understanding mm's unreliability

[dignityback]

Can anyone tell me why some mm do not follow through on their words.

I don't mean on the big question of D day, but rather when they say they will phone and don't. Do they just tell us that to fob us off, to keep us happy until the phone call doesn't materialise.

Or do they do this because it is playing mind games, manipulation, to keep us guessing. If they don't phone when they say, is it because they just can't be bothered. Does it mean they are not that into us? I am not talking about a situation where they can't phone (emergency type), but where they choose not to do so.

 

Just wondering if any OW or OM have been on the receiving end of this kind of treatment and what did they think it meant.

Do they go chasing after the MM if the MM ignore them for long enough, and does that feed MM's ego?

I read somewhere that if the OW goes silent on a MM when he is "in his cave", that is the wisest response, and it is best not to hound or pressure him. So if MM doesn't call, then OW should just ignore him and not initiate contact herself. MM doesn't like it when he is being ignored and often seeks out the OW.

What a sick game it all is!

 

Anyone got any views?

[whichwayisup]

but rather when they say they will phone and don't. Do they just tell us that to fob us off, to keep us happy until the phone call doesn't materialise.

 

You are the OW in his life, second or third from his wife, his kids, his job. Remember, he has other obligations that take presidence over you, so if he says he'll call, chances are he got busy with his family. Or maybe, just didn't feel like calling. If you want to stay the OW in his life, get used to be treated like you are not important enough to him.

 

Sorry, but the reality of your situation is an affair. He will see you on HIS terms, not yours.

 

I hope someday soon you gain the strength to end it.

[stockmos]

First of all, what whichwayisup says is true.

 

Secondly, the reason could be one or any combination of those things. In most circumstances I don't think it's anything as sinister as mind games or manipulation or a "sick game".

 

I think the problem is that the natural thing for a person to do is say "I'll call you" and do it. Unfortunately in the case of an affair there is deceit involved, so the MM often has to break that promise. Really if a MM is upfront about an affair with the affair partner it would be better for him to come clean and explain that there may be many occasions when he simply cannot call due to being married.

[Babybird]

Yes this is a twisted game we play. It drives me nuts when I don't hear from him. Every once in a while I ignore him the whole weekend. No texts at all. (I never call). By Saturday night he doesn't know what to think, by SUnday he's worried. If I haven't talked to him when we get to work Monday morning he all over me. Are we still together? Are you mad at me? Do you not want to see me anymore?

 

It's kind of amusing to see the shoe on the other foot. Gotta keep him on his toes.

[Kenzo]

Babybird-right there with you! Always keep them on their toes! I think in a way it gives the OW (us) a little bit of control in an othwerwise ridiculously lopsided relationship. I do the same thing, no calls, no texts, and by Monday he's losing it. I don't do it often, but when I do I am always a little amazed at how insecure he really is.

[GreenEyedLady]

Or maybe, just didn't feel like calling. If you want to stay the OW in his life, get used to be treated like you are not important enough to him.

 

Sorry, but the reality of your situation is an affair. He will see you on HIS terms, not yours.

 

I hope someday soon you gain the strength to end it.

 

Ok, every A is NOT like that...let me tell you if he treats you like that, GET OUT...it's not ok...mine NEVER treated me like that...You know why?! Because if he had, I would have kicked him to the curb immediately...and when a MM loves you or even just wants to keep the regular sex going, he'll do what he needs to to keep you happy enough...

 

Men will treat you the way you let them...I ended my affair because it took it's toll and I wanted MORE...if you want to stay with him you need to talk to him about how he treats you...

 

YOU'RE the single one...THE A really is on YOUR terms, because you can just walk away...

[Can'tGiveUp]

Not following up on promises like phone calls are not a trait owned solely by MM. Most likely, that was the kind of single guy he was too.

 

And sometimes it is fun to play the game like babybird...but I generally do that when I am not serious about the person...or at least not serious yet.

 

A better question would be why you find that acceptable...and condone that behaviour by staying with him?

[dignityback]

What the hell does it mean if he arranges to see you one day and says he will call you. He asks you if you would prefer the morning or the afternoon to meet up. You say to him that morning or afternoon is OK whichever is easier for him. You are trying to be accommodating because it is a weekend and so it may be difficult for him. He again says he will call you.

It was his idea to meet up.

 

So you wait in all day and you hear absolutely nothing.

You start worrying that he is OK but you can't phone because he no longer works and has got his own cell phone and hasn't given you the number. So you go to work and on Wednesday afternoon (5 days later) he calls bleating that he has been ill and it is a big thing for him to phone you now to let you know. You ask if he has been hospitalised and he says "No" he has been in bed at home.

So he was in bed and chose not to call me from his cell to let me know he wasn't showing up. When I start getting angry, when he eventually does phone, he turns it back on me that I am not being sympathetic and that he has got off his sick bed to call me.

 

Things don't add up for me and I think:-

1. It is the height of ignorance/bad manners not to call me on the day to let me know he was cancelling.

2 It shows that he has zero respect for me, let alone any love for me.

3 He is treating me so badly that he is hoping that I will end it.

4 He enjoys keeping me in the dark and wondering what is going on because it feeds his huge ego and it prolongs things and the mind games he is playing.

5 At the end of the day, this mm is emotionally abusive towards me but why.

6 This mm cannot be happy witin himself if he gets a kick out of treating other people (especially someone who loves him) like crap when they are showing him compassion.

7 This man wants out of the affair but can't bring himself to say it.

 

Aby ideas as to why he would do this.

[Woggle]

He is already cheating on his wife to date you so you can't rely on a man like that having any character or reliability.

[dignityback]

Hi Woggle, yes I know what you say about him cheating but there is more to it than that.

 

What I am getting at is why it took him 5 days to call with a crappy excuse to let me know why he didn't show.

[Woggle]

Hi Woggle, yes I know what you say about him cheating but there is more to it than that.

 

What I am getting at is why it took him 5 days to call with a crappy excuse to let me know why he didn't show.

 

Because he is a no good cheating dog. It is that simple.

[whichwayisup]

What I am getting at is why it took him 5 days to call with a crappy excuse to let me know why he didn't show.

 

Because he isn't committed to you, that's why. You are the OW, and he'll see/talk to you when HE feels like it.

 

Question is, how long are you going to stick around and let him treat you like crap? And, if you were dating a single guy and he treated you like your MM treats you, would you still be dating him????

[dignityback]

WWIU--no I wouldn't let a single guy treat me like that--he would be out the door. No single guy has ever treated me like that either.

 

I keep making allowances for mm but I think I have made too many excuses for him and this last episode with him not calling for 5 days has really annoyed me.

Plus he says evenings are very difficult whereas they didn't used to be.

I just wonder if he wants out that's all.

More to the point I don't need this crap in my life either.

 

I would love to sit him down and tell him about his behaviour towards me, although another part of me thinks just let it go and ignore him, like he does me. I know I might be feeding his ego but I wonder if he stops to think about his behaviour and the effect it has.

Have any OW/OM ever done this.

[Salicious Crumb]

Can anyone tell me why some mm do not follow through on their words.

 

 

They are cheating on their wives...what gives you the idea that they are reliable?

[Salicious Crumb]

Ok, every A is NOT like that...let me tell you if he treats you like that, GET OUT....

 

LMFAO...and if the MM treats you well...then an affair is a beautiful thing?? ......geez.

[whichwayisup]

I would love to sit him down and tell him about his behaviour towards me,

 

But he doesn't care!!! He isn't married to you, he isn't committed to you, he doens't respect you enough to consider your feelings. You telling him how you feel, and telling him you don't like his behaviour won't change anything. The only thing that will change is if YOU change.

 

WWIU--no I wouldn't let a single guy treat me like that--he would be out the door. No single guy has ever treated me like that either.

 

So, why are you letting a MARRIED GUY treat you like that????

 

Look within yourself and ask yourself WHY you're letting some married man be an a-hole to you. What are you really getting out of this affair with him? Is losing who you are, your self respect, your self confidence worth giving up just to have some stolen moments with him? Please, think about it. You don't have to put down your answer - Just do some objective thinking.

[dignityback]

WWIU-well he is hardly committed to his marriage either is he.

 

I am not getting much out of this except alot of anguish and feeling bad about myself. I didn't feel used in the beginning but when I have to say things like "It would be nice to go out somewhere for the day " and he says "Oh you want to go out, OK" and nothing materialises you know you are on the losing side. He sounded surpised that I should want to go out.

What crap is that! OH yeah, I won't be able to lie on my back in the restaurant!

 

So if I want out, do you think I would lose all my dignity if I talked to him?Not in a tearful, pleading way, but just point out a few home truths.

Or would he see that as weak-I actually think it would take courage, but I open myself up to him telling me hurtful things or fobbing me off and not wanting to talk.

 

Maybe a dignified silence should be maintained, and I should continue as if I don't care a less, as in the past when he has treated me shoddily he expects me to chase after him and I have generally obliged. Not this time though.

[GreenEyedLady]

DB: Quite frankly, he DOESN'T RESPECT YOU or care about your feelings...I'm sorry that is harsh...if he did, he wouldn't treat you the way he does...

[GreenEyedLady]

LMFAO...and if the MM treats you well...then an affair is a beautiful thing?? ......geez.

 

Is YOUR M a beautiful thing? From what you've written around here, I think NOT...

[puddleofmud]

Learning to "follow" a manipulator's game is never going to be rational. One will never "figure it out" other than, hopefully, that one is just plain and simply being MANIPULATED.

There will never been any kind of logic one may grasp. "They" say, act, do and "you" are to follow, never question, never challenge and be ever sweetly compliant.

One can fight, one can assume, one can "guess" and one can use strategies of their own but the truth is that one will never "win".

You may opportune yourself and have a 'sit down' but this will most likely end up with you just being as confused and smiling sweetly which is exactly where in HIS mind--you belong....

Point is where in YOUR mind, heart and soul do YOU want to be>

(forever) somewhere up his rump where he controls your life or in control of your own life?

Sounds as if you are doing a really great job of understanding that you would rather be the latter.

Stand strong and know that you have all the options you need to take a better course for yourself and leave this (his) manipulative crap in the dust.

[kimberlyk]

Really...what were you thinking when you decided to even correspond with a MM ???

 

Counseling should definitely be in your future plans...see the psychiatrist, not the MM.

[pricillia]

DB,

 

If I were you, I would not even show concern that he did not call you, just laugh it off.

 

Plus I would end the relationship with him if he is not giving you what you need in this relationship... It is not easy being an OW just a bunch of heartache and pain for everyone involved.

 

I am curious to know more of your story with him, how did you meet, how long have you been with him ect ect.

[dignityback]

Thanks for all the replies.

 

Although I know this affair is crap and unhealthy why do I feel so numb and empty now that it is going wrong. I should be jumping for joy but I'm not.

Last night I went over every significant event that happened and most were negative.

 

Pricilia, I have been with him for nearly 5 years with some periods of NC in between.

 

I met him at work. He doesn't work there now. One example that springs to mind is when I thought everything was OK and I phoned him. He was cold on the phone and said "You think you know someone well and then you don't". I took it as being directed at me and asked what he meant. He said he didn't want to discuss it over the phone and then told me he was going to the theatre that night and that he wouldn't be seeing me for the foreseeable future. Then he ended the conversation. I was in shock because I didn't know what I had done wrong and it was months before he contacted me again. There must have been something else going on but he made it look like it was my fault.

 

Then another time he wasn't calling me, so I called him and he said he was on his way out of the office. I said to him that he must be under pressure and I would back off. He said "oh yes thank you". My friend told me that I had given him an excuse for not calling me and he took it, when in fact it was because he just didn't want to. Two weeks later he called me.

 

I always made excuses for his behaviour but now I wish I had stood up to him although I am not sure he would listen and might find a more compliant OW.

He hates anyone telling him what to do; he constantly has arguments with people over petty issues, he is consistently late to meet people and is obsessed about his background, tracing his ancestors, didn't like his mother-she was cold and nothing was ever good enough for her. His dad died when he was 21. He comes across as confident yet he asked me if people in the office ever laughed at him!.

 

He went to Spain with a friend when he was young and met a family who helped them out with accommodation. On their last night, the family cooked them a meal and mm and his friend decided to go to a party instead and never showed up for the meal and never phoned to make an excuse. I think that is disgusting behaviour and I do not understand it and he was only 18 when this happened.

 

So I have been wondering if I could ever be truly happy with him. He is so complex but definitely a manipulator and am tiring of his games.

 

You are probably right, the best thing to do is not to show that I am upset/annoyed by him not calling me, as that is what he wants. In the past I have always just resumed the PA when he wants, but this time I am not. He is getting annoyed and I am standing my ground.

He doesn't respect me or my feelings so why should I risk further humiliation and feed his ego, by talking to him when he won't listen and might resent it anyway. Anyway it makes me look desperate too. If he wanted to talk he knows my number.

[Seen_It_All]

He was cold on the phone and said "You think you know someone well and then you don't".

 

I didn't know what I had done wrong and it was months before he contacted me again. There must have been something else going on but he made it look like it was my fault.

 

What YOU had done wrong? What a prince. Not only is the guy a cheating scumbag who lies to his wife every day, but he's pulling scams on you as well. He's quite the charmer, indeed. And then this piece of sh*t called you MONTHS later and you actually talked to him?

 

Then another time he wasn't calling me, so I called him and he said he was on his way out of the office. I said to him that he must be under pressure and I would back off. He said "oh yes thank you".

 

Oh, he's quite the charmer. I can see why you continually swallowed your pride to call him.

 

I always made excuses for his behaviour but now I wish I had stood up to him although I am not sure he would listen and might find a more compliant OW.

 

Do you see what you're typing? What are you, a servant? If you don't follow the rules that this sh*it-bag sets down, you're replaced with someone who will? How can you even stand touching this piece of trash? Your value to this loser is ZERO. I repeat, ZERO.

 

One more time - ZERO.

 

....yet he asked me if people in the office ever laughed at him!

 

He's utterly repulsive as a man AND as a human being. I'm not laughing at him at all. I find him utterly nauseating.

 

So I have been wondering if I could ever be truly happy with him.

 

Happy with this loser? How's the last 5 YEARS been working for ya? 5 years WASTED on an utterly repulsive, using LOSER.

 

He doesn't respect me or my feelings so why should I risk further humiliation and feed his ego, by talking to him when he won't listen and might resent it anyway. Anyway it makes me look desperate too. If he wanted to talk he knows my number.

 

I definitely agree with you there. Giving this pile of garbage even the respect of a "hello" is too good for him.

[Erik]

Salicious, an affair with a MM (or MW, from my perspective) is an incredible powerful thing. It can be immensely ugly or immensely beautiful.