oh for cripes sake I am sick of it!

[Trialbyfire]

And how many women forget about the the unadulterated lust they had for their husband, and IT's importance once they have a home?

It's difficult to have unadulterated lust for someone if the other party is emotionally negligent and you're exhausted.

[mockeryjones]

I find this discussion interesting because I'm not a stay-at-home mother, nor will ever be. In all honesty, I've had difficulty understanding why anyone would ever want to be 100% financially reliant. I've always been a career person and would rather someone slit my throat than be a traditional little woman.

 

it's not about being 100% financially reliant, it's about being 100% there for your children whenever and however they may need you. when you have kids, if you have kids, you'll understand, they come first and you want the best for them. this sometimes means we need to give up that which is important to us (like a career, or the ability to work less than a 60 hour week) in order to give them that.

 

As I get more into this discussion, it's interesting to see how different people perceive the role of a stay-at-home mother, myself included. It's easy to say, be assertive but if you're not, it can easily be the most difficult thing in your life, especially when someone has all the power and you basically are beholden to them.

 

i have no idea what relationships you have seen but a stay at home woman generally has a great deal more power in a relationship than does a career woman. a stay at hom mom has total power over how the kids are raised, and in my book that far outweighs the financial "power" of a working husband.

 

 

While I've never withheld sex in my life because it's something I enjoy, I can see why it can be a way for a traditional woman to regain the power balance in the relationship, particularly with an emotionally negligent husband.

 

looking at realtionships on the basis of power like that frankly scares the hell out of me. if you focus on power in relationships like that ultimately all you get is a power struggle.

[a4a]

I find this discussion interesting because I'm not a stay-at-home mother, nor will ever be. In all honesty, I've had difficulty understanding why anyone would ever want to be 100% financially reliant. I've always been a career person and would rather someone slit my throat than be a traditional little woman.

 

As I get more into this discussion, it's interesting to see how different people perceive the role of a stay-at-home mother, myself included. It's easy to say, be assertive but if you're not, it can easily be the most difficult thing in your life, especially when someone has all the power and you basically are beholden to them.

 

While I've never withheld sex in my life because it's something I enjoy, I can see why it can be a way for a traditional woman to regain the power balance in the relationship, particularly with an emotionally negligent husband.

 

It is about power and control even with women that are not STAHMs or depend on a man for other reasons.

 

Some women choose to use it as a "signal" to say my needs are not being met instead of opening their mouth. Some guys are not mind readers. Some guys take this signal as "my wife does not love me".

 

It is the wimpy route for any woman to take regardless of her status or role.

 

Some women probably like to use it as then real issues are avoided.

 

Look at the "my husband got a lapdance thread".........fine example of a woman choosing to not communicate and build resentment instead.

[a4a]

It's difficult to have unadulterated lust for someone if the other party is emotionally negligent and you're exhausted.

 

well you tell them that!

[Trialbyfire]

a4a, are all women as assertive as you are?

[Moose]

what is she allergic to sex?

I've asked myself this question several times.....

You are now making excuses for her choosing to not meet your needs.....

Not making excuses, just agreeing that there has to be an underlining problem....

you are not into poking her with hot branding irons or anything else she fears during sex are you?

Noooo....not at all. There is an, "issue", about how we ummm, "fit"....so to speak......where sex can be, "uncomfortable" for her. That's all I'll say about that subject.....

She is choosing not to be intimate with you. Is it your fault?...... ask her... point blank.

If I had a dime for everytime I've asked that question.....I could buy your farm! I've stopped questioning this a year or so ago in fear that I'm pushing her away from me instead of towards me.

Do I not treat you right? "YES", What can I do to make you happy? "I am happy, who wouldn't be"

Are her typical responses.

She is selfish. You are just an easy meal ticket and she knows you're not going any place.

 

It's not like she just lays around eating bon bons. She's a fantastic housewife, mother, and friend. So I know she's appreciative of me, and respects me. So this doesn't fit.

 

She no longer finds you physically attractive.

 

COME ON! Look at my avatar a4a! Who in their right mind would think I'm ugly??? Give me a break already!..... Joking.....I have wondered about this. 19 years ago I sported Bon Jovi hair, and now I'm bald, I haven't gained any weight, but the 6 pack has turned into a smooth pillow so to speak....my age is starting to show in the face both in color and texture......but I still have my MULTI million dollar smile! (perfect teeth).......still, she brags about her, "Hot Hubby" all the time....could be she's covering up reality.....don't know...

 

She desires someone else.

 

Shutters.....I hope not......but if so.....she had better not act on it.......

 

You are not meeting her needs and you refuse to see that, and she doesn't have the balls to tell you. Because you will refuse to believe it.

 

She's never been afraid to approach me about anything......and I like to think I have an open mind, open enough to admit I'm in the wrong.

 

You suck in bed (sorry but it does happen)

 

hmmmm......I hope not! I can't remember a single complaint from any of my lovers.....quite the contrary.....

 

Something happened to her in the past and this could be a seriously rooted deep issue.

 

She's led a VERY sheltered life. To the point where sex was considered dirty, filthy, and un Godly.....this is most likely part of her problem.....

 

She is super pissed at you and has not forgiven you.

 

Another possibilty considering the hell I put her through during my bout with alcoholism.

All in all, I think she's a great woman, nay, a completely marvelous woman who doesn't have a strong enough sex drive, or at the least, an abnormal sex drive compared to that of a typical woman.....at least, that's what I gather.....

as for slapping her upside the head..... that is to knock some sense into her.... sheesh don't take everything so literal.

Sorry, just the image of someone slapping my wife rubs me wrong......didn't mean to take it literally....

And I did not post this in regards to Mrs. Moose it was a general observation.

Oh....I know....no prob....

(to clarify more, I am not saying any of this with any form or intention of disrespect, I know how sensitive you are with me)

 

cuz deep down you and I - probably are soul mates (ok that was a joke, but I am sure you are laughing too)

Ahhh.....YOU DO CARE ABOUT ME!!! Who knows what our future holds!!!

Moose wouldn't it be great to have her throw you against the wall and suck your head down your neck hole?

 

It can happen....... you just have to be willing to find a way to get her to do it...... which may mean changing how you think.

 

You already stated she is not that kind of person...... maybe you are part of the reason she is not..... maybe your prudishness is having an effect? Just a thought....

Thanks a4a......I'm a tryin'......believe you me....I'm a tryin'......

[Erik]

I was married to a total bitch for seven years. Completely braindead, we did not have one single thing in common. But from the day we met and for the next seven years, our sex life got better daily.

 

I've since had two seven-years relationships with wonderful women with whom I had everything in common, but where I had only McSex. I KNOW what's alpha and omega for a good relationship. Sex is magic when it works, and voodoo when it doesn't. It's a biological prerogative like water, food and shelter. Five minutes of post-sex pillowtalk is worth five weeks of therapy.

 

Women think this only holds true for men, because for most women sex is at best a pleasant pastime, but probably just a boring duty. They don't realise how thoroughly a rotten sex life ruins their relationships.

[silktricks]

It's difficult to have unadulterated lust for someone if the other party is emotionally negligent and you're exhausted.

And it's difficult to be all lovey dovey and romancy when YOUR exhausted and feeling neglected because the person who promised to love, honor and obey has decided that if they don't get what they want FIRST, they won't give you what you need.

 

You said earlier, why does the woman always have to give first? She doesn't ALWAYS have to give first. But it seems like altogether too often she expects that she always GETS first. That isn't fair either.

 

This marriage thing is a partnership. NOBODY has the right to manipulate the other by withholding themselves sexually.

[Crazy Eddie]

Why aren't you sleeping with your spouse?

 

Because you're pissed at him? Open your big fat mouth and work it out. Staying pissed at someone indefinitely is no fun for either of you.

 

What if you can't stand him, you've tried to talk it out, and he won't even try to meet you halfway and you see no sign that either of you will ever adjust to the other? If that's the case, what are you hanging around for? If he makes you miserable and you turn around and make him miserable, all you've accomplished is that now you're both miserable. What good does that do?

 

What if you like him but you're not attracted to him? If you just can't give him what he needs for whatever reason, then give him permission to get his needs met elsewhere while you both continue to enjoy each other's companionship. If you don't want him sexually, why should you object to that? Open your big fat mouth and work with him to solve the impasse in a way that meets both of your needs, or part ways without trying to screw him over. (Yeah, yeah, open marriages are bad and unstable and all that jazz, but what's the worst that can happen here? The marriage will fall apart? If you're not sleeping together, the marriage is already doing just that.)

[Trialbyfire]

And it's difficult to be all lovey dovey and romancy when YOUR exhausted and feeling neglected because the person who promised to love, honor and obey has decided that if they don't get what they want FIRST, they won't give you what you need.

 

You said earlier, why does the woman always have to give first? She doesn't ALWAYS have to give first. But it seems like altogether too often she expects that she always GETS first. That isn't fair either.

 

This marriage thing is a partnership. NOBODY has the right to manipulate the other by withholding themselves sexually.

Or emotionally, or helping out.

 

If a man comes home and flops himself on the couch, he has time to recharge before bed, where the woman doesn't.

[a4a]

Why aren't you sleeping with your spouse?

 

Because you're pissed at him? Open your big fat mouth and work it out. Staying pissed at someone indefinitely is no fun for either of you.

 

What if you can't stand him, you've tried to talk it out, and he won't even try to meet you halfway and you see no sign that either of you will ever adjust to the other? If that's the case, what are you hanging around for? If he makes you miserable and you turn around and make him miserable, all you've accomplished is that now you're both miserable. What good does that do?

 

What if you like him but you're not attracted to him? If you just can't give him what he needs for whatever reason, then give him permission to get his needs met elsewhere while you both continue to enjoy each other's companionship. If you don't want him sexually, why should you object to that? Open your big fat mouth and work with him to solve the impasse in a way that meets both of your needs, or part ways without trying to screw him over. (Yeah, yeah, open marriages are bad and unstable and all that jazz, but what's the worst that can happen here? The marriage will fall apart? If you're not sleeping together, the marriage is already doing just that.)

 

I love you Eddie!

[a4a]

Or emotionally, or helping out.

 

If a man comes home and flops himself on the couch, he has time to recharge before bed, where the woman doesn't.

 

so tell him that!

[Trialbyfire]

so tell him that!

So every woman is as assertive as you? Do you have any children?

[Erik]

You're not one for mellow mercy, are you a4a? I can't really fault your thinking, but your mercurial attitude makes me feel like a choirboy. I often gripe about women and sex, and you are right, everybody should do a conscious effort to get the sex life to work, but if I felt I was only given sex out of semi-contractual obligation, I'd end the relationship there and then.

[Mr. Lucky]

You qualify for Husband of the Year.

Somewhat ironic then, given the title of this thread, that he's not getting much sex...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Trialbyfire]

Somewhat ironic then, given the title of this thread, that he's not getting much sex...

 

Mr. Lucky

Based on some of the arguments used in this thread, he should be more assertive and tell her that and make her give it up, huh?

[a4a]

I've asked myself this question several times.....:lmao:Not making excuses, just agreeing that there has to be an underlining problem....Noooo....not at all. There is an, "issue", about how we ummm, "fit"....so to speak......where sex can be, "uncomfortable" for her. That's all I'll say about that subject..... If I had a dime for everytime I've asked that question.....I could buy your farm! I've stopped questioning this a year or so ago in fear that I'm pushing her away from me instead of towards me.Are her typical responses.All in all, I think she's a great woman, nay, a completely marvelous woman who doesn't have a strong enough sex drive, or at the least, an abnormal sex drive compared to that of a typical woman.....at least, that's what I gather.....Sorry, just the image of someone slapping my wife rubs me wrong......didn't mean to take it literally....Oh....I know....no prob.... Ahhh.....YOU DO CARE ABOUT ME!!! Who knows what our future holds!!! :lmao:Thanks a4a......I'm a tryin'......believe you me....I'm a tryin'......

 

 

Moose take the bull by the horns and do not get resentful.

 

Plan on sending the kids off..... get them out of your hair..... get some flowers, dress to the nines, stash some candles that you can whip out in a moment, and pick up some good carry out on the way home...... brush your teeth or spray your nasty office breath outta your mouth...

 

Tell your wife you need her to join you in a business engagement and to be ready at 7 pm when you get home.....

 

Sweep her off her feet...... I mean it.... like you used to... and if she gets to fighting you off and saying no....let go and just keep telling her how wonderful she is.

 

Two outcomes are possible: a new start or she is going to end up confessing why she does not want you any more.

 

If this fails... she needs some IC to undo the damage done. There is nothing ungodly or sinful about a healthy sex life between married people.

 

If there are issues and she is choosing not to confront them.... and you are suffering - that is not love. Think about it. ..... she is choosing to not confront the issues and allowing you to suffer because of her choice.

[Moose]

Based on some of the arguments used in this thread, he should be more assertive and tell her that and make her give it up, huh?

And he has.......

 

The latest was when the other thread, "sexless marriage" came about.....

 

First off.....I am totally opposed to, "making her give it up".....

 

That reduces sex to a physical act. What I crave is more than that......her, "wanting" to be with me in that way is the goal here....not forcing myself on her......

 

When we talk about it, she's the first to admit it's her fault. I tend to feel there's more to this, so I try to get to the crux and ask where I have went wrong, or what is that I'm doing, or not doing that causes this lack of affection.

 

At the end of the day, it's her that's in tears, feels terrible, and me that's even more confused when we first began to discuss it.....

 

It is to say the least, a circle of confusion in which only she can break, and I'm having a hard time, "forcing" myself to, "force" her in breaking that circle.....did what I just write make sense?

 

No man wants to bring his wife down to the point where she feels irresponsible for meeting, "his" needs.....

[Ripples]

Just a thought; sometimes it's nigh on impossible for someone to change if they have no idea what to change to. If you live your life in a certain way and always have (or have ever since you can remember), it's pretty hard to break those habits, to even realise you've got them. It's far easier to blame the other person for wanting you to be different than realise how you are isn't healthy.

 

I guess it all boils down to if the 'frigid wife' in this case, really wants to change.

 

Do we ever hear on LS from the women who are accused of being frigid? It'd be interesting to have a more balanced picture.

[Trialbyfire]

And he has.......

 

The latest was when the other thread, "sexless marriage" came about.....

 

First off.....I am totally opposed to, "making her give it up".....

 

That reduces sex to a physical act. What I crave is more than that......her, "wanting" to be with me in that way is the goal here....not forcing myself on her......

 

When we talk about it, she's the first to admit it's her fault. I tend to feel there's more to this, so I try to get to the crux and ask where I have went wrong, or what is that I'm doing, or not doing that causes this lack of affection.

 

At the end of the day, it's her that's in tears, feels terrible, and me that's even more confused when we first began to discuss it.....

 

It is to say the least, a circle of confusion in which only she can break, and I'm having a hard time, "forcing" myself to, "force" her in breaking that circle.....did what I just write make sense?

 

No man wants to bring his wife down to the point where she feels irresponsible for meeting, "his" needs.....

Have you tried a second honeymoon? Sometimes this will help to recharge a relationship if the two of you have some time away from responsibilities and circular habits.

[a4a]

So every woman is as assertive as you? Do you have any children?

 

No kids but I don't stop working until I go to bed. So yes I guess you could say with 40 animals + to care for it would equal at least 1 child in our home Plus we are running 3 businesses....... so yep busy...... and building a house right now. Slacking like hell today tho just ordering gravel and wood for new deck-paperwork for one biz. I literally do not get a day off a week, nor does he.

 

But I still find time to show H I love him in a way that he needs. And no he does not always fulfill my needs. But I damn sure let him know this.

 

I am sure I can make him happier as well if I just choose to..... I think I will whip up his favorite meal tonight and blow him.

 

:D Last night he brought me tea and cake in bed while I hashed out some PR bits on the laptop.... see it is a two way street. oh then I blew him.

[silktricks]

Or emotionally, or helping out.

 

If a man comes home and flops himself on the couch, he has time to recharge before bed, where the woman doesn't.

 

Are we still talking about a stay at home wife here? I've been that. With two kids. I've also been the sole wage earner while my H was a house husband with three kids.

 

I would ANY DAY OF THE YEAR choose the stay at home role. I don't give a **** how bad of a day it seemed like, at it's WORST it didn't hold a single solitary candle to getting up and going to work every single day in a stress filled environment where you know that your family's entire financial future rests in your hands.

 

A stay at home mom has ZERO excuses for not taking care of everything she can and making her husband's life as pleasant as possible when he's at home. He has taken on a tremendous burden by being the sole breadwinner in today's society. The stress is tremendous.

 

If she really thinks he should come home and help with dishes, cleaning or cooking she should have her head examined. If he does help with any of those things she should thank her lucky stars (and in keeping with the theme of this thread, give him a blow job or two.)

[mockeryjones]

And he has.......

 

The latest was when the other thread, "sexless marriage" came about.....

 

First off.....I am totally opposed to, "making her give it up".....

 

That reduces sex to a physical act. What I crave is more than that......her, "wanting" to be with me in that way is the goal here....not forcing myself on her......

 

unless of course that's what she wants you to do.......some do. ask first though.

 

 

 

 

 

 

When we talk about it, she's the first to admit it's her fault. I tend to feel there's more to this, so I try to get to the crux and ask where I have went wrong, or what is that I'm doing, or not doing that causes this lack of affection.

 

if she admits it's her fault tell her "get thee to councilling post haste". If she's told you that it's not you, then take her at her word and tell her she needs to get this fixed. it's easy to take responsibility if you plan on doing nothing about it. if she does nothing about it this is nothing more than an emotional blackmail tactic.

 

 

At the end of the day, it's her that's in tears, feels terrible, and me that's even more confused when we first began to discuss it.....

 

once again she should probably see a shrink. if she is unwilling despite your repeated expression of concern and wllingness to do your bit i would be highly suspicious of those tears she sheds.

[Mr. Lucky]

No man wants to bring his wife down to the point where she feels irresponsible for meeting, "his" needs.....

If you are the good H you say you are and you are meeting HER needs, how would you like her to feel for not meeting your needs?

 

Mr. Lucky

[IfWishesWereHorses]

Moose,

 

Have you tried non-sexual intamacy with her? Sensual massages, just let me wash your back. Have you ever mentioned playfully that you saw another man checking her out. Do you let her catch you looking at her. Instead of a big hug when you come in do you ever just lay your hands on her waist and tell her how good she smells.

 

During my first pregnancy I was literally frightened to have sex. My husband c omplained that I did not kiss him and he was right but for me it was a trigger which meant that I would be sexual with him so I refrained. If she could learn to be sexual with out it necessarily leading to sex all of the time then that could increase desire.

 

Women know that men want sex what we want to believe is that they desire us.