You know what? I'm $@!& tired of it ..

[Karma24]

I know that feeling because I've been right there myself

 

Gee, I really can't imagine why.

[Impudent Oyster]

I've been thinking about your posts H2T, and I just want to throw a couple of things out there.

 

Were you going to leave your wife for another woman? What stopped you?

 

Do you think your wife might be afraid to get too close to you because she fears that you're only staying with her until the next OW comes along?

 

Are you only staying with her until the next OW comes along?

 

Some men don't like to be alone, maybe she's better than nothing but if you do find someone who will give you what you need, you'll have no problem leaving her. I'm sure she knows how disposable she is and probably doesn't want to invest everything in a man who isn't loyal to her.

[Ruby Tuesday]

She then tried to get the heat off of her by bringing up the A. I guess she was thinking that was gearing up for another one. But she went on about the A and at that point I was ready to end the argument. I could see we were getting nowhere.

 

Take the heat off herself? LOL, that's cute.

 

All I ever read from your posts is you demonizing her and blaming her for all your problems. I can hardly belive you would stay with such a "monster" for even a day.

 

She opened up to you, she revealed the source of her pain (you and your affair's) and you of course are just going to want to blow that off. That is so arrogant. It's all about you H2T. I truely doubt your sincerity because, man, if she really knew what you said about her she would hate you.

[Impudent Oyster]

Wow. H2T, I went back and started reading your first post here on the website, it's only from last July.

 

When you posted, you were a man in love with his OW, a man who said he was divorcing (btw, did you ever consult an attorney), mostly because his wife didn't show him enough attention or affection, but OW did.

 

Your plan was to get a divorce and marry the OW, and your wife didn't even know about OW at this point!

 

Well, OW understandibly got upset when you planned a vacation with the woman you CLAIM you no longer loved and were divorcing (who does that? goes on vacation with their wife when they're planning to divorce them?), so she came to your home and caused a D-Day. I don't blame her (and I'm a BW).

 

So all of a sudden, when OW turns "psycho" on you, (which she isn't, she's just fed-up with your BS), you decide you actually DO love your wife and you can make it work if only she will fix herself and become more affectionate. How can a person go from being totally in love with OW back to being in love with the wife in one day?

 

Flash forward 8 months and you are STILL looking for other people to make you happy! Nothing has changed. I predict you will have more affairs and will continue to rely on others for your well-being.

 

YOU need a lot of help. YOU need counseling. YOU need to figure out that you can't rely on other people for your happiness. YOU need to figure out why you're afraid to be alone. And finally YOU are very needy. Your wife and the OW were/are exist to serve you it seems.

 

If you don't get help, your life is going to play out in this very same cycle over, and over and over again. Please take some personal responsibility and stop blaming your wife, her job, the OW, the kids, etc.

[Impudent Oyster]

It's all about you H2T. .

 

I agree, it really is ALL about H2T. I'm no shrink, but my guess is he has serious NPD tendencies.

[Scrivdog]

YOU need a lot of help. YOU need counseling. YOU need to figure out that you can't rely on other people for your happiness. YOU need to figure out why you're afraid to be alone. And finally YOU are very needy. Your wife and the OW were/are exist to serve you it seems.

 

Heeheehehheeehheeheheheheheheheh ..! You people are the best. Moose, H2T, tommyr, and all other men in sexless marriages can always count on some Oprah watching feminazi trying to make a guy wrong for wanting more out of life than taking care of some shrieking sexless harpie.

 

Rather than spew hate, ladies, I'd strongly suggest you take heed. There is a lesson for you here. Your husbands want sex and companionship. Go ahead and deny them that and I guarantee you that in no time you'll find yourselves desperately trying to hide your wrinkles in the dim lights of Lucky's Sports Bar with your other sexless shrews bitching about men as you frantically scan the room for the scant supply of available divorcees. I see it all the time and after reading these boards, I now know how they got there.

[Impudent Oyster]

Heeheehehheeehheeheheheheheheheh ..! You people are the best. Moose, H2T, tommyr, and all other men in sexless marriages can always count on some Oprah watching feminazi trying to make a guy wrong for wanting more out of life than taking care of some shrieking sexless harpie.

.

 

I've never shrieked in my life, I love sex and I've never been accused of being a harpie, but if being a feminazi means that I wouldn't have sex with a misogynistic serial cheater like you if you were the last man on earth and the human race depended on it, then guilty as charged.

 

And you would never catch me in a bar looking for a man, I get hit-on just going to the bank or grocery shopping, I'm way out of your league.

 

My condolences to your long-suffering wife.

 

BTW, if your wife is such a drag, get a divorce. What are you waiting for? Ohhh let me guess, you're staying with her for the kids...it's much better for them to have a lying serial cheat for a dad than an honest divorced one. Keep telling yourself that.

[Moose]

You're in a sexless marriage, but all other aspects of your marriage are picture perfect?

 

No affairs by either party, the spouses are best of friends, the kids love both Mom and Dad......but there's no bedroom play for months on end??

 

In my case, I firmly believe that I would be destroying my honor as a man if I bailed on my marriage.....

[Ruby Tuesday]

Be specific, Moose. What is your approach in the bedroom?

 

Are you the "bend over honey, I wanna do ya" type or do you go out of your way to be romantic with your wife? Do you go out on dates? Do you cuddle and touch under the blankets? Are you intimate with her in all the ways a woman needs?

 

Tip: A womans sexuality is fueled by emotion. That means you have to talk to her and really ((( l i s t e n ))) to her when it's her turn.

[Moose]

Be specific, Moose. What is your approach in the bedroom?

 

Are you the "bend over honey, I wanna do ya" type or do you go out of your way to be romantic with your wife? Do you go out on dates? Do you cuddle and touch under the blankets? Are you intimate with her in all the ways a woman needs?

 

Tip: A womans sexuality is fueled by emotion. That means you have to talk to her and really ((( l i s t e n ))) to her when it's her turn.

LOL.....trust me RT.....I'm a romantic almost to the extreme.....

 

My approach in the bedroom is the same. None. She's asleep by 9:05pm each and every night. Anytime before then, the kids are still up, so no go then either.

 

We go out at least twice a month without fail, and she doesn't cuddle with me any longer.....

 

On the rare occasion when she is up past 9, she's either too tired, or something else is physically bothering her.......

 

You don't need me to be specific, (or demand that I do), I've already told you what our marriage is like. Picture perfect minus sex.......

[Ruby Tuesday]

What about sending the kids to your parents for the weekend or hiring a housemaid or a nanny to help her? Maybe taking her on a vacation (even a few towns away to remove her from her duties) to a hotel for a weekend?

 

Just remember there are highs and LOWS in every marriage. It can change for the better. You can achieve a higher level, but you need to be able to work through it together.

[Moose]

We already have a maid, I send her to a weekend spa, (by herself) twice a year whenever she wants. (it's in the budget), we go to a weekend marriage retreat every year, and we also go on, "business" trips whenever we can justify her going with me.

 

Like I've said, I'm in, and a lot of men are in a useless situation......

[JustBreathe]

Bottom line:

 

There are no martyrs or saints in marriage. You basically do get what you give. If you aren't feeling loved or appreciated enough consider how loved and appreciated you make your spouse feel. If you feel you do so much for your spouse and get nothing in return, then do LESS so that way you don't feel resentful. Do only what you think is fair so you don't feel angry.

 

If you aren't getting enough sex consider talking with your wife to figure out why it is she doesn't want any from you, because believe me, the large majority of women do like it. We do need it and appreciate it just like men do. Women in sexless marriages are equally as frustrated as their husbands. If she isn't wanting it from you, she has her reasons, and if you want to have a sexual relationship with her, it is incumbent upon you to ask her why she doesn't want it with you. Maybe it's not you. Maybe it's medical.

 

If you've tried everything and your sexual relationship won't re-start, then maybe you need to discuss this with your wife and tell her you do not intend to be without sex for the rest of your life and if you can't come to some resolution, then you will go out and get it somewhere else. She can either agree to get some help and some counseling, or she can agree to let you have your friends on the side - or you can divorce and find people you can have a mutually satisfying relationship with.

 

Staying only for the kids is not wise. You aren't doing your kids any favors by staying with someone you don't love or don't want to be with. They will grow up having a warped distorted view of love and marriage and turn around and marry the wrong person themselves.

 

Some of the things posted about women here have been full of hatred and loathing. I wouldn't want to sleep with a man who views women this way. I like sleeping with men who like me. Imaging sleeping with a woman who doesn't like men? It is no wonder your marriages are sexless.

 

Get well soon.

[Karma24]

Heeheehehheeehheeheheheheheheheh ..! You people are the best. Moose, H2T, tommyr, and all other men in sexless marriages can always count on some Oprah watching feminazi trying to make a guy wrong for wanting more out of life than taking care of some shrieking sexless harpie.

 

Rather than spew hate, ladies, I'd strongly suggest you take heed. There is a lesson for you here. Your husbands want sex and companionship. Go ahead and deny them that and I guarantee you that in no time you'll find yourselves desperately trying to hide your wrinkles in the dim lights of Lucky's Sports Bar with your other sexless shrews bitching about men as you frantically scan the room for the scant supply of available divorcees. I see it all the time and after reading these boards, I now know how they got there.

 

Oh great...I sense another Tom DORKis fan here. Haven't you men ever heard that you need to make love to a woman's mind first before you can make love to her body? Oh wait. No. No you haven't.

[Mr. Lucky]

You're in a sexless marriage, but all other aspects of your marriage are picture perfect?

You know Moose, I like your online persona. You seem reasonable, rational and thoughtful. But, you are (at the very least) in denial here. All other aspects on your marriage - the personal, soul-level emotional parts - can't be be picture perfect in the absence of sex. You also can't have even passable communication in your M if you can't tell your wife how this affects you AND she can't hear and understand your saying this.

 

So I'm willing to accept that you two do a good job of sharing car-pool, laundry and child care needs, but for me to believe that you have a "picture perfect" marriage in every way BUT the bedroom, where you're nuturing, supporting and bonding with each other in every way BUT sex, ain't gonna happen. And I think, in your case, that the first step in dealing with a problem is recognizing the scope of the one that exists. Just my opinion...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Scrivdog]

I agree 100%, Moose. I get the feeling that somehow there's a psychological payoff somewhere for you in this situation. Maybe your close friends who know about this get to feel sorry for you and to admire your dogged persistence and self-sacrifice. Maybe it allows you to feel morally superior to your wife.

 

But clearly you're holding your honor as man in high regard while ignoring the fact that your wife hasn't been very honorable as a wife.

 

 

 

You know Moose, I like your online persona. You seem reasonable, rational and thoughtful. But, you are (at the very least) in denial here. All other aspects on your marriage - the personal, soul-level emotional parts - can't be be picture perfect in the absence of sex. You also can't have even passable communication in your M if you can't tell your wife how this affects you AND she can't hear and understand your saying this.

 

So I'm willing to accept that you two do a good job of sharing car-pool, laundry and child care needs, but for me to believe that you have a "picture perfect" marriage in every way BUT the bedroom, where you're nuturing, supporting and bonding with each other in every way BUT sex, ain't gonna happen. And I think, in your case, that the first step in dealing with a problem is recognizing the scope of the one that exists. Just my opinion...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Impudent Oyster]

You're in a sexless marriage, but all other aspects of your marriage are picture perfect?

 

No affairs by either party, the spouses are best of friends, the kids love both Mom and Dad......but there's no bedroom play for months on end??

 

In my case, I firmly believe that I would be destroying my honor as a man if I bailed on my marriage.....

 

I agree with you.

 

Have you considered that there might be physiological issues at play here? How old is your wife? Maybe she should have a blood test to check her testosterone levels, they could be low, and that is entirely fixable. Or she could even be depressed, or on medication that affects libido.

 

She should see a doctor for her low libido, it's not an uncommon phenomena in women of a certain age and it CAN be helped.

[a4a]

I agree with you.

 

Have you considered that there might be physiological issues at play here? How old is your wife? Maybe she should have a blood test to check her testosterone levels, they could be low, and that is entirely fixable. Or she could even be depressed, or on medication that affects libido.

 

She should see a doctor for her low libido, it's not an uncommon phenomena in women of a certain age and it CAN be helped.

 

or could be:

 

She no longer is physically attracted to him

 

She has a problem with sex = dirty /sinning and Moose is a by the book kinda guy, so liking or wanting sex is not what a really good woman does.

 

She is using the sex as a control factor in the M. Not unusual, maybe she feels like it is the only part of the M she actually has control over.

 

Only way to solve it is bring the issue up and hope she wants to resolve it.

If not stop whining about it and stay in your perfect sexless marriage. (not trying to be harsh but you ruled out any other options for yourself if she decides not to deal with it)

[Impudent Oyster]

or could be:

 

She no longer is physically attracted to him

 

She has a problem with sex = dirty /sinning and Moose is a by the book kinda guy, so liking or wanting sex is not what a really good woman does.

 

She is using the sex as a control factor in the M. Not unusual, maybe she feels like it is the only part of the M she actually has control over.

 

)

 

Yes, it could be that she's not physically attracted to him, but I don't think she's using sex as a "control" factor, unless Moose has done something to her that we don't know about that would account for her resentment.

[a4a]

Yes, it could be that she's not physically attracted to him, but I don't think she's using sex as a "control" factor, unless Moose has done something to her that we don't know about that would account for her resentment.

 

well that drinking thing or his strong personality as he at times has here may be the same at home????

 

He comes off as being the king of his castle and in control of pretty much everything..... keeps his wife in control even though he provides her with quite a bit of things. But my guess is she feels the need to keep up the "good wife" thing as well....... probably feels she has no clue who she is and everything boils down to her being the text book good wife. One must fulfill their duty in the eyes of others and for that matter the church.

 

Who makes the final decisions...... is she hiding things from him?

 

He provides and it is her duty to respond as being a good girl, but sex is used as control for her. Because she can choose not to give herself to him.... and he cannot take it, or be with another woman.

 

Thing is it is simply to see if this is it or not. If she clearly knows that it is a problem in the M, loves and wants to please him because he is so good to her, is indeed in the perfect M....... she certainly would want to fix it ....... unless of course this is her one thing that she retains control of.

 

Of course I doubt Moose would lay it out on the table and demand that she fixes it..... because then she would be having sex out of duty not desire.

 

Duty seems to be a major thing to Moose..... one must fulfill their duty no matter what?

 

 

hey now this is just a thought to go by what is posted here...... so I may be way off the mark. I don't live with them.

[Moose]

Mrs. Moose gets up first at 6:00 to wake the kids up for School, I usually stay out of the way on purpose since there's 5 of them trying to get ready at once.

 

They leave for the bus right at 7:00, by that time, I'm already up getting my coffee and heading to the bathroom to get ready for work. Mrs. Moose is on the couch watching Good Morning America.

 

I finish getting ready, give her a kiss goodbye, we exchange, "Love you's" and "Have a good day's" and I'm on my way to the office.

 

I'm here by 8:00 and leave at 5:00 pm.

 

During that time, Mrs. Moose is home either washing clothes, or cleaning the house, taking her fru fru dog to the vet......again.....or shopping with her Mom, (who's recently retired......yeah....), or just laying around doing nothing at all. (to which she openly admits to doing, it's not an assumption).

 

The kids get home at 3:45. When I walk in, about 5:30, the first thing I usually see is the 17 year old on the computer, the girls on the video games, the youngest boy in his room watching cartoons, and Mrs. Moose on the couch.

 

I usually get tackled by the girls at the door, and they help with taking my laptop and coat to my office. Mrs. Moose greets me with a, "Hey Baby", and gives me a kiss. We hug everyday about this time for a few minutes and talk about how our days went.

 

Depending on how things went, that could take an hour or so while I change into my yard clothes. I've gotten into the habit of asking Mrs. Moose if there's anything she needs me to do before I start on the outside duties. Usually it's a no, but now and then she'd ask me to do something she'd like to see done.

 

I then go outside and work on feeding the animals, mowing, welding, changing oils, whatever needs to be done.....Mrs. Moose is usually preparing supper, or depending on what day of the week it is, she's at Church or at a Bible study. At least 2 evenings of the week is, "Fend for ourselves" night.

 

I don't usually stop outside until dark, I then shower, and I eat afterwards.

 

By then Mrs. Moose is usually already in bed. This is a typical week for us, unless there's a function at School we need to go to.

 

Saturdays we all try to sleep in, then we do something as a family. Either the nature center, lake, or just working and playing in the yard.....

 

Sunday's are a no brainer. It's Church all day and night.....then it's back to the ole' routine.

 

Sounds boring.....but I just wanted to illustrate, there is no dominance on my part anywhere in our relationship.

 

I do think that there is some truth to her physically not being healthy in that area, or like a4a mentioned, she's using this as her leverage for whatever reason......

 

Before the next person says it, WE HAVE talked about this, millions of times, it gets better for a month, then it's back to the same ole, same ole......

 

So I guess I'll take some advice, and I'll just stop my whining now.

[whichwayisup]

Who makes the final decisions...... is she hiding things from him?

Remember his daughter's little incident? His wife hid that from him for over 2 days and dealt with the situation on her own without him, and that really upset/pissed him off.

 

Sex missing is affecting their marriage, how could it not? Also, he says they don't cuddle either, and even cuddling is part of intimacy.

 

Sure she loves him, I don't doubt that, but like many marriages later into the years after being together for so long, that deep desire and passion slips away...But to get it back, it's up to BOTH to re-capture it and bring it back into their marriage.

[Ladyjane14]

Wow... what a difference a day makes! We seem to be on a whole different (albeit somewhat related) topic.

 

But getting back to the original poster for a minute... I have to say I'm REALLY disappointed in the way this guy keeps getting 'nailed to the cross' every time he posts a problem or a vent regarding his recovery process.

 

Yeah... he f*cked up. And spectacularly too. But he's done EVERYTHING we've asked of him to try to rectify that. And while there's been times when he's clearly impatient or confused in the process... he's STILL in the game.

 

There is absolutely NO REASON why he shouldn't be able to come here and ask a question, or vent off some emotion, without getting his head chewed off every time he makes a post. To be honest... I'm frankly disgusted that this keeps happening over and over and over again.

 

 

 

Anyway... on an aside to Moose. Have you tried getting a little "afternoon delight"? If she's tapping out at 9:05 every night, you might have better luck working around her sleep schedule. Also, while I understand her reticence at having the kids lurking around... that's what bedroom doors are for.

 

I mean seriously, you don't have to advertise that you're "doing it"... but I think there's something to be said for kids knowing that Mom and Dad have a close relationship and that they sometimes want to be ALONE.

[a4a]

 

Sunday's are a no brainer. It's Church all day and night.....then it's back to the ole' routine.

 

Sounds boring.....but I just wanted to illustrate, there is no dominance on my part anywhere in our relationship.

 

I do think that there is some truth to her physically not being healthy in that area, or like a4a mentioned, she's using this as her leverage for whatever reason......

 

Before the next person says it, WE HAVE talked about this, millions of times, it gets better for a month, then it's back to the same ole, same ole......

 

So I guess I'll take some advice, and I'll just stop my whining now.

 

 

OMG I would find that life so so so so so so boring... I don't see you doing anything to make your life exciting or romantic at all. Sounds like a routine is right.

 

Actually sounds like my life with my H. Work, more work, obligations, some more work, gotta do this and that, work, and back at it in the morning.

 

Are you ever freaking spontaneous? Do you have it in you to send the kids away for a weekend and surprise her? Skip church, skip the nature trip with the family..... you seem to lack an intimate life with your wife.

[Gunny376]

H2T, I've read your entire thread, and what comes across is

 

You love your wife

 

You love your kids

 

You love your family

 

You're miserable

 

You wife is passive-aggressive, and is punishing you for your affairs. The wife has issues about the affairs, which she isn't dealing with. She's not forgiven you ~ and until she gets IC and MC she never will.

 

She's emotionally checked out of the marriage ~ and at best all she in it, for is for you to be her meal ticket through life. At best the two of you are slipping into a sexless, emotionally void martial comma.

 

Lady Jane is right! Time to get legal advice, shoot for the moon, the house, custody of the kids ~ the works. Divorce courts don't care too much anymore who did what, who said what. The process of divorce is seen as the dissolution of a business partnership as much as anything else.

 

Women get custody of the children 90% of the time ~ primarly because the fathers don't contest nor seek custody. But in the 10% where they do seek custody ~ they get custody 90% of the time!

 

The worse case scernario I see here is that you may have to pay her alimony for a period of time ~ but Hell that would still be less than the 100% support you're paying her now?

 

My God, Man! She's a big part of the problem here, and not trying to be part of the solution, she's a big part of the question here ~without even trying to be part of the answers. She thinks (and has you convinced) that she's got you over the barrel and she can run around and do just as she wants, when she wants, how she wants, act like she wants ~ and if you don't like it ~ then you can go to the beach and pound sand where the sun don't shine!

 

I don't know what you call this ~ but it isn't marriage. Ten more years of this?

 

She could call it whatever she wants, separation, independence, divorce if that word fits. Me? I'd be calling it QUITS!