herenow Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 I've often pondered this myself. An OW thinks that if the MM doesn't respect his own M, why should she? The W in the M is not worth thinking about. OW didn't make vows to her, right? I agree that a MM has no respect for anyone including himself. That's where the problem begins. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Children see a lot more things day to day between two parents even before an A takes place, sometimes the A is just the straw the breaks the camel's back, but as far as what the children feel and absorb it can happen routinely. And the harm is done for good. OF course an A is not the answer, but sometimes it is the tumor to the cancer. You are justifying injuring a child by having an affair... Even Lizzie doesn't feel that way Sorry.. your whole post doesn't hold water.. try again Link to post Share on other sites
KnowHowLoveFeels Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 You mat not believe in marriage for yourself, but can't you at least respect people who do? It is a common myth that OWs are out there to destroy marriages for the sake of their selfish enjoyment. Nothing can be further from the truth! Lizzie can reject these MMs who come onto her every day, AND they will still come on to her again and again - UNTIL she finally sleeps with them. Married men, for some deep psychological reasons, find independent, strong-minded, and confident women attractive. Lizzie is just that, and I am sure MMs are attracted to her like bees to honey. The enemy is not the OWs - it is really yourself! I can relate to Lizzie because MMs come onto me all the time. I am married and in my early 30's, but I have men from all ages wanting to take me out. And after reading this thread, I'm beginning to think that perhaps, I should just give in, and "save" my marriage. LOL. (That last note was a joke. I am not able to do that yet. And I cannot be sure that I won't fall in love.) Link to post Share on other sites
Havn_a_life Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 I agree that a MM has no respect for anyone including himself. That's where the problem begins. And an OW is more than happy to come in there and help that dysfunctional MM along. LOL Link to post Share on other sites
Havn_a_life Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 It is a common myth that OWs are out there to destroy marriages for the sake of their selfish enjoyment. Nothing can be further from the truth! Lizzie can reject these MMs who come onto her every day, AND they will still come on to her again and again - UNTIL she finally sleeps with them. Married men, for some deep psychological reasons, find independent, strong-minded, and confident women attractive. Lizzie is just that, and I am sure MMs are attracted to her like bees to honey. The enemy is not the OWs - it is really yourself! I can relate to Lizzie because MMs come onto me all the time. I am married and in my early 30's, but I have men from all ages wanting to take me out. And after reading this thread, I'm beginning to think that perhaps, I should just give in, and "save" my marriage. LOL. (That last note was a joke. I am not able to do that yet. And I cannot be sure that I won't fall in love.) Yep, M and in my 30's too! I'm sure I could have an A with a guy, M or S. I have values I live by, though, which are to respect my vows and be faithful to my H. Aren't I just the oddest thing? Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 3) I can return the question: aren't you getting sick and tired of continually asking me the same questions over and over or attacking me? Yes I am actually and I have voiced my thoughts on OTHER threads so I can go to another thread without having to read the bickering going on about you and your life choices. I was making a point which is why I said what I said. But I'm done. Link to post Share on other sites
NoIDidn't Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 I have never said that you should not be able to do whatever you want. I have always said that it's your choice on how you live your life. How is that not respect? HN Don't you know you are not respecting her beliefs because you haven't thrown out your own and embraced hers? Link to post Share on other sites
NoIDidn't Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Yes I am actually and I have voiced my thoughts on OTHER threads so I can go to another thread without having to read the bickering going on about you and your life choices. I was making a point which is why I said what I said. But I'm done. WWIU I didn't think your post was harsh or judgmental in the least. You just asked an honest question. One that says, you don't have to defend yourself so why do it. But she's defensive with everyone that disagrees. Yet another clue that all is not well in Canada. Link to post Share on other sites
herenow Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 It is a common myth that OWs are out there to destroy marriages for the sake of their selfish enjoyment. Nothing can be further from the truth! Lizzie can reject these MMs who come onto her every day, AND they will still come on to her again and again - UNTIL she finally sleeps with them. Married men, for some deep psychological reasons, find independent, strong-minded, and confident women attractive. Lizzie is just that, and I am sure MMs are attracted to her like bees to honey. The enemy is not the OWs - it is really yourself! I can relate to Lizzie because MMs come onto me all the time. I am married and in my early 30's, but I have men from all ages wanting to take me out. And after reading this thread, I'm beginning to think that perhaps, I should just give in, and "save" my marriage. LOL. (That last note was a joke. I am not able to do that yet. And I cannot be sure that I won't fall in love.) Interesting that you are calling me my own enemy. Nothing could be further from the truth. Both my H and I have faced our problems and have worked to make our marriage stronger. His affair was a real wake up call that we both answered. I have always said that I blame him the most for his choice and he has accepted the responsibility for what he has done. As a matter of fact, I don't even think the OW is the enemy, she is totally irrelevant. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Lizzie60 Posted June 22, 2007 Author Share Posted June 22, 2007 Yes I am actually and I have voiced my thoughts on OTHER threads so I can go to another thread without having to read the bickering going on about you and your life choices. I was making a point which is why I said what I said. But I'm done. I'm done... for tonite..it's midnight.. I have a long 4-day weekend ahead of me LOL. Good nite! Link to post Share on other sites
KnowHowLoveFeels Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 I'm sure I could have an A with a guy, M or S. Actually, I don't have single guys asking me out for some time now. My point was, it is the married men who are the boldest in that department. Geez. Link to post Share on other sites
Tomcat33 Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 You are justifying injuring a child by having an affair... Even Lizzie doesn't feel that way Sorry.. your whole post doesn't hold water.. try again And you are twisting my words around. I never justified harming a child in order to have an A, I would be insane to do think that. What I said was that whether an A happens or not in a lot of the cases where there are major problems in the marriage before the A even happens the problems that exist are doing a number on the children. Kids can sense the distance between parents, they can sense the anymosity and the un-love that exists, that is just as harmful as finding out that one of your parents is having an A out of the blue. In some cases where there never was an A the kids are still deeply damaged by seeing the tension that exists between the two people that should be setting the example of love. The way they relate to one another during this period of crisis can and will cause traumatic effects on a child's development. So if on top of that an A happens that can be what breaks the cammel''s back. Of course not all marriages suffer through severe turmoil in order for an A to happen, I am speaking of those that do. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 And you are twisting my words around. I never justified harming a child in order to have an A, I would be insane to do think that. What I said was that whether an A happens or not in a lot of the cases where there are major problems in the marriage before the A even happens the problems that exist are doing a number on the children. Kids can sense the distance between parents, they can sense the anymosity and the un-love that exists, that is just as harmful as finding out that one of your parents is having an A out of the blue. In some cases where there never was an A the kids are still deeply damaged by seeing the tension that exists between the two people that should be setting the example of love. The way they relate to one another during this period of crisis can and will cause traumatic effects on a child's development. So if on top of that an A happens that can be what breaks the cammel''s back. Of course not all marriages suffer through severe turmoil in order for an A to happen, I am speaking of those that do. this post is bunk.. you are trying to to say that an affair doesn't affect the kids because they are already affected by the bad marriage.. Bunk... What about the affair where the MM cheats on his pregnant wife ? the kid didn't sense any tension but feels the full effect in his soon to be life.. You cannot say that it is okay to hurt a child simply because he is already hurt by something else.. there is no excuse for that.. Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Yet another clue that all is not well in Canada. Hey! I live in Canada! Link to post Share on other sites
NoIDidn't Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 And you are twisting my words around. I never justified harming a child in order to have an A, I would be insane to do think that. What I said was that whether an A happens or not in a lot of the cases where there are major problems in the marriage before the A even happens the problems that exist are doing a number on the children. Kids can sense the distance between parents, they can sense the anymosity and the un-love that exists, that is just as harmful as finding out that one of your parents is having an A out of the blue. In some cases where there never was an A the kids are still deeply damaged by seeing the tension that exists between the two people that should be setting the example of love. The way they relate to one another during this period of crisis can and will cause traumatic effects on a child's development. So if on top of that an A happens that can be what breaks the cammel''s back. Of course not all marriages suffer through severe turmoil in order for an A to happen, I am speaking of those that do. The problem I am having with your logic is that it seems like you are blaming someone in the M for what the children see. It does sound like you are saying that since the children see the problems, the A shouldn't be a big deal? That's what it seems like. Problem is, children - especially young ones - tend to blame themselves for the problems between mom and dad. And they don't have the tools to deal with what they see. Having an A with children involved only compounds whatever other dysfunction they are learning. Link to post Share on other sites
Tomcat33 Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 this post is bunk.. you are trying to to say that an affair doesn't affect the kids because they are already affected by the bad marriage. .. NO that is what you are willing to see into what I said, go back and re-read it until it you get what I meant. AND keep in context with what KHLF had posted in regards to "breaking vows". If it still doesn't make sense to you then I'll explain it again in the morning.... Link to post Share on other sites
NoIDidn't Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 this post is bunk.. you are trying to to say that an affair doesn't affect the kids because they are already affected by the bad marriage.. Bunk... Yep, that's what it seemed like she was saying to me too. Link to post Share on other sites
NoIDidn't Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Hey! I live in Canada! Oh, WWIU, you know what I meant. LOL!!! Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Problem is' date=' children - especially young ones - tend to blame themselves for the problems between mom and dad. And they don't have the tools to deal with what they see. Having an A with children involved only compounds whatever other dysfunction they are learning.[/quote'] Very good NID.. they burden themselves with the blame.. All ages.. even young adults can do that.. The child also keeps the fantasy that his/hers parents will get back together someday.. they carry that burden a very long time... Link to post Share on other sites
Tomcat33 Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 The problem I am having with your logic is that it seems like you are blaming someone in the M for what the children see. . YEAH of course I am saying that. Who should we blame Lizzie? or Angelina Jolie? :laugh::laugh: well if you had it your way I'm sure both. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Hey! I live in Canada! Maybe that helps prove her point Link to post Share on other sites
Darth Vader Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 The beauty of "wrong and right" is that it is subjective to each individual. Some people can see that for what it is. Some can't. And some know it's wrong, yet continue doing it because it feels good. It's called Denial! Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 keep in context with what KHLF had posted in regards to "breaking vows". Yes, but those other things do not do as much damage and tear a family apart, causing pain to so many like an affair does. It's apples and oranges... Link to post Share on other sites
KnowHowLoveFeels Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Interesting that you are calling me my own enemy. Nothing could be further from the truth. Both my H and I have faced our problems and have worked to make our marriage stronger. His affair was a real wake up call that we both answered. I have always said that I blame him the most for his choice and he has accepted the responsibility for what he has done. As a matter of fact, I don't even think the OW is the enemy, she is totally irrelevant. HN, you are still your biggest enemy. Think about it. The affair is over, yet you still peruse LS infidelity posts... for what? I am not trying to sound like a smart ass or pass judgement here. If you were truly over the affair, you'd be able to see how insignificant the affair was in the scheme of things in your marriage. Why should it upset you that some stranger enjoys her time with married men? She's not hurting anyone, and she's probably prolonging the married man's marriage, just as she claims. I really laud her for having the courage to stand by her POV. The only thing that I find hard to believe is her claim of not ever falling in love with any of the men. I can't understand how she manages to separate the sex from the emotions - and not getting hurt in the process. I will say it again. Affairs are not the worst thing that can happen to a marriage. Domestic violence, mind games, sexual abuse, neglect, and at least a handful other infractions are worse than finding out that your spouse has been sleeping with another woman. Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted June 22, 2007 Share Posted June 22, 2007 Jokin'around here, so no offense... I'm in Ontario. Enough said!! GO Leafs Go! Link to post Share on other sites
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