"Creepy Dude"..the creepiness continues. Ugh.

[Just A Girl2]

Okay, so yesterday afternoon, after Creepy Dude had called and left a voicemail for the 4th time, I decided it would be in everyone's bests interests if I let him know what was up, but I didn't feel comfortable talking to him. So I emailed him the following letter..trying to be clear, honest and half-kind but firm:

 

 

 

Last night after you left, and today, I've done a lot of thinking about things. Not even sure where to start here.

 

I made it clear to you from the start that I'm not one to rush into things. I'm not a huggy/cuddly/snuggly person when I just meet someone.......all of that is reserved for when I know someone quite well, and that's not about me being any kind of "prude"....it's more about common sense and my own personal comfort level.

 

I didn't appreciate the way you boldly made your way over onto the couch last night, trying to hug me, keep me warm, having to sit right close beside me, having to have your hand on my knee/leg, whatever. You should have picked up on the clues I was giving, that I wasn't interested in that, at this stage of the game. Yes, we've spent a fair bit of time talking on the phone, but last night was the first night we met......and I just think you were out of line in this respect. Don't act like we're some "old couple" when we're not.

 

And at the door when you were leaving, badgering me for multiple hugs was out of line, too. I made it clear before last night that when I first meet someone, I prefer to be more reserved until I have had enough time "in person" to get to know them. I also told you that I don't kiss on the first date/first meet someone. It was more than obvious last night that you were trying to kiss me, the way you were trying to convince me to make eye contact with you when you were badgering me for several hugs. In fact, you ended up kissing the back of my head. That pissed me off because you crossed the line and were not respecting my wishes or comfort zone. For someone who claims to be so shy, you come across as quite bold and presumptuous.

 

I realize that you have been lonely for some time, and that you've been hoping to find someone you think is 'right' for you, but I think you're going about it the wrong way. You come on far too strong. There have been several 'little red flags' I've picked up on since we first spoke last weekend, and they've been in the back of my mind and I've tried to give you the benefit of a doubt as well....perhaps attributing your "over-eagerness" to act like some 'old couple' to you being shy and maybe trying to overcompensate for that.........or you not having dated a lot in the past (for you were with your ex wife for a lengthy period of time) and maybe not being sure of how to 'act'.

 

The first night we spoke on the phone, you were already telling me THEN that now you were going to buy me an Xmas gift. Whoa! Too eager. Unless a couple has been dating a few weeks and things are well established, exchanging gifts is simply not necessary, it's too much.

 

Your frequent requests to me, for me to call you at specified times during that day, was beginning to come across as fairly needy. I don't mind calling someone, just to say "hi", when I have a free moment.....but to have someone put me on the spot and make such a big deal out of it, it's a turn-off. Now if we'd been dating for a month or more, then sure, I'm going to want to call you to say hello....but considering we hadn't even met in person yet, it was too much for you to keep asking, in my opinion.

 

The many times you've admitted to continuing to admire my picture........even up to last night, when we spoke at 6pm (prior to you coming over), that was slowly starting to creep me out. If you're going to oogle someone's picture, at least keep it to yourself...otherwise you could come across as sort of obsessed.

 

The fact that after only the 2nd time we'd spoken, you were already asking me for a hardcopy of that picture, so you could put it in your truck.......come on, that's a bit much.

 

I don't want to be with someone who's evasive, distant, too busy to spend time with me...but on the other end of the spectrum, I don't want someone who's smothering, who's overly-eager, who's making references (whether direct or indirect) to spending a life together before we've even met, for god's sake.

 

I'm not the kind of person who likes to feel pressured, compelled, smothered, coerced or pushed. Speaking in general terms, people who do this, strike me as being too needy, too clingy, very insecure and possibly even desperate. Those qualities are all huge turn-offs to me. There's a great difference between being interested and available, and being overboard and overwhelming.

 

You are a nice guy, from what I know.....and you do have a lot going for yourself, but I think you're just far too eager to "get" the person/relationship that you are after. I think you very much miss the good things you had in your marriage, and you're just too darn eager to get them again. When you meet someone new, you have to respect their comfort level, you have to take things slow, ESPECIALLY when you haven't even met them in person yet.....and ESPECIALLY on the first occasion that you meet them. Yes, I like hugs and kisses and being affectionate and cuddly.....but there's a time and a place for that, and I'm not so desperate for anyone's affection that I'm going to die if I don't get it. I am a very independent person and when my marriage ended, I didn't shrivel up into a ball and hibernate. If I remain single for the rest of my life, I will still go on and make the most of my life. I don't "need" someone in my life, I don't think, to the degree that you do. You want to jump far too fast into things.......to get to the point that most couples get to, several weeks into the relationship. I know you've been lonely, and i know you want that one special person to settle down with...........but your eagerness is coming across as being too clingy and overwhelming.

 

I'm telling you all this because I obviously owe you an explanation, and also so that you can hopefully reflect on what I've shared, and take something from it, so that you don't continue to meet women and turn them/scare them off.

 

I know this letter seems pretty negative, but I'm just being completely honest. You claim to be so shy, but you seemed anything but shy last night..when you practically jumped on me on the couch (trying to be all cuddly, not in a sexual harassing type of way), and then at the door.

 

You are what you are, and I am what I am. I don't think we're a good match because our needs are actually quite different. I want a good relationship but I will not be pushed or smothered or overwhelmed. No way.

 

I wish you the best in your search for the right person for you..........but it is simply not me. I suspected this as the days passed but figured that meeting would give me a better idea as to things......and I learned all I needed to know.

 

I'm sure you did not INTEND to be so pushy/clingy/overwhelming; I'm sure that wasn't your intention, and I'm not trying to make you feel badly here, but nevertheless, you were.......and we can't change that.

 

I wish you the best in your search for someone special, but it is simply not me and I will not change my mind about this, so please don't even try.

 

I feared that if i didn't say SOMETHING, he would continue to phone and phone and phone, possibly even drive out here to see me. Ugh.

 

He mailed me back last night about an hour after I sent this (which I didn't read til today), then this morning at 7am. All apologetic, all sucky, blabbering a lot but not saying very much. Did repeatedly acknowledge my having told him well in advance that i wasn't the huggy/kissy type until I know someone well/am seriously dating someone. bla bla.

 

At the end of this morning's email, he added onto it, "please just write back quickly and let me know that you did receive my two letters." I wasn't going to, because why WOULDN'T I have received them? ..but I figured to pacify this dingdong, so that he'd have no further reason to contact me, I wrote back a couple hours ago, saying nothing but: got them both, read them both.

 

Well now, he's emailed me some weird flippin email. The subject line says "Are You In Love". I was almost too afraid to open it, having this sickening feeling that it was him writing to ask me something stupid like "is the reason you've ended things because you realized you'd fallen in love with me?" LMAO. Well, no, it wasn't that....it was even more weird.

 

It's some type of attachment for a 'screensaver' (don't worry, I'm not stupid enough to open it.....could contain a virus though doubt he's smart enough to do something like that, but anyway...)

 

Inside it says:

 

 

hi,

check the attached love screensaver

and feel the fragrance of true love..

 

the attachment's file name is: love.scr

 

Going to search for info on it, online, to see if it is by chance a virus, or whatever it is.

 

What the hell kind of weird assed crap is this to send someone who's told you go buzz off because you're clingy/needy/creepy?

 

Yuck. Maybe a good hot shower with a boar-bristle scrub brush would make me feel better. lol

 

PS..and no, I am obviously not going to respond. In fact, I'm not going to delete it either. Just in case he turns out to be a REAL wacko, I'm going to keep everything he sends me. To be safe, just in case.

[Tony T]

It was very kind and humane of you to send him a very detailed explanation of why you want nothing else to do with him. It's also very wise to have no further communication with him, including responding to his emails.

[Just A Girl2]

The file extension (scr) did cause me to be suspicious. Well, did a search on it, and lo and behold, it's a type of Worm Virus. His email acct is the only one he apparently has...a hotmail acct. When reading up on info, on this particular virus (link below), it doesn't seem to mention anything about it corrupting email addresses in peoples' hotmail acct......but it does mention MSN (which hotmail is affiliated with)....so maybe I'll give him the benefit of a doubt, and attribute it to him spreading around a virus but not knowing?

 

He's lead me to believe that he's not real sharp when it comes to computers.....(unless that's BS), so I don't see how he'd even KNOW to find this file out there, and intentionally send it to me....though I must admit, the timing is suspicious, as is the "content" of the virus-laden email. (about love).

 

Love.scr (worm virus)

[mighty bop]

I can't believe you even wasted your time writing a letter that long to a weirdo like that!!! You should have just said "Leave me alone!!!"

[Just A Girl2]

With someone as clingy and pushy and persistent as this guy (phoned 4 times yesterday, I'd been ignoring his calls), you don't just tell them "leave me alone" without some kind of explanation......giving NO explanation just gets them going even more....and they generally will continue to contact you to "find out why." I wanted there to be no reason whatsoever as to WHY I was not interested.

[moimeme]

JustA,

 

You ask:

What the hell kind of weird assed crap is this to send someone who's told you go buzz off because you're clingy/needy/creepy?

The sort of wierd assed crap that people with immature emotional responses would pull off. You hurt his feelings so he wanted revenge. This isn't just a shy, lonely guy.

 

It is indeed nice of you to try to be considerate, but all of your instincts are 'creeped out' and have been from the start. I doubt that the screensaver is an accident and I strongly urge you not to communicate with him further. Whether or not I'm wrong, and whether or not this was a deliberate, malicious act, this guy is definitely headed towards being a problem. Way too many voicemails, messages, etc.

 

I hope to heavens he will just go away, now. If he doesn't, keep all emails and voice messages he leaves. And please, please, PLEASE never invite a strange man to your home again, no matter how lovely he seems on a week's internet and phone acquaintanceship.

 

He started by violating your comfort level - therefore, after a point, he doesn't deserve your continued concern for being 'nice'. If he is that obtuse about manners, he will be obtuse about whether or not you are being nice. Don't answer any more calls or letters. Tell your cop neighbour about him, too - right away.

 

Next time, follow the 'rules' of Internet dating - you don't want to be another statistic!

[moimeme]

from: http://www.stalkingbehavior.com/

 

(I sincerely hope you won't need this)

 

A Behavioral Approach:

 

B. F. Skinner's laboratory experiments on operant conditioning lent understanding into the frequency of behaviors contingent on external reinforcement. In essence, if a particular behavior is rewarded, there is an increased chance that that behavior will be repeated. Conversely, if there is no reward, the behavior decreases in frequency or is extinguished.

 

Sometimes, when the reinforcement is provided intermittently (in a variable-ratio schedule), the behavior is more resistant to extinction. This is because one has learned that a reward could occur at any time and that persistence pays off. A good example of this situation is seen at the slot machines found in gambling casinos. The winnings occur randomly (intermittently) offering just enough reward to keep one pulling the lever for hours on end.

 

Consider the stalker. When the stalker calls the victim several times in one evening until the victim either "gives in" (e.g., tries to reason with the stalker) or offers the stalker some attention (an affective response, such as fear, anger, or shock), these responses serve as reinforcement for the stalking behavior.

 

Ending the behavior: Behaviors that are not reinforced tend to decrease or extinguish all together. But will this apply to stalking behaviors? There are examples in the literature suggesting that it can (Westrup, 1998). Harassing phone calls (i.e., threatening calls, "hang-ups", etc.) are very common stalking behaviors and will serve as a good example. As noted above, any response to the caller can be reinforcing. Resisting the urge to reason with or respond affectively is difficult, but important. However, withholding such reinforcements produce what has been described as a behavioral "spike". In other words, much like the child who is ignored and responds with a louder tantrum, the stalker may "step up" his or her behaviors. This makes it difficult persevering against the unwanted onslaught of attentions.

 

Cautions: Before implementing any interventions, it is very important to have an experienced threat management team perform a risk assessment. Each stalking situation is different. It should be noted that sometimes, when a stalker is met with resistance, he or she may actually escalate the stalking behaviors.

[Just A Girl2]

Hey there,

Did you see my second post, explaining that the weird "Are you in Love" email from him, was obviously a VIRUS? And I know from experience, that when someone's address book is, unbeknownst to them, infected with a worm virus, it just starts whipping out these emails, to many or all in their address book. I get a zillion of them in my hotmail acct.....just different ones.

 

The link I posted about this particular 'worm virus', does, at the bottom, mention this specific "love.scr" virus....and how one of the common "subject lines" a person receiving it will get is, "Are you in Love" (among a few others). So I'm pretty sure it's harmless and very much a coincidence.

 

However....about an hour after that one from his acct, I received a strange one from his SISTER (who he lives with). I know her full name (she's divorced) because he'd often phone me on her line (instead of his cell phone..he rents the basement suite)..and her name would show up on my caller ID.

 

Well, this particular email from her......it was really strange, didn't seem legit. It also had an attachment, but from my search, this attachment doesn't appear to be any kind of virus. Why SHE would be emailing me (they share the same computer, to my knowledge), is beyond me. I've never mailed her, she's never mailed me...so if it WERE some obscure virus, those things spread by sending out mass emails to everyone in that person's address book. Well, I couldn't BE in her email address book, because I've never written her, she's never written to me....and the times he's emailed me (I've checked), it's always been from his hotmail acct. Let me copy here what it said:

 

Hi, I just came across it.. check out.. =======================

Are you one of those unfortunate human beings who are desperately

looking for friends.. but still not getting true friends with whom

you can share your everything..

 

anyway you wont feel down any more cause GC Chat Network has brought

up a global chat and online match making system using its own GC

Messenger. Attached is the fully functional free version of GC

Instant Messenger and Match Making client..

Just install, register an account with us and find thousands of online

pals all over the world..

You can also search for friends by specific country,city,region etc.

 

Regards Admin,

GC Global Chat Network System..

 

If this really WERE something written by this company (GC Global Chat Network System), a) it's written very poorly and unprofessionally....some things not capitalized, punctuation missing, etc......and b) I did a search online for this company, and "GC Global Chat" and "GC Instand Messenger" and I don't come up with anything (did my search only on Google).

 

The file that's attached with it, is: GC_Messenger.exe

 

Naturally, I sure as heck didn't open it. I did a brief search to see if that's some type of new virus, but I don't get anything on it at all.

 

What are the odds that just NOW, I get this strange email from his SISTER's email account? (it's an email account set up from her ISP, not just some free web-based one).

 

What do you make of this Ms Internet Researcher? :0)

 

The reason I *did* feel the need to write him that letter yesterday, was because he really would have had NO IDEA in the world why I was ignoring him.....and when you're dealing with someone who's a little 'off' or whatever, I think it's best to be up front versus leaving them in the dark, and only giving them more reason to keep phoning and phoning and phoning, wanting to know "what is wrong".....or, showing up in my doorstep, wanting to talk (not that I'd answer the door, and I have a peephole, too!). If someone's a little cuckoo, and you cut them totally off without any kind of explanation, I think you increase the risk of them obsessing more and more about you.....going over every little detail of your last meeting, with a fine-tooth comb, stewing over things, wanting to know what's wrong, ........to the point where they could flip out and go nuts with trying to make contact, to get at the reason(s) as to why you are ignoring them.

 

I will not be returning any further emails from him, nor have i responded to the 'virus' one, from him....or the weird one from his sister (I nearly did to that one.....was going to drop her a line and ask her what that was all about, but decided against it......could have been him that wrote it from her acct).

 

JAG2

[midori]

Wow. You've got a live one on your hands, that's for sure.

 

The things he is sending you sound to me like they might be "trojans" (I think that's what they're called), little programs you send as attachments to someone, which when opened install themselves invisibly and record your email passwords, etc. You have to send them as ".exe" programs in order for them to work.

 

I think the letter you sent to him was very good. And your instinct to ignore him is good too. You're right, there's no way his sister's email accoutwould have your address in it. He probably used it thinking that you would be less suspicious of something coming from his sister, that your curiosity would be picqued, etc.

 

This sounds to me like a guy who's got way too much invested in the idea of being in a relationship. You happen to be the person he has slotted into the "girlfriend" role, and he is bound and determined to make it happen. Not because of you, who you are as a person, but because he has decided that This Must Be.

 

Yikes. I had a similar experience last month with a guy I went out with only once. He came on way too strong, too fast, talking about buying me xmas gifts and spending New Year's Eve together. Whoa! I began the evening thinking he was pretty nice. I ended the evening convinced I didn't want to have anything further to do with him. After getting emails from him I responded by saying, "I don't think a romantic relationship is in the cards for us. Maybe we'll see each other at _____'s (mutual friend who introduced us) next party." He emailed me again but I didn't respond. End of story (I hope. I hope.)

 

I hope this one figures it out soon. All it'll take is for him to meet another Potential Girlfriend and you'll be off the hook.

[Just A Girl2]

Well, this is the time of day that he'd be awake (he'd emailed me yesterday morning at 7am my time, he's not working now but used to getting up early)...and guess what? Just received ANOTHER virus-email from his hotmail acct. I don't even have to check it to verify that it is one...it's another one about a "screensaver" (file: funny.scr). Good God! This is now more than just a coincidence.

 

Now what you think about the Trojan (the mail from his sister's acct)....yeah, very possible, I'll try looking into it more. The thing is......not to put down what he does for a living at ALL, but he's a trucker, and can barely type, not too computer literate.......(unless he's just a bad typer and much more of a computer whiz than I think?).....he just doesn't strike me as the type to know how to send someone a trojan, know what I mean? Though having received 3 virus-laden emails related to him within the past 12 hours, it's got to mean something.

 

At the particular Internet Personals site that we met on, I blocked his profile a couple days ago...so that he can no longer read my profile, or even see when I'm online there....but I can still see his profile. I see he's been there within the past 12 hrs, and has even changed his profile (though it hasn't yet been approved so not sure what it now says)....hoping this is a sign that he'll just continue looking for someone!!

 

I hope the guy you wrote about leaves you alone, too, geez !!! What the hell is with these guys? I thought it was more women who could be known to be too pushy and wanted to rush things, rush into marriage LOL. Apparently NOT!

 

If anyone reading this knows anything about computers/viruses/trojans, and has followed all this til now, please respond and let me know how easy it would be for a so-called computer novice to send me a trojan.

 

With these 2 worm viruses..why would he be stupid enough to send them to me from HIS acct? You think if he wanted to wreak havoc on my PC, he'd make up some fake email addy to send them from. The fact that the possible trojan comes from his sister's acct....good thinking, Midori.....the fact that because it's from her, that MIGHT pique my curiosity enough to open the attachment. BUT.....if that's the case, and say reported this to the authorities..would he really want to involve his SISTER? THough hell, maybe she's in on it too...because she's mad that someone hurt her brother?

 

JAG2

[moimeme]

JustA - so this oddball claimed he was just a 'novice' on the internet, huh? And you believed him, huh? Would you like to buy a nice igloo in the Sahara, perchance? Or is it just that you're assuming that a man who drives a truck can't know stuff about computers? He knows enough to find and register on a personals site and to change his profile. A true novice would be bamboozled by those sorts of things. Nor does the inability to type mean that he doesn't know his way around a PC. Certainly receiving more than one virus from him can no longer be considered a coincidence. Perhaps some irritated woman sent him one once in hope of ending his means of harassing her.

 

I don't know if Hotmail closes accounts, but you could email them and see if they'll do something to stop him.

I hope you read the info in my above post. It said that stalkers, when dissuaded, will sometimes escalate, trying to elicit a reaction. This bit with his sister's account is a way to do it.

 

Oh, and just because he knows his way around computers and viruses, that doesn't mean he has the common sense to know he can get in trouble. Criminals commit crimes every day thinking that they will elude escape. Most of them are mistaken, but that doesn't twig with them. You are dealing with someone whose thinking is suspect, at best, so I'd not assume he's logical or that he has common sense. If he did, he'd be able to conduct a normal relationship, after all.

[Just A Girl2]

I didn't mean to come across like I was implying that 'truckers' would automatically be too dense to know about computers. My Dad was a trucker for many years, still is (cept now owns a trucking business), and he's one of the smartest men I know..I have the utmost respect for truckers, in fact.

 

And no, I'm not naive....and I don't assume that because a guy can't type worth **** that he's computer-illiterate......but the guy had a hard time even figuring out how to resize a picture. And as for changing one's profile, it's not rocket science......you click on a link that says "edit profile", add or change what you've written, then hit "send." Setting up a profile isn't tough.....I personally know a few people who had only had a computer for a couple weeks who placed an ad there and had no problems.

 

I did receive another 'virus email' from him today around noon. Incidentally, I also received a couple of them from email addresses I didn't recognize (one traced back to somewhere in China).

 

As for reporting this to abuse@hotmail, not much point. I've complained to them over the years, for nasty crap I've received in MY hotmail acct (from porn spammers who use hotmail accts), and it takes about 3 weeks before you get a "canned response" back.....then nothing after that. They are as useless as t*ts on a bull. Far too many users for them to care, is what it seems like.

 

As for as virus-emails in general, there have been times in the past where I'll receive a whole slough of them, from someone's address that I don't recognize.....like maybe get 7 of them within 3 days. I've always just suspected that some innocent person's address book became infected, unbeknownst to them, and their email acct was rattling off emails (with virus attachments) to everyone in their address book, without them even knowing. Sometimes I've actually contacted the person and let them know, and they were glad to be told, admitted they didn't have their anti-virus software updated.

 

But yes, the thing with having received the email from his sister, that's surely strange....though perhaps it has something to do with the fact that they share a computer? It makes no sense that if he was trying to Trojan me, that he'd get his sister's email acct involved. If he was sly enough to do such a ****ty thing, he could create a new email acct (or use an anonymous remailer) to do so.

 

Why would he risk getting his sister involved, when I could just as easily email her (while he's at work) and forward her the email FROM her, to show her what occurred.......

 

Anyway, I'm keeping my eyes peeled......but not too worried.