sexless marriage after 23 years

[Computers]

I agree with all of you. In fact I came home tonight and told her that we needed to find some time this weekend for a long, uninterrupted talk. She said ok, and didn't even ask what I wanted to talk about. I thought that was a little weird. BUt at least she acknowleged that we would talk.

 

Anyway, we'll get some time alone and get real. I'll fill you in after we talk.

 

I really don't have anything left to lose.

 

How did the "talk" go? You mentioned that she know that it's serious, but does she know that you're actually thinking about leaving her and divorce?

[Brendan Ireland]

Ok, dear.

 

Let's not insult each other.

 

Obviously you were making a point with your earlier statement.

 

g***

 

My friend I wasn't insulting your view - but you did ask "Can you elaborate on this, with scientific examples and evidence, please?"

 

You asked me to elaborate - I did. Of course my argument re a celibate world is complete nonsense, but taken in extremis, it is scientific fact. A logical scientific case can me made for many things in life, it doesn't mean they are right, but the arguments are nevertheless valid though not plausible.

 

I suppose at the end of the day it is a matter of who really gives a t**s - On the subject of this thread I do feel for Saddad, I too live with a woman I love and we have wonderful children, but she clearly does not want a sexual relationship with me anymore. I am told I have to respect this wish of hers and believe me we used to have a very good sex life. But I do feel she should be prepared to respect that if I want sex as a functional part of my life then there should be no questions asked if I go out and get it, with someone who just wants a bit of sexual activity in their lives and no more with someone else - ie an F buddy. After all - infidelity works both ways - Denial of sexual relationships with your H or W could in some peoples minds may be construed as infidelity, and the H or W who takes action to rectify that part of their lives by finding an F buddy could be seen as someone taking responsible action for their own health and well being. It doesn't mean the whole relationship has gone just because the sex has gone. If I asked my wife to play golf or go to a football match with me she would look at me as I were mad. But I still play golf and go to football. If I ask her to have sex with me, she says no, so why shouldn't I or Saddad or any other H or W in this situation just do the same as playing the golf and going to the football match. I wouldn't blame saddad if he went off to get an FB and just carried on at home as normal - it may just put the smile on his face he needs.

[Mr. Lucky]

I wouldn't blame saddad if he went off to get an FB and just carried on at home as normal - it may just put the smile on his face he needs.

Saddad doesn't want sex. Like most men in a similar situation, Saddad wants sex WITH his wife. See the difference ?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Mustang Sally]

Thanks, Mr Lucky.

How well stated, that was.

[Brendan Ireland]

Saddad doesn't want sex. Like most men in a similar situation, Saddad wants sex WITH his wife. See the difference ?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

But he clearly isn't going to get it the way things are going and hey ho if she doesn't want it then he can wait all he wants, because it won't happen - So he can stay sad and celibate or just tell the frigid ***** to put up and shut up and go off and exercise his loins with someone who understands that sex is part of life and good fun. Love. ha ha - its good if you get love and sex but if you can't just grab the sex and take it for what it is - a physiological enjoyable time. A bit like going out with lads for a few beers - you don't want to do it every night but 1 or 2 nights a week is good fun.

[Desperate HH]

So he can stay sad and celibate or just tell the frigid ***** to put up and shut up and go off and exercise his loins with someone who understands that sex is part of life and good fun.

 

Which is about where I am... A few months ago, in a counseling session, I told my darling wife that celibacy and I don't get along - that I would be having sex, and I hoped it would be with her. Next conversation, I asked her if she wanted me to tell her, when I was no longer celibate. Later she told me she had no right to object... Let me assure you, this was NOT what I wanted to hear.

 

If it was a physical problem, something beyond her control, I think I could handle it. But this is rejection, plain and simple. Emotional cruelty, even abuse. It's not so easy to live with that over a long period of time.

 

DHH

[Brendan Ireland]

Which is about where I am... A few months ago, in a counseling session, I told my darling wife that celibacy and I don't get along - that I would be having sex, and I hoped it would be with her. Next conversation, I asked her if she wanted me to tell her, when I was no longer celibate. Later she told me she had no right to object... Let me assure you, this was NOT what I wanted to hear.

 

DHH

 

HH none of us want to hear the woman we love does not want to have sex with us. It's tough - but you have told her you don't want to be celibate and she has, from what you said, accepted this... but be careful she may sting you by drawing you into a situation when your infidelity gives her the excuse to sue you for divorce.....very expensive business. So just don't tell her about the extra-curricular activities - but don't go getting sex from someone looking for "involvement" There are lots of couples out there living separate existences under the same roof, its not perfect and yes it is difficult to live with but try to train yourself to do so - my wife has just become a complete boring frigid **** but I just cannot be bothered with the hassle of separation so I now travel away from home to old pastures and have a couple of FBs well away from home. I hope she is going to return to an element of normality. If she doesn't I will smile, play along with the farce we live in and then leave her at my time of choosing.

[Mr. Lucky]

but I just cannot be bothered with the hassle of separation so I now travel away from home to old pastures and have a couple of FBs well away from home.

So you believe in exercising your right to sexual freedom, but not so strongly that you can be bothered with any "hassles" attaining it?

 

Hey, maybe there's no need for any struggle or conflict in marriage. At the first sign of distress, we'll all run out and line up F Buddies. Such an elegant solution might even put LoveShack out of business ...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Brendan Ireland]

So you believe in exercising your right to sexual freedom, but not so strongly that you can be bothered with any "hassles" attaining it?

 

Hey, maybe there's no need for any struggle or conflict in marriage. At the first sign of distress, we'll all run out and line up F Buddies. Such an elegant solution might even put LoveShack out of business ...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

I don't want the hassles you refer to because as we all know in this world men get screwed when it comes to separation and divorce, and yes I don't want the hassle of breaking up my entire life and the life of our children just to satisfy one person (my wife), there are no hassles having functional sex with an FB and actually it improves our home life as we are not growling at each other. Regards the other sentence - you do not know my full circumstances and do not know if this is the "first sign of distress", getting an F buddy is my business not yours or anyone elses, I happen to enjoy it, and it improves the quality of life in our married home - perhaps I am doing us all a favour. Truth is I would like to make love with my wife on a regular basis. She won't have sex, not with me and as far as I am aware not with anyone else either - Well sorry girl but if you won't have it then I have found someone else who will, but if sex is 10% of my life I am not going to go disrupting the other 90% of my life to suit her needs. Regards putting Loveshack out of business, I don't think the loss of a message board is going to have any effect on the well being of the population. Lets face it. People come on (personal) message boards to sound off - they have no bearing on the realities of life, so whatever you read on any message board take it all with a large dose of salt, well meaning messages about relationships in a cyber community are likely to have about as much effect on a relationship getting fixed as the proverbial cow jumping over the moon. The truth is Loveshack and all the well meaning words on this thread will make not one jot of difference to any of our lives. So Saddad - this is your thread and believe me I do feel for you but don't think anything you read here will make any difference to your life, because when you turn off your pc and go back into your home and talk to your wife - this message board and all you read here is one great irrelevance. Good luck mate - I hope you fix things up with your wife just as I hope I do with mine.

[OpenBook]

She won't have sex, not with me and as far as I am aware not with anyone else either - Well sorry girl but if you won't have it then I have found someone else who will, but if sex is 10% of my life I am not going to go disrupting the other 90% of my life to suit her needs.

 

Just out of curiosity, would you be OK if she DID go out and get her own lover? Someone who first makes sure all HER sexual needs are fulfilled before he gets his own rocks off?

 

this message board and all you read here is one great irrelevance.

 

If you think it's so irrelevant, then why are you posting here?

 

You sound like an angry guy. As a woman, I would be very nervous about having any type of interaction with you IRL. I fear for your W and your FB's.

[Brendan Ireland]

Just out of curiosity, would you be OK if she DID go out and get her own lover? Someone who first makes sure all HER sexual needs are fulfilled before he gets his own rocks off?

 

 

 

If you think it's so irrelevant, then why are you posting here?

 

You sound like an angry guy. As a woman, I would be very nervous about having any type of interaction with you IRL. I fear for your W and your FB's.

 

Answer to first question: If she does go out and get a lover it might put a smile on her face. And by the way you don't know about whether her sexual needs were met when we made love in the past. They were and I was very attentive as a lover towards her, not that its got anything to do with you, but I do admire your use of capital letters to emphasize your points - the written equivalent of shouting at someone.

 

Answer to second question: It is interesting to hear other peoples views although in reality they will make no difference to any of our lives, posted on a message board, plus the fact I find it mildly entertaining.

 

Response to third point: You sound very judgemental. My W and FBs have nothing to fear from me. Your comment is extremely offensive - but there you go - out here in cyberspace it makes little difference to me or you, Anyway as a woman you have nothing to fear, so go back to your cup of herbal tea and fear not.

Edited January 23, 2008 by Brendan Ireland

[OpenBook]

And by the way you don't know about whether her sexual needs were met when we made love in the past. They were and I was very attentive as a lover towards her, not that its got anything to do with you, but I do admire your use of capital letters to emphasize your points - the written equivalent of shouting at someone.

 

IF YOU'RE SUCH A GREAT LOVER, THEN WHY DOESN'T SHE WANT TO HAVE SEX WITH YOU ANYMORE?

 

Your comment is extremely offensive - but there you go - out here in cyberspace it makes little difference to me or you, Anyway as a woman you have nothing to fear, so go back to your cup of herbal tea and fear not.

 

I wonder if you find it offensive that I'm not taking your word for it. There's a good reason why I fear guys like you. And I hate herbal tea... "not that it's got anything to do with you."

[Brendan Ireland]

IF YOU'RE SUCH A GREAT LOVER, THEN WHY DOESN'T SHE WANT TO HAVE SEX WITH YOU ANYMORE?

 

 

 

I wonder if you find it offensive that I'm not taking your word for it. There's a good reason why I fear guys like you. And I hate herbal tea... "not that it's got anything to do with you."

 

Answer to Q1 - I never said I was a great lover my dear, but I do feel I satisfied her sexually. I don't know the answer to your question, but I have asked her and she can't seem to explain - perhaps she is just frigid, who knows what goes through anyone's mind never mind a womans mind.

By the way I see you are now YELLING AT ME with your capital letters, tut tut do calm down.

 

Answer to point 2: No I don't find it offensive that you're not taking my word for it. What I find offensive is your suggestive innuendo that my W and FBs should "fear" me. I can assure you they have no reason to fear me, but you seem to think they do - based on what? A few words on a message board? You don't know me, you don't know the people in my life and yet you imply these women should fear me, you actually have no right to do that, so examine your own conscience first.

 

I thought you might like herbal tea. I suggest camomile. It is very calming you might benefit from it.

 

Now where was I.....

[Mustang Sally]

IF YOU'RE SUCH A GREAT LOVER, THEN WHY DOESN'T SHE WANT TO HAVE SEX WITH YOU ANYMORE?

Thank you, Openbook.

 

My thoughts, exactly.

 

Now.

Having said that, I realize that most of the time it is not that simple....you know, what with the emotional entanglements of LTRs/marriages and all. But I think it's a damn worthy question that everyone who finds themself with a partner that doesn't want to have sex with them owes it to themself (and their partner) to ask. And I mean really ASK. Strip it bare. It can be rather painful, but also illuminating. You know?

[Mustang Sally]

Answer to Q1 - I never said I was a great lover my dear, but I do feel I satisfied her sexually. I don't know the answer to your question, but I have asked her and she can't seem to explain - perhaps she is just frigid, who knows what goes through anyone's mind never mind a womans mind.

Well.

Let me give you a few options to mull over, of what might be going through a woman's mind who doesn't have satisfying sex with her partner.

 

And I would say that YOU feeling you have satisfied her is important, sure. But what really matters is if SHE feels you have satisfied her, no? It's the same for her. Maybe she feels having sex with you once in a blue moon should be completely adequate and satisfying to you. But if you do not agree, then, Houston - we have a problem. Wouldn't you say?

 

Maybe there is something about you that she finds a complete turn off. Really. I'm sure you are a nice looking man, and very kind and caring, but maybe there is something....I don't know...but it could (and does) happen, no? And she doesn't want to tell you point blank (not saying this is the right way to approach it) because she doesn't have malicious intent towards you - she knows you are a good guy, and you try your best, and she knows that such a confession would certainly be hurtful. Thus, she tries to fake it tilll she makes it. But, still, the negative emotions/feelings from sex with you still come to her. And so she just can't get up for it any more than absolutely necessary.

 

Maybe your...technique...is lacking. Despite you and her talking about it. Despite her showing you what she likes and how to do it for her.

Again. Telling you that you are not "all that" in the sack would be hurtful. So she keeps it to herself.

 

Again. I'm not saying that any of this is the right way to deal with such a situation - on either partner's part.

 

Is it a tangible, physical problem vs an emotional issue in the relationship? Could be either, or some combination of both.

 

I would offer to you that the road to solving such an issue is NOT through going outside of the M because of some perceived "basic physiologic requirement" that is going unmet, but in communication with one's partner.

 

It may or may not end up being an impasse for the couple.

[Brendan Ireland]

Here we go analysis paralysis. My W has quite simply become a frigid bitch, and personally I wish she would go and getted f***ed by someone else because as said before it may put a smile on her face, like the smile she used to have when we used to have incredible foreplay and sexual activity. In due course I have little doubt we will separate in the meantime I am going to do whatever I fancy. We will bring our kids up in a civilised way but when it comes to being a "couple", we will do what we need to do in the family home - share all the chores, clean the place, clean the kids, get them out to school in the morning, get meals on the table (BTW FYI I do nearly all the cooking and laundry in our house), but when it comes to having a perfectly normal romp in the sack well that element of fun is gone from our lives, it may come back I don't know I don't ask her to consider it anymore because she just goes ape, I have given up on any normality in my marriage anymore. She goes to bed in the spare room with her book and for all I know her dildo to play with. I go to bed in the marital bed and usually the 2 and a half year old coming in to me half way through the night and then the five year old at six in the morning - funny how the kids come to me and not their mother but if we went to court guess who would get custody? Every night we sleep apart wake up in the morning and get on with the everyday stuff. We simply cannot afford to separate and I am not willing to leave the family home - nor for that matter is she. It is a ****ty stalemate - but do you know what its our stalemate.. TBH I would rather live with her and get some joy out of life from my children and occassional playing away from home than give her the satisfaction of me leaving the family home. In other words if I can't f**k her one way I will another.

[Mustang Sally]

Alrighty, then.

I wish you eventual solace and resolution.

[jmargel]

Here we go analysis paralysis. My W has quite simply become a frigid bitch, and personally I wish she would go and getted f***ed by someone else because as said before it may put a smile on her face, like the smile she used to have when we used to have incredible foreplay and sexual activity. In due course I have little doubt we will separate in the meantime I am going to do whatever I fancy. We will bring our kids up in a civilised way but when it comes to being a "couple", we will do what we need to do in the family home - share all the chores, clean the place, clean the kids, get them out to school in the morning, get meals on the table (BTW FYI I do nearly all the cooking and laundry in our house), but when it comes to having a perfectly normal romp in the sack well that element of fun is gone from our lives, it may come back I don't know I don't ask her to consider it anymore because she just goes ape, I have given up on any normality in my marriage anymore. She goes to bed in the spare room with her book and for all I know her dildo to play with. I go to bed in the marital bed and usually the 2 and a half year old coming in to me half way through the night and then the five year old at six in the morning - funny how the kids come to me and not their mother but if we went to court guess who would get custody? Every night we sleep apart wake up in the morning and get on with the everyday stuff. We simply cannot afford to separate and I am not willing to leave the family home - nor for that matter is she. It is a ****ty stalemate - but do you know what its our stalemate.. TBH I would rather live with her and get some joy out of life from my children and occassional playing away from home than give her the satisfaction of me leaving the family home. In other words if I can't f**k her one way I will another.

 

And your children don't pick up on this? Good chance when they are adults they are going to be in a dysfunctional relationship. You are their role model, they look upto you. I would much rather come from a broken home, then live in one.

[Desperate HH]

IF YOU'RE SUCH A GREAT LOVER, THEN WHY DOESN'T SHE WANT TO HAVE SEX WITH YOU ANYMORE?

Thank you, Openbook.

 

 

My thoughts, exactly.

 

Now.

Having said that, I realize that most of the time it is not that simple....you know, what with the emotional entanglements of LTRs/marriages and all. But I think it's a damn worthy question that everyone who finds themself with a partner that doesn't want to have sex with them owes it to themself (and their partner) to ask. And I mean really ASK. Strip it bare. It can be rather painful, but also illuminating. You know?

 

I don't much care for Brendan's tone, or the attitude he projects. But, I am a man in a very similar situation. And your suggestion that, if a female suffers loss of libido, it is likely due to the male's sexual inadequacy, is pretty offensive. Long-term rejection can be emotionally crippling, leading to deep feelings of inadequacy and worthlessness, and affecting every aspect of one's life.

 

Ast to "stripping it bare", by the time a relationship reaches that point, sex is likely to be an ancient memory, and layer upon layer of resentment has built, on both sides. It is unlikely that much useful information will come from such a conversation.

 

I think that Dan Savage has it about right: You can have strict monogamy or you can have a low libido, ladies, but you can't have both. If monogamy is a priority, you're gonna have to put out, i.e., regular vaginal intercourse and the occasional tide-him-over handjob and/or blowjob, cheerfully given. http://www.thestranger.com/seattle/SavageLove?oid=175188

 

And for far, far more discussion on low-sex marriages, see The Sexless Marriage Forum - http://p094.ezboard.com/bsexlessmarriage

 

DHH

[OpenBook]

I don't much care for Brendan's tone, or the attitude he projects. But, I am a man in a very similar situation. And your suggestion that, if a female suffers loss of libido, it is likely due to the male's sexual inadequacy, is pretty offensive. Long-term rejection can be emotionally crippling, leading to deep feelings of inadequacy and worthlessness, and affecting every aspect of one's life.

 

Well, if we (complete strangers on an anonymous public forum) don't care for his attitude, imagine how his W must feel - having to put up with that on a constant daily basis. That would feel like long-term torture to me. I don't blame her a bit for shutting down sexually. Any man with this kind of attitude toward women is not a great lover in my book - no matter how skilled he is in bed. A great lover is one who actually loves women, for everything they are, the whole enchilada. This guy sounds like he doesn't even like women at all, and views them as nothing more than a hole and a heartbeat.

 

Ast to "stripping it bare", by the time a relationship reaches that point, sex is likely to be an ancient memory, and layer upon layer of resentment has built, on both sides. It is unlikely that much useful information will come from such a conversation.

 

Generally speaking, when a woman has those layers upon layers of resentment, she shuts down sexually. To a woman, everything is integrated and connected. Men do not operate like this; they have a marvelous ability to disconnect all the circuits, "compartmentalize." They can heap tons of emotional abuse on a woman, discount her as a person, take her for granted, wear her down to nothing - and still want to have sex with her. And they're shocked and outraged when she doesn't go along with whatever he wants. Sometimes, withholding sex is the only card she feels she has left to play.

 

I think that Dan Savage has it about right: You can have strict monogamy or you can have a low libido, ladies, but you can't have both. If monogamy is a priority, you're gonna have to put out, i.e., regular vaginal intercourse and the occasional tide-him-over handjob and/or blowjob, cheerfully given.

 

Wow, this just makes me want to run out and get married. Have you ever tried this approach with a woman? If so, how did that work out for you?

 

---

 

OK, we get it. You need sex to feel like a man. (Nothing wrong with that at all.) Well, we need to be cherished in order to feel like a woman. If monogamy is a priority, you're gonna have to "put out" by actually treating us like sentient beings!! And no, laying back on the bed and saying "Honey, do me" does NOT count.

[Brendan Ireland]

Well, if we (complete strangers on an anonymous public forum) don't care for his attitude, imagine how his W must feel - having to put up with that on a constant daily basis. That would feel like long-term torture to me. I don't blame her a bit for shutting down sexually. Any man with this kind of attitude toward women is not a great lover in my book - no matter how skilled he is in bed. A great lover is one who actually loves women, for everything they are, the whole enchilada. This guy sounds like he doesn't even like women at all, and views them as nothing more than a hole and a heartbeat.

 

- Actually not true. My greatest friends are all women and I love them all the real problem I have with my W is not just the sex issue. She has made a unilateral decision she doesn't want to live with me anymore, and its nothing to do with sex, but as part of that decision she won't partake in conjugals anymore. Despite my somewhat beligerent tone, about how I feel, which I am well aware will be offensive to many- but there you go that's life, I do carry a lot of anger about the situation BTW, because she flatly refuses to work on the marriage...but she expects me to leave the family home and my children - and as it happens my workplace because I work from a home based office. This anger I feel is not just about sex, but being expected to totally disrupt my life to satisfy her. I am simply not prepared to leave the family home to accomodate her (a) I cannot afford to and (b) I really don't want all that disruption in my home and work life. and © despite all the issues about joint custody etc and accomodating the family through two separate households I actually want to be with my kids every day of the week, and put them to bed, feed them, care for them etc. (d) I still believe it is better for children to be jointly parented within a family home - even if the parents do not really get on - providing they control their emotions children will be better off in a family home with two parents.

 

We do actually get on reasonably well - but there is an underlying tension because I know how she feels and I know she won't sleep with me, which does lead to arguments and accusations - all verbal by the way before anyone dares suggest anything else

 

Generally speaking, when a woman has those layers upon layers of resentment, she shuts down sexually. To a woman, everything is integrated and connected. Men do not operate like this; they have a marvelous ability to disconnect all the circuits, "compartmentalize." They can heap tons of emotional abuse on a woman, discount her as a person, take her for granted, wear her down to nothing - and still want to have sex with her. And they're shocked and outraged when she doesn't go along with whatever he wants. Sometimes, withholding sex is the only card she feels she has left to play..

 

- Maybe so, and maybe my W feels like this. We have had problems in our marriage (who hasn't for goodness sakes), and I genuinely have and still am trying to rectify things but there is no turning back for my W. In the meantime we carry on co-habiting in tension. But... I have told her I am not going to leave, as there is no threat to anyone in the household, the house functions perfectly well, we jointly play with and enjoy the children - their emotial needs are well catered for. We just don't do family holidays, sex and weekends away with the kids (or each other). Why because she won't.

 

My W knows the score. If the family home is to be broken up by separation she is going to have to be the driver - ie she is going to have to leave, she is the one who will have to sue for divorce, she is the one who will have to set up a new home and all the hassle that entails. Neither of us can afford to take this option at the moment - so in many ways I have cocooned my feelings - become indifferent towards her and the situation and just accept this is the way it is. I am not going to simply walk away from the situation to accomodate her emotions. She knows where the door is if she wants to leave - adios amigos.

 

Anyway enough of my crap - how is saddad getting on?

[OWoman]

Generally speaking, when a woman has those layers upon layers of resentment, she shuts down sexually. To a woman, everything is integrated and connected. Men do not operate like this; they have a marvelous ability to disconnect all the circuits, "compartmentalize." They can heap tons of emotional abuse on a woman, discount her as a person, take her for granted, wear her down to nothing - and still want to have sex with her. And they're shocked and outraged when she doesn't go along with whatever he wants. Sometimes, withholding sex is the only card she feels she has left to play.

 

OB, thank god you started that with "generally speaking"! What you have described as "women" fits my MM to a T, while you'd classify me as a man based on those criteria!

 

My MM stopped having sex with his W because of the abuse. It wasn't a decision in his part, his body simply stopped allowing it to happen.

[Mustang Sally]

And your suggestion that, if a female suffers loss of libido, it is likely due to the male's sexual inadequacy, is pretty offensive.

Desperate -

I'm sorry that I offended you.

I didn't intend for that to be the outcome, but if that's what happens, then I can at least own it.

 

And I am very aware of how crippling it can be to have a sexless/low sex marriage. I've lived it.

 

I'm just suggesting that this is ONE of MANY possible contributors to the state one may find themself in. That's it. If one is really interested in finding solutions, I just think it behooves them to examine ALL possibilities, even if some are...offensive and painful. Again. I know because I've been there. Maybe rather than interpreting what I've suggested as "The woman hates sex because the man's technique sucks" it could be thought of as "The woman doesn't desire sex because it is unsatisfying for her" and then examine all the reasons - both physical and emotional - that that might be?

 

And in this examination, whether one can do it in a public forum such as LS or not...at least one should - in one's OWN MIND - allow for the possibility that there is responsibility on the part of BOTH partners...and maybe in significant amounts, at that. Not just the partner that doesn't want the sex. Yeah. It's painful. But if you aren't willing to "strip it bare" - and that includes looking at yourself (collectively), then I don't think you are ever going to find that resolution...except maybe continued resentment and/or eventual divorce.

 

Peace.

Edited January 24, 2008 by Mustang Sally

[Woggle]

Why do women think that a man should just accept living like catholic priest. There is a reason that only weirdos for the most part become proests and it is because they can't have sex. Being denied sex is actually the one reason I can find to justify cheating though a man should be honest. Brenden doesn't sound like a misogynost but a man who is fed up.

[Cobra_X30]

She goes to bed in the spare room with her book and for all I know her dildo to play with. I go to bed in the marital bed and usually the 2 and a half year old coming in to me half way through the night and then the five year old at six in the morning - funny how the kids come to me and not their mother but if we went to court guess who would get custody? Every night we sleep apart wake up in the morning and get on with the everyday stuff. We simply cannot afford to separate and I am not willing to leave the family home - nor for that matter is she. It is a ****ty stalemate - but do you know what its our stalemate.. TBH I would rather live with her and get some joy out of life from my children and occassional playing away from home than give her the satisfaction of me leaving the family home. In other words if I can't f**k her one way I will another.

 

Your pretty angry about the rejection. I can understand that.

 

I would say that you are in a stalemate. If it has not been suggested before... perhaps you should ask your wife what you could do to make her happier.

 

Seriously... if you have had that discussion, and you have made changes, then it may be time to sit down and have that... "I love you but I'm not sure I'm still 'In Love' with you chat." If she cares for you in any way... walking out that door will maker her want to change. You will never be more attractive to a woman than when you are rejecting her!