Said he was going to propose- now not sure

[lexi29]

Bf and I together for over 3 years. He's 30 and never been married or even engaged before. Has an 8 yr old son. He left me and dated his ex for three weeks and then wanted me back. Long story but it turned out to better our relationship. Now we both feel like we are in the honeymoon period and it is better than ever. We spend a lot of time together with his son (he has full custody) and his son is always saying (since we got back together) that he wants us to get married. My bf told me that when he gets his tax return money he wants to buy a ring and propose. He told me this about a month ago. He asked me to do his taxes and I found out he is getting $4000 back. He will get the money in about two weeks. He recently moved to a bigger apartment and wanted me to move in with them. I told him I wasn't ready to move in yet. Truth is I want a ring on my finger before moving in with him. I moved in with a bf before we were engaged and it took him forever to propose (didn't work out anyway) so I feel that moving in without the ring is not for me. I haven't told him this though because I don't want him to ask me to marry him JUST to get me to live with him. IF that makes sense.

 

Well even though its probably crazy I am happier than I've ever been. We get along so well now and his son adores me and I adore him. We are a little happy family and its wonderful. I still have lingering insecurites from the way he left me so suddenly but he's realized he made a huge mistake and every single day he tries to make up for it. He says he realized he doesn't want me to ever not be in his life. That he had stopped appreicating me and didn't realize how much he cared for me and how important I was to him until I wasn't around anymore. That he will do ANYTHING to make sure that doesn't happen again. I am so happy being with him and his son all the time. I know I will disapointed if he doesn't propose (but he has no idea about this as he thinks I"m somewhat afraid of marriage) I know if he does not buy a ring with his tax return money he will not be able to propose until this time next year as he is terrible at saving money (last year he spent his tax return in a week!!)

 

Last night he was telling me what he plans to do with the money. He said he will pay off his truck and make some repairs to it. thinks he will spend about $2000 on that. He did NOT mention buying a ring. A month ago when he told me he was going to buy a ring with his tax return he also said he was buying his son an XBOX 360. Last night he didn't mention anything about the XBOX either. Do you think I should expect him NOT to buy the ring? I know I will be disapointed if he doesn't. Note this isn't about how much he spends or anything- I wouldn't care if he only spent $500. on a ring. Its about the timing. If he doesnt' use some of THIS money to buy the ring he won't be able to afford anything until this time next year. Do you think he's going to go through with it?

[sunshinegirl]

Seems like you need to have a conversation with him about what moving in together represents to you, what concerns you about it, what your preferences are. Don't expect him to read your mind.

[curiousnycgirl]

Lexi -

 

I haven't gone back to your recent posts, as I know they have been numerous, I've read them. If I recall correctly - you told him you are not ready to be engaged. So how can you expect him to buy you a ring now?

 

Another thing I recall is the very recently you were not trusting him, etc. How can you think you two are ready to get engaged? Why not take some serious time, and let this relationship stabilize before thinking long term?

 

I think you need to reread some of your own posts to remind yourself that you two need way more time.

[dropdeadlegs]

While I can see your point in not wanting him to propose just to get you to live with him, I think he may have received some mixed signals. How did you react when he spoke of using his refund to buy a ring? He might be confused about your reluctance to live together and see it as reluctance to marry based on your "I'm somewhat afraid of marriage" comment within your post. I guess if I'm not clear of your wants and expectations, maybe he is confused, too. He may fear rejection.

 

On the other hand, he spoke of spending half the refund and didn't speak of the other half, so he may still have plans.

[lexi29]

Thanks for the thoughts. I guess I am in a "fog" right now because I am so happy. I just want to be with him and his son every day (though we do take one day a week off at MY request and use that time to spend with friends and family). I am thinking more of that I need him to actually follow through on everything he says he is going to do because he is earning my trust back and that is part of trust.

 

Thanks for pointing out that he may be confused by my actions and words. I don't want to live with him because it is too soon but I would be excited to get engaged. I guess that does sound kind of weird. But I would POSSIBLY move in with him if we got engaged. But it is possible to get engaged and not live together right away.

 

When he talked about using his refund to buy a ring I was kind of suprised but I didn't say much (postive or negative). He is always talking about how he feels he wants more than I do (because I dont 'want to move in with him right now) but that is because he looks at it as we've been dating almost 4 years and I"m looking at it most of the time as we just got back together. So to me this is a fresh start and yes those years count but its not as though we've dated over 3 years consecutively without breaking up. He says it was a short break (he only dated the other woman for 3 weeks before he left her) but to me it was a HUGE upset. So I'm not going to sweep it under the rug and act like we've been together for the last 3 + years straight and we should be moving forward by now.

 

I don't think he's rushing me, I think he feels like I do that the way things are going and we are so happy that he wants to take the next step. The next step to him I thought was getting engaged because he brought that up. But I now think the next step is moving in together and THEN getting engaged. I'm not up for that. Its something I need to talk to him about and even though normally I can talk to him about anything I'm afraid of bringing up this topic for some reason. Maybe because deep down I think its too soon to be talking about this.

[dropdeadlegs]

I think you said something that is important.

 

"Its something I need to talk to him about and even though normally I can talk to him about anything I'm afraid of bringing up this topic for some reason. Maybe because deep down I think its too soon to be talking about this."

 

Since you are happy, and looking at the recent past as a fresh start, maybe it is too soon to be thinking about the next step.

 

Once you are completely confident in maintaining the current status, that conversation won't be fearful.

 

(While totally willing to put the short breakup in the past and chalk it up as a learning experience on his part, my skeptical side would be popping in for a visit every now and then for awhile.)

[lexi29]

After thinking about what everyone has said- I think the bottom line is that I WANT him to propose because he suggested he was going to. I need him to follow through with what he tells me he is going to do as this is part of trust. Also getting engaged would prove to me that he is committed and seriously wants this to work. I guess I consider getting engaged as taking a pathway toward marriage and not that you start planning the wedding as soon as you get engaged.

[dropdeadlegs]

After thinking about what everyone has said- I think the bottom line is that I WANT him to propose because he suggested he was going to. I need him to follow through with what he tells me he is going to do as this is part of trust. Also getting engaged would prove to me that he is committed and seriously wants this to work. I guess I consider getting engaged as taking a pathway toward marriage and not that you start planning the wedding as soon as you get engaged.

Understood. I think it's time to have that talk with him. Now.

 

Explain exactly what you have explained, here, to us. Make sure you are both on the same page. That refund isn't in his hands yet and this conversation would best take place before he receives it and spends it in a way that might leave you feeling hurt. I say that because he said he would be proposing, not because he has to propose. Following through is definitely a trust issue. If he has had second thoughts, or feels he has received mixed signals, now is the time to address things.

 

All that said, if he expects a short engagement and a quick ceremony, are you ready to proceed? Make sure your expectations of the engagement "path" are in sync during the discussion, too.

[lexi29]

I will talk to him. I guess I just felt like I should "wait and see" and not make a big deal of out something that could be nothing (he might follow thru on his own) I know (unless he changed his thoughts after we broke up and got back together) that his thinking about an engagement being a path to marriage and not a rush to the altar is the same as mine because we've talked about it in the past.

[dropdeadlegs]

Wait and see is certainly an option, but if you will resent his not following through I think he should know that. That's all I was trying to say. I haven't always been completely honest in my expectations and that is usually how I have ended up hurt or confused.

 

Only you can decide if fully gaining back the trust is best addressed by talking to him about your expectations, or seeing if his actions meet up with his words. It's a tough call from the sidelines! I sincerely hope things work out the way you want them to, though.

[lexi29]

Well, I talked to him last night- we were moving stuff into his new place and he brought up the living together thing again and I told him that first of all he never actually asked me, that he's just hinted around about it. He's made comments about he wished I would move in about twenty times and he wanted me to go with him to look at apartments and he would always ask if I liked the place and if I could see myself living there. But he never came out and asked "would you move in with me?" He said he was hinting around to see what my feelings were and that he knew I probably wouldn't move in yet because he knows that I want to be engaged or married to someone before I move in with them.

 

He said he feels that you should live together BEFORe you get engaged or married so that you find out all the "dirty little secrets" of the person ahead of time. As in you find out if they are messy, and all their annoying little habits etc. I agreed that I want to live with someone before marriage because I feel this is so true. I was with an ex for several years (we dated right after high school) and our relationship was perfect and then we got engaged and moved in together and it was like I was living with a totally different guy than I'd been dating. I found out so much I never knew about him. So I do agree you should at least "try out" the situation before you get married. However my bf made it sound like he wants to live with someone before he invests in a ring and makes a commitment.

 

I told him I understand his feelings but that if those are his plans we should just end things because I will never be comfortable moving in with him (or anyone else) without a ring on my finger. My personal feelings are that it is too easy to move in with someone and get used to it and they never propose because there is no need or rush as they already have you living with them and acting like you are married. It would definately be an even bigger deal to move in with my bf (therefore the reason I would want the commitment of being engaged) because I would be moving 1/2 hour farther away from where I work, would be responsible for his son while my bf was at work ( after i get off work) and we would we splitting bills etc so I'm not doing all that without a ring on my finger. Also my bf has lived (most were only briefly) with about six of his past gfs (from the time he was 17 years old) so its not a big deal to him. But he's never been engaged before.

 

When I told him that maybe we should just end things now because we have different views on the subject and prolonging our relationship (if we are never going to see eye to eye on this) isn't doing his son any favors. As his son tells us at least once a week he wants us to get married. (he's 8). My bf said that he could always change his mind that this is just the way he always thought. I wanted to ask him why he told me (several times- at least 3 in the last two months) that he was going to be spending part of his tax return on a ring but I didn't want to seem like that's all I"m after. And how do you bring that up anyway?? Because honestly, if he hadn't been the one to bring it up (getting engaged) and mentioned it several times I wouldn't be even thinking about getting engaged right now. But when he put the idea in my head I got excited about it because I really do love him and his son very much. It probably is way too soon to be discussing an engagement but he put the thought in my head and now I'm wondering why he doesn't sound like he plans to follow through or wants to "try me out" and have me live with him like its some type of test before we get engaged. I'm disapointed and hurt and I"m not sure why. I think it has to do with trust. He's told me something and I found out that while he may not have lied (he was probably thinking out it) he doesnt' seem ready to follow through with what he's been telling me.

[dropdeadlegs]

lexi, I'm sorry things didn't go exactly the way you wanted.

 

I can see things from both points of view. I do think you should "try before you buy" even though that offers no guarantees. I think it is a time when roles can be defined without the hassle of a big financial mess if things don't work out (assuming it's done right.)

 

I also think that living together might slow down the "path to marriage" in many cases, and agree that you would be the one with the most changes and "inconveniences" in your case. You have every right to expect marriage after 3 years, especially when becoming a step parent would come with the territory.

 

I'm sure it wasn't the most comfortable conversation, but I think you should have mentioned the talk of the ring. I know it's hard to bring up, but it was the right time to do it. Remember that HE brought it up initially. Now you will have to revisit the subject to get an answer to that, assuming he doesn't buy one with the tax refund. It will be harder to bring up his talk of a ring again. If you hope he got the "hint" and will come through, it will hurt and disappoint you even further if he doesn't.

 

So, what to do? Wait and hope, or get answers ASAP? I guess the answer depends on how much more you are willing to invest of yourself in the event the ring isn't coming next month. You have a lot invested already, and until he started talking about a ring, and then other ways of using the money, you were admittedly happy. Trust is very important. Is NOT getting a ring a deal breaker for you when your trust has already been challenged? I don't expect answers here, just giving you something to think about.

 

Good luck, lexi. I hope it goes your way.

[lexi29]

dropdeadlegs, thanks for your comments. I appreciate you taking the time to post.

 

I know I should have brought up the subject of the ring last night but I wasn't sure how to do it. It has only been three months since he left me for his ex (the two week relationship) so its very soon to be expecting to get engaged. The thought wasn't even in my head until he brought it up. He TOLD me several times that his plans were to buy a ring with his tax refund. I don't know if he was testing me, if he was joking (he wasn't laughing) or what. I got excited/interested in the idea because HE brought it up and stated this is what he planned to do. Now we hadn't gone ring shopping, he hasn't asked for my ring size or any of that so maybe I shouldn't have jumped the gun. But because of the trust issue, I need to know that I can take him at his word. So IF he says something he needs to follow through with it and I think thats the whole reason I am disapointed. Not so much because I'm in a rush to live with him or be engaged. But because I need to be able to believe everything he tells me.

 

I don't think he was lying to me trying to keep me around (because I've never expressed interested in getting engaged and I admit I"m somewhat phobic about marriage (although I DO want to get married someday)

 

I too agree you should "try out" someone before you marry them. Therefore I WOULD live with him before marriage and if we got engaged I'd probably move in with him soon after and its not like we'd have to start planning a wedding. I could wait a couple of years. I will NOT move in with him before he gets me a ring though because I've seen too many people just move in together and cohabitate and never move forward. I moved in with a bf before after only dating a little less than a year and I thought we'd get engaged soon (we were madly in love at the time ha ha) and this bf had talked about gettting married etc and assured me that he had plans to get engaged within the next few months. Well we lived together for almost two years and it NEVER happened. HE always had one excuse or another. I left him for that very reason. So while I know that getting engaged doesnt' mean we are going to be togehter forever or even that we'll make it to marriage. But it shows that we are both on that path and I won't accept any less (to live with him).

 

IF he'd never said anything about a ring I would be perfectly happy with the way things are right now and probably wouldn't even have thought anything about it until next year or so. But because he put that idea in my head then now I EXPECT more of him. I guess I'm afraid to bring up the fact that he said something about using his tax refund (part of it) to buy a ring because when he left me for his ex, they only dated maybe three weeks before he broke up with her but during that time, think it was the 2nd week she told him they should get married right away. He laughed it off and says she was crazy but I"m afraid he'll see me as this pushy obnoxious woman who desperately wants to get married, and I'm not at all. I mean I would like to in the future but if he asked me to get married before the end of the year I'd say no way. So I don't want to seem like i'm pushing the issue. I"m happy with the way things are right now. I would be happy getting engaged, yes, but only because he brought it up and I thought it was going to happen. If that makes sense.

[lexi29]

One last thing- I found this quote under a thread titled "Patiently waiting still" It is a quote by AmyMarieca.

 

" I always felt like I was trying to convince him to love me and want to marry me. I don't think it should be that way. Men should be begging us to marry them! "

 

This perfectly sums up my thoughts on why I do not want to live with my bf before getting engaged. He wants to "try out" our living together situation and while I agree that there is a lot you can find out by living together I don't think its too much to ask that he buy a ring and commit more fully before I uproot my life and move in with him. If I moved in with him before getting engaged I would feel exactly as the above quote. That I would be trying to auditioning for the part of his wife and trying to convince him to love me and want to marry me. As if I should have to convince him that I'm worthy!! I know he probably didn't mean it this way and that he is just being cautious but either he loves me enough and wants that commitment or he doesnt'. I'm not going to change and cater to his every need so that he thinks I"m "good enough" for a ring. Ahh! i DON'T even know why I'm getting worked up by this. HE is the one who said several times that HE planned to ask me. It wasn't even MY idea so why am I so upset that he probably is not going to follow through?

[dropdeadlegs]

He wants to "try out" our living together situation and while I agree that there is a lot you can find out by living together I don't think its too much to ask that he buy a ring and commit more fully before I uproot my life and move in with him.

I agree and think you should stick to your guns on the matter.

 

Ahh! i DON'T even know why I'm getting worked up by this. HE is the one who said several times that HE planned to ask me. It wasn't even MY idea so why am I so upset that he probably is not going to follow through?

Because even though you weren't leaning towards getting engaged yet, you're questioning the likelihood of him ever doing so if he doesn't follow through? Especially after bringing it up himself? Now it's become the pink elephant in the room that's right in front of you but not spoken of.

 

I went through something similar. My BF's father died about two years into our R. We lived apart and were very happy together and hadn't discussed anything like going to another level. I stayed with him at his home for almost two months trying to help him through mourning because his dad lived next door and it was a big change for him, despite their differences, and seeing that house every day made dad's passing very real all the time. It was a big inconvenience staying with him. I went back and forth trying to keep my "home" life in order (getting my mail, keeping my grass cut, constantly needing "stuff" of mine) and I have two kids to boot! Well, we began discussing living together at that time. Ah, the seed was planted.

 

His place was too small to accommodate all of us, as was mine. He inherited several thousand bucks, was by no means becoming wealthy, but it was enough for a downpayment on something bigger. He owns his land and it was always understood that we would live here. Well, after I went home (school started) I expected things to start moving in the direction we spoke of. Everything took much longer than I had envisioned, and I began to wonder if he was stalling, or had changed his mind altogether. He still spoke of it occasionally, but I wasn't seeing "action" on his part. I became insecure, but I didn't ask because I was afraid to hear the answer. Mind you, I was perfectly content with the status quo and had no expectations before any of this happened! To keep from ultimately being hurt, I started back peddling, giving him "outs" and in all reality I was then the one sending mixed signals. I started really panicking, wondering what to do when the time to renew my lease approached (months in advance, mind you.) I chose to wait and see (and hope.) During this time I found myself withdrawing a bit. I was kind of "aloof" and that was making me miserable, too. This wasn't a deal breaker, and I knew it, but I was all worked up just the same.

 

Honestly I think my reactions slowed things down even further, when just talking about it would have eased my insecurities. Everything did come to fruition, just not on my time frame nor like I had mentally "scripted" it. The whole process took over 17 months, even though I was certain of the outcome at 11 months. I could have avoided about 9 months of insecurity, though! I'm guilty of expecting a certain amount of "mind reading" at times because I'm afraid of confrontation. Confrontation isn't always a bad thing, but it seems like it has such negative vibes to me.

 

Maybe none of this is relevant to your situation, but nipping uncertainty in the bud would have been better for me. Just wanted you to know that you're not alone in your feelings.

[Star Gazer]

When I told him that maybe we should just end things now because we have different views on the subject and prolonging our relationship (if we are never going to see eye to eye on this) isn't doing his son any favors. As his son tells us at least once a week he wants us to get married. (he's 8). My bf said that he could always change his mind that this is just the way he always thought.

 

So what was the end result, Lexi? Did he agree to think about it some more? Propose?

[lexi29]

So what was the end result, Lexi? Did he agree to think about it some more? Propose?

 

 

We didn't really say anymore about the topic after that. It was just me expressing my feelings that if I won't live with him before he proposes (and he said he was going to do this very soon)and he wants me to move in with him BEFORE he buys a ring to see if it works out before he spends the money etc. And I won't do that then we have different ideas on how we want to proceed and because his son is involved and very attached to me and the idea that I might be his step mom someday then we shouldn't drag this out if we are never going to see eye to eye. I WILL NOT change my mind about the moving in to see if it works out before we get engaged so the ball is in his court that HE has to be the one to change his mind/ideas or it isn't worth continuing the relationship. He got kind of upset by me suggesting we end things and back peddled saying that living together BEFORE getting engaged wasn't the way he HAD to have it its just what he preferred and thought was best. But that he could probably do it my way.

 

He didn't specify that he was going to propose, just that he understands that I don't want to live with him before this happens. So probably now he will quit bugging me about moving in with him. The thing is, I was perfectly happy just being his girlfriend and spending the night with him on weekends and seeing him 6 days a week. And that is probably how things will stay right now. I know he's happy with our relationship and thats why he wants me to move in with him so quickly (We've been together almost 4 years but its only been a few months since our breakup so I say this is moving quickly as I"m just counting the time since we got back together)

I just wish he would have never brought up buying a ring because he got my hopes up and I expected him to follow through. If he'd never brought it up I wouldn't have wanted it but now I do.

 

and dropdeadlegs thanks for sharing your story. It does make sense and I see exactly where you are coming from! I really do need to sit down with my bf and have an open discussion about all of this. Hard to do sometimes with an 8 yr old around and in your face constantly though. lol.

[StartingOver07]

I guess I will be a lone voice here saying that I do not agree with a "try before you buy" approach to marriage. The divorce rate is actually higher for couples who live together before marriage.

 

What I do think is a really good idea is pre-marital counseling. Many chruches offer (or even require) this and it is an excellent way to discover some of the things youw ouldn't otherwise learn about your partner.

 

Especially in Lexi's case, where there is a child involved, I think it would be ill-advised to live together without being married, or, at the very least, engaged with the certainty that marriage will follow.

[norajane]

I guess I will be a lone voice here saying that I do not agree with a "try before you buy" approach to marriage. The divorce rate is actually higher for couples who live together before marriage.

 

What I do think is a really good idea is pre-marital counseling. Many chruches offer (or even require) this and it is an excellent way to discover some of the things youw ouldn't otherwise learn about your partner.

 

Especially in Lexi's case, where there is a child involved, I think it would be ill-advised to live together without being married, or, at the very least, engaged with the certainty that marriage will follow.

 

You're not the lone voice - I agree with you on all counts.

 

And I really believe it wouldn't be kind or fair to his son to bring a 'mommy' into the house when there's no plan to get married.

[BUENG1]

I guess I will be a lone voice here saying that I do not agree with a "try before you buy" approach to marriage. The divorce rate is actually higher for couples who live together before marriage.

 

What I do think is a really good idea is pre-marital counseling. Many chruches offer (or even require) this and it is an excellent way to discover some of the things youw ouldn't otherwise learn about your partner.

 

Especially in Lexi's case, where there is a child involved, I think it would be ill-advised to live together without being married, or, at the very least, engaged with the certainty that marriage will follow.

 

The divorce rate is lower for couples who don't live together before because most of the people who don't cohabitate before marriage are Christian and consequently will not divorce under almost any circumstances( because of religion).

[StartingOver07]

The divorce rate is lower for couples who don't live together before because most of the people who don't cohabitate before marriage are Christian and consequently will not divorce under almost any circumstances( because of religion).

 

Actually, no. Religion was not an issue.

 

The research concluded that couples who had to live together first were less committed to mariage/each other than couples who progressed from dating --->engagement--->marriage. The need to live together first was born out of uncertainty in many cases apparently.

 

It was also interesting that among marriages that ultimately ended in divorce, those of couples who lived together divorced earlier and were less likely to seek MC.

 

I have to LOL - I just Googled to find the original research article and stumbled instead on this article released from the New York Times this morning: http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9B0DE2DF1331F934A35751C1A961948260

 

Couples who lived together before marrying have nearly an 80 percent higher divorce rate than those who did not and they seem to have less regard for the institution, according to a study of Swedish women by the National Bureau of Economic Research here.

[lexi29]

You're not the lone voice - I agree with you on all counts.

 

And I really believe it wouldn't be kind or fair to his son to bring a 'mommy' into the house when there's no plan to get married.

 

 

And I totally agree with this! I do not want to live with him without being engaged and I told him that if we do not see eye to eye on this (we do NOT have to live together right now but he wants me to move in and keeps talking about it) that their has to be more of a commitment and plans for the future because if not it is just going to confuse his son. And I do not want to hurt his son. The poor kid has been through enough. My bf has lived with a lot of his exes but has not lived with anyone since his son started living with him full time. Since his son so desperately wants us to be married (so he feels he has an intact family in one household) I would never consider moving in and "playing house".

 

I've read the studies about living together before marriage and they basically can be interpreted anyway you want them to. Two of my female friends each got married in 2002. One lived with her husband for about a year before they married. They were together five years before marriage. The other did not live with her husband before marriage. They got married about a year and half into dating. Couple #1 (lived together before marriage) is still together and happy. Couple #2 (did not live together) is still together but very unhappy. She found out many things about her husband she did not know before moving in with him. She says that she would be happier if she lived next door to him or something. They have a child together who is 3 yrs old and my friend is very religious and does not believe in divorce. To this day they still fight over household chores, watching the child and her husband's constant playing of video games. I think if she was not so religious she would divorce him (I should point out they had sex before marriage so she's not THAT religious) I'm not sure if she would have lived with him before they got married if it would have made a difference or not. I know that they fought immeditately upon moving in together and she was miserable the first year of being married to him. But all that is off topic so I'll stop here.

 

Thanks for the opinions and advice!

[lexi29]

Well he followed thru and he proposed to me last Thursday! I was totally in shock because I didn't expect it at all!! As a matter of fact, I almost came here last week to post an update that I knew he WASN"T going to propose because he was spending his tax refund money on a lot of other stuff he needed and he hadn't brought up the engagement thing since I last posted here about it. I was definately suprised!!