sharing finances

[fluffy0]

Hi, I have a question for everyone. Me and my fiance are getting married in two weeks. We agreed that after the marriage we will put 80% of what we get as presents (which I think won't be that much since most of our guests are kinda poor) into a joint checking account to start off and then we will use that account to cover the joint expenses and have separate accounts for 'our" money.

 

We kind of disagree as to how much to put in each one. I say we put almost all our money into the joint account (and a little into savings every month so that pretty much everything we buy comes out of that and each get about 25$ or so just for ourselves and just transfer that out of the account at the beginning of every month. i also am willing to make my savings account joint even though i have 4600 already saved in there since I have been saving since high school, as long as he is willing to contribute some each month.

 

He thinks we should just use the joint account for things that we share like rent, food, etc. and pay for the rest out of separate accounts. part of it is that he has a lot of debt and says he doesn't want to burden me with it. His dad is really irresponsible with money and his parents fight a lot about it so he says wants to avoid that.

 

I don't see how keeping everything separate avoids fighting b/c if isn't paying off his credit cards and then gets into financial trouble i have to bail him out, since it's not like I can be living large while he can't pay for food if we are married.

 

Also, there is the issue of credit cards. He doesn't have an insurmountable amount of debt, and a lot of it was neccessary since he is paying for school out of pocket with no loans right now, but he just has a A LOT of credit cards. I have none b/c since i have been a student and haven't worked regularly due to schedule conflicts, study abroad, etc. i feel I am not yet responsible enough to be handling them. But I don't really like that he has all this "money" to spend if he wanted to at his fingertips and I don't. He refuses to get rid of any of them and says he uses them responsibly but it just bothers me that sometimes he uses them to lend money.

 

Also, his father, whom I am really starting to loathe, cries poor every few months and asks him for some money even though his parents live better than us and we have a baby on the way and are both students. I think he is a total moocher but my fiance thinks he owes his parents because his parents raised him and he is the only one who will help them blah blah blah. it pisses me off that we don't have luxuries like cable, internet, or even a landline and live in a tiny apt. but his parents think they are just too good to live like that.

 

Anyways, sorry this post was so long but i am just wondering how other people share money in a marriage/ long-term partnership. Also, how do you handle mooching in-laws and lending money in general. I mean I know i have to respect the values my fiance has but ugghh, it makes me so mad that he gives those irresponsible idiots money and makes excuses for them. (sorry, had to vent) I would really appreciate everyones ideas on how to share money in a marriage and how to handle giving money to in-laws

[Tony T]

You have some VERY MAJOR PROBLEMS here that must be resolved BEFORE you can even think of getting married. So sorry, but I smell a divorce big time in this scenario.

 

Money is the number one cause of marital discord and the two of you are very far apart. First, why be married if you're going to handle your money separately. It should all go into one pot and the two of you discuss how it's going to be handled...saved or spent. OK, if you want to have separate accounts for minor things...fine. If you can't come to some agreement that you are both very happy with concerning the bank account situation, DON'T GET MARRIED.....it will ONLY GET WORSE....it will cause you more pain and horror than you can imagine. Money brings out the primitive animal in everyone.

 

Equal in problems is your fiance helping his parents. This is really nice but if what he makes goes mostly to his parents, unless his parents are ready to croak they could keep you poor for many years. There are a lot of people who allow their parents to suck them dry. I believe in honoring my father and mother...but it ought to be the other way around as well. If he continues to give bucks to his parents every few months you will grow to resent it more than you can imagine.

 

LENDING money with credit cards? It doesn't get much worse than that. A person with a lot of credit cards can easily let spending and debt get out of hand. That situation is a bomb ready to go off at anytime. I'm with you all the way...there is simply NO REASON he should have so many credit cards and NO REASON in the universe why he should be using them to loan money...unless he's taking a LOT of collateral and getting paid an interest rate greater than what he's having to pay the credit card companies.

 

Your future marriage is now in critical condition and you don't know it. Either see a counselor who can help you sort this out...or just give it some thought. Do you want to be with a partner with whom you are constantly arguing about money??? I don't think so.

 

Give this marriage business more thought. Love can dry up with the $$$. I think your engagement was far more premature and I'm so glad you posted here. Please get the advice of those you trust who are around you...don't take it from me. You are in big trouble with this dude...but you most probably won't listen to me now because you are so in love.

 

Print out my post and hide it somewhere so you can see just how true it all becomes if you go through with this before coming to major agreements that will be kept for sure!

[Touche]

Wow. For once, I have nothing really to say. Tony said it all. Please pay attention Fluffy. Read that post again and again. Pretty much all that I was going to say was mentioned in Tony's post. He's right.

 

Watch out. In my opinion you moved WAY too fast but live and learn, right? Hope you can turn this around before it gets worse.

 

Good luck and let us know how it works out for you.

[woodsfield]

my head is swimming:confused:

 

i'll just put in my two cents:

you better get this straight before you get married and keep it straight. this will BIG stresser in your marriage,

 

different things work for different folks.

[Trialbyfire]

I agree that differences in financial money management can kill a marriage..fast... You two need to resolve this pre-marriage.

 

As to combining your money, I don't agree. I agree with your b/f that you keep one joint account for shared expenses, where you both fuel it with your portion, monthly. I would have serious difficulty with someone who tried to tell me how to manage or attempted to take control of my finances. Also, I'm not interested in controlling my partner's finances.

[fluffy0]

I really appreciate everyone's advice, and I was sort of surprised at how much everyone jumped at my fiance. I suppose my post may have made it seem worse than it is, he doesn't lend his parents most or even a large percentage of the income or anything and he always pays his fair share with our shared expenses.

 

I am sorry, but i can't cancel teh wedding and i think everyone gets married with a certain amount of unresolved issues, i mean you can't plan out and discuss EVERYTHING that will come up in your marriage ahead of time. We ahve been together for a long time and though I will admit this pregnancy was very much unplanned (I thought I would need fertility meds to ever get pregnant but I know I should still have been more careful) but we were planning our wedding before I found out so we are not getting married just to make my pregnancy legitimate or anything. Also, we did talk about our finances a lot ahead before getting engaged. It's just that it's quite different talking about things in the hypothetical and actually planning out every detail and doing it. Like we always agreed we would ahve a shared account, but not teh exact way we would go about doing it.

 

I know it sounds like I am making up excuses for myself ,but I just don't see canceling the wedding as a good option.Also, since i am pregnant, I don't want to give myself a huge amount of stress. So, for better or worse, i am going ahead with the marriage plan. What I really need is advice on how to talk about money. It seems like everytime we talk, we come with some plans but when we try to actually see them to fruition they turn out impractical. So, I would really appreciate some advice on how to talk about money or some ideas on how to work out a compromise.

 

Please understand that I know this could have been planned better and we should be completely on the same page before getting married, but some things are easier said than done. I am trying to fix my situation as much as possible right now.

[Curmudgeon]

So, I would really appreciate some advice on how to talk about money or some ideas on how to work out a compromise.

 

The money issues have to evolve. Of course, they're complicated by a coming child. You've no idea how expensive the little rug-rats can be but you're about to find out.

 

Talking should be the least of your worries. If the two of you can't communicate rather than confront, that's the first issue you have to work on. Once you can be open and honest with one another on all things, the money issues will begin to fall into place with mutual cooperation.

 

One thing I've learned about financial planning, and I used to be horrible at it, is that both of you need to pay yourselves, individually and collectively, first before you start paying others. Even if it's just a little bit, something has to be set aside every month or however you're paid. Especially with a child, vehicles, etc. things will happen that are unforseen.

 

If it's any comfort, my wife and I have been married 11 years and it's the first time for both of us in a marriage with a dual income. I think we're now in our fifth iteration of managing our joint finances after a number of trials and errors. However, one constant has always been that a significant percentage of our household income goes into savings and investments for our future. My wife actually retired, with a pension, five years ago and I'll be following suit in less than three years, also with a good pension.

 

Solve the communications issues and you'll be fine!

[katiebour]

As someone who learned the credit card lesson the hard way, I can see why this situation would be stressful to you. I graduated college with $15,000 in credit card debt and have been paying it off to a consumer credit counseling agency for almost 7 years now. Thankfully I believe I'll be able to eliminate them within 6 months.

 

I had 9 cards and when things got tough financially, or when I wanted to be irresponsible and splurge (oh, some of the STUPID things I bought) I maxed them out.

 

Unfortunately, realizing that having a multitude of credit cards is a bad thing and that someday you'll have to pay the piper is a lesson that is most often learned through painful experience. And frankly, in order for your b/f to have this experience, he'll have to do it on his own- you CANNOT bail him out if/when he gets in trouble. Otherwise he'll have no incentive to learn from his mistakes.

 

I live with my b/f and we work out the finances. Basically I have my credit card debt, student loans, and my share of the bills. My b/f has school-related expenses (textbooks etc.) and his share of the bills. He works 20 hours a week so his income is of course half of mine.

 

We don't have a joint account, and probably won't get one until either we get married or until I get the debt paid off.

 

As for the bills now, I generally pay them; if I can't afford to pay a bill, I toss it my b/f's way and he takes care of it. We're also embarking on some dental work for him, so most of his current funds will be going towards that.

 

In our relationship, even though we're not married, it's been a "for better or for worse" kind of situation. When my b/f started school, he got about $1600ish to live on for 4 months from financial aid. His car died, he had to buy a used one, and he could not pay bills or buy textbooks. I paid his rent, his bills, bought his books, and supported him for about 8 months until things got back on track for him.

 

Thankfully when financial aid situations got better, he repaid me in full from his fall loan. This enabled me to take care of almost 2 grand of my credit card debt in one fell swoop- so supporting your significant other is not neccessarily throwing money into a bottomless pit.

 

However, for you my dear I think that maintaining the bulk of your funds in private accounts would be wise. A joint account with a carefully budgeted amount being direct-deposited from your individual accounts would be good. Pay rent, electricity, gas, phone, internet, cable, food and any other shared expenses from this account. Budget out approximately how much that is, maybe add $50 a month from each side for contingencies, and do not deposit a single dinar more than that total amount.

 

DO NOT give your SO your savings account. That is your backup in case of emergency, and since you seem to have the better head on your shoulders, financially, you need to remain prepared. Also you might want to think about setting up an IRA that you pop $100 into each month- there's no time like the present to safeguard your retirement.

 

There are no guarantees in life these days, and no guarantees in marriage. You need to make sure your finances are secure, contribute to the household expenses, and let your b/f make his own mistakes and learn from them- all by himself. The bottom line is: take care of yourself and your children. You have a baby on the way- start a savings account for baby and put $50-100 in there each month. You'll thank yourself 18 years from now when baby goes to college. Encourage your b/f to get his head on straight with the finances- encourage him to start his own savings account for baby. But above all do not put any of your resources within his reach. There are too many stories of ex-spouses draining joint bank accounts in the event of divorce.

 

It sounds like although your b/f is not being smart with the cards, he does want you to maintain financial independence. It is a very good thing that he's not trying to get his hands on your money- keep it that way.

 

And again, I must emphasize- let him learn his lessons from the cards. If he can't pay them, then HE needs to figure out a solution other than you bailing him out. I repeat, the only way he will learn about responsible credit is by dealing with the crisis himself. I recommend Consumer Credit Counseling Services- they take all your cards and pay them, you pay CCCS one lump sum a month, they cut your interest waaaay down and calculate payments based on income, and you are completely unable to use cards while paying CCCS.

 

If you have to take over payment of rent and shared expenses so that he can pay his debt, then of course you should do so, but only after he commits to a program like CCCS.

 

Trust me, once the lesson is learned things get a lot better. I'm almost 7 years down the line, almost free of consumer debt, and I know if I ever get a credit card again it will be only one card with a self-imposed maximum balance of $500.

[Trialbyfire]

Credit card debt is one of the worst kinds of debts possible. The interest rates are phenomonal. They should always be the first thing you pay off or you will kill yourself paying the interest, nevermind getting to the principal.

 

I have two credit cards. Both are always paid off monthly. I don't even bother with the second one anymore except to fuel my paypal account, since it has a deliberately small max set, in case paypal ever gets hacked again. Sometimes I even forget I have the second card until it comes time to purchase anything online.

[brainless twit]

My husband and I have a joint checking account, but we pay our bills separately. I have an Excel spreadsheet with all of our bills and paydays, and every pay period I sit down and crunch numbers. It's complicated but it has worked for us for 6 years of marriage.

 

My bills are my student loans, car payment, and one credit card payment. He has a car payment, a monthly gym membership fee, and one credit card payment. We added up all the joint bills (mortgage, insurance, food, utilities), divided by four (two of us, two paychecks per month), and that's the amount we both pay out of each check. Every payday, I know exactly how much money is coming out, where it's going, and how much is left. Whatever is left after bills belongs to whoever got paid. For example, after I pay my personal bills and my portion of the household bills, I usually have +/- $300 left on payday. I portion $80 to cover filling my car up twice, then the rest is for whatever I need to buy. When my husband gets paid, his bill money comes out, then whatever's left belongs to him.

 

That sounds confusing when I look back at it, but it truly does help. Even though we keep track of our own money, the account is joint to cover anything that comes up that one of us may not be able to pay on our own.

[fluffy0]

My fiance is pretty responsible with paying off credit cads every month, and his balance isn't outrageous, it's a little more than 4,000. the problem is that he doesn't pay much more than the minimum amount. He's talked about maybe getting a loan from the bank to pay everything off and then he would just have to pay just the loan. He refuses going to those credit counseling companies. I think mainly he doesn't want to not be able to have credit cards and he figures f his debt isn't that outrageous then why do it.

 

My main problem of all is his willingness to lend money to his father. This man is the most irresponsible person I have ever met. He has no idea what "you can't afford it means you can't have it" is. Ofcourse, he is also a great manipulator. Like one time he called my fiance and said he thinks he has late stage stomach cancer or something like that. He hadn't even gone to the doctor at all yet and he is already self-diagnosing himself with late stage cancer? Oh, and by the way can he borrow some money because he can't afford groceries or to put gas in his car. Well, it's been a few months since then and looks like he doesn't have that cancer after all. What a surprise.

 

He also is constantly crying about how they must take cold showers because the gas has been turned off because he has no money. But somehow there is always enough money to pay for the cable and high-speed internet. Uh-huh.

 

I've worked in a center for kids with troubled parents so I know how even if your parent is a drugged out prostitute who prostituted her own kids for drug money you will still defend her and want to feel accepted by her. So I understand that no matter what his dad does he will always feel it is his responsibility to help out his parents. I guess the fact that my fiance is always really generous is what made me fall in love with him, but now I am seeing the dark side of it. So, any advice on how to deal with the future mooching father-in-law issue?

[norajane]

In this situation, I'd say keep your finances separate, except for that joint account for joint spending.

 

I say this primarily because you will need to have money available for emergencies, and it doesn't sound like your fiancee has any savings for that, nor does it sound like he will be responsible enough not to fritter away the savings. Keep your savings for emergencies, and to pay the expenses for your child that you don't even know about yet.

 

Your other option, and I don't recommend it unless your bf hands over his credit cards, is to pay off that $4000 debt with your savings account, maybe over a span of 6 months. There's no reason to pay the minimum and pay the outlandish interest rates when you have money available. When he borrows cash from his cards, he's getting hit with a lot more interest than if it were just purchases - he's being very, very foolish!

 

Also, banks aren't going to give him a loan unless he has collateral. And it doesn't sound like he has any assets.

 

HOWEVER, paying off his cards for him is a bad idea if he's just going to keep racking up more debt!

 

My suggestion is to put together a comprehensive budget which you both stick to religiously. Put all your monthly expenses in there as well as your expected income. Figure out how much you'd have to pay off each month to clear the credit card debt, and make sure that he pays the cards first. You should also put that wedding money toward paying off the cards.

 

Sometimes seeing ALL the numbers in black and white like in a budget makes the financial reality hit home. He has to change his attitude about credit cards - and about lending money HE DOES NOT HAVE - before you will ever get out from under your debt. Especially with a baby on the way.

[andersks]

As soon as you get married, your money and his money become "our" money. You are in it together and both need to take care of each other's debt if you ever want to start saving for a future.

 

If you ask me, you should have a joint account for expenses such as rent, and things you need to pay now. And a second joint account for paying off both his and your accumulated debt. Keep a little money for each of you to have in your pocket as cash. Then when you pay off the old debt, change that account into a savings for the future.

 

"first you have to pay off yesterday, pay for today, and then you can think about paying for tommorrow."

[marsbars]

I will have to say that being in a marriage that was a joint account only relationship, that by the way has fallen apart because of money, a joint account plus separate ones for both of you is really the way to go. But use them for your personal expenses. Not family expenses. Remember his debt will be yours the minute you say I do. Unfortunately that is the breaks. I would have to say that if you commingle all of your money it becomes a hotbed for fights. Eventually one partner feels that they are getting the short end of the stick when they want to spend some money and there isn't any to spend cause the other already spent it. Trust me, this has been one of the reasons that my marriage is on the rocks. IF both of you are responsible for the family expenses and then your own accounts then there is accountability. No one feels that they can't buy something. If you have the money in your account it is yours. IF you don't well you'll have to wait till payday. Money is one of the biggest stress-ors in a marriage.

[curiousnycgirl]

Fluffy I know you say your main issue is his father, and from your previous posts I believe this - but what are you doing about it?

 

I actually think it is very simple - you need to explain to him that while it is very nice that his parents raised him, and that clearly you appreciate that, because you love him - his primary responsibility now is to you and the baby which are his family.

 

It is really that simple. If his family (meaning you) are doing without - than he has some nerve giving even a dime to his parents, or to anyone else for that matter.

 

Frankly if he can't even pay down $4,000 in credit card debt - then he is not financially ready to support a baby. Therefore he needs to get ready, which means not another penny to his parents. It really is that simple.

 

Of course if he doesn't see it that way, then I agree with all the other posters, you are very foolish to consider going forward with the wedding. This is a huge issue - it is his basic value system.