Reason why I would never be an OW....

[LivingMyDreams]

You assume that the man/woman who strayed has not addressed any issues within themselves. Why so easily assume this? Why the death knell to never being able to resolve one's own issues if one decides that the marriage is over? Individual growth comes to us all the time through different situations and people. When a spouse dies, does that mean that the surviving spouse can no longer grow and resolve issues within themselves? Of course not! Growing within ourselves is a part of this life we've been given. Daily we CHOOSE whether or not to grow and learn. Whether we do or don't has nothing to do with staying in a horrible marriage or relationship.

 

And Chinook, sometimes they do treat the spouse like dirt beforehand, but we are just too young, naive and immature to realize it. Sometimes watching the relationship of our parents with each other teaches us a warped view of what true respect and love are supposed to be between a man and woman. I'm very sorry for your growing-up experiences with your parents. Parents using children as pawns is another horrific issue that I see happening all the time. It's part of the reason why I say I hope her kids don't end up hating her.

[lonelybird]

Because usually, she doesn't treat him like dirt until AFTER they're married (or him treating her like dirt).

For what? if there are no reason, why one choose to treat the other he/she used to love like dirt?

 

I saw many marriages. Especially my parents'. If one meet them from time to time, not with them whole time, the person (for example, OW) really don't know what's happening between them. From outside seems my mom didn't treat my father well from time to time. But I know that because in the past my father cheated on her, not only one time, and started when they both were young and in love, and at that time my mom didn't doubt him at all and treated my father very well. After many times, she stored up anger. I didn't say it is right though. But in spite that my mom treat my father not very well from time to time (when she remembered the anger), they still love each other and be together now. As a OW they really don't know what happened.

[Chinook]

For what? if there are no reason, why one choose to treat the other he/she used to love like dirt?

Who knows the answer to that..? I can't say why it happens but the sure fact of life in some marriages is that it does happen. My father was a pig to my Mom and for no reason. She never cheated on him, she respected him, cared for him and he treated her like dirt just because he could. Sometimes, people are just like that. Once the ink is dry on the marriage certificate, it's like they don't have to try any more and they don't have to make an effort. My Mom was abused and devalued and yet she still stayed with my Dad for as long as she could. In the end he beat her and she couldn't take any more, so she left.

[Ladyjane14]

....My father and mother were married for about 20 years before they finally divorced. My mother spent most of those years as a nasty, mean, cruel, vicious wife, and a pretty uninvolved mother...

 

 

....My MM has been married for nearly 20 years, faithful to her only up until last year. He adored her from the time he was 13. Promised to always take care of her and always has. Always will, too; she'll never have to worry about being provided for.

 

...he had been responsible for all four children in every way for years at that point. He has a relationship and closeness with his kids that most fathers AND mothers would love to have with their kids. She's wanted nothing to do with any of them, him or the kids, for over ten years.

 

Hmmm... there seems to be a correlation in these two stories. It almost sounds like you're sleeping with 'Daddy' and punishing an inattentive 'Mommy'.

 

I think I'd talk with a therapist about that if I were you.

[LivingMyDreams]

And boy, the therapy I did for two years during that marriage was wonderful! Thanks to Ellen! Exactly what I needed in a therapist. Challenged my thinking about myself, the ex, parents, didn't pat my back and "poor baby" me.

 

I never want to see his estranged wife punished. Far from it. I worry that her kids are going to hate her for how SHE'S treated them, how SHE abuses and neglects them. I want so much for these children to have a great relationship with their mom, and them with her. Kids need to have really good relationships with both parents.

 

And my mom and I are doing well enough. Have been for a long while now. I understand to some degree why she is the way she is and that she'll never change. Btw, she treats second husband just as badly. Maybe not all men are absolute pieces of poo? Maybe some women are just happy when they're miserable and happiest when making others miserable?

[HappyAtLast]

A person that would leave "his wife/fiancee/girlfriend for me"....is just not the type of fellow to be looking for IMO.

 

Grown up people do not leave their spouses for someone else. They leave for themselves.

[luvmy2ns]

Grown up people do not leave their spouses for someone else. They leave for themselves.

 

Amen, bruthuh!

 

So, HAL, I assume then that you are one of these imaginary "men who don't cheat" that L60 says don't exist.

[Hurt & Alone]

Going back to the orginal post of "Why I would never be an OW" it is an assumption that the OP M or W set out to put themselves into a predicament to begin with. I think that sometimes things just happen. As the old saying goes "God has things happen for a reason".

In all my life I had never imagined that I would be involved with a MM and then it happened. I have learned a valuable life lesson of hurt and pain that I know I will never forget (almost like childbirth). I am able to take some valuable lessons from the whole mishap and its not all negative. My XMM taught me how a man should treat a woman.

[Tomcat33]

Amen, bruthuh!

 

So, HAL, I assume then that you are one of these imaginary "men who don't cheat" that L60 says don't exist.

 

 

Funny enough HAL is one of those very real men who left his W to be with his OW, they have been happily together since.

[norajane]

My XMM taught me how a man should treat a woman.

 

 

What could he have taught you except that he thought it was ok to lie to and cheat on his wife, the woman he made a marriage commitment to? That it's ok for men to treat their wives like crap?

[lonelybird]

Funny enough HAL is one of those very real men who left his W to be with his OW, they have been happily together since.

yeah, real man who only think about himself own happiness is much more important than others anyway, at least this world teach us so

[Tomcat33]

yeah, real man who only think about himself own happiness is much more important than others anyway, at least this world teach us so

 

Well I think HAL is more real than most men he thought of EVERYONE'S happiness. Rather than stay with his wife and string along two women he had the courage to leave one relationship that was not working for him to start one that DID work for him.

 

It happens people do fall out of love marriage is not a prison, people change and relatinships fail. I think that is much more honourable than a lot of situations, though not IDEAL by society's standards. Life is short this is not the dress rehearseal for another life this IS life, if you find happiness go to it and try to be fair. He was fair he allowed one woman to move on while he took the chance on another. And it worked out for him in the end.

 

Some people were just put on this earth to be miserable and to cause misery to all those that surround them HAL was not one of those people. Clearly.

 

What do you recommend staying in a relationship that doesn't work nor you want anymore?

[Hurt & Alone]

I believe I stated that it was not all negative. As far as "learning how a man should treat a woman" was with my personal exp with him not what was going on at home. Lying and cheating on his wife, well that was a negative aspect of it. My personal experiance is when we were together he treated me like no other man had in the past including my ex-husband (abusive).

[lonelybird]

Well I think HAL is more real than most men he thought of EVERYONE'S happiness. Rather than stay with his wife and string along two women he had the courage to leave one relationship that was not working for him to start one that DID work for him.

 

It happens people do fall out of love marriage is not a prison, people change and relatinships fail. I think that is much more honourable than a lot of situations, though not IDEAL by society's standards. Life is short this is not the dress rehearseal for another life this IS life, if you find happiness go to it and try to be fair. He was fair he allowed one woman to move on while he took the chance on another. And it worked out for him in the end.

 

Some people were just put on this earth to be miserable and to cause misery to all those that surround them HAL was not one of those people. Clearly.

 

What do you recommend staying in a relationship that doesn't work nor you want anymore?

I see, he is better than those who string more than two women.

 

If you decide, any relationship can be worked out. It is like love. True love is about choice, not only feeling and passion. What do you think the wedding vow "through thick and thin"?

 

Life is short this is not the dress rehearseal for another life this IS life, if you find happiness go to it and try to be fair.

Life isn't only about here, in flesh, our soul won't die after pysical body die, our soul would go to a place, either heaven or hell

 

This world is too desperate, because life is short that you can and should do whatever make you happy :sick:

[Tomcat33]

If you decide, any relationship can be worked out. It is like love. True love is about choice, not only feeling and passion. What do you think the wedding vow "through thick and thin"?

 

 

Life isn't only about here, in flesh, our soul won't die after pysical body die, our soul would go to a place, either heaven or hell

 

This world is too desperate, because life is short that you can and should do whatever make you happy :sick:

 

Exactly, IF YOU DECIDE. If you decide you don't want to work it out it is your choice and your personal RIGHT to do so. Relationships end, you can't forece someone to love you, you can't force someone to feel something they don't.

 

Why would anyone in their right mind want to hold someone hostage to love them? That is sort of what you are implying.

 

In life there are no absolutes and there are no 100%s circumstances change and people change. Of course you go into a marriage thinking it will be forever and throught thick and thin but some realtionships simply do not work.

 

If you are of the idea that people should stay together no matter what then should you not divorce a man who molests your child? Should you stay with someone who physically abuses you? Should you stay with someone who you simply don't get along with no matter how much you have tried? That's nonsense.

 

Ideally we enter marriage for the long haul but in practice some things in life don't pan out as we wish, that's the reality of what we are, simply human. We are suseptible to change to having our feelings change and no one has the right to take another person's life away from them if they feel they cannot work out a relationship in order to make it healthy and functioning, sometimes getting out is the only and BEST alternative.

 

Every relationship we enter has a probability that it could end, marriage is no exception.

 

so whould you do whatever makes you miserable?

[lonelybird]

Exactrly, IF YO DECIDE. If you decide you don't want to work it out it is your choice and your personal RIGHT to do so. Relationships end, you can't forece someone to love you, you can't force someone to feel something they don't.

 

Why would anyone in their right mind want to hold someone hostage to love them? That is sort of what you are implying.

I never forced anybody to love me. If you looked my other posts, I said about controling self rather than controlling others, one cannot control another.

 

I think your definition about love is VERY different from mine.

 

your definition about love is passion, feeling, emotion. nothing wrong with this. but true love does need more than this

 

True love is giving, patience, and sacrifice

 

Actually many cheaters cheat not because of abuse, but because of their own selfish passion gone out of hand

 

Whenever problems arise, they flee rather than face the problem in themselves and their partner. and grow out of it.

 

ps, i didn't mean you should stay with a severe abuse spouse

[Tomcat33]

I never forced anybody to love me. If you looked my other posts, I said about controling self rather than controlling others, one cannot control another.

 

I think your definition about love is VERY different from mine.

 

your definition about love is passion, feeling, emotion. nothing wrong with this. but true love does need more than this

 

True love is giving, patience, and sacrifice

 

Actually many cheaters cheat not because of abuse, but because of their own selfish passion gone out of hand

 

Yes that last line is very true, but in some cases people are open to find love elsewhere because all the love is gone from the current relationship. We can't deny that happens. Lust, passion attraction are all parts of love.

 

I agree that true love is more than just passion, but true love is companionship respect and devotion as well, something that also seems to go out the window in a marriage or ltr after a while, on BOTH parts. So many vows are broken before the cheating even comes into the picture.

Abandoning your spouse both emotionally and physically is a borken vow and yet I don't see a whole forum created to support people who break their vow in those ways. But cheating yes that is the sin of all sins.

What hypocricy

 

The act of cheating I still don't think is the right solution, however in some relationships there is no hope of recovery and the A is the securtiy one partner needs to ensure that when they get out they have something to cushion the blow. I am not saying it is right I am just saying that some people need that. I am not saying it is ideal or right or admirable or anything I am just saying it is what it is.

 

In my observations I have found that a lot OW/OM get involved with marrried people who assure that there is no turning back, there is trust placed on someone who is not in the right mind to make tust worthy decisions. They assure that the marriage is at the last stages before the final day comes. And yes I know that morally speaking both parties should wait until they are in the right situation to engage in a relationship but life sometimes presents oportunities for us in the strangest of ways, and we end up surprising ourselves in how we behave and the choices we make. God forgives those who are willing to repent, God does not turn away from those simply because they make a mistake. And god most certainly does not condemn those who fall out of love. I don't want to bring god into this whole debate because that is not something I let rule my life when making choices but seeing as you are very much guided by the word of god, then I think you should be fair in admitting that god does forgive no where does it say that god expects us to live a life of slavery to another human being. If you feel that your companionship and deep love is no longer there then you would be a slave to another human being all in the name of what?.

[lonelybird]

I think you should be fair in admitting that god does forgive no where does it say that god expects us to live a life of slavery to another human being. If you feel that your companionship and deep love is no longer there then you would be a slave to another human being all in the name of what?.

Yes, God does forgive:). But if people break the commandment of God, even if God forgive them, the bad consequences still follow them, it is invisible law, we don't see them, but we are guided by these invisible laws. like "what go around what come around"

 

God loves King David very much, but when David committed adultery, God forgave him, but God still punished him, severely.

 

No, no, no slavery to another human being. Any sin is a sin against God. When you do what is good in God's eyes, please God, God would supply you and make your heart rejoice! God can change people, including your spouse:) You see, the first important thing is to please God, then everything would fall into right places.

 

But if you break commandment of God, you bring curses or bad consequences into your own life.

 

You stay in a marriage because this please God, this make you grow, make your true love grow, make you more spiritually mature, NOT about slave to another

[Tomcat33]

Yes, God does forgive:). But if people break the commandment of God, even if God forgive them, the bad consequences still follow them, it is invisible law, we don't see them, but we are guided by these invisible laws. like "what go around what come around"

 

God loves King David very much, but when David committed adultery, God forgave him, but God still punished him, severely.

 

No, no, no slavery to another human being. Any sin is a sin against God. When you do what is good in God's eyes, please God, God would supply you and make your heart rejoice! God can change people, including your spouse:) You see, the first important thing is to please God, then everything would fall into right places.

 

But if you break commandment of God, you bring curses or bad consequences into your own life.

 

You stay in a marriage because this please God, this make you grow, make your true love grow, make you more spiritually mature, NOT about slave to another

 

 

Yes I agree that's why you stay in a marriage that is hard but that is still working you do it for spiritual gowth and maturity but some relationships stop growing and neither partner is willing to move it forward so it's best to get out.

 

Why didn't you comment on the breaking of vows that happens before adultery? What is your opinion of people who are sinners before they even cheat? They sin by breaking all the other vows that they swore into like respect and humility and empathy and companionship and emotional support etc?

 

 

What is "karma" is karma not just us? life works in ups and downs, in cycles. We go through good patches and bad patches, in great moments and horrible critical ones. But that's life regardless of what you do, you can't avoid it you can't perdictic it. However, we can call bad energy our way and we can call good one. Sometimes no matter how hard we try we cannot get away from bad energy but that's the cycle we are meant to live for that period of our lives and yet nothing lasts forever. There are people that lose a child, that get cancer and lose a parent all in the timespan of 6 months, and these people are not horrible they haven't commited any major sin, it's just their time to be tested to be put under the gun and see what will become of them. But God does not make people SUFFER because they are bad. We all suffer one way or another because we are put on earth to pass the tests that life has for us suffering is living it is growth and it is progress.

 

I think Karma is no different than believing your life is just a series of lucky and unlucky events, we can make good luck and bad luck for ourselves life is simply a series of good and bad moments, it is mostly up to us how many good moments we aim to live vs bad ones. But sometimes it is out of our control. I know my family will die some day and I will suffer watching them die or perhaps I will die first but that's not because I was a horrible person that's because that's life. Everything else I have a fair bit of control over so if I want to bring good karma my way I am fully capable of it.

 

If you beleive in Karma as an independant entity you might as well sit on your couch and wait for Karma to come knocking on your door to offer you an entire life...

 

I just don't think it works that way.

 

WE are karma, our brain is Karma. If you beleive you deserve to be punished you WILL be punished, by your own doings. we make or break good things that happen to us. The brain is very powerful, some people hav been known to cure themselves of cancer because their belief was so strong. Just as that can happen some people can kill themselves because their belief is so strong that they deserve the worst. So Karma is what we tell ourselves every day.

 

you can choose to call good energy your way or you can choose to call bad one, either way you decide what you want for yourself. They needed a name for that so might as well call it Karma.

[mrmaximum]

He's being 'tortured' because unfortunately he still loves her very much and she has basically had him dangling on a string. He confronted her with the evidence and she blatantly lied to him and denied it. Yesterday he finally reached a point where he couldn't take any more and he wrote her a mail asking her not to contact him any longer and to leave him be. I'm hoping he can at least start the process of healing now. I received an SMS from him last night saying it was the first time in 5 years he has cried. I've never seen him so wrecked by anyone. People don't appreciate the destruction they cause when they cheat on someone they supposedly love.

 

Glad your bud got wise and got rid of the excess baggage.

[mrmaximum]

What a sinful world!

 

Does anyone ever think about "before he cheat on me, I will cheat him first?"

 

Worked with a guy who said that EXACT same thing. I was so stunned I couldn't even answer. It's time like that one where I feel sorry for women for dealing with some of the men out there.

[mrmaximum]

Sorry there...got my posts mixed up...but the statement still stands.

 

You compared being an OW to being a gf....meaning someone who is with someone unattached, or with a MM..

 

So the MM is the pitbull, and the bf would be the yorkie.

 

Sure you can get bit by both....but you're more likely to get used by the MM than the bf.

 

Make sense now?

 

 

 

 

snide but true. you make no bones about enjoying sleeping with other women's husbands on this forum....so whats the problem?

 

Trust me, Not worth your time, let it go

[lonelybird]

Why didn't you comment on the breaking of vows that happens before adultery? What is your opinion of people who are sinners before they even cheat? They sin by breaking all the other vows that they swore into like respect and humility and empathy and companionship and emotional support etc?

I didn't say they are right. Bible teach us "husband love wife as his own body, and wife respect her husband; and they are submitted to each other"

 

There are people that lose a child, that get cancer and lose a parent all in the timespan of 6 months, and these people are not horrible they haven't commited any major sin, it's just their time to be tested to be put under the gun and see what will become of them.

I didn't say people suffering only because of sins.

 

Jacob was a righteous man in God's eyes, he didn't disobey God, but he did suffer. Why? because that was God's purpose, because God wanted to bring him to the promising land. Anyone who love God and obey God, no matter what happened in their life, all things works good for them.

 

But sin is different. sins do bring curses and bad consequences. It is unavoidable.

 

WE are karma, our brain is Karma. If you beleive you deserve to be punished you WILL be punished, by your own doings. we make or break good things that happen to us. The brain is very powerful, some people hav been known to cure themselves of cancer because their belief was so strong. Just as that can happen some people can kill themselves because their belief is so strong that they deserve the worst. So Karma is what we tell ourselves every day.

I agree with this "positive thinking bring positive consequences, negative thinking bring negative consequences"

 

But besides this, if you disobey God's commandments, but you think that it is ok and not get punished according to your logic. This is terribly wrong. You think our brain is god, but there is a true living God who is in control of everything, not our brains.

[Tomcat33]

. Anyone who love God and obey God, no matter what happened in their life, all things works good for them.

 

But sin is different. sins do bring curses and bad consequences. It is unavoidable.

 

 

I agree with this "positive thinking bring positive consequences, negative thinking bring negative consequences"

 

But besides this, if you disobey God's commandments, but you think that it is ok and not get punished according to your logic. This is terribly wrong. You think our brain is god, but there is a true living God who is in control of everything, not our brains.

 

Can I ask you something and please don't take offense but, with a name like "lonelybird" am I to interpret you don't obey god and that is why you are lonely, or that you have commited some serious sins and this is why God is choosing loneliness for you and your life?

 

I have read enough of your posts and you seem to come across like you are on God's path to be his a good pupil and you don't commit sins or go against god's word, so why are you lonely? shouldn't your name be "happy bird"? Seeing that you say god rewards all those who follow his way?

[lonelybird]

Can I ask you something and please don't take offense but, with a name like "lonelybird" am I to interpret you don't obey god and that is why you are lonely, or that you have commited some serious sins and this is why God is choosing loneliness for you and your life?

 

I have read enough of your posts and you seem to come across like you are on God's path to be his a good pupil and you don't commit sins or go against god's word, so why are you lonely? shouldn't your name be "happy bird"? Seeing that you say god rewards all those who follow his way?

haha, I am a happy bird. I picked this name lonelybird when I had nothing to with God, go figure, it is testimony:p