Can We Change Back?

[michaelk]

In another thread, RoseRen said:

 

... People change.

 

I can marry a person who is THE ONE for me and yet cannot expect him to remain the same. Over the years, he could change and become less loving, less lovable and less compatible to me.

 

Now, I have two options.

 

a) I can dump him and find another person who is 100% compatible to me. But there is no guarantee that the second person I'm going to be with is going to remain the same.

or

b) I can accept the situation and the person the way they are and make amends for any shortcomings from my part and inspire the other person to change back into the THE ONE again. But there is no guarantee that he will change back into my "soulmate" again.

 

I personally prefer option b (And actually am trying to execute that in my life). So I do believe that there is just ONE person for me - and that would be and will be the person I have taken my vows with.

...

 

Taking it as a given that people do change, my question is this: Can we change back? If so, can it be done by choice and force of will?

 

And on a related tack, it is right in a relationship to stay with someone else with the goal of 'inspiring them to change back'?

[RoseRen]

Thanks Michael. :-)

 

I thought I would put this here as well... as I can't think of anything else to add on.

 

It wouldn't be cool to hijack this thought-provoking thread... but just to answer you:

 

I used to be a firm believer in what you just said there. How would someone feel I have changed? Through my actions and words. What influences these? My thoughts. Can I change my thoughts? Yes.

 

The only thing that can't be changed is the past. But I think I can change my thoughts and thus in turn my actions, behaviours, words, attitude and even emotions. I think there is a well-known concept called Cognitive-Behavioral Therapy (CBT) on the same lines.

[quankanne]

isn't necessarily always for the worse, or is negative. Ideally, change in a relationship will positively reflect the needs of the couple as a unit, not individuals greedily going about their own way and other person be damned (called "married singles" in marriage encounter-speak)

 

it is right in a relationship to stay with someone else with the goal of 'inspiring them to change back'?

 

abuse and serious marital problems aside, wouldn't leaving someone because they're not who you expect them to be the same as marrying someone and expecting to change them to suit your desires? It's one thing to encourage someone to be a better person because you know that they've got it in them, and another to say "you must bend to meet my needs/desires" ...

[Kasan]

Taking it as a given that people do change, my question is this: Can we change back? If so, can it be done by choice and force of will? And on a related tack, it is right in a relationship to stay with someone else with the goal of 'inspiring them to change back'?

 

Of course you can change back--but unless the behavior is destructive, why would you want to change back? Change is a part of growth, how we get there can come from great pain, or by age and maturity.

 

I really like how I have changed through the years, and I really like how my marriage has changed.

 

Some people do outgrow each other in a relationship, and/or they grow at a different pace, and catch up. The ones that can't keep up, sometimes get left behind.

[White Flower]

In another thread, RoseRen said:

 

 

 

Taking it as a given that people do change, my question is this: Can we change back? If so, can it be done by choice and force of will?

 

And on a related tack, it is right in a relationship to stay with someone else with the goal of 'inspiring them to change back'?

Well, I don't believe we can change back. We can try to behave in a past manner that pleased others yet we cannot change back to who we were because as Kasan basically stated, we cannot ungrow ourselves.

 

There were times when H would just drive me to distraction and because it is so difficult for him to apologize or do what it takes to make things better I would find myself "being the better person" in hopes of making the peace. He would become nice again after a few weeks or months I would forgive him. Eventually I found myself falling in love with him again. I would counsel many of my younger married friends to just hang in there because you will eventually fall in love again. But I found this pattern after 20 years or so was not so effective. One cannot be the soul provider of give and take, forgive and heal. It takes two people in a marriage to make it work. I also agree with what Kasan says, "Some people do outgrow each other in a relationship, and/or they grow at a different pace, and catch up. The ones that can't keep up, sometimes get left behind." This is what is happening to us. I grew and changed and he is stagnant unto himself. I cannot go back to that. For now, we co-exist in our house by choice and perhaps force of our own will (for the kids' sake really) but I do not feel we, especially I, have changed back into who I was.

[michaelk]

My original take on this was that our experiences are what change us, and we can't 'un-experience' something once it's happened. Therefore there's no going back.

 

But RoseRen made an excellent point regarding CBT, so apparently we can change our behaviors and intentionally change - at least part of ourselves.

 

Still, while I think we might be able to get to a similar state, I think we can never recreate the same state we once were in. We may be able to recreate behaviors and even feelings, but I don't think that makes us the same person again. Because underneath it all, the reason for those behaviors and feelings has changed!

 

Actually, now that I think about it, there is an exception: amnesia!

[White Flower]

My original take on this was that our experiences are what change us, and we can't 'un-experience' something once it's happened. Therefore there's no going back.

 

But RoseRen made an excellent point regarding CBT, so apparently we can change our behaviors and intentionally change - at least part of ourselves.

 

Still, while I think we might be able to get to a similar state, I think we can never recreate the same state we once were in. We may be able to recreate behaviors and even feelings, but I don't think that makes us the same person again. Because underneath it all, the reason for those behaviors and feelings has changed!

 

Actually, now that I think about it, there is an exception: amnesia!

You REALLY need to read Journey of Souls now!!!

 

And thanks for clarifying your point about intentionally changing part of ourselves. I kept "changing" for H with the hopes that it would make things better but I just ended up losing so much of myself. That balance thing again...

[norajane]

My original take on this was that our experiences are what change us, and we can't 'un-experience' something once it's happened. Therefore there's no going back.

 

I totally agree with this.

 

That said, I also believe we can continue to change, and that we can create something better - although different - than what we had 'back' then. Provided that there hasn't been so much damage done that it's impossible to move beyond it.

[OpenBook]

Still, while I think we might be able to get to a similar state, I think we can never recreate the same state we once were in. We may be able to recreate behaviors and even feelings, but I don't think that makes us the same person again. Because underneath it all, the reason for those behaviors and feelings has changed!

 

I don't know if I agree with this, Michael, but you've sure got me thinking!! With my exH... the same things that made me weak in the knees for him, all those years ago when I was young and stupid!... are the EXACT SAME THINGS that make my knees weak today. The difference is my perception of the man as a whole. I didn't see the stark incompatibilities back then, but they are clear as a bell to me now. His second W is much more compatible with him, and was better able to see and accept the entire man going into the relationship, than I ever was.

 

I understand the "draw" I had for him now -- just as I understand the reasons why it didn't work. So I guess I DO agree with you -- I can't go back and recreate that same innocent, naive state with him -- because I'm not innocent and naive anymore. But if I decided to turn a blind eye once again, I have no doubt that I could recreate that state -- because I'm still attracted to the same qualities!

[michaelk]

But if I decided to turn a blind eye once again, I have no doubt that I could recreate that state -- because I'm still attracted to the same qualities!

 

But even then you'd be in a different state, because you'd be a person who is choosing to ignore known deficiencies in their spouse, rather than one who assumes the best of them because they don't yet know any better.

 

And so even though you might behave the same, you aren't the same.

[White Flower]

I understand the "draw" I had for him now -- just as I understand the reasons why it didn't work. So I guess I DO agree with you -- I can't go back and recreate that same innocent, naive state with him -- because I'm not innocent and naive anymore. But if I decided to turn a blind eye once again, I have no doubt that I could recreate that state -- because I'm still attracted to the same qualities!

This is where it gets sticky.

 

I happen to believe that we are souls who use a human body as a host. There are very many wonderful human qualities and very many wonderful spiritual qualities. I am sure your physical body was drawn to your exH's physical body as young adults, but as your souls matured, the physical became less important. Or perhaps the physical was the only thing left! Whatever the cocktail was then, it isn't quite what you need now. You can respect him and be happy for him in his new M, but you cannot go back because you are completely different now.