaves them oftentimes feeling like they can somehow "fix" things, that they can somehow patch it up between Mom and Dad if they're just good enough or smart enough. They're stuck with a big box of puzzle pieces and the key ones missing.

 

If it comes down to it... keep your words informational, age appropriate, and emotionally unbiased. All people are flawed and imperfect. And the kids shouldn't have to feel disloyal because they still love their "imperfect" Dad.

[greengoddess]

Thank you for responding. I am really lost.

 

I know it's a joke he tells me to get help and talk to someone. I know.

 

I told him no contact EVER. He agreed. Then I finally managed to get the company phone bill. Not easy to do. Talk about a slap in the face. All his professions of love and he's still talking to her.

 

He insists he knows how hurt i am now. He insists he will never speak to her again or her him. I don't believe him.

 

I asked him to leave right after I posted this. I told him I've been living with this for too long and can't keep doing this. I told him we can do this for two more years and nothing will change. I will never trust him.

 

He told me no. He told me he will never leave me that i can leave if i feel i need to. I just need some space. I need to find my thoughts on this mess.

 

He will come home and wrap his arms around me again and I will be happy and in love then he'll leave for work and the torture begins again. All the doubts, all the wondering if he is talking to her.

 

No Ladyjane I can not share a man. NEVER.

 

Is there hope if you feel you will never get over it? Never trust again.

I'm tired and I'm sad. That's not me. I'm a happy energetic person. Where did I go?

[PWSX3]

Your H is just wanting his cake & eating it too, been there done that myself.

 

Your H has forgotten that it takes 100% from both parties to make a relationship work & he is trying to blame you for his part that he isn't putting into the relationship. Why should he blame himself when he has you to blame, it's a lot easier to find fault in others then it is to face the ones we have.

 

Ask yourself this question; how can a person put 100% effort into a relaionship when he is spending even 10-20% on another one? I'm not the best with math but I know that won't add up...

 

LJ is correct you have to set boundaries & when you set those boundaries then you have to be welling to stand up to them. You can't say; if you don't leave that OW then I'm leaving and you never leave then your H knows you are just bluffying.

 

Your H is just telling you what you want to hear, it's over, I love you not her, blah, blah, blah. If he really meant it then he would have done it long time ago.

 

Your H is the one that needs to man up to what he is doing and that's the bottom line, the only choice you have I feel are you welling to stay with a person like that or are you welling to better yourself & move on without them???????

 

Besides the counoling like many people will tell you to do there are good books out there to read. For "me" that was a very big help to understand what "I" needed to do.

 

What you are going thru is very hard and I wish you the best......

[Gunny376]

~18 years of marriage?

~kids?

~You love the smuck?

~Otherwise a good marriage?

 

I'd fight for the marriage. I'd be letting her know~that she wasn't woman enough to take my man.

 

I'd get an attorney and file a lawsuit against her for alienation of affection and get an RO against her. And threaten to take everything away from her but her dreams ~ why not? She's doing no less than that to you.

I'd get into MC and IC, and I'd put a GPS tracker on his cell and his car. Sorry Charlie that's the price you've got to pay to earn my trust back!

Look up MarriageBuilders and the book "Surviving An Affair" and other books at the site. ("The Five Languages of Love")

 

You're what? In your thirties with children. Starting over with children in your thrities isn't for the weak minded. You've got to be hard corps!

 

If he's willing ~ and you're willing, I'd work on the marriage. And, yes he is addicated. And, you've got to treat it as such. But it is something that can be overcome ~ and again its not fo the weak-minded, and its not going to be without heartache, tears and pain. But for those determined enough you can not only recover ~ but take your marriage to new heights. The two of you are at a critical turning point in the marriage. Its time to change your priorties from the day to day functional aspect of being married to the day to day emotional aspect of being married.

 

Lady Jane and Mz P went through it, but from differenet angles and with different outcomes. And, they're all :love: with their DH's today. Marriage and fidelity isn't a natural state for human beings and you've got to learn how to be married.

 

Which is harder? Staying or going? As a general rule? Divorce. That's a whole different can of "whop-azz" you don't even won't to know about. And since the divorce rate for second marriages is 10% higher than first, and the divorce rate for thrid marraiges is even 10% higher than second marriages (62% and 72%) you're best chance at martial bliss is in the one your in right now. The one with the guy that is the Father of your children.

 

I won't lie to you? The easiest way ~ divorce. But, its not always the best way. Sometimes in life, you've just got to get "broken off the chain, pit-bull, 'junk-yard' dog mean and angry and fight for what's yours! Sometimes, you've got to get madder than Hell, and say "Forget this! I'm not taking this anymore!"

 

What have you've got to lose? What have you've got to gain? Sounds like to me if you stand your ground, you've got much more to gain by standing your ground and fighting for your marriage, than you've got to lose? I'm not saying beg by any means. And, I'm not saying give up your dignity and self respect. And the DH has got to work and earn his way back into the marriage ~ no doubt. You need to set some bounderies and stake out your turf. And, I'd be letting the OW know, as well as the DH.

 

Don't let your pride be your guide!

[Ladyjane14]

I asked him to leave right after I posted this. I told him I've been living with this for too long and can't keep doing this. I told him we can do this for two more years and nothing will change. I will never trust me.

 

He told me no. He told me he will never leave me that i can leave if i feel i need to. I just need some space.

 

He will come home and wrap his arms around me again and I will be happy and in love then he'll leave for work and the torture begins again. All the doubts, all the wondering if he is talking to her.

 

No Ladyjane I can not share a man. NEVER.

 

Is there hope if you feel you will never get over it? Never trust again.

I'm tired and I'm sad. That's not me. I'm a happy energetic person. Where did I go?

 

You know, I like to believe there's ALWAYS hope.

People can and do recover from infidelity, and often end up with an even stronger relationship.

 

That said... it's not an easy path.

 

I've seen Dr. Phil say this a couple of times... and I'm going to paraphrase... 'Unless and until the betrayed spouse is completely assured that the formerly wayward spouse understands EXACTLY the feelings pain and injury his cheating has caused... not one step forward can be made in healing the marriage'. Not one step.

You're still where you are today because you DO NOT believe that he truly does identify with your pain and suffering.

 

Now, that's not saying that he never can... just that so far, he hasn't.

 

This is why the boundaries are important. This is why a NO CONTACT EVER rule is important. This is why 100% transparency for "as long as it takes" is important.

 

If he's not going to cooperate with those ultimatums though... you literally have NOTHING to work with. That "one step" CANNOT be made.

 

Anyway, you might not be able to put him out today. But you don't have to tolerate him continuing to cheat on you either. See an attorney and get yourself a plan for how you can legally ENFORCE your boundaries. Alot of them will offer a low-cost or even free initial consult. You'll feel much better when you know what your rights are.

 

Meanwhile... set those boundaries. If he says he's in full NC, ask that he prove it to you. And that he KEEP proving it to you. He's worth less than nothing to you if he won't work actively to EARN your trust back

 

 

And... one last thought about what to tell the children if it becomes necessary to separate. When you walk a mile in a kid's shoes, it seems a bit arbitrary and even kind of scary for Mom and Dad to suddenly "drift apart" and STOP loving each other. A kid has no way to guarantee himself that the same won't happen to him.

 

So, if you do decide to separate, keep it simple and age appropriate... but don't be dishonest either. I know there's alot of argument out there about what should be told to children.. but I just sooooo disagree with LYING to kids. IMHO, it sets them up for unrealistic expectations and unresolved anxieties. It just seems to be better to deal with life's tribulations matter-of-factly and as they come.

[PWSX3]

Could I suggest a good warm up book. I read His Needs, Her Needs and that was a good starter for me.

 

I know your H is not doing his part & because of that you are having doubts, but maybe there is a good chance there are things that you could still do to get him back interested in you.

My guess is your H feels he is lacking something in your relationship, someone else has paid attention to him & he likes that feeling.

 

I know from first hand experience that people get in a rut in there marriage. They start expecting to many things from the other person.

 

When is the last time you two went out on a "date"? When was the last time he brought you flowers or did something nice for you because he wanted to? When was the last time you let candles & put something sexy on for him?

 

What you have to do is find what those things were that first attracted you to each other and get that back again. No you won't get that crush type feeling or those fun little butterflies, and Gunny could give you the stats on how long that lasts but you can get back that feeling of loving each other again.

I am reading a book now called Relationship Rescue and I'm not finished with it but it has also been a good book, but there is a lot of homework you have to do so it takes a little more time.

 

My best advice is educate yourself and do what you can do. Then you have to hope that with your changes he will realize that he needs to step up to the plate as well.

 

I feel if you love someone you need to fight for what you want. When my W moved out and I was talking to my best friend he said something that will stick with me forever. He said; have you done everything you could to save your marriage?????

I was able to tell myself; no I hadn't done everything I could do & that is when I started looking at myself & figure out what I could do, not what I wanted the other person to do for me.

I'm still learning and I've still got issues but that's another story. :laugh: but my point is do what you can do, make yourself the best person you can.

[Gunny376]

So, if you do decide to separate, keep it simple and age appropriate... but don't be dishonest either. I know there's alot of argument out there about what should be told to children.. but I just sooooo disagree with LYING to kids. IMHO, it sets them up for unrealistic expectations and unresolved anxieties. It just seems to be better to deal with life's tribulations matter-of-factly and as they come

 

Forever and ever ~ Amen!

[Gunny376]

I'm still learning and I've still got issues but that's another story. :laugh: but my point is do what you can do, make yourself the best person you can.

 

And, that's not just today, nor tommorow ~ married or single ~ that's a lifelong chore!

[greengoddess]

Gunny thank you for that kick butt pep talk. I'm scared to try. I tried and I was happy again. Truly happy but just felt something wasn't right. Just too many times where we'd be having a conversation and he'd insist he told me something when he hadn't. So I went the phone bill route and was crushed again.

 

He is so remourseful and loving. Calling all the time. Asking me to go to the office with him. I just can't go through this again. I shut my heart off and it's coming back and i don't want it to. I don't want to feel so in love again that i can be hurt this bad. I'm afraid of that.

 

pws i can't figure out what was missing in our marriage. We did date all the time. Always went out. Vacationed without the kids and just really took good care of ourselves. That's why I'm so lost. how could this happen if everything was perfect? He assures me nothing is missing that he's so happy and just wants me and he can't explain the odd connection with her. He insists he doesn't know why he talked to her.

 

Ladyjane my kids have watched a good friends parents split and my oldest has said such horrible things about the cheating father. My husband is a great dad. How can I crush their respect for him. He deserves whatever I do with us but he doesn't deserve to lose our kids respect. They love him. Won't I hurt my kids if I have to tell them the truth.

 

Gunny my state does not have AOA laws. I have called her and told her to stay away from my family. She has no remorse. No conscience. She doesn't care about my kids or me. Basically in her opinion if our marriage wasn't already broken then she could not have gotten in to him.

 

I would love to legally go after her. She persued him. It's all in the phone bill although he had his fair share of calls. He married me he needs to answer to me. I won't give her anymore space in my head. I just need to learn to trust my husband again but what if I can't? What if i know deep down I never will? Do I waste years only to find out what i may know today? It would be so easy if I didn't love him anymore or if our marriage was in trouble before this or If I believed he loved her and didn't love me anymore. It would be so easy.