Women with Too Many Past Sexual Partners!

[AAlike]

To be honest, I wouldn't know how to discuss my view on sex without involving my morals. And as far as giving it a little bending room, that's not going to happen.

 

And that's OK - as I said, morals are morals and of course if you're on the more conservative side then yes, your viewpoints about sex will probably involve your morals, that's fine. I agree that you and anyone that you date should have similar morals - however, what I meant by bending room is this - if you met someone who had tried casual or premarital sex once or twice several years before meeting you but had since decided that it was something that she disagreed with, thereby putting her in a similar moral category as you (and this is a hypothetical, I don't really know where your morals specifically lie), would you write her off? Even though you have come to the same conclusion despite taking different steps to get there?

 

It is a problem for me. It's not something I am proud of nor am I ashamed for feeling that way. It is what it is.

 

As you'll see from a thread that I am hoping to start today if I get time, it has been and is even currently a problem for me - and there's nothing wrong with that at all. Dealing with the past of a loved one is hard - I'm legitimately in love for the first time and all of this stuff that I've advised other people how to deal with in the past and thought I was incapable of is happening to me - funny how that works. If anything though, it's a testament to how strong your feelings are.

 

I'm not suggesting that you be proud or ashamed of it, but since you know that it's a problem I'm suggesting that perhaps you work on it. I know that I am.

 

I can see how it might seem like that but I don't think that it's true. I am simply focusing on the women because I don't have to evaluate the men's sexual history. Men are not my target group, the women are. Having said that, I would agree that I do believe in certain aspects of gender roles but I do not apply double standards.

 

This is an older post of mine that might illustrate my point of view.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/showpost.php?p=1466708&postcount=28

 

And I agree with you - I certainly don't find that lifestyle to be "cool" either - like I said, I meet women on a regular basis and the ratio of women that I've slept with to women that I have successfully flirted with and felt like I could have taken it further is quite low. The few guys that I know that have numbers in that range are basically getting blind drunk and screwing whoever every night without a whole lot of enjoyment and moreso to fuel their egos and mysogynistic tendencies. These are the kind of dudes that get off on the empowerment of screwing other people's girlfriends so they can rub it in their face. not cool. But it's not the number, its the intent that renders these people to be of questionable integrity.

 

So I ask you - what is your "number" range of acceptability? It just seems silly to me. It's almost like saying "murder is OK, but only if you kill less than 5 people".

[EnigmaXOXO]

Blackbird ...

 

In more recent talks, he's actually expressed the more negative side, such as how empty those encounters made him feel, how they were the only ways he felt he could have intimacy with people because he couldn't find emotional intimacy, et cetera.

 

I hope you pay attention to that, in addition to how he treats you NOW aside from those past experiences which ultimately brought him to that epiphany. It’s not the first time I’ve heard that admitted by both males and females who might have been considered sexually promiscuous at some point in their life compared to the experiences of others.

 

As for you, you’re not missing out on anything. You have already reached the same conclusion in regard to “empty sex” vs. “sex with someone you love” without having to figure it out the hard way. You saved yourself a lot of mopping up in way of having to explain and/or justify your past to someone you care about and risk the pain of possible rejection. True, our past is very much a part of who we are today ... it’s what shapes us and makes us. Sometimes for the better, and sometimes for the worse. But even that is subjective and open to individual interpretation.

 

So here you both are, having taken two different paths to arrive at the same place. If it’s a mutually happy and beneficial place, than what does your past or his past matter in the grand scheme of things? Especially if the past remains in the past, and none of the people either of you have been with are a part of your present. None of those 50 women matter to him as much as the one he is with now. They are nothing more than not-so-pleasant memories that he has put behind him. And those ghosts have no more power over your relationship than you’re willing to give them.

 

It’s not the 50-100 random women he’s slept with that you need to worry about ... rather it’s that one person he felt a deeper connection with and has never quite gotten over. The one who broke his heart and he still thinks and wonders about on occasion. If that person does not exist ... than you are her. And shining brighter than all those nameless, faceless, forgotten people says A LOT about how valuable you are as an individual.

 

Do any of those nine people from your past change the way you feel about the man you’re with now?

[AAlike]

Is that all you ask for from a man?

 

When we enter into a relationship part of what we need to do is to prove to our partner that they are someone we greatly value... someone special.

 

Now, as with anything else in life... if you have a large number of something... the intrinsic value of each one decreases. In other words, if you have 55 cars... you may have one that you like, but it's less special to you than if you had 4 cars.

 

So, hypothetically speaking, if you have been with lots of people, how do you prove to your partner that they hold more value to you?

 

this analogy doesn't make a whole lot of sense. it would make sense if you were dating 55 women at once, but I don't think that's your point, is it?

[luvmy2ns]

Is that all you ask for from a man?

 

When we enter into a relationship part of what we need to do is to prove to our partner that they are someone we greatly value... someone special.

 

Now, as with anything else in life... if you have a large number of something... the intrinsic value of each one decreases. In other words, if you have 55 cars... you may have one that you like, but it's less special to you than if you had 4 cars.

 

So, hypothetically speaking, if you have been with lots of people, how do you prove to your partner that they hold more value to you?

 

If all I want from a man is sex, then yes - that is definitely all I ask of him. I certainly don't expect flowers and dinner, no more than he would expect that of me in those circumstances. As for large numbers, do you think we keep our past sex partners in some closet somewhere?

 

Now my honey, on the other hand? No. We have expectations of each other, because we have a relationship. We're not just sex partners. I prove his value in so many ways they are too numerous to mention here.

[AAlike]

To go back to the "why do guys care about pasts and girls don't" that started this whole thing up - now that I think about it (and now that I'm actually dealing with it for the first time), I actually think that this is not really accurate - a more accurate statement, at least from what I've noticed is:

 

Guys tend to be bothered by their girlfriend's past CASUAL exploits and not so much by her more EMOTIONAL exploits - i.e. "she's slept with seven people - it'd be OK if she had six or seven boyfriends but the fact that they were strangers I can't handle"

 

Girls tend to be bothered more by their boyfriend's past emotional exploits and not so much by their casual ones - i.e. "I don't care about a couple of meaningless flings but does he still have feelings for the one girl that broke his heart"

 

Now, these are certainly generalizations and definitely do not hold true in all cases, and the female tendency is logistically superior to the male one, but I think that they both stem from a culture that is driven by the objectification of women. Guys think "I can deal with a situation where my girl was respected but not one where she was objectified" - when guys think of their girlfriend's past exploits they do so not from her perspective but from an exaggerated perspective of the guy - as if this guy went straight from the bedroom to writing her name on the bathroom wall and high-fiving and telling stories in the locker room. For girls its the opposite - they're not threatened by women that their boyfriends had objectified in the past, but rather women who might have shared that rarified air or "pedestal" that they are currently on.

 

but in reality, this whole notion is a bunch of BS - and hopefully it's beginning to change. People need to understand how to separate the physical from the emotional aspect of sex (even if they don't want one without the other) and realize that women have their own (and in my opinion higher) sex drive than men and are perfectly capable of making rational decisions about where, when and with who they can act upon it.

[hotgurl]

 

No, I'm not. Anyone who does the same thing with each partner is not much of a lover. Some women like it hard and fast, some soft and loving and carressing. Often they like it mixed up to varying degrees. Some love having their neck bitten, others their ass slapped, and even others their ear canal licked (yes that actually was the case once). Some women can't get enough

 

darn now I want to have sex

[EnigmaXOXO]

but in reality, this whole notion is a bunch of BS - and hopefully it's beginning to change. People need to understand how to separate the physical from the emotional aspect of sex (even if they don't want one without the other) and realize that women have their own (and in my opinion higher) sex drive than men and are perfectly capable of making rational decisions about where, when and with who they can act upon it.

 

Otter has frequently posted some great links on “retroactive jealousy” which makes for some pretty insightful reading. I believe it is just as much of a catalyst behind this controversial issue as anything else.

 

After all, humans are just humans.

[tanbark813]

Now, as with anything else in life... if you have a large number of something... the intrinsic value of each one decreases. In other words, if you have 55 cars... you may have one that you like, but it's less special to you than if you had 4 cars.

 

The first two girls I slept with were very special. They were both girls I loved and were in the context of LTR's. The third girl I slept with, however, was just a drunken ONS in college. Now, according to your "logic" they should all be very special since at that point in time I had only slept with 3 people. But while the first two were very special, the third most certainly was not.

 

There were a few more girls after that. It wasn't just ONS's but they were flings at best (hey, it was college). It wasn't until a number of girls after the 3rd that I had another LTR. She was more special than #3 and the handful of girls after that. But again, by your "logic" she shouldn't have been more special than #3. So then how is it that she was??? Mainly because your "reasoning" makes no sense. And to extend it further, by your "logic" it's impossible to show 2 girls that they're special to you, or at least as special as if you had only been with one in your life. I already know it's possible to show 2 girls they're special, since I've done it, but if you think you or anyone else is incapable of showing more than 1 girl that they're special to you then I would argue that that person is not very loving at all.

 

Furthermore, each additional girl didn't change what happened with each girl prior to that. Nor did it change what I felt about them at the time or afterwards. To think that a present or future situation could possibly alter the past is a ridiculous notion.

 

Finally, kind of a loosely related point: If a person only has opportunities to have sex with 4 people in their life and they accept all 4 then they're far less selective than someone who has 40 opportunities but only takes 20.

 

I don't know, Cobra. The mindset you seem to have is just far too simplistic for me.

 

So, hypothetically speaking, if you have been with lots of people, how do you prove to your partner that they hold more value to you?

 

I already answered this.

[AAlike]

Otter has frequently posted some great links on “retroactive jealousy” which makes for some pretty insightful reading. I believe it is just as much of a catalyst behind this controversial issue as anything else.

 

After all, humans are just humans.

 

Yes, and having issues with retroactive jealousy is precisely what brought me to these forums in the first place, so I'm well aware of it.

 

My question is do you think that retroactive jealousy is the cause of this issue or the effect? I think that it's more the effect than anything - I think that if we as a society understand that a woman can make a conscious decision to have consensual, casual sex for the same reason that a guy can make said decision that retroactive jealousy will become far far less prevalent.

[luvmy2ns]

if you think you or anyone else is incapable of showing more than 1 girl that they're special to you then I would argue that that person is not very loving at all.

 

Good point. When I was dating a few guys at the same time (and they all knew it - never lied to a single one of them, and was NOT sleeping with them all at the same time - ewe), I made them all feel special by not canceling dates, by baking one a cake on his birthday and taking him out for dinner, by focusing my attention on the man I was with when I was with him, by being HONEST with them all. I treated them all very good, and they felt that and continued to see me, even though they knew they weren't the one and only with me.

[BeautifulMystique]

Does it really matter how many partners one had in the past? Isn't it more meaningful on how that person is treating you?

 

Don't get me wrong, I know what is being discussed here but I would like to think there is more to a person than how many partners he or she has been with. I don't know if I could be with a guy who had more than 20 partners in his past [i'd have probably met one but never did I ask any of my ex-boyfriends] but even if I did meet one, and he has all the attributes that I look for then why not?

[BeautifulMystique]

Good point. When I was dating a few guys at the same time (and they all knew it - never lied to a single one of them, and was NOT sleeping with them all at the same time - ewe), I made them all feel special by not canceling dates, by baking one a cake on his birthday and taking him out for dinner, by focusing my attention on the man I was with when I was with him, by being HONEST with them all. I treated them all very good, and they felt that and continued to see me, even though they knew they weren't the one and only with me.

 

I agree with you, luvmy2ns. I have always been honest with all my guyfriends and they know about each other. I don't sleep with every single one of them but do make each and every one of them special!

[Phateless]

Every individual connection can be special in some way. We all have multiple friends, each of whom we have a unique connection with, making them all special in one way or another. I don't buy the argument that sex isn't special, the more partners you've had. When you're really into someone, it changes everything, no matter how much experience you've had.

[Phateless]

lol @ "retroactive jealousy." I can't believe people get worked up over that...

[BeautifulMystique]

Every individual connection can be special in some way. We all have multiple friends, each of whom we have a unique connection with, making them all special in one way or another. I don't buy the argument that sex isn't special, the more partners you've had. When you're really into someone, it changes everything, no matter how much experience you've had.

 

True. Nicely said, Phateless.

[EnigmaXOXO]

My question is do you think that retroactive jealousy is the cause of this issue or the effect?

 

Don’t know. I’m not that smart.

 

I can only speak for myself ... but I’d say it was the “cause” for me since emotions are primal. No matter how much control (or disconnect) I manage to wield over them. As stubborn as I am, you’ll have a harder time changing the way I feel in response to certain things than changing the way I think about them. I can say that logically, certain things shouldn’t affect me ... but does that really go far in changing my immediate reaction (at the core of it, under the surface) to specific emotional triggers?

 

Whether or not I have been conditioned by societal views or by personal experience is really the million dollar question. For me, I’d say it has been an equal combination of both.

[Tomcat33]

A person could have 100 sexual partners and always give more or less the same to each person but then in comes #101 who wipes the slate clean in terms of what a person is capable of giving. I am a firm believer that we give according to what we feel, some people bring out the best in us, others bring out just enough in us, some the worst and others make us surprise ourselves in terms of just how much we are capable of giving.

 

It all boils down to our biggest sex organ, the brain. The emotional connection determines how "special" we will treat the person we are with.

 

In conclusion, I disagree that if you have many partners you can't make that one "special" someone feel differently. It's not a matter of how many patners you have had sex with it is a matter of how you connect with them.

[AAlike]

lol @ "retroactive jealousy." I can't believe people get worked up over that...

 

me neither, but like I said, emotions, especially ones that are rare and unfamiliar, can have unpredicatble effects. There's no doubt that retroactive jealousy is absurd in principle and illogical, but hell, so are love and romance!

[Tomcat33]

me neither, but like I said, emotions, especially ones that are rare and unfamiliar, can have unpredicatble effects. There's no doubt that retroactive jealousy is absurd in principle and illogical, but hell, so are love and romance!

 

 

Retroactive jealousy is only permissible, in my books at least, if your partner's past partners come back into the picture and they are sniffing around to see if they can still have them. Only then would I feel jealous, or if knowing they are having a friendship behind my back would also bother me...stuff like that. But just thinking of my guy's past and getting jealous of what they did with whom, is absolutely nuts!! Not to mention if you have sufficient confidence in yourself sexually you shouldn't care less how the other people performed or what they did in the sack, it's not about what you do but how you do it and with whom.

 

 

The past is past, it's gone and never coming back what is the point of dwelling on what a person may or may not have done in the past? Seriously, who cares? Unless my partner was a sex maniac who slept with the whole city, OR a eunuch / 40 yr old virgin (THAT would be so much more alarming!) OR he murdered a person in the past or beat a woman, I don't care about his past.

 

We all have a past and unless you are 19 you are expected to have experiences under you belt, that's life.

 

Oh one last thing... it has been my exprience in talking to girlfriends or in group discussions where women tell all, that the types of women who have had a LOT of sexual partners totally lie about it when they meet the guy they are seriously interested in. SO guys, no use in even worrying about that because for all you know that meek and mild little goody two shoes you are with who says she only slept with 3 guys by the age of 45 may have in fact lost count by the age of 16.

 

My point is you will NEVER know the truth about a person's past so why worry about it?

[Florida]

Oh one last thing... it has been my exprience in talking to girlfriends or in group discussions where women tell all, that the types of women who have had a LOT of sexual partners totally lie about it when they meet the guy they are seriously interested in. SO guys, no use in even worrying about that because for all you know that meek and mild little goody two shoes you are with who says she only slept with 3 guys by the age of 45 may have in fact lost count by the age of 16.

 

My point is you will NEVER know the truth about a person's past so why worry about it?

 

Tomcat-so true! I have known quite a few women who admitted very high numbers, but to the husband/BF he was told another story.

 

I remember this one guy who had been dumped by this girl I knew who was a friend of a friend.

 

He was devastated and really upset, he mentioned she told him he was her second. That seemed to strengthen the feeling of devastation for him.

 

Me and my friend looked at eachother, mouths agape, thinking of all the stories she told us that pointed to 10x that. Coincidentally-her next BF who was also left in the dust said the same thing. He was so glad to be with a gal with low numbers. She was very pretty and virginal looking, by the way. Some women will even go so far as to put down other women with risque pasts to prove to their man how pure they are, even though their pasts far surpass that of the person they are penalizing to said BF/husband.

 

I read another advice forum where a woman was a former escort was getting married and never told her fiance about that. The only way to really know the truth is through a P.I. The same could be said for men too.

 

Tomcat is so right!

Edited January 17, 2008 by Florida

[AAlike]

Retroactive jealousy is only permissible, in my books at least, if your partner's past partners come back into the picture and they are sniffing around to see if they can still have them. Only then would I feel jealous, or if knowing they are having a friendship behind my back would also bother me...stuff like that. But just thinking of my guy's past and getting jealous of what they did with whom, is absolutely nuts!! Not to mention if you have sufficient confidence in yourself sexually you shouldn't care less how the other people performed or what they did in the sack, it's not about what you do but how you do it and with whom.

 

 

The past is past, it's gone and never coming back what is the point of dwelling on what a person may or may not have done in the past? Seriously, who cares? Unless my partner was a sex maniac who slept with the whole city, OR a eunuch / 40 yr old virgin (THAT would be so much more alarming!) OR he murdered a person in the past or beat a woman, I don't care about his past.

 

We all have a past and unless you are 19 you are expected to have experiences under you belt, that's life.

 

Oh one last thing... it has been my exprience in talking to girlfriends or in group discussions where women tell all, that the types of women who have had a LOT of sexual partners totally lie about it when they meet the guy they are seriously interested in. SO guys, no use in even worrying about that because for all you know that meek and mild little goody two shoes you are with who says she only slept with 3 guys by the age of 45 may have in fact lost count by the age of 16.

 

My point is you will NEVER know the truth about a person's past so why worry about it?

 

I totally agree with you Tomcat - at no point should retro jealousy be considered "permissible" (in your examples it's not RJ but common-sense based precautions!).

 

All I'm saying is that it's easy to bash people for being insecure/immature/illogical/judgemental when they experience this syndrome, and yes, it is all of those things - but it's not something that you can simply "reason" your way through. I've always been a super-logical, extremely stable person, but my first experience with smack-you-upside-the-head love brought out behavior that I didn't think that I could EVER be capable of. We're all a little insecure when it comes to that emotion I think, because it's something that you can't prepare or practice for.

[luvmy2ns]

I thought yesterday about bringing up the fact that people can lie, but I figured that would occur to someone. Apparently, there are many gullible folks out there.

[Florida]

I thought yesterday about bringing up the fact that people can lie, but I figured that would occur to someone. Apparently, there are many gullible folks out there.

 

agreed luvmy2ns. Now the problem with bringing it up is that the next posts may start in on "why do you know liars?" and "well not everyone is" blah blah because it is scary to think you never really know another person.

 

Only your subjective experience of who they are based on observation, friends, and interactions, which, let's admit, can be faulty as a determing tool of everything.

 

But throwing this fact in is going to start a paranoid fire of postings.

 

"But I thought I knew him/her!" is always the last battle cry of the people who have been duped, there are no surefire ways of knowing anyone completely. Isn't that why all are on here?

Edited January 17, 2008 by Florida

[Tomcat33]

Woppsy I'm sorry if I have unleashed the hounds and broke some sort of female "code" :laugh: (I tend to be a straight shooter so...if my "edit" button seems broken, it's not. I was made that way) :laugh:

 

the point was more to the effect that we never actually know what is real and what is not in terms of a partner's past so why even worry about it?

 

Like in Florida's story of the ex call girl, that story is priceless and should be put into prespective with the reality that a lot of women are extremely promiscuous they just don't admit it. They also don't get paid for it, they give it up for free...but they down play it for fear of being called slags. I have more respect for a prostitute at least she makes a business out of it where two people end up in a win/win situation....where as the promiscuous goody two shoes offers it up to the first guy that buys her a drink....anyway don't want to go off topic thats another point.

 

 

The idea that love makes us act in weird ways is true, jealousy comes from a fear of loss, when we feel potentially threatened that we could lose a person we feel jealous. On the other hand when we are "in love" that feeling is also produced by a small precentage of that same fear of loss, it is a big precentage of reciprocation with a small fear of loss and the unknown that causes that crazy feeling. So if you think about it it is only natural that we would start to create crazy scenarios in our heads that put us at a disadvantage of loss.

 

I think that the feeling of jealousy, outside of obvious acts that will induce jealousy in another person, for the most part is a choice. You choose to feel jealous or threatened about something through your own irrational thoughts. So again some feelings can't be avoided but some can. If you choose to focus on your partner's past you can seriously drive yourself crazy with insecurities and jealousy, it's like trust, you can choose to trust someone or you can be be consumed with insecurties that will produce irrational jealousy.

 

Seeing an ex of my partner's come on to him = rational jealousy (IMO)

 

Thinking of how my ex partner was in bed with her = irrational jealousy (IMO)

 

So you can choose to not focus on the irrational stuff because at the end of the day when you are in a relationship there are plenty of "rational" things that are going to happen over time that will give you a run for your money, so why create more drama with things you have no proof or control over?

Edited January 17, 2008 by Tomcat33

[Florida]

So, the question is this. Why does this typically matter to men and seem irrelevant to women? Is it ok to judge a person based on thier past exploits? Why or why not?

 

It matters to me in the following ways:

-did they have one night stands?

If yes, that makes me unhappy.I would hope it was something that would be approached with more solemnity.

 

-did he ever have a threesome?

If yes, I will feel strange about it, and not be so interested. Just because it points to a kind of division of what is important: hedonism vs non hedonism.

 

-did he ever lie to a girl/promise a relationship was his intention to sleep with her?

If yes, that is just wrong-not acceptable. No way.

 

-Did he have true feelings for the girls he had been with ? And had he hoped it would actually turn out to be something long lasting?

If yes, that is good.

 

-Had he ever turned down easy sex because he wasn't that into the girl, even though they could have done it no strings attached?

If yes-GREAT! that is a good guy.

 

I offer the same, so it is important that matches.