Open To Receive....Bring it on!!

[annabelle75]

Annabelle, see we can all agree on this one aspect at least. And TC, I feel for what you went through. But why do I sense that you blame yourself? He should have come to you and been honest about trying to fix it or moving on...the right way wasn't to hurt you and cheat on you. That was the coward's way out. That's what a man with no integrity and honesty does...a selfish man. I don't care how much you felt you neglected him, he was still in the wrong.

 

Can we all agree on this much?

 

I agree, he was wrong. So was my exH. There is no excuse for cheating on your spouse. I think its just that both TC and I have been honest with ourselves that there problems in the relationships that we were both responsible for as well. Neither of us would lay the blame soully on our partners or those they cheated with. We know we are far from perfect and aren't afraid to take some of the blame.

 

I think we both just kind of hang out here to deflect alot of the attacks directed toward those still going through the struggles of an affair. We get how they feel and don't like to see them get beat up on.

[Tomcat33]

Annabelle, see we can all agree on this one aspect at least. And TC, I feel for what you went through. But why do I sense that you blame yourself? He should have come to you and been honest about trying to fix it or moving on...the right way wasn't to hurt you and cheat on you. That was the coward's way out. That's what a man with no integrity and honesty does...a selfish man. I don't care how much you felt you neglected him, he was still in the wrong.

 

Can we all agree on this much?

 

 

That's fine I don't deny he acted in the worst possible way, hence the engagement was off and the marriage never happened despite how many years after that he begged me to reconsider...BUT on the same token I know what I did to contribute to the fail of our rel at the time. I was not motivated by our union and I had neglected certain things that I should not have and in a sense I pushed that man away from me. I have come to terms with what I did wrong, and learned the very hard way what not to do when a rel is failing. In retrospect everything happens for a reason, we were both young and I think maybe in time he might have changed his ways as I have mind, but ultimately what happened was something that was very much a product of the state our union was in. I never once thought of the woman he slept with as someone who came to ruin my engagment, we ruined our rel all by our selves, the OW was just a tool brought in to extend what was already happening.

 

Because I have been on both ends, and no thankfully I was not cheated on in an A for a year not sure how I would have handled that emotionally speaking given how distraught I was his one night fling, but I can assure you the outcome would have been the same. Get out we're through, there are no second chances for us. AND even after all that I can still look back and exactly where and how I went wrong in contributing to the deterioration of my rel. What can I say I've learned a LOT a long the way.

 

oh and sorry I forgot TOUCHE thanks for your thoughts ;-)

[Touche]

I agree, he was wrong. So was my exH. There is no excuse for cheating on your spouse. I think its just that both TC and I have been honest with ourselves that there problems in the relationships that we were both responsible for as well. Neither of us would lay the blame soully on our partners or those they cheated with. We know we are far from perfect and aren't afraid to take some of the blame.

 

I think we both just kind of hang out here to deflect alot of the attacks directed toward those still going through the struggles of an affair. We get how they feel and don't like to see them get beat up on.

 

But I'm sorry I just don't get that. Neither one of you deserved what you got no matter WHAT you think you did wrong. I really believe that. Two wrongs don't make a right. You married men of low character. They should have come to you and tried to work it out OR come to you and told you that they wanted out. Cheating on you was the wrong choice.

 

I guess that's where I disagree with you. The sole blame for the cheating SHOULD be on your exes...not on you.

 

This has been very interesting...and I mean that. I'm seeing things in a different light. I'm not being sarcastic. I just can't imagine, if that happened to me, blaming myself in any way, shape or form. I really can't. A commitment and vows ought to mean something. And when they no longer do to one party, then that person should be honest about it and not sneak around and lie and enter into a physical relationship behind your back.

 

I guess I look at things like that in a very black and white way. But in my mind, some things ARE that black and white...with no grey areas.

[Trialbyfire]

There's a trend with both women. Both women were cheated on, took the blame onto themselves and then became OW.

[Tomcat33]

I agree, he was wrong. So was my exH. There is no excuse for cheating on your spouse. I think its just that both TC and I have been honest with ourselves that there problems in the relationships that we were both responsible for as well. Neither of us would lay the blame soully on our partners or those they cheated with. We know we are far from perfect and aren't afraid to take some of the blame.

 

I think we both just kind of hang out here to deflect alot of the attacks directed toward those still going through the struggles of an affair. We get how they feel and don't like to see them get beat up on.

 

 

That's just it!

 

So sick and tired of all the bashing, some days it really brings out the absolute worst in me(case in point see two pages ago under "Tomcat" LOL), but I think both you and I are strong women who tend to fight for the underdog and well if need be we jump in eve if it is to fight back but hey who said we have no empathy :laugh:

 

I feel for both sides ladies I really do but look at how this thread started and go back to the first page and see just where it takes a turn for the ugly, I really don't get those people that feel the need to pipe in just to troll. Fair enough some poeple didn't get the point of this thread, does it have to have a point? was it malicious in any way? was it offensive in any way? I don't think so...

 

So once is enough to ask what is this for? but no it has to go on and on an on and you know something sometimes OW just wanna come on to a thread like this spill out their guts just have a serious case of verbal drainage not for any particular reason other than to get the thoughts out of their heads....why can 't people just respect that? If you don't want to read silly things OW, because everyone knows we are just a bunch of dumb twits who can barely chew and walk at the same time, why even come here to read what we have to say? WHY?

[Tomcat33]

There's a trend with both women. Both women were cheated on, took the blame onto themselves and then became OW.

 

 

 

 

Just love arm chair psychiatry!

 

 

Look did it ever occur to you that maybe just maybe because we were on BOTH ends we have a better understanding of what it's like to acknowlege when one is wrong? No one is excusing our cheaters for doing what they did. WE ARE NO LONGER with them is that not sign enough that we are on the same page as you?

 

And being an OW due to the circumstance I ended up in had JACK to do with the fact I had been cheated on in the past. MAYBE because I can understand the deterioration that happens in a rel, I can appreciate what my ex was going through. YES he was a liar in some respects but his marriage was a DISASTER. I saw it first hand, they were seperated when I dated him HELLO how much more do you need to see that they were OBVIOUSLY not working things for the best. AND to top it off I met his family/friends/coworkes and they reaffirmed everything I had already see myeslf what I heard from the outside.

 

 

You see TBF maybe just maybe you are the perfcet woman all men dream about and there really were not problems in your marraige at ALL./ maybe your H was one of the many men who cheat for no reason at all and this is why you cannot conprehend what Anabelle and I are saying.

So it's futile to try to get each other heard because you just cannot see beyond your own reality. It's like telling me that childrend die of starvation in Africa, yes the notion is very upsetting to me but until I can see a child's little sunken in body from dehidration pulled away on a gurny and little eyes closed, I might not get the the REAL sense of what it means to have starving children die.

Then again I may not need to see that because I get it OR I could just be one of those people who is in denial that it even happens.

[Touche]

That's just it!

 

So sick and tired of all the bashing, some days it really brings out the absolute worst in me(case in point see two pages ago under "Tomcat" LOL), but I think both you and I are strong women who tend to fight for the underdog and well if need be we jump in eve if it is to fight back but hey who said we have no empathy :laugh:

 

I feel for both sides ladies I really do but look at how this thread started and go back to the first page and see just where it takes a turn for the ugly, I really don't get those people that feel the need to pipe in just to troll. Fair enough some poeple didn't get the point of this thread, does it have to have a point? was it malicious in any way? was it offensive in any way? I don't think so...

 

So once is enough to ask what is this for? but no it has to go on and on an on and you know something sometimes OW just wanna come on to a thread like this spill out their guts just have a serious case of verbal drainage not for any particular reason other than to get the thoughts out of their heads....why can 't people just respect that? If you don't want to read silly things OW, because everyone knows we are just a bunch of dumb twits who can barely chew and walk at the same time, why even come here to read what we have to say? WHY?

 

But we're all here for understanding. And very often understanding doesn't always come from someone agreeing with what you say but trying to point out another way of looking at things. Wouldn't you agree?

 

As for your other post...yes I agree. The OW is not to be blamed for the failure in your relationship. But wouldn't you agree that she contributed to it in a small way? Of course, your fiance' should take the brunt of the blame for not dealing directly with your problems and turning to another woman...but can you really say that she didn't contribute at ALL?

 

Did you not have a little bit of resentment towards her?

 

Didn't you think she should have respected your engagement?

 

But really, for the most part, I have to agree with your post on that. HE screwed up. You were lucky you didn't go to the alter with him. It would have happened sooner or later for any number of reasons. Because that was his character.

 

So forgetting the BS for a minute..because I know you don't think she factors in to this, why, WHY would you want to start it up with a man like the men you ended it with? That's what I don't get. Why? Please tell me. I want to understand.

[Trialbyfire]

Many people reenact prior relationships but they become the perceived person in the seat of power. This is a form of self-empowerment and the need to control and fix, past wrongs.

[Touche]

Ok, TC..just read your other post after I posted. So your guy was already PHYSICALLY separated when you met? That's a different story in my mind. Are you still with him? Is he getting divorced?

 

(Sorry for all the questions..don't know your story...don't answer if you don't want to..just trying to understand.)

 

And thanks for the thanks. I appreciate your patience in explaining your point of view.

[herenow]

I don't have time to read all the posts here, but I have something to say about the original post.

 

The way it reads, you are telling BW that they are not charitable people and instead of posting our views about OW on this forum, we should think about the plight of others less fortunate. I find that insulting, but I'm sure you knew that when you wrote it.

 

However, if you are trying to say that an OW shouldn't be judged by their actions and that we should remove the act of the affair from who the person is. I find it hard to do that. I believe that a persons actions do indeed define their character. JMO

[Touche]

Many people reenact prior relationships but they become the perceived person in the seat of power. This is a form of self-empowerment and the need to control and fix, past wrongs.

 

Wow, so much truth to that. Not saying it's true of these ladies but I can relate to that in my own life in a way. It's certainly something worth thinking about.

[annabelle75]

But we're all here for understanding. And very often understanding doesn't always come from someone agreeing with what you say but trying to point out another way of looking at things. Wouldn't you agree?

 

As for your other post...yes I agree. The OW is not to be blamed for the failure in your relationship. But wouldn't you agree that she contributed to it in a small way? Of course, your fiance' should take the brunt of the blame for not dealing directly with your problems and turning to another woman...but can you really say that she didn't contribute at ALL?

 

Did you not have a little bit of resentment towards her?

 

Didn't you think she should have respected your engagement?

 

But really, for the most part, I have to agree with your post on that. HE screwed up. You were lucky you didn't go to the alter with him. It would have happened sooner or later for any number of reasons. Because that was his character.

 

So forgetting the BS for a minute..because I know you don't think she factors in to this, why, WHY would you want to start it up with a man like the men you ended it with? That's what I don't get. Why? Please tell me. I want to understand.

 

For me, I didn't blame the OW because I knew if it hadn't been her, it would have been some one else. He had the inclination to cheat and he would have found some one sooner or later to play along. If the only thing keeping him from cheating was the fact no other woman would sleep with him .... well just the fact that he was willign to cheat was enough reason for me to toss him to the curb. I deserved better than that.

[Trialbyfire]

Wow, so much truth to that. Not saying it's true of these ladies but I can relate to that in my own life in a way. It's certainly something worth thinking about.

It's by conscious effort that if someone crosses my radar and is attractive to me, I have to ensure that they are not a carbon copy of my ex. I can easily see myself falling for the same man because there's a type I know I'm attracted to.

[Cobra_X30]

Yes please. I want something with nuts.

 

 

OMG... I have tears Im laughing so hard. I completely missed the double meaning the first time!!!

[RealityCheck]

You see TBF maybe just maybe you are the perfcet woman all men dream about and there really were not problems in your marraige at ALL./ maybe your H was one of the many men who cheat for no reason at all and this is why you cannot conprehend what Anabelle and I are saying.

So it's futile to try to get each other heard because you just cannot see beyond your own reality. It's like telling me that childrend die of starvation in Africa, yes the notion is very upsetting to me but until I can see a child's little sunken in body from dehidration pulled away on a gurny and little eyes closed, I might not get the the REAL sense of what it means to have starving children die.

Then again I may not need to see that because I get it OR I could just be one of those people who is in denial that it even happens.

 

Now this is worth reading! This is called the open consciousness!

NICE TC! VERY! VERY! MUCH APPRECIATED!

[annabelle75]

Many people reenact prior relationships but they become the perceived person in the seat of power. This is a form of self-empowerment and the need to control and fix, past wrongs.

 

In the specific case of my marriage and then when I found out I was an OW, this doesn't pertain. If I had even had the slightest hint that I was getting played I would have never gotten involved with him.

 

But in other relationships I have had, I can definitely see this trend. I have no doubt we all do it. Once you get burned you have a tendancy to try to reclaim the power in future relationships. So in sumnation ... we're all a bunch of head cases.

[Cobra_X30]

It's by conscious effort that if someone crosses my radar and is attractive to me, I have to ensure that they are not a carbon copy of my ex. I can easily see myself falling for the same man because there's a type I know I'm attracted to.

 

Do you understand why you are attracted to this type of man?

[annabelle75]

OMG... I have tears Im laughing so hard. I completely missed the double meaning the first time!!!

 

I'm more clever than I look.

 

(glad some one finally go it)

[Touche]

For me, I didn't blame the OW because I knew if it hadn't been her, it would have been some one else. He had the inclination to cheat and he would have found some one sooner or later to play along. If the only thing keeping him from cheating was the fact no other woman would sleep with him .... well just the fact that he was willign to cheat was enough reason for me to toss him to the curb. I deserved better than that.

 

Ok, I get this. And I understand it completely. But what I'm asking is why others (not you) still would get involved with a man who is doing the SAME thing with another woman (cheating.) That's all I'm asking.

 

As for TBF, I told you a thousand times...stay away from the guys with the flashy cars!

[Cobra_X30]

Originally Posted by Cobra_X30

Coy I may be, dumb I am not. Do you honestly believe that affiars happen when spouses are open and honest with each other? Affairs thrive only in darkness and secrecy. Often the spouse doesnt know there is a problem. Maybe they are too busy making money for the family, taking care of the children.

 

If YOU are unhappy in a marriage it is YOUR responsibility to communicate and initiate fixing it. When we all develop the ability to read minds, only then will your point be valid.

 

 

Please point out WHERE I said that A happen when spouses are opne and honest with one another.

 

I look forward to seeing where I said that! (this should be good)

 

 

So your basically saying that my point sailed clear over your head? Hmmm... I can be obtuse at times.

 

Ok, you clearly stated in previous posts that BS's need to continue to work on thier marriage, and if they dont, cheating can be expected to follow.

 

I say that if there is a person who is unhappy in the marriage... it is upon the unhappy person to take steps to make thier spouse understand that fact. If this fails they may walk away from the marriage knowing they tried to communicate thier needs and thier partner did not respond.

 

BTW... I agree that your relationship was basically a marriage.

[Cobra_X30]

I'm more clever than I look.

 

(glad some one finally go it)

 

 

I bow to the master!

[Trialbyfire]

In the specific case of my marriage and then when I found out I was an OW, this doesn't pertain. If I had even had the slightest hint that I was getting played I would have never gotten involved with him.

 

But in other relationships I have had, I can definitely see this trend. I have no doubt we all do it. Once you get burned you have a tendancy to try to reclaim the power in future relationships. So in sumnation ... we're all a bunch of head cases.

There's a type that you're probably attracted to, as well.

 

Welcome to LS, where the psychology never ends...

 

Do you understand why you are attracted to this type of man?

Of course. It's a number of different attributes that are attractive to me, that can easily create the same or similar end result.

 

As for TBF, I told you a thousand times...stay away from the guys with the flashy cars!

Sveetheart, you know I need the other bookend.

[Touche]

Originally Posted by Cobra_X30

Coy I may be, dumb I am not. Do you honestly believe that affiars happen when spouses are open and honest with each other? Affairs thrive only in darkness and secrecy. Often the spouse doesnt know there is a problem. Maybe they are too busy making money for the family, taking care of the children.

 

If YOU are unhappy in a marriage it is YOUR responsibility to communicate and initiate fixing it. When we all develop the ability to read minds, only then will your point be valid.

 

 

 

 

 

So your basically saying that my point sailed clear over your head? Hmmm... I can be obtuse at times.

 

Ok, you clearly stated in previous posts that BS's need to continue to work on thier marriage, and if they dont, cheating can be expected to follow.

 

I say that if there is a person who is unhappy in the marriage... it is upon the unhappy person to take steps to make thier spouse understand that fact. If this fails they may walk away from the marriage knowing they tried to communicate thier needs and thier partner did not respond.

 

BTW... I agree that your relationship was basically a marriage.

 

EXACTLY on the bolded part. But no, I don't agree that the relationship was basically a marriage. I'm sorry but I've been in both kinds of relationships and iin my opinion there IS a difference. But I respect those who don't agree on that.

[johan]

I'm sorry but I've been in both kinds of relationships and iin my opinion there IS a difference. But I respect those who don't agree on that.

 

I don't respect them at all. I spit on them.

[Cobra_X30]

I don't respect them at all. I spit on them.

 

I hope you dont work in food service!