not mad about other girls;mad about lying

[CrushedOrgans]

oh dear lord, please help me, this is such a non-problem, i feel like i should just get over it, but i can't.

 

i'll try to make this as short as possible. i caught my fiance, i'll call him ryan, looking at these videos of stripping girls online. he was in a chatroom with some of his real life friends (they were going to play an online game together) and he sent them this link to a few videos and sites of this one girl. they said they'd seen it before, but he kept saying things like "it's worth looking again, look at that ass and those nice big titties." *mine are bigger by the way, which i smugly mentioned, ha)

 

okay, so not bad right?

 

but he has said for all the time we were together (about 2 years) that he has a lot of porn (i've seen it all, i really don't mind it) but that he doesn't look at anything new, not even the old stuff, and doesn't even think about girls that way when he's in a relationship. he didn't even go to a bachelor party for a good friend at a strip club because he had started dating me before it occurred.

 

so obviously i find that not looking and saying things about girls is a lie and i caught him. i don't mind the porn, i look at it myself and he knows it (surely i don't have as much or have looked at as much as him, but i have enjoyed it and find it erotic, with him as well) but i don't lie about it. and i look at acts of sex, i don't pinpoint one man and talk explicitly about how much i enjoy his body parts.

 

so i asked him, "you lied to me about looking (he said someone sent it to him,which occurs sometimes and is the only time he looks, which is possible, but still) what else are you lying about it? were you picturing her naked and thinking about having sex with her?" and he said well, i was picturing her naked out of curiosity but i don't think about having sex with other girls." he also said he doesn't masturbate to them either. i sort of believe that, but i don't know. he doesn't do it often anyway. i felt like he was being just enough honest to not have to tell me the worse stuff.

 

so i said "when you go out with your friends in real life, do you look at girls this way?" and he said no, he considers online and real life very different.

 

my questions are, is he lying, is he thinking about screwing other girls and making me think he is this innocent creature? what is it like for most guys? i feel like i've been cheated on, even though i know i haven't and i'm lucky he's just 'appreaciating' with the eyes.

 

but is the only thing keeping him from checking out real life girls the possibility that something could happen? because real life people and online people should be equal when it comes to arousal, if they're both not to be taken seriously...and yes, i agree, my opinion also means that looking at real life is okay, as long as it's really just looking, seeing someone who looks nice and noticing.

 

i guess i just want to know how to get this trust back. i don't think he would do anything to hurt me, but i didn't think he would lie either. so now i feel like i never know what he's really thinking, and maybe even doing. if you lie about little things, does it always mean you lie about big things?

 

how do i get past this? how do i accept that i'm not mad about him looking, but that i believed him when he said he wasn't that kind of guy? i know they all say that, but i only really ever believed him, he's so polite and benign.

 

i know that in order to get past it, i have to suck it up, accept that it could have been much worse, and that he lied to not hurt my feelings. but is it really as simple as that?

 

and why do i keep seeing his words about this other girl in my head, over and over? it's making me physically ill, and i never thought i would react this way.

 

please, any advice at all. thank you very much.

[CrushedOrgans]

or is there anywhere else anyone can point me in the right direction? this may have been discussed a lot here. i just thought mine was different because nothing actually happened, i just didn't like what i saw and feel he was being dishonest. so i need more of a way for me to just accept it and get over it, which would be different that advice on porn addiction and actual cheating and stuff. that was all i found.

[MarnieGirl]

it doesn't really sound like he has a porn problem, but i can see where you'd be upset. how did you find out? did he just show it to you? did you get in on the chatroom, or did you snoop on his computer cause you were suspicious.

 

i do think you should always listen to your gut, but in this case, he seems like he is usually honest about most things. i think it's safe to assume that all guys think about hot girls this way, probably even about having sex with them.

 

but don't you have anything private that you keep to yourself that you don't think he needs to know, and that if he knew, it would hurt his feelings? i don't mean things that can really hurt you, like hiding something really important, but something like he has? just some harmless looking at hot girls he can never touch anyway?

 

i think if you were worried about him cheating, it would be different. i think he "lied" to save your feelings, and i think he knows better now. i say "lied" because it really doesn't sound like he's always into the porn. i do think it's possible he does look at the stuff people send him, and may pass it on, and that it doesn't have to mean he is searching day and night for chicks. he still likes the way they look, whatever, but he's fine with an occasional forward instead of hunting.

 

however, just because it is the generally accepted view that "guys will be guys and look at girls and think about sex with them" is not to say that YOU have to accept it. you might have trouble finding one that doesn't, though.

[CrushedOrgans]

thanks, marinegirl. i know all that you're saying in my heart, really. i know it. but i just keep thinking of those words he said about this girl. it hurts and i didn't expect it would. he always tells me i'm beautiful, but i don't look a thing like this girl, she couldn't be more opposite, except we both have dark hair. i can't believe it, it's like a tape running over and over in my head. and sometimes i feel like i want to be with him so badly, so feel with him me, and then i hear it again in my head how much he enjoyed her body and i don't want him to even touch me.

 

i wish i could delete it from my mind. then everything would be fine.

[CrushedOrgans]

so last night we talked about a lot of stuff. i do feel a little better, but still somewhat reserved.

 

i feel more sexually attracted to him lately, and last night i got on top (haven't in quite some time.) he came in 2 minutes.

[CrushedOrgans]

things have taken a turn for the worse.

 

i am so hurt. he had a screenname in his pants pocket. he went out with his friends last night, to a "friend's house" but i think he really went to a bar. his clothes were all smokey.

 

i don't know that it's a girl's name, but it sure looks like it. i added it to my lost but i haven't seen it on yet.

 

i want to check his computer again. since i have confronted him, he has said he is sorry and won't do it anymore, but he deleted all his past conversation from his aim logs and turned the log off.

 

is there anything i can check to see what he's up to? he has windows, probably xp, but i don't know where to look. i am sure he deletes his history, but isn't it really impossible to completely delete anything? i should be able to find something.

 

i don't want to use a keylogger, he is big on computers and knows a lot about them, and i would be afraid he would know it was there.

 

i want to see what he is hiding. any help?

 

why is it always online? he didn't even get a phone number!

[CrushedOrgans]

please someone help me. i want to be able to confront him with actual proof, because if i don't, i let myself doubt what i think and i will give him the benefit of the doubt.

 

if there's nothing, i would like to continue planning my wedding, what left there is to plan.

 

if i really find something, i am going to cancel it and not look back.

 

any tips or anyone who can point me in the right direction to a post on ls about tips on finding out? i don't mean reading facial expressions and twitches and stuff like that, i mean how to look on his computer, where i could find something. and can he tell if i look?

[Guest]

Look, guys look at porn, they look at girls online, they look at girls on the street. They sometimes use those images to masturbate. It's not a big deal, and there's no reason to feel threatened. You are turning this into a big deal because you are insecure.

 

Now you totally want to invade his privacy by looking at what he's doing on the computer. And you think you're ready to get married? You know nothing about men and will make his life a living breathing hell if you marry him - absolutely do not do that unless you can stop being so immature and insecure!

 

Outside of this, have you ever had any reason to feel bad about how he treats you or what he's done? Does he respect you, is he kind to you, does he make you feel like you are his one and only? If so, don't ruin your relationship by doing dumb stuff and thinking that guys don't masturbate or look at girls. Every guy masturbates, every guy looks, and you will never find a guy who doesn't. Grow up.

[scrybe74]

Pretty much all guys check out other women whether they are in a relationship or not. A good chunk of women do the same. My gf is honest enough to admit that to me and me to her. It's not big deal because that's where you TRUST the person you're with. There is a big difference between checking out other females and actually trying to turn it into something real.

 

That being said....I think it's a little disrespectful to you for him to comment on other women's bodies like that. Again...I've seen a woman on the internet or walking down the street and thought to myself 'man...would I love to get a handful of that _____" But....BUT.....I don't say it around my gf, I don't even say it out loud to myself or my buddies. It's just shows little or no class in my opinion when you're in a relationship.

 

He seems guilty of bad judgement and social manners. (I can guess what stripping video he's talking about...she's pretty famous on the web). As to what he's thinking in his head or whether he masturbates to it or not....I think you should let that go. What goes on in his head and what he does when he self pleasures should be his own privacy.

 

Just tell him that when he talks like that about other women it makes you really uncomfortable and hurts your feelings and see what he does about it.

[CrushedOrgans]

Look, guys look at porn, they look at girls online, they look at girls on the street. They sometimes use those images to masturbate. It's not a big deal, and there's no reason to feel threatened. You are turning this into a big deal because you are insecure.

 

Now you totally want to invade his privacy by looking at what he's doing on the computer. And you think you're ready to get married? You know nothing about men and will make his life a living breathing hell if you marry him - absolutely do not do that unless you can stop being so immature and insecure!

 

Outside of this, have you ever had any reason to feel bad about how he treats you or what he's done? Does he respect you, is he kind to you, does he make you feel like you are his one and only? If so, don't ruin your relationship by doing dumb stuff and thinking that guys don't masturbate or look at girls. Every guy masturbates, every guy looks, and you will never find a guy who doesn't. Grow up.

 

i was willing to get over it and then i found a name in his pants.

 

don't you dare tell me to grow up. i don't trust him because he lied to me, not because he looked at porn. you obviously didn't read my first post.

 

in my opinion, yes it upset me to see what he said about her. but someone who does that and LIES about it seems less ready to get married than someone who is trying to prevent a potential problem in the relationship.

[CrushedOrgans]

 

(I can guess what stripping video he's talking about...she's pretty famous on the web).

 

Just tell him that when he talks like that about other women it makes you really uncomfortable and hurts your feelings and see what he does about it.

 

i doubt it's anyone you're thinking, honestly, though i would like to know who you're talking about. at least if it was a celebrity i would feel better that it's not some chick just showing her stuff off and who could live next door. it's not that keyra chick, and my ass is nicer anyway, if that's who you mean.

 

but thanks for the rest of it, i appreciate your comments. i have told him it bothered me, but how do i find out now if he actually stopped?

 

and yeah, i get that "most men look at porn and think of having sex with other people." but at the same time, many women don't like the idea of it all, even if they do accept it. so why do the women always seem to be expected to secede to the man in this issue EVERYTIME? why isn't it "oh well i love my girlfriend and i know she wouldn't like this so i won't." i neeeeeeeeed to feel like he loves me and only me, i don't think he neeeeeeeeeeeds porn. see what i mean, a little bit?

[Guest]

Yeah? Well maybe he lies about it because he knew you'd be so immature and overreact. As you have.

[CrushedOrgans]

do any other longstanding members (not shady anonymous guests) have any real advice that is beyond "get over it, your feelings don't count"? i mean, i supposed to get married here, this is about my prom date.

[purspeed]

You need Homer McDonald. Look him up. He will cure all of your problems, no joke.

[CrushedOrgans]

Yeah? Well maybe he lies about it because he knew you'd be so immature and overreact. As you have.

 

so it should be okay to lie to someone to continue a behavior that you know would hurt someone's feelings if they knew? it's okay to lie so you don't have to deal with getting in trouble? you suck.

 

and he wouldn't have gotten in trouble anyway. i guess it makes me mad when people lie to me. see the name of the thread? i don't mind porn, i like it. i watch it myself. but i don't lie about it. and he had no reason to lie. he knows i watch it, i never hid it from him. i'd usually show him what i was watching and we'd end up...hanging out.

 

and yes, it is definitely to immature to have feelings and an opinion. i'm just a woman. silly me.

 

last time i checked, lying to your fiance wasn't considered the height of maturity either. and neither is hiding behind being a guest so you can't get kicked out for being a d*ckhead.

 

oh, well. i guess you didn't see i already have a solution--posting my own nude video on the web for other guys to check out.

[Guest Girl]

Firstly I can understand the fact it is the lying and not the porn itself that is the main thing which is upsetting you here. And also the difference between porn involving sexual acts and that focussed entirely on a particular person. I experienced both in my last long term relationship, and with hindsight wish I had got out soon after the first few lies came to light, as the trust was never regained and the cost to my own confidence was huge.

 

When you've taken the time to explain your own limits and boundaries, believe you and a partner are on the same wavelength, and that you've been heard and understood, it really will throw you when suddenly you wonder who your partner actually is and if they lied about this, what else are they lying about. And in light of the screen name on top of that (which could be entirely innocent but I appreciate at this point you're so worked up you really do wonder) it's understandable you're upset, angry and shaken.

 

If you've tried to talk to him thats a start, but its a sad fact (as I found with my ex) that different people have different levels of needs and ability to communicate. You can explain your feelings to him until you're blue in the face and he still may not 'get' where you are coming from. Thats not your fault, but neither is it his - you may just be too different in that respect and trying to force understanding is as productive as banging your head against a wall.

 

Revenge tactics of making your own stripping video... understandable to a degree, also one way of temporarily making yourself feel 'better' than the girl he was talking about, but utterly futile in terms of finding a workable and mature solution to the real problem between you. You're hurt and you don't trust him, he will probably end up hurt and angry and unable to trust you - so you're both feeling equally crap and no one wins, and the relationship crumbles...

 

My advice for now - you need to calm down, take some time out, maybe go stay with a friend away from him and especially his computer. You are upset enough to become rather obsessive at this point (its natural - I've been there myself), and you need to step back from the situation somewhat. If he isn't trustworthy, he isn't, regardless of you watching his every move or not. If he is, in your current state you probably won't believe it anyhow. You both need to have a lot more talks over a period of time, with space from each other and the issue in between.

 

When you're this stressed everything escalates - I bet the thought of who he thinks about when he masturbates never even crossed your mind before this discovery? Or if it did, you shrugged it off again because you otherwise felt secure

[scrybe74]

i doubt it's anyone you're thinking, honestly, though i would like to know who you're talking about. at least if it was a celebrity i would feel better that it's not some chick just showing her stuff off and who could live next door. it's not that keyra chick, and my ass is nicer anyway, if that's who you mean.

 

but thanks for the rest of it, i appreciate your comments. i have told him it bothered me, but how do i find out now if he actually stopped?

 

and yeah, i get that "most men look at porn and think of having sex with other people." but at the same time, many women don't like the idea of it all, even if they do accept it. so why do the women always seem to be expected to secede to the man in this issue EVERYTIME? why isn't it "oh well i love my girlfriend and i know she wouldn't like this so i won't." i neeeeeeeeed to feel like he loves me and only me, i don't think he neeeeeeeeeeeds porn. see what i mean, a little bit?

 

Yep...I was thinking of Keyra....and you have an ass even CLOSE to that.....then he's a fool.....foolish man! FOOLISH....

 

(Okay....I'm calm now....get it together....)

 

Anyway...I get what you're saying. The most important thing is that he lied to you. Spying on him is going down a path that you don't want to go. You should feel comfortable in your relationship and not have to feel the need to check up on him.

 

As far as how do you know if his actions are in line with what you need in a relationship....I say give it a few weeks or a couple of months. It'll come out one way or another if it's important to him. If it is...and that's the way he is .,...you need to do a real serious gut and decide if you want to continue living with these uncertainties. You sound like a pretty open minded girl.....sometimes guys can take that for granite.

 

I with I had something more positive and concrete for you....

[CrushedOrgans]

guest girl and scrybe, i really can't thank you enough. honestly, thank you. this really has been a hard time, and sometimes i realize this is all over something stupid, but then i am reminded that he really did lie and that's what it is all about. so thank you for taking my feelings into consideration, no matter how much you may disagree with me on certain points. i really do appreciate it.