Is it wrong for me to want my fiance to finish college before we get married?

[writeon]

Hi, I'm new here and engaged. My fiance is perfect except that he still hasn't finished school. He's 34 and he's taken about a year and a half's worth of college credits quite awhile ago. He always told me he wants to go back & finish & get his bachelor's degree. I'm 26 & I have a graduate degree that I finished about a year & a half ago, before we were engaged.

 

I've always told him (& shown him) that education is very important to me, and that I want to marry someone with that same value so that education can be important in our family. We broke up awhile ago for several reasons, which have been worked out, but the education issue is really bothering me. While we were broken up, he said he was registering for classes & that he realized he had been too focused on planning our wedding to be motivated to finish his goal of getting his degree. (The funny thing is we didn't plan much of the wedding -- we had found a place & were debating the date when we broke up).

 

He had all these brochures from local and online schools that he had requested & was telling me about the courses he was going to take. We got back together & he didn't register for the fall semester, because he said he needed time to decide where to go & what courses to take. He kept telling me he was going to register for the spring semester, and he wanted my help with that. Last night I went on the computer to help him, b/c he had said he was going to do it last weekend but he kept putting it off, & he finally told me that he wasn't going to go this semester either, and that he doesn't think he'll go back for a year and a half, because first he wants to work on patenting an invention he's been working on. He said he can't do everything at once & the most important thing to him right now is getting his invention patented, & then he will concentrate on school.

 

I really don't know what to do. I love him & he is perfect in every way, we had some issues but we've worked them out in couple's counseling and he is very good at communicating now and I am really thankful for his constant love & support & for the way he treats me. I am more comfortable around him than anyone-- I feel he loves & accepts me for who I am, & we always have a good time together. I love his personality -- he is so nice & funny -- & I love our life together. I know he will make a fantastic husband, I have no doubt about his ability to put me first, be there for me, be a good father if we have kids, etc.

 

I don't know if I'm making the education issue too important. I feel like he tricked me w/out meaning to, by saying that finishing his degree was important to him just because he knew that I want to be with someone who has finished college or is at least working towards it. Now that I find out he had no intention to go for at least a year, & that other things are more important to him, & that he kept telling me he was going to go when in fact he isn't, I feel very sad because I'm not sure if it means he's not right for me. I guess I have to stop wanting him to finish school because he obviously doesn't want it. He says he wants it but things keep happening to delay it. I feel like he doesn't want it enough to work towards it (even a class at a time? -- he does have a full-time job as a bank manager) & that he puts other things ahead of it & makes excuses, including money, time, & needing to do other things first.

 

Am I being unreasonable? Does this mean he's not right for me or that if I really want him to be my husband (which I do), I need to let go of my desire that my husband has a college degree & values education as much as I do?

 

I am really sad. I guess I would just to like to hear if other people think I'm being too demanding/ unrealistic or if I have the right to be upset that he told me he's finishing school & now he's not? Sometimes I think I just won't marry him until he's finished with college, but then I think, is that being too harsh?

[allina]

I think you you are being completely reasonable and should stick to what you want. Is he able to follow through and focus on things other than finishing college? Is he driven when it comes to his career? He sounds like he really has no desire to go back to school, does he have an alternate plan? You sound like a smart, successful and reasonable woman and I think this needs to be resolved before marriage. You don't want to end up with a hubby you have to look after and nag to go to class and finish his degree. This isn't something that will "just fall in to place" after marriage.

 

My SO and I are sort of in a similar situation, except for we're not engaged. We live together and are planning on getting engaged in 2008. However I'm 24, recently out of college with my BA and don't really know what I'm doing. I'm debating on grad school or looking for a better job and he wants me to come up with a stable plan and put it in motion before we move ahead. I completely agree and don't think getting engaged or married before having your life at least mostly sorted out is a good idea.

[writeon]

He's not driven at his career. He has a very stable job as a bank manager, which he's been in for quite a few years, but since I've met him he says he doesn't really like it. But I don't know what else he would like to do. It's hard for me because I'm very ambitious and driven at everything -- formerly school, now my career, and in other areas like running and volunteering.

 

He is very good at his job and well-liked there, so I'm not saying, "he can't hold down a job" or "he's miserable at his job." His parents instilled in him a very good work ethic, whereas mine instilled the desire for education. We just have different upbringings I guess.

 

I think he keeps working at this job because it's good for now, but it doesn't make him happy -- it's more of a 9-to-5 work and then come home kind of job, & he doesn't know what else he'd like to do. He kind of just goes with the flow of things instead of challenging himself.

 

Since I've met him he has had an idea for an invention that he recently became very passionate about. I admire his passion for that as he is not a very passionate person in general, he is more of a relaxed, chill kind of guy. So I know he is really thinking about what he's passionate about and trying to work to make that into something. I appreciate that, as it used to feel like I was doing all the challenging things and he was kind of coming home from work and sitting around. But I don't want him to hang all his hopes on an invention that might or might not pan out, instead of working on going to school too.

 

He is like a family guy. I think his plan for his life is to marry me and probably have a family with me. I think that's sweet and I feel lucky to have such a good fiance and someone I know will make a great husband when so many other women are complaining about their non-understanding boyfriends or whatever. He really does everything else right.

 

I have always been a lot more literate/ passionate/ political/ intellectual than he is. Recently he's made a real effort to connect with me in those ways. He's started reading more and asking me about books I'm reading and stories I'm writing and debating philosophical issues with me... things he never did in the past before we broke up. I love that he's realized I need more intellectual stimulation in our relationship and the problem is definitely not that he's not smart... he's very smart, I think he just gets set in his humdrum routine.

 

I guess the thing that bothers me just as much as him not seeming to want to finish school is that I feel he led me on. He said what I wanted to hear but now he isn't following through on his word. I don't want to be bitter about that. I want him to be a man of action though, not someone who says what will get me in his favor, without meaning it.

 

Thank you for giving me advice & sharing your experience with me. I agree with you and your boyfriend's idea that both of you should have your own lives set before you get married. That is something I have to work on with my fiance. This may be where his life ended up & he doesn't have much of a desire to go any further with it, while my life was constantly changing during the time we were together (we met while I was in my last year of graduate school). I guess I have to ask myself if I'm content with that, if it's the case.

[Aloros]

I think you need to have a serious talk with him. It is not unreasonable for you to want your fiance to finish college before you are married. It's having your proverbial ducks in a row.

 

And I completely understand where you're coming from in the sense that he is not keeping his word. I had a similar problem with my ex, in that he couldn't stay in school and his graduation date kept getting pushed back. There was a lot of bait and switch. He'd tell me he was going to go talk to a counselor to find out his graduation date, then he said he couldn't do it that day because he had to make an appointment, then he'd cancel his appointment...etc. I kept telling myself I could wait one more week, I could stick around for one more week, just until I found out when he would finally graduate.

 

Finally, I got so frustrated, I just grabbed him, the computer, and his course catalog, sat down, and figured out right then and there the credits he needed to graduate and how long it would take him to accumulate them. You know what he told me? That he didn't want to tell me when he was going to graduate because he didn't want me to break up with him. We dated for nearly six years, and that clinched it for me. He wasn't a bad guy, but we had very few similar interests and he couldn't keep his word. He was very likeable, but it just wasn't enough.

 

You have two issues: 1. is that you need to decide how important him graduating college is to you. Is it make it/break it? 2. and the larger issue imo is - are you ok with him not keeping his word? This probably won't be the last time this happens. Some people are more conflict-avoidant than others, and though this probably contributes to his understanding nature, it also contributes to his squirming around matters instead of confronting them.

 

Is it enough? It's unlikely he'll really change very much. Is he enough for you, as he is right now? It's ok to be annoyed, irritated, and frustrated by your partner as long as you can look them in the eye at the end of the day and tell them that you love them just as they are and don't expect them to change.

 

I hope things work out for the best for you, either way.

[melodymatters]

Well, I think perahps you ARE putting too much importance on a piece of paper degree. Some of the most succesful people I know started their own businesses and are millionares without a degree. Plus, he has a good job, is a great guy and has a passion for his invention.

 

Have you ever heard of Bill gates ? College drop out !

[writeon]

 

You have two issues: 1. is that you need to decide how important him graduating college is to you. Is it make it/break it? 2. and the larger issue imo is - are you ok with him not keeping his word? This probably won't be the last time this happens. Some people are more conflict-avoidant than others, and though this probably contributes to his understanding nature, it also contributes to his squirming around matters instead of confronting them.

 

Is it enough? It's unlikely he'll really change very much. Is he enough for you, as he is right now? It's ok to be annoyed, irritated, and frustrated by your partner as long as you can look them in the eye at the end of the day and tell them that you love them just as they are and don't expect them to change.

 

Aloros, thank you for your very helpful post, it really made me think. You are right, there are two separate issues I'd merged into one. For the first time since I've met him, I've realized: I'm okay with him not having his college degree. I'm okay with his not-so-glamorous job as a bank manager. I just realized that he is very happy with his life, but he's afraid that I'm not happy with him the way he is. He's SAID that he'd like a "better" job and to finish college, but looking back, it's probably only b/c he thought those were things I would want (yes, he was right). In all honesty he's pretty happy with his stable job and he doesn't see the need for a degree right now, but he's afraid that if he tells me that, I won't want to be with him. And no wonder, because that's the message I've been sending.

 

But when I really think about it, I don't care about that stuff. Yes education is very important to me and I want it to be important to our children if we have them -- but I'm not afraid he's dissuade them from college or anything. I think he could teach them things I couldn't or that he's better at -- how to be likeable and make people laugh, how to deal with people who are hard to get along with, how to be good at public speaking, and -- most importantly -- I think he teaches ME what real love is all about. He is 100% supportive, encouraging and loving. He treats me like a queen. He accepts me, is proud of me, and never makes me feel bad about myself, ever, so I should be the same for him and not accidentally make him feel bad for not having a college degree.

 

The second issue -- his dishonesty -- is the toughie. I think I've contributed to it because he's afraid that he'll say something I disapprove of and I won't want to be with him anymore. I need to show him that I love and approve of him for who he is. I've asked him in the past to be completely honest with me, even if he thinks it's something I might not want to hear, but he does have a tendency to avoid conflict and try to smooth things over by saying what he thinks I want to hear. He really needs to stop that, but I also need to give him a more supportive environment so that he knows he really can tell me anything and I'll still be happy with him. We are in couple's counseling so I'm going to bring that up -- I guess it's good we had this "fight" (as close as we ever get to fighting, anyway) about his schooling because it illustrates a problem on each of our sides and can help us get better at resolving these issues. It shows me that I need to accept him for who he is and be happy with him, because he is truly a wonderful person that I am very lucky to have. And it shows him that he needs to be straight-forward with me, which we've tried to work on before, but hopefully when he sees that I've learned I'm too accidentally hostile to him, and that I'm not going to be that way anymore, he can really start opening up with me and being honest.

 

Do you think this can work or will he continue to parrot what he thinks I want to hear even after I've shown him that I accept him for whoever he is and whatever he has to tell me?

[writeon]

Some of the most succesful people I know started their own businesses and are millionares without a degree. Plus, he has a good job, is a great guy and has a passion for his invention

 

 

This is so true. He is so smart, nice, funny, happy, fun to be with, adorable and loving. He is everything I want so yes I was putting too much emphasis on a degree. He probably feels like he's never good enough for me. I need to show him that he is all I want and I don't want to change him. What was wrong with me?!?! Thanks for pointing this out.

[Aloros]

I'm glad you've worked some things out!

 

As for the anger/parroting issue, I do think in some situations it's OK to get angry. You don't want to start repressing your feelings and opinions! I've found what helps me is to tell my SO that just because I'm angry with him doesn't mean I don't still love him. It also helps to thank him for being honest with you and mean it, even if you don't like what you're hearing.

 

Hope this helps!

[OTgirl]

Hi!

 

I agree that being educated is important, however it doesn't necessarily need to formal.

Does he speak well and use good vocabulary?

Do you have engaging conversations?

Does he read regularly?

 

Having a college degree doesn't guarantee success by any means. I know plenty of people with a BA or BS who either don't work, work at jobs they hate, don't make much money, or have student loans coming from their ears!

 

Besides, so many people have a degree now, that it really doesn't make you all that special! In fact, trade school is the better way to go! That's right. Even college newspapers state that many people with college degrees have problems finding a job! Oh, the same is true for some terminal degrees!!!

 

Back while I was working on my undergraduate degree, a professor told me that the day after he received his doctorate degree was the most depressing day of his life. He saw his degree as a piece of paper. He didn't make any more money with the degree, but he had the status of the doctor. He thought, who cares about having a doctorate. It doesn't make me better than anyone else.

 

Bottom line... I think you're putting too much into it. This is coming from a graduate student in a respected field.

[writeon]

(My responses are in bold)

 

Hi!

 

Hi OTgirl, thanks for your response to my question.

 

I agree that being educated is important, however it doesn't necessarily need to formal.

Does he speak well and use good vocabulary?

 

Yes definitely -- and he writes well too (although not a lot). My pet peeve is when people say things like "your" instead of "you're", "their" instead of "there", etc. And he never does any of that.

 

Do you have engaging conversations?

 

Sometimes he is a man of few words, but I've come to appreciate that because I realize that his actions speak louder than words. And we do have engaging conversations -- we just took a road trip to Durango, and almost the entire time was spent discussing a book I'm reading called "Integrity." He was full of examples from his job, sports, media, etc... it was very engaging. I wish he were more passionate about politics like I am (he is pretty neutral and doesn't debate it much), but I guess I'd prefer that to someone who is alwasy pushy about their views.

 

Does he read regularly?

 

No, we've been together for over 2 years and for most of the time the only thing I've ever seen him read was a poker book I bought him and a couple Maxim magazines lol. But lately he's been reading a book on how to patent his invention and he read through it in a week or so... I think if he's very dedicated to something, he'll read about it, but he's not a big reader in general. He does keep up with the news/ current events a lot better than I do though. Plus he's very witty with jokes -- he can always entertain a crowd while I stand there feeling dumb and speechless -- and he regularly beats me at trivia games. He's a very smart guy.

 

Having a college degree doesn't guarantee success by any means. I know plenty of people with a BA or BS who either don't work, work at jobs they hate, don't make much money, or have student loans coming from their ears!

 

That's his exact point, he always points to people that have high degrees and low-paying jobs and student loans. Since he doesn't need a degree for his job, I guess he's being very practical!

 

Bottom line... I think you're putting too much into it. This is coming from a graduate student in a respected field.

 

Thanks OTgirl. I appreciate your advice and I agree with you. I have "let go" of the finishing college issue. He is just fine the way he is. I'm so lucky to be with him and I don't want to make him into who *I* am or what I want him to be.

[sderenzi]

Thus we find the truth, you don't care about him but only about your own future. You want someone to take care of you and pamper you like a baby while they do all the hard work. Education isn't important to you but instead the IDEA of it is, many people are educated in other ways beyond school.

 

Once the author Ray Bradbury was asked why he never went to college, he replied "I went to the library instead." This is a prime example of truth, but for you the only truth is education comes through college. This is a lie you've been made to believe, I suggest you rethink your entire paradigm of thinking before you end up divorced in 4 years.

 

PS Because you're driven you think he should be, this is a flaw in reasoning and will not bode well for your marriage, adios!

[stillafool]

Wow, 25 years ago I was in love with a Harvard attorney. He loved me too but not enough to marry me without a college degree. He married someone who had all the credentials he was looking for in a woman. He has tried to contact me through the years and finally when I spoke with him he told me he has never loved anyone like he did me and has not gone one week without thinking about me. He said he wished he hadn't let a small thing like a degree stand between us. I have since obtained my degree and am happily married to someone else now. Good luck.

[writeon]

Thus we find the truth, you don't care about him but only about your own future. You want someone to take care of you and pamper you like a baby while they do all the hard work. Education isn't important to you but instead the IDEA of it is, many people are educated in other ways beyond school.

 

Once the author Ray Bradbury was asked why he never went to college, he replied "I went to the library instead." This is a prime example of truth, but for you the only truth is education comes through college. This is a lie you've been made to believe, I suggest you rethink your entire paradigm of thinking before you end up divorced in 4 years.

 

PS Because you're driven you think he should be, this is a flaw in reasoning and will not bode well for your marriage, adios!

 

Geez, you are certainly mean and judgmental. It is not wrong of me to be driven and want to be with someone who is also driven. What is so wrong with that? I'm sorry but I just don't get you at all.

 

My fiance is very driven, and I am just now realizing that he doesn't have to be driven in the way I am (education) to be so. I never said that the only true education comes through college, and I'd appreciate you not putting words in my mouth, thanks. I know that he is very educated and I have SAID that he is smarter than I am in a lot of ways and that he learned things in other ways besides higher education. Yes, the idea of education and education itself is very important to me, so what? I worked very hard to put myself through 7 years of college and grad school on my own. I am just now learning that education doesn't have to be as important to my fiance/ future husband because he is a great person with his own goals and important values. I love him and I am very glad that other people (not you, but nice people on here) helped me figure out that I was being too demanding and asking him to highly value something that I myself highly value, instead paying attention to his own values and goals for his/ our life.

 

I think this is a good thing for me to have figured out before we got married, that I accept him for who he is because I love him (and yes he does pamper me which makes me very happy. I pamper him too -- I never nag about him going out with his friends, I bring them beer when they play video games, I give him long massages and neck rubs, I take him out to nice dinners and occasionally try to cook for him [although he likes to cook a lot more than I do and he is much better at it ] Last Christmas I surprised him by sending him to Chicago to see the Bears/ Seahawks play-off game b/c he is originally from Chicago and he is the biggest Bears fan ever. I totally suprised him by setting up with his boss at the bank for him to get the days off work, by arranging with his good friend from high school who still lives in Chicago for him to stay with him while he was there, by getting him the ticket and the airline ticket, etc. He said it was the best Christmas present ever and that he felt totally pampered. So I do pamper him and I love that he pampers me too -- I wouldn't have it any other way! We treat each other equally as well, and I am really glad for this.

 

You sound very bitter about something (perhaps you were not able to go as far in your own schooling as you would have liked? perhaps you once had a significant other who thought you weren't good enough for them?? just some guesses becuase you seem very bitter towards marriage and education in general), but please don't take it out on me, that is not necessary. I am happy and if you aren't, that's not my problem, thank you.

[writeon]

Wow, 25 years ago I was in love with a Harvard attorney. He loved me too but not enough to marry me without a college degree. He married someone who had all the credentials he was looking for in a woman. He has tried to contact me through the years and finally when I spoke with him he told me he has never loved anyone like he did me and has not gone one week without thinking about me. He said he wished he hadn't let a small thing like a degree stand between us. I have since obtained my degree and am happily married to someone else now. Good luck.

 

This is a good lesson, I agree that if I left him because he didn't have a college degree, I would find other men with college or higher degrees that wouldn't treat me nearly as well as he treats me. He is the love of my life, with or without a college degree. Congrats on being happily married and obtaining your degree. Thanks for sharing your story with me!!

[writeon]

Thus we find the truth, you don't care about him but only about your own future. You want someone to take care of you and pamper you like a baby while they do all the hard work.

 

PS I do not want someone to do all the hard work. My fiance and I do equal work in our relationship. We equally pamper each other as I said in my last post to you. Job-wise, he works very hard and I do too. I started a very successful career over a year ago after I graduated, and I work 50 hours a week. I also run marathons and volunteer as a Court Appointed Special Advocate for foster children involved in abuse and neglect cases. As I said to your other post, I went straight through school until I was 25 years old and finished, I never quit and I never took a break. I amn not saying this to brag, just to SHOW that I am certainly not adverse to putting in a lot of hard work, whether it's in relationships, school or work. I'd appreciate you taking a look at the facts of my life instead of judging me based on... I don't even know what... your apparent dislike of me for some reason, just because I value education. Thanks!