the war changed him

[mandy81marie]

When he first came home his would tell us stories. Uneventful stories, but he at least talked a little about being over there. I don't push the issue for him to talk about "over there" but I let him know that I am here if he needs me. I have tried to make him feel like gettig help elsewhere isn't "un-manly" But he obviously isn't ready to talk to anyone about "over there"

 

As for me thinking or wanting to stray away. . . To be honest, the thought has never crossed my mind. I've been to focused on how to fix my husband and not so much on how lonely I am. Until recently that is, which is why I decided to go to counseling. I needed to do something that focused on ME for a change. Although our talks are mostly of my husband, at least the outcome will fix me first so I can hopefully still fix him.

[Gunny376]

There was a time when someone such as your husband ~ whose MOS (Miltary Occupational Speciality) was Comm (Communications) wouldn't see too much of any kind of action. There have always been Comm guys that did see combat, experience it, fought in it, and experience the horror of it ~ but for the most part ~ support MOS's such as comm, supply, motor t, were "in the rear with the gear" As a rule of thumb for both the Army and the Marines for every "ground pounding, pack humping, trigger pulling grunt" there's about eight to ten support guys backing them up in the rear.

 

That's not the case with the current war in Iraq and Afghanstain, you wear the uniform your on the front line ~ because the front lines are everywhere and are un-defined. A lot of the guys that are getting killed in Iraq ~ are just infrantryman ~ they're from all over the board, comm, cooks, bakers, supply, admin ~ whatever. Even if you're up in the s*** everyday ~ death surrounds you, you hear about it, you talk about it.

 

Guys that have actually been "up in the s*** won't ~ can't discuss it with people that have never been in it ~ in part because its painful, and its something that you spend the rest of your life dis-placing yourself from, trying to put behind you ~ but in part ~ and a large part because there's no mutual point of reference.

 

About the best way that I can describe this would be a woman ~ a mother could sit around all day, all night, all week, all month, and try and try for years and years to explain and describe in explicity detail to another woman ~ let alone a man what its like to be pregno ~ and to give birth. You can't do it! Because there's no mutual point of reference.

 

Next time you meet and honest to God Combat Vet try to get him to explain in explicit detail what it was like? Its the very rare bird that will discuss it with someone whose not a combat vet. And, more than likely ~ he's not a combat vet, just spewing BS. A true combat vet can spot them a mile away! They don't walk the walk ~ they don't talk the talk, and they don't have that look in their eyes. Everything about them is wrong. They're body language.

 

Despite Hollyweird's constant protrail of such ~ there's no glory in it. Its hot, dirty, nasty, disgusting, a lot of guys soil themselves, a lot puke their guts out from nerves or from what they've seen, heard and experienced. Its surreal, its a living on the razors edge. You're living, moving, and making decsions not in seconds, but nano-seconds and they seem like hours. There's a lot of irony in it, and there's a lot of un-beliveable BS! There's a lot of "I just can't f****** believe it!" and there's a lot of,..........................you can do a lot of living in a short while.

 

Maybe your husband has PTSD ~ I don't know, I'm not there. From your posts, I'm inclined to believe that he does. I had it, and then I retired from the Corps to find out that I had been "institionalized" by it. With no in-difference to your Faith ~ when I retired from the Corps ~ I had a long, post-poned date with Mr. Reality ~ and he beat me up pretty badly once I got back out her in civilain la~la land ~ aka ~ the real world!

 

I do know that your husband isn't living a full life, he's not showing up for the freaking party ~ Life isn't a dress rehearshal. The time to get real about your life is right here, and right now. A significant part of life is just showing up ~ and your husband is laying down on the job when it comes to that.

 

And, I'm going to get "Gunny" on you here ~ so he's got a bad back?! WTF? You know what? There's lot of folks that have worse than that and they still wake up, and show up, and go on to do great things, and to live life to its fullest. He's still has his face, he still has two legs, he still can walk, he still has his arms.

 

There use to be a local guy here in Southeastern Alabama, he ran for Governor a couple of times. He was self made multi-millionaire. He started the first TV station in SE Alabama when he got back from WWII.

 

He was a poor Southern Country boy, never went to college, enlisted into the Army Air Corps at the start of WWII. He use to fly bombing raids over Germany in B-17's. He got shot down, become a POW.

 

In the process he got burned, he lost his ear, an eye, a hand, and to be honest it "hurt" to look at him ~ but he didn't let it slow him down one bit ! His name was Charles Woods.

 

I don't know what your husband has gone through ~ but he's using it as an excuse! I've got injuries and pains caused from 20 years in the Marines ! But, I don't use them as an excuse for not showing up each day.

 

I've been through a lot in my life, and a lot of it wasn't fair ~ (what's fair got to do with anything?) Just with what I've gone through I could lay down and throw the ultimate pity party ~ but you know what? The world doesn't care~ the world moves one, the world and all the people go on. The sun still rises and the moon still sets! Sympathy? I can tell where your going to find sympathy ~ somewhere in the dictionary between the words s*** and syhpliss! You're looking for sympathy, look it up in the dictionary ~ that's the only place you're truly are going to find it.

 

There's always going to be someone smarter, prettier, better looking, etc than you and there's always that's going to less so.

 

Life?

 

Life is 1% of what happens to you ~ but 99% about what you're going to do about it! Life? Life deals you limes ~ just re-arrange the letters and turn it into smiles. (Limes ~ smiles ~ give it some thought here folks)

 

In closing ~ you've got Gunny's "Man-Up" award for being a "Stand By Your Man Kind Of Woman"

 

:bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny:

 

(BTW ~ in case you didn't know, giving sox-bunnies is like giving high fives etc)

[Sup]

From Gunny, YES! He DOESN'T just give this out to everyone. The "very rare bird" has landed, right here, just for you. I suggest listening to Gunny, he's got the shot glass, the whole nine, as he's put it. Were you in Nam, or Gulf, Gunny, if you don't mind me asking....... My father was in the Gulf, part 1 as I call it. He was retired in time to miss part 2. I had a friend who was a navigator bombadear (I know I misspelled that) in Nam, in a B - 52 bomber, he talked some, but not alot, I guess he thought I was a little too young at the time to really share. Gunny, IMO, her hubby has seen SOMETHING while over there, I mean you and I know it's not his back that's the problem.

[Gunny376]

From Gunny, YES! He DOESN'T just give this out to everyone. The "very rare bird" has landed, right here, just for you. I suggest listening to Gunny, he's got the shot glass, the whole nine, as he's put it. Were you in Nam, or Gulf, Gunny, if you don't mind me asking....... My father was in the Gulf, part 1 as I call it. He was retired in time to miss part 2. I had a friend who was a navigator bombadear (I know I misspelled that) in Nam, in a B - 52 bomber, he talked some, but not alot, I guess he thought I was a little too young at the time to really share. Gunny, IMO, her hubby has seen SOMETHING while over there, I mean you and I know it's not his back that's the problem.

 

Gernada

 

Panama

 

First Gulf War

 

Haiti (Refugee Relief)

 

Cuba (Refugee Relief)

 

Hurricane Andrew Relief

 

Rwanda (So called Humanitarian Relief ~ actually burial detail ~ throwing thousands of dead men, women, and children from the side of the road into the back of a dump truck, then into a mass grave, covering with lime, and burying them)

 

Pakistain ~ Same deal as Rwanda, except it was because of a typhoon instead of tribal warfare.

 

PTSD doesn't have to be because of combat, war, etc. Its relevant to one's life experiences, stress tolerance levels, etc. Its delaying stress until later. Its the minds in-ability to deal with something at a given moment for a given reason.

 

The guy that flew in B-52's for example ~ at the time he's dealing with it by rationalizing it by thinking ~ "Ok, I'm flying in a plane, dropping bombs, doing my job!" Its only later in life that he comes to terms with the fact that he was a participant in killing people?! Along with people trying to kill him? (Surface to Air Missles)

 

For most killing isn't easy ~ its not natural. You've got to de-humanized the enemy. That's why we call them "rag-heads, Charlie, gooks, chinks, zipper-heads" ~ its only later that you come to terms that they are human, they are someone's son, brother, father, etc.

 

And, no! The back pain is just his excuse, I know plenty of people drawing disability that shouldn't, and I know of plenty of people that get up and go to work that should be on disability and don't have any business working the jobs they work.

 

I work with a guy, that got thrown under a bushog as a child, (for those that don't know, that's what the DOT pulls behind the tractors to cut the grass on the side of the road) but he gets up and goes to work everyday, he limps and walks funny (and its a miracle he even can walk) but he's always got a smile on his face, and a laugh in his voice and a positive attitude.

 

Bottom line? Its all about attitude. Its all about knowing and undersanding that life is 1% of what happens to you and what you go through,and 99% about what you do about it, how you preceive it, how you deal with it, how you react to it ~ the choice is yours. You can choose the red pill or the blue one. You can see the glass as half empty, or half full ~ the choice is yours.

 

You can sit and hold a pity party for the rest of your life ~ because life threw your azz under the bus, or you can get off your azz, crawl your azz out from under the bus, brush yourself off, and get busy living your life! Either get busy living ~ or get busy dying! The choice is yours!

[amerikajin]

Gernada

 

Panama

 

First Gulf War

 

Haiti (Refugee Relief)

 

Cuba (Refugee Relief)

 

Hurricane Andrew Relief

 

Rwanda (So called Humanitarian Relief ~ actually burial detail ~ throwing thousands of dead men, women, and children from the side of the road into the back of a dump truck, then into a mass grave, covering with lime, and burying them)

 

Pakistain ~ Same deal as Rwanda, except it was because of a typhoon instead of tribal warfare.

 

PTSD doesn't have to be because of combat, war, etc. Its relevant to one's life experiences, stress tolerance levels, etc. Its delaying stress until later. Its the minds in-ability to deal with something at a given moment for a given reason.

 

The guy that flew in B-52's for example ~ at the time he's dealing with it by rationalizing it by thinking ~ "Ok, I'm flying in a plane, dropping bombs, doing my job!" Its only later in life that he comes to terms with the fact that he was a participant in killing people?! Along with people trying to kill him? (Surface to Air Missles)

 

For most killing isn't easy ~ its not natural. You've got to de-humanized the enemy. That's why we call them "rag-heads, Charlie, gooks, chinks, zipper-heads" ~ its only later that you come to terms that they are human, they are someone's son, brother, father, etc.

 

And, no! The back pain is just his excuse, I know plenty of people drawing disability that shouldn't, and I know of plenty of people that get up and go to work that should be on disability and don't have any business working the jobs they work.

 

I work with a guy, that got thrown under a bushog as a child, (for those that don't know, that's what the DOT pulls behind the tractors to cut the grass on the side of the road) but he gets up and goes to work everyday, he limps and walks funny (and its a miracle he even can walk) but he's always got a smile on his face, and a laugh in his voice and a positive attitude.

 

Bottom line? Its all about attitude. Its all about knowing and undersanding that life is 1% of what happens to you and what you go through,and 99% about what you do about it, how you preceive it, how you deal with it, how you react to it ~ the choice is yours. You can choose the red pill or the blue one. You can see the glass as half empty, or half full ~ the choice is yours.

 

You can sit and hold a pity party for the rest of your life ~ because life threw your azz under the bus, or you can get off your azz, crawl your azz out from under the bus, brush yourself off, and get busy living your life! Either get busy living ~ or get busy dying! The choice is yours!

 

 

That's one of the best posts I've seen on LS.

[Sup]

Yeah, you've been around Gunny. That's alot to deal with. I don't envy you at all. But to the lady on here, get your hubby some help the best way you can, but, unfortunately, he can't be helped if he's NOT will to get help. If you do end up leaving, make sure the Divorce is final before you start looking around. No one deserves that kind of treatment. Gunny can tell ya all about it.

[mandy81marie]

Guys that have actually been "up in the s*** won't ~ can't discuss it with people that have never been in it ~ in part because its painful, and its something that you spend the rest of your life dis-placing yourself from, trying to put behind you ~ but in part ~ and a large part because there's no mutual point of reference.

 

 

 

 

I know I could never understand what he went through over there. Which is why I've tried to convince him that talking to someone through the VA would help him. ~ His excuse for that is "they said nothing is wrong with me so why keep trying?" . . . . . . UMMMMM, You keep trying because most likely that person was a dill hole that didn't know what they were talking about, and you keep trying so you can feel better.

 

 

 

 

 

I do know that your husband isn't living a full life, he's not showing up for the freaking party ~ Life isn't a dress rehearshal. The time to get real about your life is right here, and right now. A significant part of life is just showing up ~ and your husband is laying down on the job when it comes to that.

 

 

 

 

He definatley hasn't shown up for the "party" in quite sometime no matter how many invitations I or his friends send him.

 

 

 

 

 

And, I'm going to get "Gunny" on you here ~ so he's got a bad back?! WTF? You know what? There's lot of folks that have worse than that and they still wake up, and show up, and go on to do great things, and to live life to its fullest. He's still has his face, he still has two legs, he still can walk, he still has his arms.

 

 

 

 

I agree with his back issue. WTF??!!!! When my mother was 19 she slipped a vertebre that almost cost her her life. And my dad broke his back racing dirt bikes. So they have tried to share their stories with him about how they have managed to get on with life having back problems. ~ His excuse for that is "my back problems are totally different and I have more pain than they did." BULL FREAKING S**T ! ! ! ! but whatever you say hun.

 

 

 

 

 

I don't know what your husband has gone through ~ but he's using it as an excuse! I've got injuries and pains caused from 20 years in the Marines ! But, I don't use them as an excuse for not showing up each day.

 

 

 

 

OH he's sooooooo using his back as an excuse. One of our very close freinds has made the comment that he is using his back as an excuse to hide his issues. SO I know I'm not the only one who notices. ~ Which makes me so angry with his mother because she plays into the whole "her son is a victim" and he can't function without pain meds because his back is badly hurt.

 

 

 

 

Sympathy? I can tell where your going to find sympathy ~ somewhere in the dictionary between the words s*** and syhpliss! You're looking for sympathy, look it up in the dictionary ~ that's the only place you're truly are going to find it.

 

 

 

You made me laugh so hard with the whole sympathy statement. I want to put it on our fridge so he can see it, but I'm sure it wouldn't help matters any.

 

 

 

 

In closing ~ you've got Gunny's "Man-Up" award for being a "Stand By Your Man Kind Of Woman"

 

:bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny: :bunny:

 

(BTW ~ in case you didn't know, giving sox-bunnies is like giving high fives etc)

 

 

 

Thanks for the award and the bunnies, you've really made my day.

[Gunny376]

With your latest post you've told and have confirmed what I suspected ~ he's playing you! Or trying to ~ and so no its not just you.

 

This guy's got issues, and he's playing the "poor me" card, BS!

 

His biggest issue is he's fraking lazy! And, right behind that I'd use the word, "Sorry"

 

Don't cater to him, don't wait on him, don't fetch for him, don't do for him, ~ zilch ~ nothing ~ don't enable nor validate this behavior.

 

His excuse for that is "my back problems are totally different and I have more pain than they did."

 

Right out of the whinner's handbook! :sick: :sick:

 

When my mother was 19 she slipped a vertebre that almost cost her her life. And my dad broke his back racing dirt bikes. So they have tried to share their stories with him about how they have managed to get on with life having back problems

 

Excatlly my point ~ no doubt they're in pain ~ but they've adapted and overcame it and went on to live their lives to the fullest they can despite it! They've learned to live with it and deal with it. They know what they can and can't do, what their limitations are ~ and they manage they're pain, and not let their pain manage them.

 

Bottom line? 99% of your DH's problems and issues are in his head ~ not in his back! Attitude ~ its all about attitude.

 

As far as what he went through, saw and experience "over-there" I'm not going to minimize it ~ but I doubt its something that it can't live down, and over-come.

 

[mandy81marie]

So the past few days I've been thinking. "does my H really know how I feel?" For the past year or so I have "given up" trying to expalin anything to him because he just never got it.

 

Sure from time to time I'll start a serious conversation with him and tell him I am not happy with my life. (I never want to start by saying, hun you're not making me happy because I hate arguments) But he doesn't seem to care and he makes no effort to try and help make me happy or find out what is causing me to be unhappy.

 

And I just don't have the energy to talk to a brick wall. Our son was born 1 1/2 years ago and I went to work right away and picked up 3 extra jobs so I could try and provide for the family since H didn't make much. 2 of my jobs gave me a pay raise so I minimized to the 2 to not be so stretched out. (my main job is a home based business where my boss lets me bring my son to work so I don't have to pay for child care ~ so I work full time & play full time mommy)

Then I had major surgery the 1st of December and still trying to recover because I can't just sit and relax otherwise nothing will get done.

 

~ Anyway ~ I didn't mean to sound like "poor me" I was just trying to say that I haven't had much energy to really work on my marriage.

 

I fear that if I try to sit with DH and inform him of how things really are that he will be a deer caught in the headlights. But maybe that's the jolt he needs to come back to reality and take care of himself and his family.

[quankanne]

possibly … but my guess is that he's too far gone in his pity party. Especially when he's got his mom feeding into it.

 

maybe giving him options would be helpful? Instead of saying I need help, you need to do somjething, ask him what he's willing to commit himself to doing? cooking? Caring for the baby? paying bills? Then hold him to it ...

[mandy81marie]

possibly … but my guess is that he's too far gone in his pity party. Especially when he's got his mom feeding into it.

 

maybe giving him options would be helpful? Instead of saying I need help, you need to do somjething, ask him what he's willing to commit himself to doing? cooking? Caring for the baby? paying bills? Then hold him to it ...

 

 

It 's the whole holding him to it that I fail at. He knows that my personality is, when I ask you to do it I mean do it now. He'll start off ok doing little tasks that I leave for him to be responsible for but the first time he doesn't do it and I ask him, hun can you please do "such & such" and he doen't do it that's when I do it myself because it wont get done.

 

So in order to really hold him to his duties do I need to get bitchy and nag him until it gets done?