Ow Challenge...

[frannie]

Frannie? Can I ask..what made you decide ..at this point..that you cannot do this any longer? Was it an accumalation of things? Or just one thing that made you realize...this is NEVER going to change?

 

Well since earlier this year I've felt myself distancing myself from him, as I say it started off sexually, and later it became just argumentative between us, I was getting angry with him. Tiny things he did started to annoy me. It became that there was really no joy in seeing him. He was happy to continue with it all, was trying harder all the time, reading up on relationship issues, emotional needs, etc. And just last month deciding to go to counselling to see what could be done about our relating...

 

But as far as I was concerned yes, he was making an effort... but it was just an effort to keep the status quo. And nothing he did was going to change the essential fact that he was still married and messing up a lot of people's lives just so everything stayed exactly the same.

 

If it was one specific moment it was the morning when he said his W had had a go at him over the weekend for not being around and putting no effort in at home. It was then I realised that it wasn't 'all ok' as long as I put myself out and made the best of it... for the sake of his home life being stable so his kids could be happy. What she said revealed to me that everyone was getting hurt, all five of us... and what was the point of that..? How could I be happy, and how could I respect someone so willing to bumble along like this..?

 

You can add to that his unwillingness to really discuss the practicalities of leaving at some point, and giving no indication of when that might be. He just came across as someone with his head in the sand.

 

But really, all those things I could have dealt with, but what made it pointless to continue was that my heart was rejecting him. I always knew it would happen at some point, I've written about it 'ending naturally' often enough on here. But here it was, is, happening...

 

... just a natural ending, I suppose. Though it is absolutely not without its pain, regret, and difficulties. Not the least of which is that he is in counselling... which leaves the dreaded 'hope' dangling over everything. However, I can't see the point in seeing him unless he's made a commitment to leave, and I can't see that happening... so... basically that's how it stands.

 

I want to give some additional information, which was prompted by a PM to me. So I was thinking that maybe other people were wondering the same:

 

No, there's no age difference between MM and I, we're both early forties. He has no medical problems, neither have I. The end of the sex part was just a precursor to the end of the emotional closeness, and came completely from my dissatisfaction with the relationship. Perfectly natural. Can't remember what the other questions were! But anyway, just to say that it was a gradual fading of our closeness due to my dissatisfaction with the situation.

[KATANYA]

Hi everyone. Great thread and I wish it were around about a month ago. I stopped the A with my MM after 2 years for a lot of reasons and things between us have been going ok up to this week.....now its all starting to get a little confused (after an out of town trip we both attended) and I'm dealing with some feelings and issues that I didn't expect I would after his actions and meeting with his W a couple weeks ago. Having a hard time with the 'clear thinking' and exMM is certainly playing the most of that---can't believe I even listen to him and/or am stupid enough to believe what he's saying! Obviously, I have work to do.....having a hard time right now.

 

I'm in!!!

[White Flower]

Hi everyone. Great thread and I wish it were around about a month ago. I stopped the A with my MM after 2 years for a lot of reasons and things between us have been going ok up to this week.....now its all starting to get a little confused (after an out of town trip we both attended) and I'm dealing with some feelings and issues that I didn't expect I would after his actions and meeting with his W a couple weeks ago. Having a hard time with the 'clear thinking' and exMM is certainly playing the most of that---can't believe I even listen to him and/or am stupid enough to believe what he's saying! Obviously, I have work to do.....having a hard time right now.

 

I'm in!!!

Hi Katanya,

 

Glad you joined:) and sorry to hear you're having a hard time. Me too as it's so tough. They always talk about the OW being his drug, but he was mine, too.

[White Flower]

But anyway, just to say that it was a gradual fading of our closeness due to my dissatisfaction with the situation.

Thanks, Frannie,

I think you just hit the nail on the head. It was dissatisfying. The unanswered questions, the time, the shorter than expected emails, the number of phone calles, etc, etc, were all dissatisfying. Why did we all on this thread allow ourselves to be treated in a less than satisfying way? I'm sure we all have individual answers.

 

For me, at first, something with him was better than nothing at home.

[KATANYA]

Hi WhiteFlower....they certainly are a drug - one I thought I could kick without this much trouble (feel like I'm on the verge of a major relapse!!!) I know so many reasons (especially after talking to W) about WHY I don't need MM in my life as anything more than a friend but.....gosh, he can talk such a good talk and he really knows me too well! Nothing about being his OW is glamourous and he's VERY honest about what he can offer and what he can't and won't....he has never pretended to be anything other than what he is. I actually want to believe what he says but that would be taking a HUGE step back.......augghhh -----I just keep repeating "I want to get out more than I want to stay in"....eventually its going to stick!

 

How's everyone else doing? How are things going with you Whiteflower - it was your 1 year mark as I read......what's your plan now?

[Gwyneth]

So much for my willingness to go along with the plan here. I gave in....

 

and now that I have the freedom to post again!!!!, I'm going to post an update on my affair.

[KATANYA]

Gwen....you made me laugh!

 

I don't think ANYONE expects that if we 'join' this challenge we will be any more stronger or have any greater immunity from our MM's:o Hopefully though it will be easier to break things off when you are ready knowing there is a group of people trying to do the very same thing (often time after time and time.....one of these times it will happen!)

 

Read your update.........buckle up, the roller coaster is on its wasy BACK UP:D:rolleyes:

[Gwyneth]

Ha Ha, for real. Maybe it's because Men make us weak?

[nadiaj2727]

Ha Ha, for real. Maybe it's because Men make us weak?

 

 

Exactly. Let's not let them make us weak anymore. Stay strong ladies.

[Gwyneth]

Exactly. However, when the married man is having his affair with us OW, it's a sign of his weakness, which means us women make Them just as week, if not weaker. Most men would never admit it, but hey, that's what it is.

[White Flower]

Hi WhiteFlower....they certainly are a drug - one I thought I could kick without this much trouble (feel like I'm on the verge of a major relapse!!!) I know so many reasons (especially after talking to W) about WHY I don't need MM in my life as anything more than a friend but.....gosh, he can talk such a good talk and he really knows me too well! Nothing about being his OW is glamourous and he's VERY honest about what he can offer and what he can't and won't....he has never pretended to be anything other than what he is. I actually want to believe what he says but that would be taking a HUGE step back.......augghhh -----I just keep repeating "I want to get out more than I want to stay in"....eventually its going to stick!

 

How's everyone else doing? How are things going with you Whiteflower - it was your 1 year mark as I read......what's your plan now?

Well, it has actually been over two years since the very beginning, but one year as a full fledged thing and he kinda missed the "anniversary". But, can't really blame him for withdrawing since I have been holding back due to my wanting more and not getting it, if that makes sense. I guess I don't want to write a book. My plan? God knows. But since I've hinted toward ending it I already feel he'll make it easy for me. He hasn't been that great at the juggling lately, so, I'm sure he'll find a break-up a relief. It will be hard, though because of the upcoming holidays and my birthday. My close friends advise me to postpone it.

[nadiaj2727]

He hasn't been that great at the juggling lately, so, I'm sure he'll find a break-up a relief. It will be hard, though because of the upcoming holidays and my birthday. My close friends advise me to postpone it.

 

Hi WhiteFlower. Your close friends know you better than us online friends. I think you should listen to their advice. I've realized (not just with xMM but with other break-ups and life in general) that NO time is a good time... there is always SOMETHING that comes up and makes you think "But I can't do it yet, because of this." So in a sense, sooner is always better. But I think they must have some good reasons to advise you not to do it during the holidays/ your birthday -- it is very hard emotionally so maybe it's better to put it off until you can focus on just getting over it. But also maybe the distraction of the holidays and your birthday, especially if you can be with your close friends/ family members, etc., will make it easier in a way. I'm obviously unsure, so I say pay more attention to what your close friends in real life say, as you know them and trust their advice for you. Either way, best wishes... even though I only know you online, I often think about you in real life and wonder how you're doing. I know that sounds so strange!!!

[nadiaj2727]

Exactly. However, when the married man is having his affair with us OW, it's a sign of his weakness, which means us women make Them just as week, if not weaker. Most men would never admit it, but hey, that's what it is.

 

Yeah I admit, MM having affairs are weak, and I think that's a big reason why they do it. But let them be weak, we can be the strong ones and end it because we know it's not good for us in the long run.

[White Flower]

Thanks, Nadia. I've thought about you ever since you posted about MM scanning restaurants before entering them and how humiliating you found it.

 

Yes, I have an upcoming test Monday regarding my ovary and my friends say that I don't need the stress of a breakup right now. Please keep your fingers crossed for me:)

 

Thanks for your support--I have really felt it:)

[nadiaj2727]

Thanks, Nadia. I've thought about you ever since you posted about MM scanning restaurants before entering them and how humiliating you found it.

 

Yes, I have an upcoming test Monday regarding my ovary and my friends say that I don't need the stress of a breakup right now. Please keep your fingers crossed for me:)

 

Thanks for your support--I have really felt it:)

 

Yes, I felt humiliated about that and many other aspects of being an OW. I still feel very guilty about it. I just try to tell myself that I finally wised up and moved on, and I won't ever do it again (and will no longer have the desire to, now that I know what I'd be singing up for!!)

 

I will definitely keep my fingers crossed for you on Monday, I sincerely hope the results of your test are good!! I agree with your friends, dealing with MM is the *last* thing you need to be worried about in light of such serious things going on in your life. I wish you could just not think about him at all and relax and take care of yourself. I know that's hard though. Good luck.

[Lyssa]

Yes, I have an upcoming test Monday regarding my ovary and my friends say that I don't need the stress of a breakup right now. Please keep your fingers crossed for me:)

 

Yup - you don't need the extra stress of a break up! I hope everything goes well with the test and all of us will be here praying and keeping our fingers crossed!!

[Lyssa]

he really knows me too well! Nothing about being his OW is glamourous and he's VERY honest about what he can offer and what he can't and won't....he has never pretended to be anything other than what he is.

 

Ggggrrr... what is it with MM?? They really know us well, don't they? He knows me so friggin' well that it irks me sometimes! It wasn't glamourous before this either for me and he has been honest about everything else. I know my MM has never pretended to be someone else or anything he isn't - which is not a bad thing.

 

I know I would take up the challenge if he didn't follow through with his words. I don't think I could go on. It was too stressful even though I keep telling myself I was not going to get all worked up over this and that everything would be okay. I'm happy it's different for me now but also at the same time, I feel the pain that all of you are going through because so many times in the past I wanted to end it because I couldn't take the emotional rollercoaster ride.

[frannie]

Thanks, Frannie,

I think you just hit the nail on the head. It was dissatisfying. The unanswered questions, the time, the shorter than expected emails, the number of phone calles, etc, etc, were all dissatisfying. Why did we all on this thread allow ourselves to be treated in a less than satisfying way? I'm sure we all have individual answers.

 

For me, at first, something with him was better than nothing at home.

 

To be fair, our phonecalls have been long and frequent, his 'visits' lasted for days, and I've never felt very dissatisfied with that aspect of things (the 'treatment'). OK, he's not brilliant in emails, but at least they're frequent

 

No, for me it was the 'not really going anywhere' and insecurity of the situation that wasn't what I wanted, ultimately. We tried to 'live in the moment' for a period of time, but relationships can't exist like that... we will inevitably want to talk of the future (if I didn't, he would...), and when the future is a blur and under a black cloud of doubt, then things start to fall apart.

 

But actually, thinking more on the 'treatment' part of it, it was more the overall picture. The way he was happy to have two women in his life (well, OK enough with it not to move to change it), and mislead at least one of them to a degree I just can't agree with... I think that, more than anything, was what killed it for me.

[BritishChic]

Wow, thanks PlayBrat for linking me to this thread- the words that you've posted are very valuable. I think the hardest battle for me, is within myself; it's the battle between my heart and my mind.

 

My mind is so over it. So over it, that its sickening. My mind is frustrated and agitated. My mind can't understand why my heart still thinks and feels so positively for him. In my mind, he is the worse scum of all. However, my mind is the one, I feel giving me such hateful feelings. I have feelings of rage some days where I want to find him and put a gun to his head. I want him to feel for a split second some sort of pain similiar to my own. I want to see him desperate. My mind thinks this'll give me control.

 

My heart wants to get in my car right now, drive 7 hours back to where I moved from, walk into his work place and tell him how much I miss him and how much I believe I still love him.

 

But now that there is a newborn involved (his with her). I feel completely unworthy of even being able to say that. I've always felt I've never had a voice. And thus, my feelings never had a voice. I wish I could tell him how I used to feel for him and have the ability, the strength to then walk away. I wish his wife could know what he did to her, I feel bad for her in a way and if it was me, I would want my husband to know he cheated on me.

 

I feel like this is a disease that's taken over my life. I want to move on. I want to begin a fresh, new relationship. I want to have those 'good' feelings all over again for someone new, someone different, someone who will treat me well. But in times of weakness when I am driving in my car and I hear 'our' song or I see a newborn dressed in blue, I feel the pain all over again. As wierd as it sounds, the baby dream was "MY" dream..now I feel like, even thats been taken away from me.

[whichwayisup]

It isn't your place to tell his wife. I mean, while you were having an affair with her husband, when things were good between you and her husband, I'm sure thoughts of telling her never entered your mind, right? So, why is it only AFTER the A ends, most OW feel the need to spill it to MM's wife? I just don't understand...(And I'm talking about OW who choose to have affairs with MM KNOWING they are married before the A starts.)

 

Your best revenge is to heal, move on and find a (single) man who can make you happy. He has a newborn and because of that child, it isn't fair of you to tell her..The A is over, so do your best to move on and don't look back.

[White Flower]

Hi Britishchic,

I copied and pasted the following from you,

 

"I've always felt I've never had a voice. And thus, my feelings never had a voice. I wish I could tell him how I used to feel for him and have the ability, the strength to then walk away."

 

This is how I eventually began pulling away. Oh, I definitely had a voice in the beginning and he was all over it. I fell in love because he heard me, knew me, and made me feel loved. My H has made me feel voiceless and MM was just what the doctor ordered.

 

He met me anytime anywhere and was so unbelievably creative about it. Once it became PA, he had to be home by 3 pm. It was just that sudden. I still felt loved, though, and he listened so much.

 

But then came the rollercoaster ride. I flew high, then plummeted. I'd tell him about it and he would meet me just to hold me. We didn't get passionate on those days. I still felt loved, but his solutions never really came to light.

 

Then we'd talk about how they never really came to light, laugh about it, make more promises (on his part), but....you know.

 

I finally figured out that he just can't keep his promises, not that the promises were huge. It is a lot for a man to juggle two women. It is great as long as they (the women) are both happy. If one is going through a difficult time, life is still pretty good for him and both women. If life sucks for both women, the OW gets the boot. Oh, he never showed me the door, but I felt like he had. That's when I found LS.

 

I told him about LS and I think after he checked it out he became concerned I would fuel myself with the knowledge and statistics that would then enable me to end it. Who knows, he may have even figured out who I am here and knows my every thought and every intention through my posts. It wouldn't be hard for him to figure out who I was. Perhaps that is why he has even pulled back himself?

 

Funny, we haven't been able to talk much at all lately and he just called from a public restroom as usual to say not very much at all while I was typing this. I felt like crying before he called and feel like crying now. These calls used to last so long for me by letting me know he was thinking of me but now they just make me sadder. I felt like he called because he had to. If I were to communicate that feeling via email, he may or may not respond. So why communicate if nothing will come of it?

 

It is so funny how we delude ourselves into thinking that we are being chased by MM because they put us above all else. Why do we do that? Why do we think they prefer us? I must admit it was a thrill even though I felt bad for his W. But, the proof is that she is above all else. And I am just an afterthought. And I have no voice in the matter.

[Gwyneth]

Wow britishchic, this sounds like a really bad situation for you. Before you do anything drastic, really, take time to heal. Just like anything that is painful, it needs time to heal. Some pain needs more time than other pain. You will survive this--your world isn't ending, and although it may seem like it is, it really isn't.

 

Smile a lot--when I'm down, I smile and for some reason it makes me instantly happy and feel a bit better. Give it a try

[head.heart& hand]

Yesterday, someone sent a link to privateaffairs .com. I skimmed it and found a little different spin on the question “why end it?” This response reminded me of ongoing conversations I’ve had with a friend mirroring the statement below.

 

The article styated " I would ask a different question: "why end it now?" Whether the EMR ends now or later, pain and heartache are probably unavoidable. Even if the relationship isn't "meant to be" (and few of these EMRs are) both OPs are going to be very reluctant to let it go. You can kill the relationship and suffer today…and in doing so, forego any joy or other benefits that the relationship could bring you if you let it continue. The relationship, for better or worse, is extremely likely to collapse from the weight of its circumstances. Forestalling that collapse may seem like tilting at windmills...but hastening it may also deprive the partners of an experience that will enrich their lives now and in the future.

 

By the way, I once purchased a rare, late 1800’s version of Don Quixote for my mmm and signed the card “ tilting at windmills (--still)”. My, that was some time ago now---. However, much has changed since that time. I guess there’s been enough progress and action to keep me tilting ( still) yet it is so often discouraging and tiring to wonder— will my story end as the novel did? “… Those false and nonsensical stories… are tottering and without a doubt are doomed to fail.”

[White Flower]

Yesterday, someone sent a link to privateaffairs .com. I skimmed it and found a little different spin on the question “why end it?” This response reminded me of ongoing conversations I’ve had with a friend mirroring the statement below.

 

The article styated " I would ask a different question: "why end it now?" Whether the EMR ends now or later, pain and heartache are probably unavoidable. Even if the relationship isn't "meant to be" (and few of these EMRs are) both OPs are going to be very reluctant to let it go. You can kill the relationship and suffer today…and in doing so, forego any joy or other benefits that the relationship could bring you if you let it continue. The relationship, for better or worse, is extremely likely to collapse from the weight of its circumstances. Forestalling that collapse may seem like tilting at windmills...but hastening it may also deprive the partners of an experience that will enrich their lives now and in the future.

 

By the way, I once purchased a rare, late 1800’s version of Don Quixote for my mmm and signed the card “ tilting at windmills (--still)”. My, that was some time ago now---. However, much has changed since that time. I guess there’s been enough progress and action to keep me tilting ( still) yet it is so often discouraging and tiring to wonder— will my story end as the novel did? “… Those false and nonsensical stories… are tottering and without a doubt are doomed to fail.”

I couldn't have said it better, thanks. BTW, can somebody tell this ditz (me) what an EMR is? And are you still with MM?

[KATANYA]

Hi Whiteflower....I do believe EMR is extra-marital relationship (at least that's how I read it! lol)

 

Your MM sounds like my (ex)MM...move forward/pull back! Uggghhh.........I wish I'd never gotten involved with him. Today I've got A LOT of anger toward him for pushing all sorts of buttons that didn't need to be pushed.........have to see him later to do a prep meeting for tomorrow........I almost want to call in sick! Don't want to see him right now - just want to stay angry!!!!!

 

It is so funny how we delude ourselves into thinking that we are being chased by MM because they put us above all else. Why do we do that? Why do we think they prefer us? I must admit it was a thrill even though I felt bad for his W. But, the proof is that she is above all else. And I am just an afterthought. And I have no voice in the matter.

__________________

 

Love what you said here. Want to add that despite ALL the reasons we know they make the worse partners, and despite all the times we feel bad for the W, and despite all the times we ask 'why doesn't she just leave his 'sorry a$$'? I wonder why we (OW) find it just as hard to walk away and why we still fall for the lines and the calls and all those things that make us feel SOOOO miserable after?

 

Sorry for the rant -----down day today!