OWoman Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 you are a typical OW. Selfish, self serving, and lacking in character/morals, you will never have a healthy relationship, you will always be second best, someones' dirty little secret. ... Now to get to the OW/OM "karma" When someone willingly, knowingly, invades someone elses world, even if they are "invited" that proves that persons character, and that says it all. I'd be wary of such sweeping generalisations. My father had an OW for ages, but stayed with my mother "for the children" and only once we'd all left the house did they divorce and he married his OW. His OW is an angel. I could spend pages here listing how wonderful she is, and all the people whose lives she's blessed in so many ways. I would have given anything to have had the privilege of her in my life, growing up. "Selfish, self-serving, lacking in character and morals" in no way applies to her by any measure or means, and not even my mother could find a bad word to say about her (though she has plenty to say about everyone and everything else). Link to post Share on other sites
JackJack Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I believe in it. Not just for OW/OM or BS or whatever. I believe in it for ALL people. I think we are all responsbile for our own actions and I think we all reap what we sow, reguardless of who we are. Link to post Share on other sites
michelangelo Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 Gwyneth, you presume a lot in thinking that there are signs of a cheating spouse. The very nature of a spouse who is cheating is to put up a front, a lie, a well-constructed set of deceptions designed to keep the betrayed spouse in the dark. Because the noncheating spouse TRUSTS their cheater, they are not clued in to looking for signs, in the event that there are any. ... I have a hard time believing that the BS is in the marriage not knowing what their spouse truly is like. I'm sure that is Very possible--not to know your spouse is a cheater and / or liar, but the signs are normally Always there. Maybe it's that the BS is ignoring those signs. My MM's wife is a perfect example of that! She knows her hubby is doing naughty things and has caught him doing some of these naughy things, yet she just keeps letting it "slip" by. So she is choosing not to dig deeper to find out what is wrong with her marriage. That is her fault right there! She's letting her husband get away with this. Thank you Link to post Share on other sites
dead-dyke Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 A betrayed spouse doesn't cause the cheating spouse to cheat - That's his/her choice. Sure, the BS is responsible for his/her part in the demise of the marriage - But it's UP TO THE CHEATING SPOUSE to communicate his/her needs that are not being met, or to tell the spouse they're unhappy and seek counselling, or end the marriage, or even separate. The cheater by him/herself CHOOSES to cheat on their own...Blaming the BS for that is just passing on accountability of their own actions. This is 100% accurate, instead of having a big arguement about holding the garbage bag open, tell me your concerns, dammit! Contrary to popular belief, I am NOT a mindreader. (6 mos. sep.), but in the first month and a half, went home to try and talk to my wife, and caught the nieghbor on MY side of the bed, with her holding her blouse shut, trying to push me out. I did not put a gun to her head, and as far as a part of the wedding party is concerned, I no longer have any use for him. maybe I'm stupid, but --- Yeah. I still love her.- (by the way, what is bs stand 4? besides the obvious *bullsh*t? Link to post Share on other sites
luvmy2ns Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 We must know different people, then... I wouldn't get involved with a MM (or at least, haven't to date) who told me how miserable his marriage was. Partly because I'm not interested in his marriage - that's his business, not mine - and partly because I'd suspect, and really resent if it were true, that I was being "used" as an escape mechanism from that unhappy marriage. But you've told us all how awful your MM has said his wife is. Isn't that contradictory to what you're saying above? Link to post Share on other sites
luvmy2ns Posted December 5, 2007 Share Posted December 5, 2007 I don't believe that every person who cheats on their spouse feels that they married the wrong person. And, I'm sure many BS's don't look at it that way either. Man, you're right about that! I know this guy who brags all the time to his friends and anyone else who'll listen that he has the best wife in the world. She's beautiful, a good mom, lets him go out and "play" with his friends, takes care of the home and children, yet he skanks around behind her back all the time with whoever he can get to f him! POS! Link to post Share on other sites
Author Gwyneth Posted December 6, 2007 Author Share Posted December 6, 2007 Your question says alot about you, you are a typical OW. Selfish, self serving, and lacking in character/morals, you will never have a healthy relationship, you will always be second best, someones' dirty little secret. Perfect example of bashing the OW and being judgemental of OW. Link to post Share on other sites
daisydufas22 Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Perfect example of bashing the OW and being judgemental of OW. What do you expect praise? You are involved with a married man. IMO you and he are both morally bankrupt. It's the NET ...... we are allowed to express our point of view. Freedom of speech! What about the wife? Oh no, let's focus on the OW....get real and you posted this ....... oh no, shock horror, my point of view is different.....it must be bashing the OW! If you really see nothing wrong with being the OW then these comments would not bother you. I guess 'deep down' you must have a problem with being the OW! If you really did not have a problem with it IMO your reponse would not be so strong. Get over yourself! What's wrong does the truth hurt? Link to post Share on other sites
Author Gwyneth Posted December 6, 2007 Author Share Posted December 6, 2007 Uncalled for, seriously. I am JUST POINTING out an Example. What part of Example do you people NOT comprehend? WOW Yes, I expect an award, heck, an Oscar for being the OW. It's just One big fun ol' act! Get real lady. This ain't no picnic, and most OW / OM will agree. Link to post Share on other sites
writeon Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 This ain't no picnic, and most OW / OM will agree. Why do you do it then? Link to post Share on other sites
Author Gwyneth Posted December 6, 2007 Author Share Posted December 6, 2007 Why do you do it then? Haven't you Ever done Anything you should not have been doing? Most human beings put aside morals and values and act upon what's there in front of them before really thinking it through. I don't see too many OW / OM around here bragging that they are happy to be in an affair with a MM. I think most of us are here for some support--yet we don't really get much of that with comments like the one I quoted above. Maybe you can pose a question like Owl did for all the OW asking "why are you in it?" It would be interesting to see all the different reasons. My one reason can differ form many other OW's reasons. Me though, I am happy to have met a wonderful man who I can call my friend and yeah, it's too bad he's married, but this works for me because I am not in a place right now to have a committment and / or boyfriend. It works when it can, and doesn't when it cannot. Maybe if you pose that question, it would help you to better understand where our minds are, and to see that we aren't the "Selfish, self serving, and lacking in character/morals, you will never have a healthy relationship, you will always be second best, someones' dirty little secret" as someone else thinks we are / will or won't have. As I said, it's not easy being the OW or the OM, but we do it because that is what it is. Link to post Share on other sites
noforgiveness Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Haven't you Ever done Anything you should not have been doing? Most human beings put aside morals and values and act upon what's there in front of them before really thinking it through. You have to be kidding me! No they don't. That's why we live in a civilized society. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Gwyneth Posted December 6, 2007 Author Share Posted December 6, 2007 You have to be kidding me! No they don't. That's why we live in a civilized society. Where do you live? Because where I live, people die every day because someone is shot, or murdered somehow, etc. I'd like to live where You live if it Is a place where people Always use morals and values. Link to post Share on other sites
writeon Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Haven't you Ever done Anything you should not have been doing? Most human beings put aside morals and values and act upon what's there in front of them before really thinking it through. I don't see too many OW / OM around here bragging that they are happy to be in an affair with a MM. I think most of us are here for some support--yet we don't really get much of that with comments like the one I quoted above. Maybe you can pose a question like Owl did for all the OW asking "why are you in it?" It would be interesting to see all the different reasons. My one reason can differ form many other OW's reasons. Me though, I am happy to have met a wonderful man who I can call my friend and yeah, it's too bad he's married, but this works for me because I am not in a place right now to have a committment and / or boyfriend. It works when it can, and doesn't when it cannot. Maybe if you pose that question, it would help you to better understand where our minds are, and to see that we aren't the "Selfish, self serving, and lacking in character/morals, you will never have a healthy relationship, you will always be second best, someones' dirty little secret" as someone else thinks we are / will or won't have. As I said, it's not easy being the OW or the OM, but we do it because that is what it is. I wasn't preaching at you about morals, I was curious to find out why you are an OW if it is "no picnic" and "not easy." You act like it's something you have to do, like going to the dentist or weeding your front lawn. It's not something you have to do, there are other choices -- date single guys or no one at all. I had never heard anyone say their relationship was "no picnic" and yet willingly stay in it for no reason (I mean, you're not married to him, you don't have kids with him... you sounded to me like someone "burdened" with this relationship you have no compelling reason to be in.) So I was just wondering why you do it, because I was curious, not because I'm trying to lecture you or anything. Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Just out of respect for those who were shot to death in that shopping mall today in the States, lets try to stay away from using that analogy.... Morals and values - Someone should start a new thread about this as it has nothing to do with Karma. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Gwyneth Posted December 6, 2007 Author Share Posted December 6, 2007 I wasn't preaching at you about morals, I was curious to find out why you are an OW if it is "no picnic" and "not easy." You act like it's something you have to do, like going to the dentist or weeding your front lawn. It's not something you have to do, there are other choices -- date single guys or no one at all. I had never heard anyone say their relationship was "no picnic" and yet willingly stay in it for no reason (I mean, you're not married to him, you don't have kids with him... you sounded to me like someone "burdened" with this relationship you have no compelling reason to be in.) So I was just wondering why you do it, because I was curious, not because I'm trying to lecture you or anything. No no, I didn't think you were. I was just saying that every OW is in here affair for many different reasons. Mine began as a crush, and then he pursued me, and I was wooed, or however you spell that. I don't know why I'm in it--I don't know why I do half the things i do. I admitted I'm selfish and wrong, but still--do not know why I'm in and haven't really even given much though to why. Well, he makes me happy and gives me a good laugh. I think that's important in Any friendship. He feels comfortable talking to me about his personal problems, whether it be with his family, wifey, or medical problems. I feel honored he can talk to me on the level he does--I'd feel honored if Anyone chose to talk to me of such personal and private matters. He's a great listener, and makes me feel special. I enjoy being around him and his friends are great too--they take good care of me. I kind of feel bad for him--he and I grew up in similar household situations and even now in his 30s, he's still very hurt by the pain he endured growing up. I am a bit too, but I think together we can discuss it and begin to grow out of that pain. It's very much an EA and yes, a bit of the PA too. I don't know--maybe he's my soul mate? I am very confused--I have said that many times too. I am still staying focused though--and away from having intercourse with him. I think if I engage in intercourse with him that it will be difficult when the time comes to end it officially. We have already tried several times ending this affair and both cannot do it. I don't know why--there's obviously strong feelings and a strong connection. I believe that married people are capable of feeling this way about another person--what they have to figure out is if this person is worth going through a divorce for. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Gwyneth Posted December 6, 2007 Author Share Posted December 6, 2007 Just out of respect for those who were shot to death in that shopping mall today in the States, lets try to stay away from using that analogy.... Morals and values - Someone should start a new thread about this as it has nothing to do with Karma. HUH??? OMG, I'm so sorry--I need to read the news. My apologies...what an idiot I am. Link to post Share on other sites
OpenBook Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Morals and values - Someone should start a new thread about this as it has nothing to do with Karma. Good idea. Why don't YOU start it, WWIU? Link to post Share on other sites
Author Gwyneth Posted December 6, 2007 Author Share Posted December 6, 2007 I'm for it! I think it would be good, as long as we can all behave like big kids! Link to post Share on other sites
GreenEyedLady Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Some of you claim that the OW will create bad karma for them because of their OW actions. I was wondering why the BSs may feel this way--if they do, and why bad karma hit them with a cheating spouse. You know, I think that people just like to make themselves feel better by telling themselves that someone who hurt them will be punished... I think however, that you don't get what you deserve, you get what you get... Otherwise, why are babies left in cars, children molested, good people struck with cancer? Because life is just like that...Sometimes you win and sometimes you lose...It's the luck of the draw... Now that doesn't mean that you shouldn't try to be a good person, because you should... But being a good person is subjective, don't ya think? Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 But you've told us all how awful your MM has said his wife is. Isn't that contradictory to what you're saying above? You must be confusing me with someone else. My MM has never said a word against his W, nor is he likely to. He has admitted, when challenged, that certain incidents which I've been told about BY OTHERS did happen as described - incidents of abusive and unreasonable and demeaning behaviour by his W towards him, and sometimes the kids, and certainly others (family, colleagues, friends). Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Haven't you Ever done Anything you should not have been doing? Most human beings put aside morals and values and act upon what's there in front of them before really thinking it through. Not sure I agree with that. Clearly that's the case sometimes - stuff happens, and people get swept along, and by the time they get to reflect on it, they're in so deep it's difficult to understand how they got there, seeing as it's not what they'd have chosen rationally to do. But I think that there are other cases where people are acting completely rationally and consistently with their moral framework. But - guess what? We don't all share the same moral framework! As I've stated many times, I don't "believe in" marriage, so to me it's no issue at all whether someone I'm involved with is married or not - that's THEIR issue to resolve in terms of their own views on the matter. But I would never, ever, ever cheat on my tax return. I just think that is plain immoral - that's the money the State uses to build roads and hospitals and schools, to run the country and make it a place we'd want to live in, how could you possibly not pay what you owe on taxes and still consider yourself a decent human being? Link to post Share on other sites
Suny1 Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 I don't think this forum is about WHY OW do what they do... Its about the circumstances in the threads that are started!~ OW already know an A is wrong...everyone well ok most everyone..knows its wrong. No point in going thru the moral issues when thats not what started the thread... even if you feel thats what you want to say to OW/OM. Its merely a *given that its wrong. *shrug Link to post Share on other sites
Suny1 Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Then again.... maybe thats a thread worth starting? However I won't be the one to start something that will have 99% OW?OM answer.... "Because I want too" Link to post Share on other sites
noforgiveness Posted December 6, 2007 Share Posted December 6, 2007 Where do you live? Because where I live, people die every day because someone is shot, or murdered somehow, etc. I'd like to live where You live if it Is a place where people Always use morals and values. and I consider those people animals. Not part of civilized society. Is that the categoy you like to put yourself in? Link to post Share on other sites
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