lindya Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Why would a man want to be just friends with a woman? I know your question isn't the same as asking "what would a man want from a woman other than sex?" On the other hand, it doesn't seem a million miles away from it." If you want an answer, you're probably best asking a man who is significantly more successful with women than the average man. Those guys generally have a few female friends towards whom they feel brotherly rather than sexual. It could be that having that sort of friendship with/liking women contributes towards the insight (into the female psyche) and edge that makes them successful with the opposite sex. Those are the often the guys who have other men hanging off their every word of "how to get women" advice. And who do you suppose they get a lot of that advice from? Link to post Share on other sites
Enema Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Are you saying that the reason a man would want to be friends with a woman is because she can help him get a woman? Link to post Share on other sites
oppath Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Just because I'm attracted and wouldn't mind sleeping with them doesn't mean I'm trying to, or hitting on them. Nor does it mean I would stop hanging out with them if they got a bf. Florida, like Phateless said, just because I have mild interest doesn't mean I am going to be overly flirtatious and act on it. Oppath how exactly will you handle this when you meet a girl who becomes your serious GF? When I meet a girl who becomes my serious gf, I hang out with my female friends less. When I commit, I let all my friends know "I have a new girlfriend." I want to introduce my new girlfriend to all of my friends and say "look at what I got." So those female friends...if we are not very close, I drop them. If we are close, they meet my new girlfriend. It's that simple. If I am hanging out with female friends and my gf calls, I always pick up and I'll tell her "I should be done in two hours and I'll call you then" and I always do. If I commit to someone, I'm in it 100%. All my friendships are transparent -- meaning every 2/3 times I hang out with my friends, my gf will be there -- and I won't hang out with a woman 1-on-1 unless my gf has gotten to meet her too and befriend her. I treat women as I want to be treated. And when I'm in a new relationship, I don't befriend new women unless there is some context like work, my softball team, etc, and in those cases, I'll only invite them out in GROUP situations. No one-on-one interactions. I was burned in my last relationship because I was a doormat and allowed my ex to get away with things with other guys as friends. I have new boundaries. No hanging out with an ex unless I can be there too. I should hang out with you 1-in-3 times you hang out with your friends and be given the chance to befriend them too. If you want to hang out with a guy you've never mentioned throughout our relationship, can I meet him? In healthy relationship, those things tend to happen and I've ignored them in the past. All I can say is that I treat people how I'd like to be treated. I've dated women and not treated them that way, but only because we had not committed. When I commit, I don't flirt, many of those friends fade away, and the ones I am friends with meet my girlfriend. I'm also pretty big on PDA so my girl gets lot's of attention from me in front of my friends. I basically exclaim "look at this awesome woman I have" not in the sense of eye candy, but in who she is as a person. When I commit, I'm really excited and I tell everyone "I am dating this awesome girl." And like Phateless said, just because I have an attraction and would sleep with some of them does not mean I am actively hitting on them or trying to get them into bed, even if we are both single. It doesn't mean I am hanging out with them with an ulterior motive unless I just met them; then it is because I am interested. But I am capable of keeping my lustful desires and flirtation in check because I value women's company, their opinion, and them as people too. Link to post Share on other sites
lindya Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 (edited) Are you saying that the reason a man would want to be friends with a woman is because she can help him get a woman? I think it's probably not as straightforward as that. I've had friendships with men who might have some vague sexual interest in me in the way that they have a sexual interest in most women...but nothing that created a strong enough chemistry for us to get it together. So the friendship is about other things. Maybe having common interests, humour or even just working together and having a bond against the common enemy (eg the boss). A lot of people have those friendships when they're younger, don't they? I tend to find that the more dealings and conversations a man has with women in general, the more realistic and insightful he's liable to be in "getting" women and knowing how to make them feel like women without being corny or overly obvious about it. When men view women in very narrow sexual terms, they're sometimes a bit awkward around them. The guy who's used to having female friends as well as lovers is usually better equipped to both be at ease and put women at their ease. Edited February 2, 2008 by lindya Link to post Share on other sites
LoveLace Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Chirs Rock's theory on "platonic friendships". A platonic friend to a man is a woman "he hasn't f*cked YET". A platonic friend to a woman is a d*ck in a glass case - break open in case of emergency! Link to post Share on other sites
Florida Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 And when I'm in a new relationship, I don't befriend new women unless there is some context like work, my softball team, etc, and in those cases, I'll only invite them out in GROUP situations. No one-on-one interactions. That's all good ground rules. Unfortunately some women friends don't take too well to being downgraded once the new GF appears, and they insist on keeping up old jokes, bringing up old times the new GF can't be in on, and all those lovely little catty things that only another female picks up on. All served with a smile! No hanging out with an ex unless I can be there too. I should hang out with you 1-in-3 times you hang out with your friends and be given the chance to befriend them too. If you want to hang out with a guy you've never mentioned throughout our relationship, can I meet him? In healthy relationship, those things tend to happen and I've ignored them in the past. Those are good too, althoug hanging out with an ex seems really unnecessary. When I commit, I don't flirt, many of those friends fade away, and the ones I am friends with meet my girlfriend. I'm also pretty big on PDA so my girl gets lot's of attention from me in front of my friends. I basically exclaim "look at this awesome woman I have" not in the sense of eye candy, but in who she is as a person. When I commit, I'm really excited and I tell everyone "I am dating this awesome girl." That's great, the PDA thing is key too. And like Phateless said, just because I have an attraction and would sleep with some of them does not mean I am actively hitting on them or trying to get them into bed, even if we are both single. It doesn't mean I am hanging out with them with an ulterior motive unless I just met them; then it is because I am interested. But I am capable of keeping my lustful desires and flirtation in check because I value women's company, their opinion, and them as people too. See this is my dilemma reading this. I only have an urge to know a guy as a friend if there is a spark there, but something is off enough that I wouldn't actually want him as a BF. So knowing that, it makes me suspicious of the whole male-female friendship in general, especially in the context of not being single. In other words, I always found my male friends cute, and almost dateable but not quite. So I don't have them now. Seems not so conducive to a healthy relationship, but that's just me! Link to post Share on other sites
blackbird Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 I won't hang out with a woman 1-on-1 unless my gf has gotten to meet her too and befriend her. Oppath, I'm curious how this works if you are trying to get to know a girl as a friend, does your gf still need to meet her first? Reason I ask: My fiance has very few friends currently, so he's been wanting to TRY to make new friends, which I think is a good idea. However, he feels like if there's anyone he wants to get to know as a friend, he can only do so without me there initially, because it's harder to get to know someone as a couple. I can understand that; it's definitely harder to build up the same level of rapport in a 3-person dynamic, where one person can often feel like a third wheel. And then when he's comfortable with the friendship, goes the idea, I would be introduced. (Though he'd make my existence clear from the beginning.) Which means if he were to try to make friends with a woman, he would not want me there, at least initially, while he 'got to know' her. I trust him very much and I understand his reasoning in a general sense, but I still think that's weird. What kind of signals does it send to a girl when a guy in a relationship wants to hang out with her alone? What depth of friendship would you be pursuing with a woman, as a man (assuming both are heterosexual), if you're in a serious relationship anyway, that you'd need to spend alone time 'getting to know her' better? Or am I being overly paranoid? Question for you guys who have been posting that you do have female friends while in relationships... how deep are the friendships, and how do they affect your relationships? What sort of boundaries do you draw? Hopefully this is still on topic... Link to post Share on other sites
Florida Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Blackbird I don't think a guy in a relationship should be making any *new* female friends. And he most certainly shouldn't be hanging out with them alone, it just sends out the signal "I'm interested in you, don't mind my GF." definition of friend: someone you seek out to talk with by phone or email or hanging out together. An established pattern of contact becomes the norm. acquaintance: someone you talk to when you happen to bump into them. But let Oppath and other male posters chime in, curious about their opinions. Link to post Share on other sites
blackbird Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Blackbird I don't think a guy in a relationship should be making any *new* female friends. And he most certainly shouldn't be hanging out with them alone, it just sends out the signal "I'm interested in you, don't mind my GF." I think that's generally right, but I don't know how black and white it is. For example we don't think either of us should be making new friends of the opposite sex who are single. But what if it's someone who is in a serious relationship him- or herself? Does that make a difference? I agree with you on the hanging out alone thing. I doubt he would be comfortable with me insisting on hanging out with a guy alone so that I can "get to know him" better, and I have no desire to. (For the record, he has never said that was definitely something he wanted to do... in fact, last time we discussed it, he said he didn't know if that was the best way to do things and that perhaps it's just not worth it at all.) Link to post Share on other sites
Florida Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 (edited) For example we don't think either of us should be making new friends of the opposite sex who are single. But what if it's someone who is in a serious relationship him- or herself? Does that make a difference? It's no guarantee, but another couple in a relationship is the lesser of 2 evils here. My BF had a friend who once he got a Gf we all hung out together. Well the new precious GF decided it was a good idea to be flirty with my BF while we were all out together, and started to invite him (my BF) out without her BF (his friend) around. He would ALWAYS bring me, but that wasn't okay, she started getting out of line and he ended that friendship. I never got the sense she gave a damn about me, she just pretended to. You have to be aware of that element too. Side note: I think she may have done it to get her guy to commit to her, they are getting married this year. I agree with you on the hanging out alone thing. I doubt he would be comfortable with me insisting on hanging out with a guy alone so that I can "get to know him" better, and I have no desire to. (For the record, he has never said that was definitely something he wanted to do... in fact, last time we discussed it, he said he didn't know if that was the best way to do things and that perhaps it's just not worth it at all.) Another couple my BF met at work and us get on really well. He never hung out with the girl alone. They work on similar projects, and we all had similar interests, and she is really nice. I met her at one of his company get togethers. So her and her BF, me and my BF all make plans and see eachother. I like her, she likes me, it's all good. There was no need to hang out with her alone first though. That would have been strange! Edited February 2, 2008 by Florida Link to post Share on other sites
oppath Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 That's all good ground rules. Unfortunately some women friends don't take too well to being downgraded once the new GF appears My friends understand and they want to see me happily taken. The ones who are more acquaintances, well, tough luck. My female friends get that I won't disappear, but I will be less available in a new relationship. althoug hanging out with an ex seems really unnecessary. I won't hang out with an ex when in a relationship. But girls I've dated have been "friends" with ex's. I got burned on it. If a girl is friends with a guy they've had sex with, I think it's reasonable, if we are committed, for her to not hang out with him 1-on-1 unless I've met him a bunch of times and are comfortable with their friendship. Some people do pull off friendships with ex's but I think it's best for those ex's to be friends in group situations, because it happens all the time that ex's cause problems and it's not irrational to be concerned as the new bf/gf. See this is my dilemma reading this. I only have an urge to know a guy as a friend if there is a spark there, but something is off enough that I wouldn't actually want him as a BF. So knowing that, it makes me suspicious of the whole male-female friendship in general, especially in the context of not being single. In other words, I always found my male friends cute, and almost dateable but not quite. So I don't have them now. What this means is you find something about those men attractive. You know what: I find things attractive, just not sexually or romantically attractive, in my guy friends and I assume you do for your female friends. There are qualities in my friends that attract me to them. That doesn't mean I will act on it when my female friend is drunk. I have many female friends. I don't fantasize about them all, even the ones I am attracted to. But yes, there is usually something there, some spark. That does not mean we can't enjoy each others friendships. Link to post Share on other sites
Nemo Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 I guess if you were a gay guy, or a dude with a ridiculously low sex-drive, then he might be able to be friends with a woman. But, even then, unless the dude is a eunuch, he will always want to get into his female friend's panties. Having female friends is just a guy's way of maximising his chances to get laid. Pure and simple. Link to post Share on other sites
blackbird Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 I guess if you were a gay guy, or a dude with a ridiculously low sex-drive, then he might be able to be friends with a woman. But, even then, unless the dude is a eunuch, he will always want to get into his female friend's panties. Having female friends is just a guy's way of maximising his chances to get laid. Pure and simple. So is it disrespectful for those in committed relationships to ever seek/maintain friendships with those of the opposite gender (or whatever gender they happen to be sexually attracted to), especially if there is any sexual attraction from either direction? Is it ever worth the complications? My answer to the above, at the moment, would be that it's possible as long as you are very honest to yourself and your SO about the reason that you are seeking/maintaining that friendship. I.e. are you really interested in that friend for who they are, beyond the sexual attraction. And just as important, what is that person's motivation for wanting to be friends with you, and how respectful are they of your relationship. Would you still be as interested in being friends with them if there was no sexual attraction at all, and vice versa? I cut off a number of guy "friends" after beginning my current relationship after we'd talked about things like this, because I was able to recognize that the main reason they were keeping in touch with me was because they wanted to sleep with me at some point. I did like them personally beyond the sexual attraction, but their behavior (making flirtatious comments despite knowing I was in a relationship, only talking to me when they were single, etc) was inappropriate and not worth the hassle. The only male friends I keep contact with now are co-workers, friends in committed relationships, and gay friends. However, I'd like to think I'd be able to have a genuine friendship with a guys outside those categories though; I'd hate to think I need to cut off the potential of worthwhile connections with a large percentage of the human race because I'm in a relationship. I just try to recognize that it's complicated. Link to post Share on other sites
Nemo Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Males keep female friends around to boost their ego, and to enhance their sexual "credibility." Of course, they will never admit to it, but it is patently true. Link to post Share on other sites
Lovelybird Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 (edited) Males keep female friends around to boost their ego, and to enhance their sexual "credibility." Of course, they will never admit to it, but it is patently true. Better find another source to boost their confidence, not ego, otherwise it will backfire, women's jealousy is like fire, and a hurt female ego wants to do so much damage, and do anything to lift self ego and beat down others Edited February 2, 2008 by Lovelybird Link to post Share on other sites
Nemo Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Better find another source to boost their confidence, not ego, otherwise it will backfire, women's jealousy is like fire, and a hurt female ego wants to do so much damage I agree! Anyway, it serves the guys right for stringing their women friends along. Guys offer emotional support in the hope that their women friends will be wanting a penis to comfort them. Link to post Share on other sites
lovelorcet Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Males keep female friends around to boost their ego, and to enhance their sexual "credibility." Of course, they will never admit to it, but it is patently true. I will agree with the credibility thing. I have lots of female friends that I get along with really well and am pretty close with. They are not there to boost my ego but they do give me a lot of female credibility. Think of it like this... I go out with a few of them one night and they also bring some other female friends. One of the new ones asks "who is that guy?" and hey answer "that's X he is a really great guy..." I think that helps a lot in meeting new people. This is not my intention by any means but it is nice Link to post Share on other sites
lovelorcet Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 Better find another source to boost their confidence, not ego, otherwise it will backfire, women's jealousy is like fire, and a hurt female ego wants to do so much damage, and do anything to lift self ego and beat down others I would not be interested in an insecure jealous woman who is not capable of handling normal social interactions. Link to post Share on other sites
Lovelybird Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 I agree! Anyway, it serves the guys right for stringing their women friends along. Guys offer emotional support in the hope that their women friends will be wanting a penis to comfort them. Beside the 'ego boost part', there are pure friendship between men and women, it is possible, depends on how less egoistic they are Link to post Share on other sites
Lovelybird Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 (edited) I would not be interested in an insecure jealous woman who is not capable of handling normal social interactions. you are totally right! I speak of the case that his female friends cat fight with each other Edited February 2, 2008 by Lovelybird Link to post Share on other sites
Nemo Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 you are totally right! I speak of the case that his female friends cat fight with each other That's a very common male fantasy. Link to post Share on other sites
Lovelybird Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 (edited) That's a very common male fantasy. maybe it is finding trouble for yourself Edited February 2, 2008 by Lovelybird Link to post Share on other sites
Nemo Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 maybe it is finding trouble for yourself I think your dog could help any man increase his scoring potential. It would instantly triple his cute factor. Link to post Share on other sites
Lovelybird Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 I think your dog could help any man increase his scoring potential. It would instantly triple his cute factor. I won't expect that! Link to post Share on other sites
Stockalone Posted February 2, 2008 Share Posted February 2, 2008 I know your question isn't the same as asking "what would a man want from a woman other than sex?" On the other hand, it doesn't seem a million miles away from it." If the man finds the woman very attractive the question would be "why should he try to become her friend and run the risk of getting friend-zoned instead of letting her know that he is interested in more than becoming just another friend?". If you want an answer, you're probably best asking a man who is significantly more successful with women than the average man. Those guys generally have a few female friends towards whom they feel brotherly rather than sexual. It could be that having that sort of friendship with/liking women contributes towards the insight (into the female psyche) and edge that makes them successful with the opposite sex. This could very well be an answer to the questions I ask myself like "What could I possibly have in common with a woman and what can a friendship with a woman provide, that I am not already getting from the guys?". When men view women in very narrow sexual terms, they're sometimes a bit awkward around them. The guy who's used to having female friends as well as lovers is usually better equipped to both be at ease and put women at their ease. I have never had a female friend in my life. Even though I understand more insight to the female psyche would be a bonus, this would be a lousy excuse for being friends if it was the only reason for the friendship. Link to post Share on other sites
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