oh for cripes sake I am sick of it!

[Scrivdog]

You forgot to mention drawing a warm bubble bath for her! Pull it together people, you're slipping..!

[a4a]

And he has.......

 

The latest was when the other thread, "sexless marriage" came about.....

 

First off.....I am totally opposed to, "making her give it up".....

 

That reduces sex to a physical act. What I crave is more than that......her, "wanting" to be with me in that way is the goal here....not forcing myself on her......

 

When we talk about it, she's the first to admit it's her fault. I tend to feel there's more to this, so I try to get to the crux and ask where I have went wrong, or what is that I'm doing, or not doing that causes this lack of affection.

 

At the end of the day, it's her that's in tears, feels terrible, and me that's even more confused when we first began to discuss it.....

 

It is to say the least, a circle of confusion in which only she can break, and I'm having a hard time, "forcing" myself to, "force" her in breaking that circle.....did what I just write make sense?

 

No man wants to bring his wife down to the point where she feels irresponsible for meeting, "his" needs.....

 

 

I was not saying to force her ........ not at all.

 

and you know what she is responsible... even if she has serious issues to deal with because of her past or childhood. Just like you had to step up to the plate and be responsible for your drinking issue.

 

She has always been like this? If not it has become habitual.

 

Moose I don't feel like doing things at times, but I do them because it makes the H happy. It could be bj's, mowing the lawn, cleaning up his wood shop, or cooking a meal for him..... anything that lets him know I love him in a way that matters to him. I draw the line on rubbing his stinky feet...... they must be washed first!

 

Painting my nails or wearing a pretty dress does not meet his needs, those are things that you just do..... I take care of an entire farm myself 5 days a week plus have my office work.... I don't expect that to be part of meeting his personal needs either. Housework is just a given, just like him working.

 

I truly think you are being shorted here.... I am sorry.

[Moose]

Just a thought; sometimes it's nigh on impossible for someone to change if they have no idea what to change to. If you live your life in a certain way and always have (or have ever since you can remember), it's pretty hard to break those habits, to even realise you've got them. It's far easier to blame the other person for wanting you to be different than realise how you are isn't healthy.

 

I guess it all boils down to if the 'frigid wife' in this case, really wants to change.

 

Do we ever hear on LS from the women who are accused of being frigid? It'd be interesting to have a more balanced picture.

That would be an interested thread!

Have you tried a second honeymoon? Sometimes this will help to recharge a relationship if the two of you have some time away from responsibilities and circular habits.

I've been taking her to a marriage retreat every year for the past 5 years. We even stay an extra day so we can shop without the other Church members watching us and what we spend. (we go a little crazy in Branson.....)

 

We've just went to this year's retreat a little over a month ago, and it was nice......but we only had, "quicky sex" that evening....and I did complain about it, (I wanted round 2, she wanted to sleep).....needless to say, we didn't stay another night....or spend much money.....

 

I'm not bunkin' your advice, I think it's great advice......but when your wife is used to being put up in a hotel, wined and dined on a regular basis, (I send her to beauty spas occasionally as well to get away from us)....a second honeymoon just seems trivial.....

[Trialbyfire]

Are we still talking about a stay at home wife here? I've been that. With two kids. I've also been the sole wage earner while my H was a house husband with three kids.

 

I would ANY DAY OF THE YEAR choose the stay at home role. I don't give a **** how bad of a day it seemed like, at it's WORST it didn't hold a single solitary candle to getting up and going to work every single day in a stress filled environment where you know that your family's entire financial future rests in your hands.

 

A stay at home mom has ZERO excuses for not taking care of everything she can and making her husband's life as pleasant as possible when he's at home. He has taken on a tremendous burden by being the sole breadwinner in today's society. The stress is tremendous.

 

If she really thinks he should come home and help with dishes, cleaning or cooking she should have her head examined. If he does help with any of those things she should thank her lucky stars (and in keeping with the theme of this thread, give him a blow job or two.)

Sorry but I can't sympathize with the guy who thinks just because he's the sole bread winner in a household, believes he deserves everything without putting some TLC back into a relationship.

 

As for sole bread winning, it's no big deal. I have a very comfortable lifestyle from my career and could easily support a family. Raising children and being a stay-at-home mother is far more demanding, depending on how much of yourself you want to put into it.

[tanbark813]

It's difficult to have unadulterated lust for someone if the other party is emotionally negligent and you're exhausted.

 

I find it odd that all your posts assume the guy is emotionally negligent. If you read through some of the posts by guy's who aren't having sex with their wives you'll see that this is rarely the case. And FWIW, withholding sex is also being emotionally negligent. If it were only physical, guys would be perfectly happy just masturbating (which, of course, they're not).

 

a4a - I couldn't be more on board with you on this thread.

[Scrivdog]

Sorry but I can't sympathize with the guy who thinks just because he's the sole bread winner in a household, believes he deserves everything without putting some TLC back into a relationship.

 

As for sole bread winning, it's no big deal. I have a very comfortable lifestyle from my career and could easily support a family. Raising children and being a stay-at-home mother is far more demanding, depending on how much of yourself you want to put into it.

 

How would you know it's more demanding or not?

[Trialbyfire]

How would you know it's more demanding or not?

That would be my question to you, too...

[Scrivdog]

That would be my question to you, too...

 

I've done both .. have 2 kids.

[Trialbyfire]

I find it odd that all your posts assume the guy is emotionally negligent. If you read through some of the posts by guy's who aren't having sex with their wives you'll see that this is rarely the case. And FWIW, withholding sex is also being emotionally negligent. If it were only physical, guys would be perfectly happy just masturbating (which, of course, they're not).

 

a4a - I couldn't be more on board with you on this thread.

That's why I defined my position at the beginning of the thread.

[Trialbyfire]

I've done both .. have 2 kids.

So you've been a completely stay-at-home dad, solely reliant on your wife for support for any number of years and have her not do a thing for you around the house?

[JamesM]

Four and a half hours and we almost have a hundred threads...wow! a4a, good thread.

 

If it was so easy as massages, bubble baths and confrontations...we would not be discussing this. Sadly, it is not.

 

And when we men come here complaining, it is not because we have not tried so many things...in fact, I know I can list the many things that should work, and they do once in awhile. And ultimatums, begging, and confrontations all work temporarily, but the low libido remains.

 

I cannot agree more. If my wife wanted to have oral sex, and I was not in the mood, I cannot see why periodically I would not want to please her. To me this would be no different than when I clean the dishes, house or any other thing I do to make her life easier. It makes me mad that she at least cannot view sex as that. But then (and I say this sarcastically) she feels like a who**. Okay, then why don't we start trying to enjoy it?

 

I know my side...I wamt to learn the other's side. And when I read of so many women here who love sex, I wonder where the ones are that don't love sex. These are the ones I want to talk to. These are the ones who I want to PM me. These are the ones who I want to tell me why I have a problem getting through to my wife what our problem is. And if we have a problem that I need to fix, then tell me so that I can fix it, so all is better.

 

Thanks for letting me get that out.

[Scrivdog]

So you've been a completely stay-at-home dad, solely reliant on your wife for support for any number of years and have her not do a thing for you around the house?

 

No .. but I did spend extended time taking care of the house and kids + I worked outside the home. Taking care of the house and kids was way more preferable to me.

[tanbark813]

That's why I defined my position at the beginning of the thread.

 

Your definition is flawed. I know this comes as a shocker but not all men are uncaring dolts who do nothing to help around the house.

[a4a]

That would be an interested thread!I've been taking her to a marriage retreat every year for the past 5 years. We even stay an extra day so we can shop without the other Church members watching us and what we spend. (we go a little crazy in Branson.....)

 

We've just went to this year's retreat a little over a month ago, and it was nice......but we only had, "quicky sex" that evening....and I did complain about it, (I wanted round 2, she wanted to sleep).....needless to say, we didn't stay another night....or spend much money.....

 

I'm not bunkin' your advice, I think it's great advice......but when your wife is used to being put up in a hotel, wined and dined on a regular basis, (I send her to beauty spas occasionally as well to get away from us)....a second honeymoon just seems trivial.....

 

I think you are being taken for granted big time

 

Sorry. And those tears are probably guilt and nothing else.

Something is not right.

 

Funny she can put you out in the cold for drinking and hurting her, but you are not allowed to let her feel responsible for hurting you? Is it because it is sex and sex is a sinful thing?

 

Maybe you both need to change your attitudes about sex... explore it together?

[a4a]

Four and a half hours and we almost have a hundred threads...wow! a4a, good thread.

 

If it was so easy as massages, bubble baths and confrontations...we would not be discussing this. Sadly, it is not.

 

And when we men come here complaining, it is not because we have not tried so many things...in fact, I know I can list the many things that should work, and they do once in awhile. And ultimatums, begging, and confrontations all work temporarily, but the low libido remains.

 

I cannot agree more. If my wife wanted to have oral sex, and I was not in the mood, I cannot see why periodically I would not want to please her. To me this would be no different than when I clean the dishes, house or any other thing I do to make her life easier. It makes me mad that she at least cannot view sex as that. But then (and I say this sarcastically) she feels like a who**. Okay, then why don't we start trying to enjoy it?

 

I know my side...I wamt to learn the other's side. And when I read of so many women here who love sex, I wonder where the ones are that don't love sex. These are the ones I want to talk to. These are the ones who I want to PM me. These are the ones who I want to tell me why I have a problem getting through to my wife what our problem is. And if we have a problem that I need to fix, then tell me so that I can fix it, so all is better.

 

Thanks for letting me get that out.

 

 

I will tell you this James........

 

bottom line if they are aware it is a very important need you have

 

If they are aware it hurts you.......

 

If they are aware you are willing to do anything to fix it.........

 

and they choose not to step up to the plate...... they don't love you.

 

I don't care what the need is, as long as it is possible/realistic.... from helping around the house, to bj's..... they choose knowingly not to do so.... that is not love.

[Trialbyfire]

No .. but I did spend extended time taking care of the house and kids + I worked outside the home. Taking care of the house and kids was way more preferable to me.

Then you are no expert either. As specified, this is the side that some stay-at-home mothers have expressed to me.

 

Your definition is flawed. I know this comes as a shocker but not all men are uncaring dolts who do nothing to help around the house.

Nah, I don't believe all men are uncaring dolts.

 

If you refer back to the definition, it is only from one perspective. It's an illustration of what can easily be the situation.

[tanbark813]

Nah, I don't believe all men are uncaring dolts.

 

If you refer back to the definition, it is only from one perspective. It's an illustration of what can easily be the situation.

 

Yes, and all your responses stem from that one perspective. It just strikes me as cripplingly narrow-minded.

[hotgurl]

I will tell you this James........

 

bottom line if they are aware it is a very important need you have

 

If they are aware it hurts you.......

 

If they are aware you are willing to do anything to fix it.........

 

and they choose not to step up to the plate...... they don't love you.

 

I don't care what the need is, as long as it is possible/realistic.... from helping around the house, to bj's..... they choose knowingly not to do so.... that is not love.

 

couldn't agree with you more on this point.

[silktricks]

Sorry but I can't sympathize with the guy who thinks just because he's the sole bread winner in a household, believes he deserves everything without putting some TLC back into a relationship.

We're not talking no TLC, we're talking the "helping out around the house" that you throw out as an expected for the man when he comes home from work.

 

As for sole bread winning, it's no big deal. I have a very comfortable lifestyle from my career and could easily support a family. Raising children and being a stay-at-home mother is far more demanding, depending on how much of yourself you want to put into it.

Really, well, who is dependent upon you? Yourself, right? Try adding four more people who are dependent upon you. It's like comparing ducks and tigers. There is no comparison. If it's just you, that's one thing - but when your spouse and children are dependent as well, that's an entirely different thing.

 

And how on earth do you know if raising children and being a stay-at-home mother is more demanding considering the fact that you have never been a stay-at-home mother?

 

Why on earth are you even arguing this point?

 

Listen, being a stay-at-home mom is demanding but the demands are of a completely different type than the demands of going to an office. And it is stressful, but the biggest reason for the stress is that you want happiness and goodness for your children. You want them to grow up to be OK, good, healthy, happy people. To say the stay at home mom has more of that stress than the father who goes out to work every day is demeaning to the man. He carries that stress everyday as well.

[Trialbyfire]

Yes, and all your responses stem from that one perspective. It just strikes me as cripplingly narrow-minded.

Hence why it was defined in the beginning. Have you never debated before? Taken a side you don't really agree with to begin to understand what the other side is experiencing? I find it very enlightening. Many of the arguments applied against my counters have been the same ones I've used with other people, on the other side of the discussion.

[My Fair Katie]

I once tried to withhold sex. Not because My Fair Husband was being a turd sandwich, but because I was tired of initiating all of our sexcapades. I made it about 3 days before I broke down and needed a good going over. My Fair Husband didn't even realize. So finally I told him I needed him to initiate a little too. So now he'll brush his teeth and grab a boob to indicate his interest in sex. If he's feeling particularly randy he may splash on some cologne.

 

I liked the old way better.

 

There's a lesson to be learned in that story somewhere I'm sure.

[silktricks]

Then you are no expert either. As specified, this is the side that some stay-at-home mothers have expressed to me.

 

But when I HAVE done both - really done both - you also dismiss that.

 

Maybe instead of siding with these stay-at-home mothers who are so dissatisfied, since you've never actually been on either side of this problem, and cannot speak with any kind of authority, you should instead express to them how lucky they actually are.

 

They are blessed to have someone love them and their children enough to take on the full burden of support and give them the joy and honor to be able to spend each and every day with their children. To be the person who has the special privilege of molding that child's life experience. To be the person who gets to see their first smiles, hear their first words, experience their first steps. They have the exquisite pleasure of teaching their children to speak, to read, to share those precious moments that will never return, no matter how dearly wish they could. Those mothers are blessed.

 

Instead of complaining, maybe they should consider just how much of their children's lives the fathers miss. Not because they don't care, but because they have to earn the money to enable that blessing.

[a4a]

But when I HAVE done both - really done both - you also dismiss that.

 

Maybe instead of siding with these stay-at-home mothers who are so dissatisfied, since you've never actually been on either side of this problem, and cannot speak with any kind of authority, you should instead express to them how lucky they actually are.

 

They are blessed to have someone love them and their children enough to take on the full burden of support and give them the joy and honor to be able to spend each and every day with their children. To be the person who has the special privilege of molding that child's life experience. To be the person who gets to see their first smiles, hear their first words, experience their first steps. They have the exquisite pleasure of teaching their children to speak, to read, to share those precious moments that will never return, no matter how dearly wish they could. Those mothers are blessed.

 

Instead of complaining, maybe they should consider just how much of their children's lives the fathers miss. Not because they don't care, but because they have to earn the money to enable that blessing.

 

the grass always looks greener on the other side.

 

But this is not a STAHM pissing match thread.

[Moose]

I know my side...I wamt to learn the other's side. And when I read of so many women here who love sex, I wonder where the ones are that don't love sex. These are the ones I want to talk to. These are the ones who I want to PM me. These are the ones who I want to tell me why I have a problem getting through to my wife what our problem is. And if we have a problem that I need to fix, then tell me so that I can fix it, so all is better.

And all of the Married sex deprived men said, "Amen"......

[hotgurl]

a4a your qoute about love got me thinking.

 

Most of these frigid women are mothers. How much do they sacrifice for thier children? They probably do a lot for thier kids out of love. Stuff they don't nessecarily want to. And yet they can't take 5 minutes to blow thier husbands and make hubby's day?