Just Wondering

[Can'tGiveUp]

I agree that its not usually so black and white like I wrote, but we all have morals and values. Obviously those morals and values differ per person and are held at different levels of importance per person.

 

And that is exactly what I mean. You know now what you believe you will do in a certain future situation. But 10 or 15 years down the road, when you have married your gf and have a couple of kids...well, you might find a shift in your thinking.

 

And you might not. I must admit I never thought I'd be where I am. I left my M for many reasons, none of which involved a 3rd party. I also stayed for many years "for the kids". When considering leaving you are faced with many issues - children, financial, personal happiness - you have to weigh all of those and choose the best option. Often that best option is what will you believe will benefit your children most.

 

I guess the bottom line is that each person has to make that determination of what the best option is for them. Sometimes that might mean staying in a sexless marriage and seeking it outside the M, with or without the approval of your SO. I'm not saying that is right, but perhaps the best option in their mind, at the time.

[Alphonse]

I'm not married...but I thought I'd respond anyway.

 

I'd think getting your "sexual fix" outside of the M would do more harm than good where the kids are concerned (generally speaking).

 

This is compared to breaking up the family, right? If so, how is that better for the kids? Is it because they shouldn't be given the idea that a dead relationship is normal?

[LucreziaBorgia]

If you are in a sexless marriage and have children, how would you handle the situation? Would you go through MC first and if to no avail would you divorce the person, or would you just go outside the marriage and get your sexual fix and stay together just for the kids sake?

 

My marriage was like that - the sex just died, and what sex there was was basically sterile. My exH proposed an open marriage, and I agreed to it. That lasted for a while, but eventually we both realized it wasn't an open marriage that we wanted - what we wanted was to separate as H and W, but keep every other aspect of the relationship. So, we live separately now, but we are still close, affectionate, spend lots of time together, and love each other very much. Best friends, family members to each other and all that. We spend time most every day together, and spend family time together with our daughter. We are much happier with each other, and closer to each other separated than we were when we were living together and trying to make marriage work. Our daughter benefits greatly from having two happy separated parents, rather than having two parents living together who were trying to make it work but failing.

 

It is a rare thing to have it work like that, but I feel fortunate that it did. I'm glad we didn't try to "stay together for this kid" because it is clear for us that it works out much better for us all this way, and no one loses.

 

If it were a nasty, bitter divorce laced with revenge thoughts, hatred and threats of keeping each other from seeing the kid then I'm not sure how that would have gone. Some people stay married just to avoid having to go through such a nasty break that hurts everyone in the end.

 

I guess we just lucked out with an amicable one.

[Pyro]

This is compared to breaking up the family, right? If so, how is that better for the kids? Is it because they shouldn't be given the idea that a dead relationship is normal?

 

One can argue that two parents who stay together for the kids but still seek sex outside of the marriage, which will lead to lies and deceit to the kids and arguements between the parents, which could have worse results.

 

My marriage was like that - the sex just died, and what sex there was was basically sterile. My exH proposed an open marriage, and I agreed to it. That lasted for a while, but eventually we both realized it wasn't an open marriage that we wanted - what we wanted was to separate as H and W, but keep every other aspect of the relationship. So, we live separately now, but we are still close, affectionate, spend lots of time together, and love each other very much. Best friends, family members to each other and all that. We spend time most every day together, and spend family time together with our daughter. We are much happier with each other, and closer to each other separated than we were when we were living together and trying to make marriage work. Our daughter benefits greatly from having two happy separated parents, rather than having two parents living together who were trying to make it work but failing.

 

It is a rare thing to have it work like that, but I feel fortunate that it did. I'm glad we didn't try to "stay together for this kid" because it is clear for us that it works out much better for us all this way, and no one loses.

 

If it were a nasty, bitter divorce laced with revenge thoughts, hatred and threats of keeping each other from seeing the kid then I'm not sure how that would have gone. Some people stay married just to avoid having to go through such a nasty break that hurts everyone in the end.

 

I guess we just lucked out with an amicable one.

 

I'll say thats a rarity. Remaining civil throughout all of that is one in a million for couples.

 

Do the kids have any idea about the open marriage situation?

[LucreziaBorgia]

 

Do the kids have any idea about the open marriage situation?

 

I only have one child, but she did not know about it. Any activity that H was doing outside the home was done after she went to bed. Only a couple of times did he go out before bedtime or an overnight trip, but it was always presented as him simply going out for a while, or going to visit a friend. He was always careful not to let it interfere with home life, or let it take any 'Dad' time away from her. She never saw a difference. She was some years younger back then, so she wouldn't have really had a context to pick up on stuff like that.

[Pyro]

I only have one child, but she did not know about it. Any activity that H was doing outside the home was done after she went to bed. Only a couple of times did he go out before bedtime or an overnight trip, but it was always presented as him simply going out for a while, or going to visit a friend. He was always careful not to let it interfere with home life, or let it take any 'Dad' time away from her. She never saw a difference. She was some years younger back then, so she wouldn't have really had a context to pick up on stuff like that.

 

Stuff like that can destroy a child mentally. Good job on keeping it under wraps.

[LucreziaBorgia]

Yes, I agree with you having had philandering parents who didn't hide it so well.

[Pyro]

Yes, I agree with you having had philandering parents who didn't hide it so well.

 

Its not the same as an open marriage, but my Mom did cheat on my Dad. My Dad found out and he told us. It really did hit me hard, especially since all the times that my Mom said she was doing one thing, that she was doing another. I wonder what would have been if my dad didn't tell me, but in a way I was glad that she was exposed.

[LucreziaBorgia]

I can definitely relate!

 

My dad's first marriage was marred by cheating. My bio mother (first wife) cheated on him with a married guy, and literally walked out after leaving me and my brother in a playpen, taping a Dear John note to the TV and leaving us there to find when he got home from work that night. They divorced and she gave us up for adoption. I was always reminded of what a "whore" my bio mother was. No one in my family let us forget it.

 

Second wife (stepmother) cheated repeatedly on him, and it basically destroyed him. My brother and I were old enough by that time to catch on, and it was humiliating. Everyone knew - classmates at school, people in the community, etc. It was gross having a stepmother like that, and even grosser and creepier being told stories about her by other people - even down to one kid at my high school asking if he could have "next" on my stepmother. I was so happy when they divorced. Man was I glad. She moved far away and I never had to see her or deal with her again.

 

I guess that was part of why the open marriage thing didn't last long in my own situation and led directly to the separation. It was better for all involved to just split.

[Pyro]

I can definitely relate!

 

My dad's first marriage was marred by cheating. My bio mother (first wife) cheated on him with a married guy, and literally walked out after leaving me and my brother in a playpen, taping a Dear John note to the TV and leaving us there to find when he got home from work that night. They divorced and she gave us up for adoption. I was always reminded of what a "whore" my bio mother was. No one in my family let us forget it.

 

Second wife (stepmother) cheated repeatedly on him, and it basically destroyed him. My brother and I were old enough by that time to catch on, and it was humiliating. Everyone knew - classmates at school, people in the community, etc. It was gross having a stepmother like that, and even grosser and creepier being told stories about her by other people - even down to one kid at my high school asking if he could have "next" on my stepmother. I was so happy when they divorced. Man was I glad. She moved far away and I never had to see her or deal with her again.

 

I guess that was part of why the open marriage thing didn't last long in my own situation and led directly to the separation. It was better for all involved to just split.

 

Did that have an effect on you at all? I mean, did you become a rebellious teen or anything like that?

[LucreziaBorgia]

Did that have an effect on you at all? I mean, did you become a rebellious teen or anything like that?

 

I wasn't rebellious in the sense that I got in trouble or tanked in school or anything like that. I was however a serial (and nearly always predatory) OW starting from the age of 15, and a serial cheater in nearly every relationship I was involved in. I was promiscuous to say the least, and most often at someone else's expense. I stopped that behavior years ago when I came to terms with what led me down that path and led me to make those decisions for myself (and inflict them on others). I am remorseful for what I have done in the past, but they say you learn from your mistakes not your successes - and I've learned a lot.

 

Was it my parent's fault? Nah. They may have modeled the behavior, but I made every decision to do what I did. If you want to get down to the psychotherapy end of it - perhaps I saw my father drawn to these types of women, and in some subconscious way sought to be the type of woman he most wanted and loved. Then again, maybe that is utter psychobabble bullsh*t and I was merely operating from an amoral position and managed somehow to stumble and fumble up a rung or two on Maslow's ladder and turn things around for myself.

 

Either way, I'm past all that these days.

[Pyro]

I wasn't rebellious in the sense that I got in trouble or tanked in school or anything like that. I was however a serial (and nearly always predatory) OW starting from the age of 15, and a serial cheater in nearly every relationship I was involved in. I was promiscuous to say the least, and most often at someone else's expense. I stopped that behavior years ago when I came to terms with what led me down that path and led me to make those decisions for myself (and inflict them on others). I am remorseful for what I have done in the past, but they say you learn from your mistakes not your successes - and I've learned a lot.

 

Was it my parent's fault? Nah. They may have modeled the behavior, but I made every decision to do what I did. If you want to get down to the psychotherapy end of it - perhaps I saw my father drawn to these types of women, and in some subconscious way sought to be the type of woman he most wanted and loved. Then again, maybe that is utter psychobabble bullsh*t and I was merely operating from an amoral position and managed somehow to stumble and fumble up a rung or two on Maslow's ladder and turn things around for myself.

 

Either way, I'm past all that these days.

 

Interesting stuff.

 

Glad to see that you are past all of it.

[Mr. Lucky]

So, we live separately now, but we are still close, affectionate, spend lots of time together, and love each other very much. Best friends, family members to each other and all that. We spend time most every day together, and spend family time together with our daughter. We are much happier with each other, and closer to each other separated than we were when we were living together and trying to make marriage work. Our daughter benefits greatly from having two happy separated parents, rather than having two parents living together who were trying to make it work but failing.

LB:

 

Have either of you been in a significant relationship since the separation and how did it affect your arrangement?

 

Mr. Lucky

[LucreziaBorgia]

LB:

 

Have either of you been in a significant relationship since the separation and how did it affect your arrangement?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

I was seeing someone for a couple of years, but we recently broke up. exH saw someone for a short while but she demolished him emotionally. I am still getting over my breakup (its an on again off again thing). exH hasn't dated anyone since her. Those relationships didn't really affect what exH and I had. Still don't. I'm not sure what would happen if either of us got into a serious relationship of the sort that would lead to living together and marriage. I guess that is a bridge we'll cross when we get there, if either of us ever do. Neither of us are in the market right now. The cancer takes up most of our lives right now.