jtalia Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 I am married with 2 sons. My husband has looked at nude pics on the internet for some time. He used to do it several years ago and I asked him to stop b/c of the kids potentially seeing it when they were on the computer. He told me he had stopped. I found it several months after that and confronted him. He lied about it all even when I asked him several times. Then when I showed him the history, he fessed up. He, again, promised he wouldn't look at it. Several years have passed and I have yet busted him again. The fact that he is looking at naked women doesn't bother me, it is the fact that he is looking up "teen" porn. He has his own laptop and the kids aren't allowed to use it. He says that when he types in "teen" that it brings up more hits. What do you all think? Should I not be concerned about him looking at this?? Since we have been having marital problems, he says he started looking at it again because "what else was he to do?" Link to post Share on other sites
LucreziaBorgia Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 He keeps looking because up until now there have been no serious consequences for doing so. He knows that the only consequences are that you get upset and get on his case for it - your feelings in the matter aren't enough to make him want to stop. People stop doing things, only when faced with personal consequences and the threat that they will lose something if they don't stop. What are his consequences? What does he stand to lose? Right now, there are no consequences, and he doesn't stand to lose anything so he has no real motivation to stop. Your being upset about it isn't enough. People don't quit stuff like that for altruistic reasons. He has to be given serious consequences that affect him, and be given a very real threat of loss. Otherwise, he'll just continue what he is doing. Link to post Share on other sites
michaelk Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 I suspect that he will look at porn no matter what condition your marriage is in. He probably just does it more now that things between you aren't so good. But this is not a bad thing, and I'm glad to hear that you aren't bothered by him looking at naked women. Generally, I would say just let him be. He's doing something that's both common and natural. On the specific issue of teen porn, though, things get a little tricky. If these are actual photos of teenagers, then he's participating in the sexual exploitation of children and there are both strong legal and moral reasons to object to that. If, on the other hand, he's looking at fantasy porn where adult women are (for example) dressed in pigtails and schoolgirls' outfits, I would let it go. There are entire cultures where this kind of fantasy is common (e.g. schoolgirls in Japan), and as long as no one's being unwillingly harmed, and no kids are involved, I tend not to worry about other people's fetishes. Link to post Share on other sites
JamesM Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 I have mixed feelings on this. I am not advocatiing that he watch porn, but since you say you don't care if he looks at naked women, then I think your problems are ...teen porn, accidental viewing by your kids, or his dishonesty. The "teen" porn to which you refer is most likely girls that are 18 and older. It is highly unlikely that he is watching actual underage teen porn. So then, you must decide at what age the models can be. Is it wrong to watch 18 yr olds? What about 20 yr olds? And on it goes. If the girls are under 18, then he is watching illegal porn. This becomes more than a marital issue. If you are concerned that he children will accidentally see his porn, then either he must no longer watch porn or he must set some "blocks" in place so that accidents don't happen. I am guessing that this is internet porn. There are filters available with passwords. If his computer is his own, then he must make it clear that no one else uses it...not because it is used for porn, but because it is his. Father's property is not for the children. If he watches porn when the children are around or are not in bed, then he needs to confine his viewing habits to when the possibility of them accidentally seeing his porn is zero...which means that the children ARE in bed or are not home. One remaining issue is how you feel that he is repsecting your wishes. In your mind (rightly so), he is lying to you. He says one thing and still does the other. In your mind, you might be wondering if he is lying about other things. If this is the main concern, then I think that either he learns to respect your feelings or you both need MC. So, if porn is okay with you, then define what age girls can be. If you are afraid that the kids will be watching it, then he must prevent this. If the whole problem is that he is not being honest with you, then this has nothing to do with porn. Porn is a symptom. Link to post Share on other sites
RollMeAway Posted October 16, 2007 Share Posted October 16, 2007 The fact that he is looking at naked women doesn't bother me... Since we have been having marital problems, he says he started looking at it again because "what else was he to do?" I'm not certain about your H, but I can tell you from personal experience that the few times I was completely fulfilled from a relationship I had no need for porn. Just me though, not sure about everyone else. Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 I'm not certain about your H, but I can tell you from personal experience that the few times I was completely fulfilled from a relationship I had no need for porn. Just me though, not sure about everyone else. I'm the same way. The times I've looked at porn have been those few occasions when the state of my relationship denied me any other sexual outlet. Not sure how universal that feeling is... Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
Faith4u Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 What else is there to do? Play some sports? Do an activity with me? Have sex with me? That is what you should ask when he says that... You know I do not like porn issues because they do break a couple if the person is addicted to them. Is he? If he is satisfying you sexually and adds is porn that is fine. But not the other way around. I am married with 2 sons. My husband has looked at nude pics on the internet for some time. He used to do it several years ago and I asked him to stop b/c of the kids potentially seeing it when they were on the computer. He told me he had stopped. I found it several months after that and confronted him. He lied about it all even when I asked him several times. Then when I showed him the history, he fessed up. He, again, promised he wouldn't look at it. Several years have passed and I have yet busted him again. The fact that he is looking at naked women doesn't bother me, it is the fact that he is looking up "teen" porn. He has his own laptop and the kids aren't allowed to use it. He says that when he types in "teen" that it brings up more hits. What do you all think? Should I not be concerned about him looking at this?? Since we have been having marital problems, he says he started looking at it again because "what else was he to do?" Link to post Share on other sites
luvstarved Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Before you talk with him you need to be clear in your own mind what your true feelings about the porn are. It is all over the map, women's feelings about porn and men's levels of attachment to it, and it really needs to be negotiated between the two of you. Nobody likes to be told what they can and cannot do, but in a relationship you have to make your choices. What can you live with porn wise and what can you not? What can he? If you really do not object to it outside of the teen angle then you need to be clear on that. He is probably lying because he is embarrassed or thinks you object to it on some different basis. But you have to be honest with yourself. You can't say you don't mind except...and then say well, actually,... Assuming it is legal porn, then that is how you need to approach it... "Teen" brings up more hits? LOLOLOL. How many does he need? I have never observed it to be difficult to find "enough" porn hits... Link to post Share on other sites
Author jtalia Posted October 17, 2007 Author Share Posted October 17, 2007 I agree with luvstarved in that you don't have to put in "teen porn" to get more hits. I think "porn" alone would bring up plenty of hits. I know it is just a lie. He puts in searches like "teen p*ssy", etc. That really bothers me. In fact, it totally grosses me out. When I had found the history on his computer, I looked at some of the sites to see what they showed as far as age goes. It looked like they were all around 18. What is the facination with such young girls? To me, they are kids and I can't seem to get passed that. I am 33 yo and I am very comfortable in how I look. He says he had to resort to this since our marriage is rocky right now. I know I had been stand offish for awhile in the sex department because of his anger issues. Just didn't feel like giving in. So, maybe he had to resort to this to get some fulfillment??? I just can't accept the "teen" thing. I know he was embarrassed about it and he did tell me he thought he had a problem. I don't trust him that he won't look at it again. He has lied before. He said he would get counseling for it but has yet to find someone. I am thinking he thinks I will forget about it. But I haven't obviously. He told me he looks at it when the kids are in bed. They don't mess around on his computer. Now I know why he was so defensive when I would ask to use his computer. Am I crazy to not want to trust him with this?? He says he will never do it again, but he has said that before and then did. Like I said before, the naked women pics don't bother me....as I know that it is only natural for a male to want to see that. The problem lies with the teen pics. As far as consequences go, I have told him that I wanted a divorce. He said he had hit rock bottom and would do anything and everything to keep me. We have many other problems than just the porn. This is just the issue that stays in the back of my head and prevents me from wanting to move on with him. Thank you all for your posts! Link to post Share on other sites
tommyr Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 I know I had been stand offish for awhile in the sex department because of his anger issues. Just didn't feel like giving in. As far as consequences go, I have told him that I wanted a divorce. He said he had hit rock bottom and would do anything and everything to keep me. We have many other problems than just the porn. This is just the issue that stays in the back of my head and prevents me from wanting to move on with him. I do not condone lying or teen porn by your husband. Now having said that, please tell me why you find it acceptable that your marriage is sexless and the H has "anger issues" yet you do not appear to be seeking any help or counseling over those problems. Instead, you are ready to divorce him because of his porn viewing. Honestly? I question these priorities. It sounds to me like you have no love for H otherwise you would be posting questions about sexless marriage and anger. So ask yourself if you want to work on your marriage with him, because it sounds like you do not want this man as your Husband, just as a sexless roomate who does not view porn. Sorry I cannot help you with that. But ask me about sexless marriage and anger, I have some great experience there. Those are solvable issues. Link to post Share on other sites
Ladyjane14 Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 I do not condone lying or teen porn by your husband. Now having said that, please tell me why you find it acceptable that your marriage is sexless and the H has "anger issues" yet you do not appear to be seeking any help or counseling over those problems. Instead, you are ready to divorce him because of his porn viewing. Honestly? I question these priorities. It sounds to me like you have no love for H otherwise you would be posting questions about sexless marriage and anger. So ask yourself if you want to work on your marriage with him, because it sounds like you do not want this man as your Husband, just as a sexless roomate who does not view porn. Sorry I cannot help you with that. But ask me about sexless marriage and anger, I have some great experience there. Those are solvable issues. I agree with luvstarved in that you don't have to put in "teen porn" to get more hits. I think "porn" alone would bring up plenty of hits. I know it is just a lie. He puts in searches like "teen p*ssy", etc. That really bothers me. In fact, it totally grosses me out. When I had found the history on his computer, I looked at some of the sites to see what they showed as far as age goes. It looked like they were all around 18. What is the facination with such young girls? To me, they are kids and I can't seem to get passed that. I am 33 yo and I am very comfortable in how I look. He says he had to resort to this since our marriage is rocky right now. I know I had been stand offish for awhile in the sex department because of his anger issues. Just didn't feel like giving in. So, maybe he had to resort to this to get some fulfillment??? I just can't accept the "teen" thing. I know he was embarrassed about it and he did tell me he thought he had a problem. I don't trust him that he won't look at it again. He has lied before. He said he would get counseling for it but has yet to find someone. I am thinking he thinks I will forget about it. But I haven't obviously. He told me he looks at it when the kids are in bed. They don't mess around on his computer. Now I know why he was so defensive when I would ask to use his computer. Am I crazy to not want to trust him with this?? He says he will never do it again, but he has said that before and then did. Like I said before, the naked women pics don't bother me....as I know that it is only natural for a male to want to see that. The problem lies with the teen pics. As far as consequences go, I have told him that I wanted a divorce. He said he had hit rock bottom and would do anything and everything to keep me. We have many other problems than just the porn. This is just the issue that stays in the back of my head and prevents me from wanting to move on with him. While I agree with you, Tommy, cerebrally... emotionally, I agree with the OP. Angry guys are NOT attractive. And as I've said many times before, women are highly reliant on their brain as a sex organ. An angry outburst can be the equivalent of a cold shower. Now, on top of that, he's added a somewhat deviant sexual behavior... it's possible that, without treatment, he may have permanently destroyed his wife's attraction for him. I agree with her about the "teen" porn. Sure, it's probably the "barely legal" variety, but just because you're on the right side of a technicality doesn't make it any more palatable to your mate. That sh*t would turn me off too... in a big way. Maternal feelings being what they are, that's not cool. Those girls are just kids, even if they are old enough to vote. Imagine the least attractive old fat granny riding a scooter at the WalMart dressed in her housecoat and you standing back 5-feet for avoiding the B.O. Doesn't that make your dick shrivel just a bit? THAT's what pervy behavior does to a woman. He can be an otherwise attractive guy, but if you find his sexual preferences to be grotesque... it ain't happening for ya. I would say that in order for this marriage to be saved, this guy is going to have to get on the stick and attend to business within his marriage. He can't just keep dousing his mate's libido in cold water and then expect her to rally indefinitely. To the OP, I would recommend setting up counseling, either with a marriage or sex therapist. Don't wait for your husband to do it. There are things you need to work on too, so I don't see this as being a matter of just individual counseling for him. It's not always easy to let go of resentments and get back into a state of trust. Counseling will help you do that. If he's non-compliant... hey, at that point you'll have done what you could to save the marriage. If he leaves you with no alternative but to divorce him, that's his choice. Link to post Share on other sites
Kenyth Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Sounds like a symptom of a sex starved marriage. I don't know if this is your case, but in a frightening number of relationships women use sex as a kind of reward system to change their spouse's behavior. This is generally totally counter-productive. Link to post Share on other sites
Ladyjane14 Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 ...in a frightening number of relationships women use sex as a kind of reward system to change their spouse's behavior. This is generally totally counter-productive. Weird. I never met a single woman in real life who does this. Mostly, they seem to be either attracted to their mate enough to want sex at a given moment... or not. Although, there do seem to be a fair few that go through with "duty sex" just to keep the peace. Link to post Share on other sites
cranium Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 He says he had to resort to this since our marriage is rocky right now. I know I had been stand offish for awhile in the sex department because of his anger issues. He said he had hit rock bottom and would do anything and everything to keep me. While I agree with you, Tommy, cerebrally... emotionally, I agree with the OP. Angry guys are NOT attractive. And as I've said many times before, women are highly reliant on their brain as a sex organ. An angry outburst can be the equivalent of a cold shower. Now, on top of that, he's added a somewhat deviant sexual behavior... it's possible that, without treatment, he may have permanently destroyed his wife's attraction for him. Has he always had anger issues? When did they start? How long have you been stand offish? Sexually and emotionally frustrated guys might develop “anger issues” after “awhile” and eventually hit rock bottom. Angry guys may exhibit anger when actually they’re depressed. Weird. I never met a single woman in real life who does this. You must run with a pretty tight crowd. Link to post Share on other sites
woodsfield Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 The problem lies with the teen pics. As far as consequences go, I have told him that I wanted a divorce. He said he had hit rock bottom and would do anything and everything to keep me. We have many other problems than just the porn. This is just the issue that stays in the back of my head and prevents me from wanting to move on with him. i see your point about the teen porn...but where do you draw the line. would it be OK for him to look at "mature" ladies. ALOT of porn sites deal with teens. i have issues with him lying and continuing to look at the young girls after your told him not to. it sounds like you will not be able to move on with him if this AND OTHER issues are not resolved. LB put it best...he won't quit until it directly affects him. sad but true. if he doesn't respect you enough to tell you the truth and stop things that hurt you, then he needs a serious "adjustment" of some kind. Link to post Share on other sites
Ladyjane14 Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 You must run with a pretty tight crowd. Actually, I don't think I do. It's saying something fairly nasty about a person to believe they treat sex as a commodity to be bartered upon. While it's true, that sometimes a woman does choose to comply with "duty sex" and one could look at it as trading sex for 'keeping the peace', I think it comes from a more honest place. Most married women understand they've made a sexual commitment to their husbands and they might occasionally choose to take responsibility to honor that commitment, even when they don't really feel like it. That's wholly different from weaponizing sex, i.e. "You be a good boy or no num-nums for you". How insulting is it to your mate to believe they're capable of that sort of crap? You know, jokes are funny because they're inappropriate. So... yeah, that one comes down in sitcoms and stand-up routines all the time and we laugh our asses off. But it's not real life. In real life, you spend your time looking up keywords like "teen pussy" and then the wife starts thinking you're a perv, gets grossed out, and doesn't want to 'do' you. He knows her views on porn. She's stated that they've talked about it extensively, and she doesn't seem to be an unreasonable woman. The guy has no excuse. Rather than attend to business outside the bedroom, he was seemingly content to treat her to a filthy temper and passive/aggressive actions, rather like a toddler who isn't getting things just his way. If he loses his family dynamic over this, it's gonna be his own fault. Link to post Share on other sites
tommyr Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Angry guys are NOT attractive. Agree. And guys in a sexless marriage are often angry (having been one myself). Rock, meet hard place. Since SHE is the one asking for advice (did not see her H on here) my suggestion was directed towards her - the porn and sexless and anger are ALL part of the same problem - her marriage lacks love and intimacy. She seems to want to solve the only thing bothering her (his porn usage) but is fine with status quo in the other areas. I doubt that removing porn from a sexless marriage with an angry husband will make anybody happier. And as I've said many times before, women are highly reliant on their brain as a sex organ. I am learning. Really, I am. Link to post Share on other sites
Kenyth Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Regardless, the simplified problem is that sex starved marriages suffer, and that that marriages that are suffering are usually sex starved. The problems tend to go hand in hand. You can play the "Which came first? The chicken or the egg?" game all you want, but it won't do much good. Many instances of men looking at occasional porn stem from them feeling sexually unfulfilled. That doesn't mean it's right, but it is nevertheless a cause and effect. If everyone would stop worrying about trying to be "right", and start showing some love, things would probably improve. Now mind you, I don't know his true use of porn. It is possible that he is an addict, which is a totally different thing. Link to post Share on other sites
JamesM Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 Regardless, the simplified problem is that sex starved marriages suffer, and that that marriages that are suffering are usually sex starved. The problems tend to go hand in hand. You can play the "Which came first? The chicken or the egg?" game all you want, but it won't do much good. Many instances of men looking at occasional porn stem from them feeling sexually unfulfilled. That doesn't mean it's right, but it is nevertheless a cause and effect. If everyone would stop worrying about trying to be "right", and start showing some love, things would probably improve. Now mind you, I don't know his true use of porn. It is possible that he is an addict, which is a totally different thing. Okay, you said two things here. Porn is a result of a sex starved marriage, and then you seemed to tack on the end that if he is an addict, it is a different story. Fact is...there are many men who have or could have great sex in their marriages, but the appeal of porn overwhelms the enjoyment of real sex. THEN the sex diminishes. When seeking a solution, it IS important to determine which came first. So, you are correct in both statements. But too much porn WILL have an impact on the sexual fulfillment that has nothing to do with the partner. As far as consequences go, I have told him that I wanted a divorce. He said he had hit rock bottom and would do anything and everything to keep me. We have many other problems than just the porn. This is just the issue that stays in the back of my head and prevents me from wanting to move on with him. Jtalia, this sentence jumped out at me, and I think this is the key to the porn problem. It is a symptom of bigger problems. My suggestion is to seek out MC for all of your problems...if you think this marriage is worth saving. And I assume for the sake of your children, you do. Link to post Share on other sites
Ladyjane14 Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 ...guys in a sexless marriage are often angry (having been one myself). Rock, meet hard place. Since SHE is the one asking for advice (did not see her H on here) my suggestion was directed towards her - the porn and sexless and anger are ALL part of the same problem - her marriage lacks love and intimacy. She seems to want to solve the only thing bothering her (his porn usage) but is fine with status quo in the other areas. I doubt that removing porn from a sexless marriage with an angry husband will make anybody happier. I hope you didn't think I wasn't agreeing with you back there, Tommy. I do. All I'm saying is that emotionally, I can see how she'd be REALLY turned off by her husband's behavior. That's all. As Kennyth pointed out... there's a bit of "the chicken and the egg" here. Yeah... porn might turn a guy on, provide him with some diversion, and seem like a pretty good stop-gap for a married guy who isn't getting any action. But... if it turns his partner off, as fetish type porn is apt to do, he's not accomplishing anything that's likely to solve his marital problems in the long term. In fact, he's just making it worse. In the end, like James, I think both these folks could use some counseling. That way, they can identify the source of the problems and get some new tools for handling the communications issues, work on overcoming resentments, etc. Link to post Share on other sites
Author jtalia Posted October 17, 2007 Author Share Posted October 17, 2007 I don't want to imply that we are having a complete sexless marriage. Actually that is not totally the case. We have been intimate on several occasions, but I feel as if it is out of duty more than anything. I have fallen out of love with him and am seriously trying to find that love I once had for him. His anger problems started about 6 years ago. I am not sure exactly what led to them. First I had thought it was I, but now I know I am not totally to blame. Our marriage was awesome to begin with and then changed a few years into it. He did marry me when I already had one son, so he had a ready made family. We never really had alone time. Then we had our last son 8 years ago. Since he was young his anger has been a problem. Name calling, out bursts, etc. I have suggested couseling to him on several occasions and he refused. Yes, refused. He said he didn't want to tell others of his problems and that he could figure them out on his own. Apparently not. I had threatened divorce on many occasions but never fell through with it. So why would he believe I would actually go??? An example of a name he has called me a couple of times is a c*nt. All the ladies will know what I am referring to here. It is a name you just do not call any female!!! I thought that was grounds for leaving but never did. My fault. This last Feb. we have hit rock bottom. I told him I was out and he cried and said he would go to counseling. We tried it individually as the counselor recommended first. She told me I needed to pack my bags and leave. She didn't say much to him. We opted not to go back to her. I tried talking with my pastor but felt extreme guilt after that. What I mean by guilt is since I have fallen out of love with my H, I have thought of being with someone else. I just have so much resentment towards him. It is very hard to be attracted to someone who treats you like sh*t. He has now been really trying and doing nice things etc. But I don't know if it is too late??? I just don't think I want to spend the rest of my life with him. I always told myself that when the kids graduate high school, I was gone. That is another 9 years and that is a very long time. The porn thing is just one of the things that has torn our marriage apart. He doesn't understand why it bothers me so. Like I said before, it is the "teen" thing. It just makes me sick to my stomach. When I am intimate with him, I feel nauseated. Partly because I am not "in love" with him. I so long for that love again. When he was eyeing the porn, we hadn't been intimate for maybe 3 weeks???? He thought that was soooo long and that it led him to look at it. Is that really that long of a time when you have been married for almost 9 years????? Thanks for everyone's input!! Link to post Share on other sites
Kazan Posted October 17, 2007 Share Posted October 17, 2007 nothing is wrong with porn, and "teen porn" is 18 and 19 year olds Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 When he was eyeing the porn, we hadn't been intimate for maybe 3 weeks???? He thought that was soooo long and that it led him to look at it. Is that really that long of a time when you have been married for almost 9 years????? I don't condone your husband's behavior, but if that statement summarizes your approach to marital intimacy, then I understand why he has turned to masturbation ... Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
michaelk Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 Is that really that long of a time when you have been married for almost 9 years????? My wife and I have been married for 13 years, together for 19. At our lowest point, when things were totally dysfunctional, we had sex perhaps every other week. Now that we are working on things, it's usually 5 times a week. And no, she's not doing it out of obligation or fear. She's after me more than I'm after her these days! Don't let yourself think that having infrequent sex is okay just because you've been married a long time. It probably indicates that something else needs looking into. Link to post Share on other sites
tommyr Posted October 18, 2007 Share Posted October 18, 2007 jtalia, Thanks for providing more background on your story. I think we can help one another! I will provide some insight into your husband's brain, if you will sneak me a copy of the HOWTO manual that brides receive on wedding day (containing that downward graph of sexual frequency versus years of marriage... WTF??!!). You do not love your husband (and he curses you) yet your thread is titled Porn question. You were hoping some anonymous genius on this forum could "fix" his porn issue then things are A-ok again? If only he would give up the porn and be satisfied with monthly sex with his "nauseated" wife then the marriage works? While you may be content with a no-sex policy, your husband will continue meeting his own sexual needs (most likely involving porn) until such time as you both address the basic problem of love and intimacy in the marriage. If you decide the marriage is WORTH fixing, then please rephrase your question to focus on the core issue - because the porn is only a symptom, it is NOT "the thing tearing your marriage apart" as you stated. Link to post Share on other sites
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