Lost my faith, might find it again...but might not

[Love Hurts]

Again - you side step and dodge what I asked in my original post.

 

I asked why you have compliments for BT and not for Moai?

 

Both are non-Christians.

 

Is it because BT does believe in some form of God so therefore the posts by BT are not scrutinized and addressed the same way?

 

To me - that is hypocritical. As far as what your religion says, a non-believer is a non-believer. All are supposed to be treated the same way. And the bible directly addressed how they are to be treated.

 

Yet there is a dramatic difference in the way you have responded to BT and Moai.

 

I asked WHY there is a difference.

 

You did not address why there was a difference.

 

You stated justification for BT's compliments - and side stepped the issue of why Moai apparently deserves none (even though your compliments are about the eloquence of BT's post though ideas in it are somewhat misguided, etc.).

 

This was the question of my post - I was not inquiring about the validation of your review of BT's post but rather why there is a compliment to one and NOT the other when you have so clearly stated you address non-believer posts with the same hand equally.

 

Are you going to side step the question that is clearly posed in this post again?

 

Moai does not see freewill as it is. So just live life and end up where ever; since each life has been predetermined.

 

After many offers of explanation of freewill are nonsufficient and apparently not helpful. Alas we look to another to pickup in area where another cannot reach.

 

This is obvious in post in #183…[b.T. has the ability to take it to finite]

Not all of us are saved; we must remember those of us that are- once were not.

As we are all sinners saved by grace we grow in the Lord one day at a time; before and after salvation.

 

You see I do not agree with all of B.T. teachings. Yet I give credit where credit is due.

 

I can also see help is available through B.T. in certain areas…and

then I would like to take it from there….

 

onward to Jesus Christ as our Lord and Savior.

 

I hope this is clearer for you.

God Bless*

[Rooster_DAR]

Interesting!

 

http://www.archaeology.org/0701/abstracts/evolution.html

 

Why is it we keep finding ancient ancestors of humans that evolved from other ape like ancestors in an evolutionary chain? Hmmm...I guess the devil is at work here.

 

[Moai]

i am not going to address every point this time, moai, because i have said enough to awaken a soul that wants to be re-awakened or to see a bigger and infinitely more complex picture. but a couple of things leapt out.

 

That is your prerogative.

 

you took on a dense body on a dense planet where evidence for god MUST be veiled in order to make free will a possibility. in other words, birth made you forget. this isn't the case for everyone - many people, myself included, re-remember the plan they made before they were born.

 

First, you say God must be veiled in order to make free will possible. Fine, but you have no evidence that this is the case. you simply believe it. That's fine for you, but some of us need a little more than just taking someone's word for it.

 

Second, how do you know that you remember the plan? Are you sure that is what you remember, instead of you making things up and wishing them to be true? How is it that you can remember things that happened before you had a brain ot remember with? Since this experience cannot be duplicated, that is I do not share the experience, it is obviously reserved for an elect. Why are you elect and I (and almost everyone else) not?

 

Hindus, who believe in reincarnation, say specifically that you cannot remember your previous lives, as that would effect the decisions you would make here, and the lessons you are to learn.

 

you currently have a very narrow viewpoint of the world, moai. there is so much more to it than you have so far realised. you see everything in black and white terms and are therefore unreachable for anyone who would show you the things of the spirit. although i have to say - you know the woman. why does she not feel platonic love and companionship from YOU?

 

Thank you for your onion of my viewpoint. I think that you consider it narrow because I reject your fantasy, and that's it. To say I am not spiritual because I reject the notion of a supreme being is a very narrow viewpoint, actually. Why do YOU have such a narrow viewpoint of spirituality?

 

I don't know her well enough to love her. As far as I know (she works with a friend), she works, and goes home. She doesn't feel what you mentioned because we aren't close.

 

it was einstein, not me, who made the discovery that everything is energy. what negative spin you put on it is coloured by your existing beliefs. there are only absolutes when you're looking at life from your perspective. from my perspective there are no absolutes save ultimate truth and untruth. everything else is illusory.

 

You are equivocating. Feel free, but I took your meaning in the context of this thread, and spirituality. And to extrapolate from Relativity to your version of spirituality is specious at best. But you can think whatever you want, and arrive at conclusions however you arrive at them. I prefer to arrive at conclusions using evidence and reason.

 

you have heard but you have not understood.

 

Typical. Anyone who doesn't agree with you just doesn't get it.

 

I get it, I think it is silly, and irrational. There is also no evidence for what you assert. So I reject it. I am certainly open to the possibility that it could be true, but I would like some evidence first.

 

Tell me, do you have the same attitude? Are you open to evidence of another definition of spirituality than your own? I doubt it. You would require evidence, just like I do. So would any Christian, Jew or Muslim--or any theist of any stripe. I would think that by being open to all of them, but strictly demanding evidence would give me a better chance of discovering the correct one. So far I am unconvinced, but there is always a chance.

 

i don't know how you got this from my post. perhaps you wanted it to be there. i said actions have consequences. i said even mistakes can lead to growth.

 

And I don't disagree with you.

 

i also said there is no hell and i would certainly never claim to know who is heading where in this life or beyond it.

 

You contradict yourself, even in that one sentence. You say there is no Hell, and yet you also say that you don't know where people are going when they die. If you don't know where people are going, how do you know there is no hell.

 

The fact is, you don't know there isn't one. You just believe there isn't. I don't either, but I also know that it is possible. It's possible that we got to a world made out of marshmallow. Both are equally likely, as is your idea of what happens. All have an equal amount of evidence to support them (as I have said), namely none. I don't for a minute think that any of them are accurate, but I could be wrong. You have settled on an idea, and have determined that you are right and Love Hurts and Lonely Bird, for example, are wrong. They believe in Hell. You have declared them wrong and you right with no evidence. I deny them all because they have no evidence. I treat them all equally. I am also equally open to all of them. You are not. Who is more spiritually open?

 

moai, you don't have to dismiss everything you hear that's new or that doesn't confirm what you already think you know. people are surprising and they can often teach you something. you have taught me something, but then i am open to learning new things.

 

That may be, but you assume that I have never heard of your beliefs system before. It isn't new. I am always looking but I have not learned of a "new" spiritual idea for 15 years now. But I am open to hearing about one. And I don't dismiss everything I hear, I just dismiss assertions that have no evidence to back them up.

 

What you want is for me to take your word for it, and grab your hand, and have you take me down this wonderful road you have found. It is a primrose path. I am sure that if I accepted your assertions there is some logic to what you believe (but not much), but I don't think that way. I have found rational thought and demanding evidence has served me well, and I have no reason to abandon that approach just because you have spoken.

 

sigh. everything i said about you having absolute free will made you come to the conclusion i think you should be FORCED into MY point of view? this is a good example of someone blinkered by dualistic reaoning being able to twist anything.

 

I didn't say forced, did I? Where did you get that from? I am simply pointing out that you are doing nothing but asserting things and asking me to accept them.

 

And yes, to an extent my reasoning is dualistic. There is either a god or there is not. I fail to see how that "blinkers" me.

 

Once that is solved, it ceases to be dualistic. Show me there is a god, first, and then we can start on the 1500 different forms of Christianity, if you like. But we must establish that there is a god at all first. This has not been done to my, or anyones else's satisfaction. Believers call it "faith" in god for a reason.

 

You have also asserted that what you say is true whether I accept it or not, and that I'll find out eventually. Granted, that is a little more benign than consigning me to Hell as Christians do, but the reasoning is the same.

 

And you are right. I may find out that you are correct. I may find out that they are correct. Or none of you. My money is just on none of you.

 

I have taken the bold step not to believe something for which there is no evidence. Could I be wrong? Sure. Is it possible that evidence will be presented that will convince me otherwise? You bet. I doubt it, but it is possible.

 

I don't believe in leprechauns, unicorns, Atlantis, astrology, ghosts, gnomes, or ogres. Or gods, no matter how you choose to redefine them. They all have the same amount of evidence for them: none. I am sure that you don't consider me closed-minded because I reject leprechauns, do you? Do you think that I reject leprechauns because I don't understand them?

 

to clarify, i would never want to interfere with your free will - or anyone else's - in order to get them to think a certain way. my entire belief system is based upon what i have experienced of god and what god (or should i say, spiritual teachers in the spiritual realm) has taught me.

 

By definition you cannot interfere with my free will, but you are trying to convince me that what you say is true, are you not? And I have admitted that I am open to any evidence that you can present. You just haven't presented any.

 

You speak with spiritual teachers in the spiritual realm, huh? How is that done, exactly? And how do you know that you are in the "spiritual realm" and not just imagining it?

 

it would be counterproductive in the extreme to seek to change someone's mind on the issue of god against their will. i speak to give you a different point of view, that's all.

 

As I said, you can't change my mind against my will. And I have considered your point of view and rejected it. No offense.

 

what you do with it has absolutely no affect on me. if you reject everything i say outright and call me a moron, i don't mind in the slightest. i am only responsible for myself. i feel no urge or desire to get you to change your mind. i only want to let you know there is more than one way to live.

 

Of course there are. That does not imply that all ways to live are equally valid.

 

your beliefs are based upon your experience so far and they are valid. my belief is based upon my experience so far, and whether you think it is valid or not should show you how dominated you are by the belief system of science, a system in which other people tell you what to think and feel it's okay to belittle anyone who questions the platform of having to accept other people's findings of what is real, what is unreal, and their assertion that only things you can measure in certain experiments have any validity.

 

Your beliefs are made up of your experience so far as well. Science is not a "belief system" in the sense that yours is. Science is a way to look at and understand the natural world. Nobody tells other people what to think in science. There is evidence, or there is not. And nobody is belittled, either--in fact, questioning the status quo is central to the way science works. Men make an assertion, present their evidence, and then everyone everywhere tries to prove that assertion wrong. When that cannot be done, it is provisionally accepted. There is always the chance that further evidence will be discovered that proves the current thinking incorrect. When that occurs, the current thinking is abandoned immediately. Science is self-correcting. There are certain things that after enough evidence comes in, it is considered silly to doubt them, like the Earth revolving around the Sun or evolution, but as we discover more our perception of the world changes. It is not dogmatic.

 

I use science because evidence has shown that it is by far the best way to understand the world around us. There may be a better way, but so far we haven't thought of one.

[Moai]

Moai does not see freewill as it is. So just live life and end up where ever; since each life has been predetermined.

 

I must disagree. I think that humans have free will and are responsible for their actions, in the system of justice we have devised if necessary. I do not believe in any afterlife justice. I could be wrong, but I doubt it.

 

In our conversation it would seem that you do not understand the concept of free will, and that within your belief system you contradict yourself.

 

After many offers of explanation of freewill are nonsufficient and apparently not helpful. Alas we look to another to pickup in area where another cannot reach.

 

And no offense, your explanations are nonsensical. I find it amazing that you can rationalize such a thing, but obviously do. And you are welcome to, of course, but I think most people would have a more difficult time with your reasoning.

 

This is obvious in post in #183…[b.T. has the ability to take it to finite]

Not all of us are saved; we must remember those of us that are- once were not.

As we are all sinners saved by grace we grow in the Lord one day at a time; before and after salvation.

 

I would appreciate any comments you wish to make on my post regarding salvation, and how it is accomplished.

 

 

God Bless*

[burning 4 revenge]

Moai, brilliant post (278)

[Love Hurts]

Interesting!

 

http://www.archaeology.org/0701/abstracts/evolution.html

 

Why is it we keep finding ancient ancestors of humans that evolved from other ape like ancestors in an evolutionary chain? Hmmm...I guess the devil is at work here.

 

 

When archeologists dig up bones and tell us they are dated billions of years old. I have no problem with that I have no problem with dinosaurs …

The Bible explains the world was populated before Adam and Eve for that we have the Gap between Genesis 1 verses one and two…along with other supportive scriptures.

 

In the beginning when God created the world He did not plant bones in the ground to weaken mans faith.

 

What are your views?

God Bless*

[Storyrider]

OP, if you are still around, I was thinking about books you might find helpful. Forgive me if you've already read them.

 

See Mere Christianity by CS Lewis for a readable Christian apology

 

Another book I found inspiring was Tales of the Hasidim as retold by Martin Buber, a Jewish existentialist. This book is a collection of parables in the Jewish Hasidic (a branch of orthodoxy) tradition.

[burning 4 revenge]

It amazes me the lengths people go to to redifine Christianity to make it adapt to our current state of knowledge and their own personal peceptions. It's an emotional repsonse, not a rational one, but they go through a great bit of trouble to rationalize it.

 

We also have a great number of people, scholars included, who wish to simply invent Jesus in the way they want to understand him. The truth is we have very little evidence of who he was. What evidence we do have suggests that he was an Apocalyptic preacher and that he must have rebelled against Mosaic Law in some respects and made some lofty claims for himself. After that it becomes confusing, because we don't know what Paul may have changed or added and the gospel accounts we have come from Paul's movement.

 

I think the world became a better place, because of Chrisianity, but that doesn't legitimize it as truth.

[Moai]

Moai, brilliant post (278)

 

Thank you very much!

[Love Hurts]

I must disagree. I think that humans have free will and are responsible for their actions, in the system of justice we have devised if necessary. I do not believe in any afterlife justice. I could be wrong, but I doubt it.

 

In our conversation it would seem that you do not understand the concept of free will, and that within your belief system you contradict yourself.

 

 

 

And no offense, your explanations are nonsensical. I find it amazing that you can rationalize such a thing, but obviously do. And you are welcome to, of course, but I think most people would have a more difficult time with your reasoning.

 

 

 

I would appreciate any comments you wish to make on my post regarding salvation, and how it is accomplished.

 

 

God Bless*

 

If you do not find Christ in your lifetime and call Him Lord Savior.

Your freewill did that not predestination.

 

I am not familiar with your postings on salvation if any on Salvation...

If it was discussed you can refresh my memories without my searching posts.

 

[i suspect you may have aligned my ending comment as if you stated it]

 

However for any all that seek salvation in the Lord.

 

CONSIDER THESE STEPS:

 

1) A confession or agreement with God that we are a *sinner.

Romans 3:23

2)A request asking God to forgive us our sins.

Ephesians 2:4

3) An acceptance of Jesus as our Savior and asking Him to be the Lord of our life.

Acts 16:31

4) An acknowledgement that God raised Jesus from the dead. Romans 10:9

5) A request for help to live as Jesus wants us to live.

Romans 7:18

6) A close thanking God for the gift of His Wonderful Son and His merciful gift of salvation.

 

Romans 6:17

Salvation is completely dependent upon faith in Christ and not at all dependent upon belonging to a man-made organization.

 

A Model Sinner's Prayer

 

"Dear God in heaven, I come before you in the name of Jesus. I confess that I am a sinner and ask you to forgive me and cleanse me from my sins. I receive Jesus as my Savior and ask Him to come into my heart. I confess with my mouth that Jesus is Lord and that You raised Him from the dead. I ask you to please help me to live as you want me to live. I thank you for the gift of your wonderful Son Jesus and Your merciful free gift of salvation. In Jesus' wonderful name. Amen."

 

Its not an elaborate speech. It’s a willing heart.

 

The thief on the cross said nine words to salvation.

 

[Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.]

 

The shortest sinner's prayer in the Bible is recorded for us in Luke Chapter 18, a chapter where Jesus was giving some parables on the subject of prayer. In verse 13 Jesus has a publican, that is, a hated tax gatherer praying the following words

 

"God, be merciful to me, the sinner!"

 

"All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me" (Mt 28:18).

Another may only say, Jesus save me.

 

Or simply Jesus. …and will be saved, because of the power of His Name as

"All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me" (Mt 28:18).

And God knows a heart…

 

Salvation is not an articulate speech; it’s the hearts desire.

 

We may question how many that believe or have believed in God and are saved?

 

All they had to call on the name of the Lord… God knows a heart.

That’s the diff in a mental ascent and one of the heart.

 

I hope this helps clarify salvation and how it its not difficult to be saved.

 

God Bless*

[Moai]

It amazes me the lengths people go to to redifine Christianity to make it adapt to our current state of knowledge and their own personal peceptions. It's an emotional repsonse, not a rational one, but they go through a great bit of trouble to rationalize it.

 

Interesting point. It seems to me that everyone wants and needs evidence for what they believe, but many, many people do it backwards. They decide that god exists, for example, and then look for evidence to support that decision. And when the evidence goes against their assumption the evidence is simply "wrong" or they torture it to make i fit somehow, instead of abandoning their position in favor of one supported by the evidence. Most people don't even seem to notice what "evidence" is, either.

 

We also have a great number of people, scholars included, who wish to simply invent Jesus in the way they want to understand him. The truth is we have very little evidence of who he was. What evidence we do have suggests that he was an Apocalyptic preacher and that he must have rebelled against Mosaic Law in some respects and made some lofty claims for himself. After that it becomes confusing, because we don't know what Paul may have changed or added and the gospel accounts we have come from Paul's movement.

 

I agree, and I find the subject interesting--although I must admit I don't know as much as I'd like, or should. Lots of stuff on the reading list...

 

I think the world became a better place, because of Chrisianity, but that doesn't legitimize it as truth.

 

Your reasoning is correct above, but I would argue that the world is a better place IN SPITE OF Christianity, but that is another thread!

[Storyrider]

Moai, aren't you the one who reads auras?

[pricillia]

Moai, aren't you the one who reads auras?

 

 

oh if that is true and Moai read my Aura then it would be black

[burning 4 revenge]

Moai, aren't you the one who reads auras?

That would be The Alchemyst

[Moai]

If you do not find Christ in your lifetime and call Him Lord Savior.

Your freewill did that not predestination.

 

I understand. But you have claimed that God is omniscient. "Omniscient" means that He knows everything, past present and future. He knows what I have done, what I am doing, and what I WILL DO. If that is so, then there is no way that I can't do anything that will alter what God already knows. Therefore, if God is omniscient, free will is impossible.

 

It must be this way. I am not making this up, or even saying anything original. Believers have been wrestling with this for ages, and have yet to come up with an explanation.

 

I do not for a moment believe in fate or destiny. I agree that if I do not accept Christ it is all my idea, and because of my free will. And since I believe that to be true, I must also believe that God is not omniscient.

 

I am not familiar with your postings on salvation if any on Salvation...

If it was discussed you can refresh my memories without my searching posts.

 

It is post #271.

 

[i suspect you may have aligned my ending comment as if you stated it]

 

Yes, and I apologize.

 

However for any all that seek salvation in the Lord.

 

CONSIDER THESE STEPS:

 

1) A confession or agreement with God that we are a *sinner.

Romans 3:23

2)A request asking God to forgive us our sins.

Ephesians 2:4

3) An acceptance of Jesus as our Savior and asking Him to be the Lord of our life.

Acts 16:31

4) An acknowledgement that God raised Jesus from the dead. Romans 10:9

5) A request for help to live as Jesus wants us to live.

Romans 7:18

6) A close thanking God for the gift of His Wonderful Son and His merciful gift of salvation.

 

Romans 6:17

Salvation is completely dependent upon faith in Christ and not at all dependent upon belonging to a man-made organization.

 

A Model Sinner's Prayer

 

"Dear God in heaven, I come before you in the name of Jesus. I confess that I am a sinner and ask you to forgive me and cleanse me from my sins. I receive Jesus as my Savior and ask Him to come into my heart. I confess with my mouth that Jesus is Lord and that You raised Him from the dead. I ask you to please help me to live as you want me to live. I thank you for the gift of your wonderful Son Jesus and Your merciful free gift of salvation. In Jesus' wonderful name. Amen."

 

Its not an elaborate speech. It’s a willing heart.

 

The thief on the cross said nine words to salvation.

 

[Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.]

 

The shortest sinner's prayer in the Bible is recorded for us in Luke Chapter 18, a chapter where Jesus was giving some parables on the subject of prayer. In verse 13 Jesus has a publican, that is, a hated tax gatherer praying the following words

 

"God, be merciful to me, the sinner!"

 

"All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me" (Mt 28:18).

Another may only say, Jesus save me.

 

Or simply Jesus. …and will be saved, because of the power of His Name as

"All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me" (Mt 28:18).

And God knows a heart…

 

Salvation is not an articulate speech; it’s the hearts desire.

 

We may question how many that believe or have believed in God and are saved?

 

All they had to call on the name of the Lord… God knows a heart.

That’s the diff in a mental ascent and one of the heart.

 

I hope this helps clarify salvation and how it its not difficult to be saved.

 

God Bless*

 

I will await your comments on post #271 before I comment further, but let me say that I have read the Bible, and it certainly isn't that simple. If it were, there wouldn't be 1500 different views on the subject--and that is just the number of different sects that call themselves "Christians."

[Moai]

Moai, aren't you the one who reads auras?

 

No, I don't believe there is such a thing as an aura.

[Moai]

oh if that is true and Moai read my Aura then it would be black

 

Mine, too! I twould be awesome if it were "clear" too. That's my favorite color. Clear.

[blind_otter]

OP - I skipped ahead and didn't keep up with the debate.

 

The greater the doubt, the greater the enlightenment. An earnestly held doubt is a huge doubt, called the great doubt. That is the place where the doubting I disappears in the explosive, fundamental doubt. This great doubt meets with opportune conditions and in the end when that great doubt is smashed, the practitioner in one fell swoop dies greatly, and heaven and earth are renewed.

[pricillia]

Mine, too! I twould be awesome if it were "clear" too. That's my favorite color. Clear.

 

 

 

your favoirite color is clear... ugh I wish my mind was clear...

 

it there such a color as clear?

[pricillia]

OP - I skipped ahead and didn't keep up with the debate.

__________________

I'll spank you smartly with my spank ray.

_Space Ghost

 

 

ha I could use a good spanking right now!...

 

but to stay on topic so I do not get redflagged I would just like to say

 

God Is Great...

[Moai]

OP - I skipped ahead and didn't keep up with the debate.

 

I missed the post you quoted. I doubt it exists, though!

[Love Hurts]

I understand. But you have claimed that God is omniscient. "Omniscient" means that He knows everything, past present and future. He knows what I have done, what I am doing, and what I WILL DO. If that is so, then there is no way that I can't do anything that will alter what God already knows. Therefore, if God is omniscient, free will is impossible.

 

It must be this way. I am not making this up, or even saying anything original. Believers have been wrestling with this for ages, and have yet to come up with an explanation.

 

I do not for a moment believe in fate or destiny. I agree that if I do not accept Christ it is all my idea, and because of my free will. And since I believe that to be true, I must also believe that God is not omniscient.

 

 

 

It is post #271.

 

 

 

Yes, and I apologize.

 

 

 

I will await your comments on post #271 before I comment further, but let me say that I have read the Bible, and it certainly isn't that simple. If it were, there wouldn't be 1500 different views on the subject--and that is just the number of different sects that call themselves "Christians."

 

 

Off the top I will get to back post 271 you have many scriptures marked ...that would need looking into as I lack a photographic mind.

 

to address the rest of your post..

 

Then prayer and any work in the Lord is unnecessary as well … since some are His and some are not from predestination.

 

Why bother to talk to you. Since you’re His from the beginning or you are not?

 

Either you will find Christ on your own or not…. So its His will from the foundations of the earth.

 

What am I doing talking to you then? You have been predestined one way or the other..

 

Why do we have Churches or ministers of the word?

Its all so useless to share the word of Salvation since either you is or you isn’t.

 

God is so confused in His word isn’t He?

 

Darn why in the world would He tell us to waste our time talking to unsaved souls?

 

Stupid isn’t it?

 

We should be born live and die and just go so where it was predestined.

Its so much simpler.

 

WRONG!

 

Man is responsible for coming to Christ. Christ did His part; He died for us.

If he is not worthy of your effort now since His death on the cross for

you.

Then why would you expect to be in His Devine Kingdom in the afterlife?

 

Here is the way I see it to be just and fair with man on earth…

 

There are so many good and wonderful people in the world, supportive helpful encouraging, humorously lighthearted; just terrific people we are thankful to have in our company or to have had made acquaintance with.

 

Still if we deny our creator who gave us life; are we really so much?

 

If we consider life has to have a greater purpose than like a vapor; here today and gone tomorrow or a weed that is grown and died. If we are more than that and hold a greater purpose and value; than to who or what do we hold greater and purpose to?

 

This is one of our divisional steps to and away from God our creator.

Some choose to believe this is all there is so eat drink and be merry for tomorrow we shall die… do all you can while you can or its our loss lifetime allotted.

 

While others…believe in afterlife and that this life has a greater purpose than we know. Many of those find the true living God; and do believe and follow Him. A realization of this lifes purpose is discovered through God and His word. Scripture teaches for those that do not see God and selfishly live this life for their pleasure and gain of the world; have no gain in God Himself.

 

My question is: why is as many desire to have nothing to do with God; [mocked and scoffed at] still when it comes to the concept of Hell being an eternal place of damnation for nonbelievers of Christ… many will say how horrible; what a tyrant of a God He is and who wants to follow a God that would send any to that place?

 

Doesn’t that sound selfish?

 

It sounds as if man wants it all his way; including in the end of a fulfilled worldly life to the open arms of Christ in eternal life.

 

If God gave to us first; as Jesus was the sacrificial Lamb, who then are we to give nothing an expect the best of everything from God?

 

Gods judgments sound fair to me on this side of death as we live and breath.

 

If we reject and want nothing to do with God, then we should gladly hold our stance in eternity and say;

 

I am so thankful I have nothing to do with Christ for all eternity. It was our choice made on earth and eternity is simply; [follow through] of our own freewill.

 

If one is stead fast and certain God is not... then stay the course without grumble in the afterlife. And give thanks you have nothing to do with Christ for all eternity. Freewill is our own... be affirmative now and then.

 

God Bless*

[pricillia]

LH, if someone is going to find Christ on thier own... then what is all the Hoopla about?

 

Let people be and don't speak the word. Let them decide on their own

 

 

Man is responsible to come to christ but in thier own time...

 

it they choose to

[Love Hurts]

LH, if someone is going to find Christ on thier own... then what is all the Hoopla about?

 

Let people be and don't speak the word. Let them decide on their own

 

 

Man is responsible to come to christ but in thier own time...

 

it they choose to

 

Thank you... this affirms predestination does not mean you were meant for heaven or hell.You have freewill and we are to hear and receive.

[pricillia]

Thank you... this affirms predestination does not mean you were meant for heaven or hell.You have freewill and we are to hear and receive.

 

maybe I am not meant for either...