Does this forum legitimize cheating?

[bish]

I think OW/OM have alot of issues!! I don't understand how cheating people could live with themselves! This forum does not legitimize cheating but all these OW/OM here on Loveshack sure go all out to justify their disgusting behavior and legitimize cheating. That is so sick and wrong on so many levels.

 

I agree wholeheartedly. Well said.

[OpenBook]

I think OW/OM have alot of issues!! I don't understand how cheating people could live with themselves! This forum does not legitimize cheating but all these OW/OM here on Loveshack sure go all out to justify their disgusting behavior and legitimize cheating. That is so sick and wrong on so many levels.

 

And I am disgusted by how many married people treat each other. I think THAT's just as sick and wrong, if not more so - as vows are being broken all over the place. And I'm not talking about the vow of fidelity. I'm talking about the vow to Love/Honor/Cherish each other... how one partner wears the other down on a daily basis until they feel like a shell of their former selves... how affection is withheld from the other as a power play... how one becomes indifferent or too wrapped up in their own head to even care about how their partner is doing...

 

And yet that behavior is legitimized because it's happening inside a marriage? Not in my book.

[reboot]

And I am disgusted by how many married people treat each other. I think THAT's just as sick and wrong, if not more so - as vows are being broken all over the place. And I'm not talking about the vow of fidelity. I'm talking about the vow to Love/Honor/Cherish each other... how one partner wears the other down on a daily basis until they feel like a shell of their former selves... how affection is withheld from the other as a power play... how one becomes indifferent or too wrapped up in their own head to even care about how their partner is doing...

 

And yet that behavior is legitimized because it's happening inside a marriage? Not in my book.

Funny how so many of us are willing to put up with or legitimize such behavior simply because we're "married". Boy you just said a mouthful. I'm here for perspective and you just gave me a new one.

 

I'm impressed. Very good post.

[White Flower]

And I am disgusted by how many married people treat each other. I think THAT's just as sick and wrong, if not more so - as vows are being broken all over the place. And I'm not talking about the vow of fidelity. I'm talking about the vow to Love/Honor/Cherish each other... how one partner wears the other down on a daily basis until they feel like a shell of their former selves... how affection is withheld from the other as a power play... how one becomes indifferent or too wrapped up in their own head to even care about how their partner is doing...

 

And yet that behavior is legitimized because it's happening inside a marriage? Not in my book.

Good point, OpenBook.

It's all about how people generalize and perceive marriage. I believe it also has to do with youth and inexperience. It's easy to have an opinion about something you know nothing about, but hope it will be. One can only hope these people won't have to go through what we did. Perhaps the very idea they are so judgemental about it is the reason they will have to go through it in the future?

 

I know I was judgemental when my dad cheated. I just couldn't understand why he would do that to my beautiful, warm, and intelligent mother. But now all these years later I do understand. And I have forgiven him completely. I may have gone through a lot to get to this point, but understanding and forgiving my father was one of the things that made it well worth it.

[OpenBook]

Funny how so many of us are willing to put up with or legitimize such behavior simply because we're "married". Boy you just said a mouthful. I'm here for perspective and you just gave me a new one.

 

I'm impressed. Very good post.

 

Thanks reboot!!

[Impudent Oyster]

And I am disgusted by how many married people treat each other. I think THAT's just as sick and wrong, if not more so - as vows are being broken all over the place. And I'm not talking about the vow of fidelity. I'm talking about the vow to Love/Honor/Cherish each other... how one partner wears the other down on a daily basis until they feel like a shell of their former selves... how affection is withheld from the other as a power play... how one becomes indifferent or too wrapped up in their own head to even care about how their partner is doing...

 

 

And what makes you think that all the MM and MW ARE being mistreated or neglected in their marriages? Because that's what they tell the OP? Come on, you can't be that naive...the standard MM line is "My wife doesn't understand/take care of/have sex with/ me...yadda yadda yadda.

 

You're making the assumption that MM isn't lying, and the chances of that are pretty slim.

[reboot]

She didn't say all. She didn't say people don't lie. She explicitly said she wasn't even talking about infidelity.

 

She said some marriages are like that. And they are. I've witnessed them. My own was much like that for a period of time.

[OpenBook]

And what makes you think that all the MM and MW ARE being mistreated or neglected in their marriages? Because that's what they tell the OP? Come on, you can't be that naive...the standard MM line is "My wife doesn't understand/take care of/have sex with/ me...yadda yadda yadda.

 

You're making the assumption that MM isn't lying, and the chances of that are pretty slim.

 

There you go again... off on your own wild tangent. If you had bothered to read my post instead of instantly getting your half-shell up, you would have noticed that I said "many married people"... I never said "all". And you have no freakin' clue what I'm basing my assumptions on. But I can give you a little hint... and you can even check it out without leaving the comfort of your own hard shell -- just mosey your way through the Marriage and Infidelity threads here on LS. That'll give you enough insight into the state of marriage today to last a lifetime.

[White Flower]

And what makes you think that all the MM and MW ARE being mistreated or neglected in their marriages? Because that's what they tell the OP? Come on, you can't be that naive...the standard MM line is "My wife doesn't understand/take care of/have sex with/ me...yadda yadda yadda.

 

You're making the assumption that MM isn't lying, and the chances of that are pretty slim.

OpenBook was responding to LoisLane's remark, "but all these OW/OM here on Loveshack sure go all out to justify their disgusting behavior and legitimize cheating. That is so sick and wrong on so many levels." Sure, some MM/MW lie and are looking for sex and caring. But their are many who are quick to attack who do not see things from the perspective of the worn down inner soul of the MM/MW. They only see the shell and call it good when we might be dying on the inside. Did I saying dying? Yeah, dying.

 

And she didn't say all.

[KnownTruth]

I don't think a forum or discussion makes the whole thing right. It is a place to be able to vent and talk and deal with our issues. I never intended to get involved with a MM, but it happened. As the OW we have a right to share our issues and have others to talk too. We are not in a easy situation.

[Gwyneth]

I don't think a forum or discussion makes the whole thing right. It is a place to be able to vent and talk and deal with our issues. I never intended to get involved with a MM, but it happened. As the OW we have a right to share our issues and have others to talk too. We are not in a easy situation.

 

 

PERFECTLY said!!!!!!

[Phateless]

OpenBook was responding to LoisLane's remark, "but all these OW/OM here on Loveshack sure go all out to justify their disgusting behavior and legitimize cheating. That is so sick and wrong on so many levels." Sure, some MM/MW lie and are looking for sex and caring. But their are many who are quick to attack who do not see things from the perspective of the worn down inner soul of the MM/MW. They only see the shell and call it good when we might be dying on the inside. Did I saying dying? Yeah, dying.

 

And she didn't say all.

 

So if it's that bad, THEN LEAVE! Seriously... I just don't get it. If it's that bad, why stay? It's certainly not a good environment for the kids if you're "dying inside." No amount of money or financial hardship is worth "dying inside" for.

 

I just don't get it. Why stay? Why not get a divorce and sleep with whoever you choose, guilt-free?

[Phateless]

OpenBook was responding to LoisLane's remark, "but all these OW/OM here on Loveshack sure go all out to justify their disgusting behavior and legitimize cheating. That is so sick and wrong on so many levels." Sure, some MM/MW lie and are looking for sex and caring. But their are many who are quick to attack who do not see things from the perspective of the worn down inner soul of the MM/MW. They only see the shell and call it good when we might be dying on the inside. Did I saying dying? Yeah, dying.

 

And she didn't say all.

 

So if it's that bad, leave. Seriously... I just don't get it. If it's that bad, why stay? It's certainly not a good environment for the kids if you're "dying inside." No amount of money or financial hardship is worth "dying inside" for.

 

I just don't get it. Why stay? Why not get a divorce and sleep with whoever you choose, guilt-free?

[Trialbyfire]

So if it's that bad, leave. Seriously... I just don't get it. If it's that bad, why stay? It's certainly not a good environment for the kids if you're "dying inside." No amount of money or financial hardship is worth "dying inside" for.

 

I just don't get it. Why stay? Why not get a divorce and sleep with whoever you choose, guilt-free?

Agreed. It really is that simple. Also, why would you let yourself get involved with anyone else, while you're married? It's pretty easy to stop it, as at the point of initial attraction. No one falls in love at first sight. You might fall in lust though and lust is easily controllable, unless you're an animal.

[amerikajin]

No, I don't think the OW/OM forum legitimizes cheating -- it hasn't the capacity to do such a thing. I think legitimized cheating is a bit of an oxymoron, actually. Cheating is cheating.

 

Where some people get upset, though, is when you point out that there are indeed shades of gray in the greater context of the relationship, and that the MM/MW, while justifiably outraged, isn't necessarily blameless either (in a lot of the cases I've seen anyway). A lot of people want to put all of the focus on the act of infidelity. I have always said that cheating is dishonest and it is an extremely destructive way to handle marital problems, but at the same time, I think it is destructive when people want to pretend like the marriage was fine until their lover cheated. Most of the time, a lover strays because they don't feel they are getting what they want out of a marriage. By that I do not mean that they are 'right' or even that their perceptions are fair and accurate -- they may be completely off the deep end. Even so, I think that when infidelity is exposed, objectively, the thing to do is to see this as an opportunity to fix a marriage. Or even if it can't be fixed, maybe it's an opportunity for both people to learn something from it -- I don't know.

[Trialbyfire]

No, I don't think the OW/OM forum legitimizes cheating -- it hasn't the capacity to do such a thing. I think legitimized cheating is a bit of an oxymoron, actually. Cheating is cheating.

 

Where some people get upset, though, is when you point out that there are indeed shades of gray in the greater context of the relationship, and that the MM/MW, while justifiably outraged, isn't necessarily blameless either (in a lot of the cases I've seen anyway). A lot of people want to put all of the focus on the act of infidelity. I have always said that cheating is dishonest and it is an extremely destructive way to handle marital problems, but at the same time, I think it is destructive when people want to pretend like the marriage was fine until their lover cheated. Most of the time, a lover strays because they don't feel they are getting what they want out of a marriage. By that I do not mean that they are 'right' or even that their perceptions are fair and accurate -- they may be completely off the deep end. Even so, I think that when infidelity is exposed, objectively, the thing to do is to see this as an opportunity to fix a marriage. Or even if it can't be fixed, maybe it's an opportunity for both people to learn something from it -- I don't know.

Not all situations of cheating result from dissatisfaction in the marriage. Some maybe from dissatisfaction from the marriage but what is considered reasonable expectations of the spouse?

 

I completely separate the marriage from the act of cheating. Marriage is between two people. If and when one person refuses to meet the basic tenets of a marriage, they make a decision to stay or go. When one party decides, yes decides to cheat, they violate their portion of the tenets of the marriage. Why anyone would want to salvage a marriage with a cheater, who knows. Each to their own, although you see enough "salvaged" marriages as even more destructive than the original one, due to lack of trust eroding further and further into the betrayed spouse's self-esteem.

 

Overall, cheating is very bad news. That people can do this to someone they purportedly love, is sick. That people are willing to be involved with a liar and cheater, doesn't say much for morals and ethics.

[White Flower]

So if it's that bad, THEN LEAVE! Seriously... I just don't get it. If it's that bad, why stay? It's certainly not a good environment for the kids if you're "dying inside." No amount of money or financial hardship is worth "dying inside" for.

 

I just don't get it. Why stay? Why not get a divorce and sleep with whoever you choose, guilt-free?

Oh, if everything were so simple....

 

Not every man is as willing a participant as to end a marriage as amicably as you. Some are very nasty and spiteful creatures. Wish I didn't have to ruin your picture perfect world with this knowledge. BTW, ending the A. Not from guilt, but for my own peace of mind.

[White Flower]

No, I don't think the OW/OM forum legitimizes cheating -- it hasn't the capacity to do such a thing. I think legitimized cheating is a bit of an oxymoron, actually. Cheating is cheating.

 

Where some people get upset, though, is when you point out that there are indeed shades of gray in the greater context of the relationship, and that the MM/MW, while justifiably outraged, isn't necessarily blameless either (in a lot of the cases I've seen anyway). A lot of people want to put all of the focus on the act of infidelity. I have always said that cheating is dishonest and it is an extremely destructive way to handle marital problems, but at the same time, I think it is destructive when people want to pretend like the marriage was fine until their lover cheated. Most of the time, a lover strays because they don't feel they are getting what they want out of a marriage. By that I do not mean that they are 'right' or even that their perceptions are fair and accurate -- they may be completely off the deep end. Even so, I think that when infidelity is exposed, objectively, the thing to do is to see this as an opportunity to fix a marriage. Or even if it can't be fixed, maybe it's an opportunity for both people to learn something from it -- I don't know.

Well put, I can appreciate that.

[Phateless]

Oh, if everything were so simple....

 

Not every man is as willing a participant as to end a marriage as amicably as you. Some are very nasty and spiteful creatures. Wish I didn't have to ruin your picture perfect world with this knowledge. BTW, ending the A. Not from guilt, but for my own peace of mind.

 

Regardless of an affair or not, isn't it worth the trouble to get away from that "dying inside" feeling? I think people are just plain scared of change and of the unknown. And what makes you think I have a "picture-perfect world?" I thought I was living the fairy tale and it ended. I almost cheated but didn't, and then a month later she left me for someone else. Go figure. I'm still glad I didn't do it.

 

It's worth going through the hard stuff to get to the good stuff on the other side. Who was it that said "courage is not the absense of fear. courage is action in the face of fear."?

[Trialbyfire]

Oh, if everything were so simple....

 

Not every man is as willing a participant as to end a marriage as amicably as you. Some are very nasty and spiteful creatures. Wish I didn't have to ruin your picture perfect world with this knowledge. BTW, ending the A. Not from guilt, but for my own peace of mind.

A man angry over a divorce will be far more violent and spiteful, if and when he finds out about the cheating...

[OpenBook]

So you blame those who wear down their spouses instead of OW who willingly give themselves to MM?? Ws are not to be blamed if their Hs are being seduced by OW. I mean aren't OW in the same league as 'wh0res'?

 

So whatever you're doing is right? You're an OW too, aren't you? So it's allright to bring down someone's M?

 

I'd rather be a 'wh9re' than a monster in a marriage. And in most cases, it's the H who's doing the seducing - not the other way around.

[Impudent Oyster]

I'd rather be a 'wh9re' than a monster in a marriage.

 

And I couldn't be either. I have too much self-respect.

[Impudent Oyster]

OpenBook was responding to LoisLane's remark, "but all these OW/OM here on Loveshack sure go all out to justify their disgusting behavior and legitimize cheating. That is so sick and wrong on so many levels." Sure, some MM/MW lie and are looking for sex and caring. But their are many who are quick to attack who do not see things from the perspective of the worn down inner soul of the MM/MW. They only see the shell and call it good when we might be dying on the inside. Did I saying dying? Yeah, dying.

 

And she didn't say all.

 

Well then she should say "in the very few marriages", because honestly, I would guess that the number of MM whose wives are really neglecting or mistreating them is practically none.

[Impudent Oyster]

So if it's that bad, leave. Seriously... I just don't get it. If it's that bad, why stay? It's certainly not a good environment for the kids if you're "dying inside." No amount of money or financial hardship is worth "dying inside" for.

 

I just don't get it. Why stay? Why not get a divorce and sleep with whoever you choose, guilt-free?

 

Because it's all a lie, a sob story to tell the clueless OP...we all know NO ONE would stay in a marriage where they were "dying inside". What a bunch of baloney.

[Impudent Oyster]

Oh, if everything were so simple....

 

Not every man is as willing a participant as to end a marriage as amicably as you. Some are very nasty and spiteful creatures. Wish I didn't have to ruin your picture perfect world with this knowledge. BTW, ending the A. Not from guilt, but for my own peace of mind.

 

So how spiteful and nasty is such a monster of a person going to be once they find out their spouse is cheating on them? This is how people get killed!