Touche Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Ok, gotcha OWoman. Yep, I'm back Ariadne. Yes, I'll post pics soon. It was incredible. But I don't want to hijack. I've posted a bit about my trip. Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Illegal = Sick Bird I've been called that, too... :p:p Link to post Share on other sites
Author LakesideDream Posted December 4, 2008 Author Share Posted December 4, 2008 Would it hurt you to look for a single lady? Don't you find it creepy that you secretly moved to this womans town with the intent of stealing her from her H. On top of that you are doing all of this without her knowledge. Its like something from a suspense film. Come on even if you do get her do you want her? You have been cheated on and now you are trying to get a woman who is willing to cheat on her long term H. IKJH, just for grins and giggles I'll answer your questions. Yes it would hurt me to "Look" for a single lady. I have been in love with this woman for 40 years, and if I believe her, she's loved me the same length of time. If I meet a "single lady" who drives the desire for her out of my soul, so be it. I ain't goin looking. I don't find moving "creepy" at all. From my recent conversations with her she doesen't find it "creepy" either. I see it as a natural evolution. Something I needed to do to make that final effort to have what I want and need, something I couldn't do from 600+ miles away. She didn't know when I would do it, but she was pretty sure that "someday" I'd show up. I waited way to long before making the move. I regret that now. BTW I didn't do anything in "Secret". I did the opposite, taking a high profile in the new community. Additionally, I cannot "steal" her away from her H. Never believed I could. My intent was/is to offer an alternative to the life she has now. The choice is hers alone. Cheating... wanting a cheater... that's pretty funny. We are both well into our 50's. We have known each other for over 40 years. We were passionate lovers when we were teens, and again 33 years later. Yes, she "cheated" on her husband with me. Woop-de-do. That was after 25 years of marriage. Her reason for doing it was because she was in love. My reason was the same. Those were the only times she or I ever cheated. I was recently divorced. Were we to ever be together as a couple I wouldn't give a single thought to her "cheating" on me. I have trusted her heart most of my life. Trusting it these years we have left (if only!) isn't even worth thinking about. Last I'm not trying to get her to cheat on her long term husband. That's not a goal of mine. Her husband is irrelevant to me. I am offering myself to her as a devoted partner, lover, friend for the rest of our lives. My desire is that we can share happiness the rest of our lives, by whatever course that happiness takes. Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Her husband is irrelevant to me. That's an interesting feeling for those of us who normally consider all to be relevant. I worked on that in MC. I believe it is the closest I've ever come to compartmentalization, a common male trait. I found the work fascinating. I can say I've found, personally, becoming a relationship supporter to be more satisfying and healthy for me. And, no, I'm not conducting a reverse psychology experiment Rather, being loving and supportive and yet firmly enforcing my boundaries on all fronts. What I'm hearing from you is you're offering one path, a path shown by your example of living, and trusting her to make a choice for herself which is healthy for her, without pressure or proactive influence. Question: Would you entertain, at this close proximity, the reality of a PA if she so offered? How would you feel about this? I suspect this is not something which would occur, but, hypothetically, how would this affect your dynamic? Link to post Share on other sites
Author LakesideDream Posted December 4, 2008 Author Share Posted December 4, 2008 That's an interesting feeling for those of us who normally consider all to be relevant. I worked on that in MC. I believe it is the closest I've ever come to compartmentalization, a common male trait. I found the work fascinating. I can say I've found, personally, becoming a relationship supporter to be more satisfying and healthy for me. And, no, I'm not conducting a reverse psychology experiment Rather, being loving and supportive and yet firmly enforcing my boundaries on all fronts. What I'm hearing from you is you're offering one path, a path shown by your example of living, and trusting her to make a choice for herself which is healthy for her, without pressure or proactive influence. Question: Would you entertain, at this close proximity, the reality of a PA if she so offered? How would you feel about this? I suspect this is not something which would occur, but, hypothetically, how would this affect your dynamic? Carhill, how nice of you to ask . Would I entertain the reality of a PA if offered. That's a hoot. There is absolutely no way I could resist. How would it affect my "dynamic". There is no way to be positive but I surmise the effect would be positive. Look to what I wrote in the reply above your post. It says: My desire is that we can share happiness the rest of our lives, by whatever course that happiness takes. This is not about a sex based relationship for me, or for her. Make no mistake, sex is important, it's not the most important thing. I'd rather hold hands and stroll by the lake with her, than make love to the most attractive woman in the world. Intimacy comes in many forms. Sex is only one form. Taking a drive to the "next town" over, having dinner, sharing conversation.. pulling her chair for her to be seated, touching her arm, deciding what to order, talking over food, then driving home together after dinner.. would be a physical affair. Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted December 4, 2008 Share Posted December 4, 2008 Great example of how intent and perception define the reality. Thanks for that I've experimented with this and have found the reality does indeed reside within my intent, rather than the visible actions/words. The sticky wicket is in the perception. One cannot control the perceptions of others. Influence to some small degree, but control of how the message is received is impossible IMO. I really can empathize here but am trying to view things from a neutral standpoint. Your story has been very instructive Link to post Share on other sites
signedin2008 Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 What did you do on Thanksgiving when she was spending it with her husband and THEIR family? Link to post Share on other sites
Author LakesideDream Posted December 5, 2008 Author Share Posted December 5, 2008 What did you do on Thanksgiving when she was spending it with her husband and THEIR family? Acually, I spent four days in California with a good friend and her family. Saw a lot of sights, visited the place I grew up, different place were I spent my teenage years (with my gal!) then on to where I lived when my children were young. Ate at a couple of world class restruants (one four, one 5 star) for a lark, Turkey dinner with a nice family. Went shopping in a real mall and bought some things not available locally that I need to live my life comfortably. She on the other hand worked all day Thanksgiving, ate take out turkey with her hubbie.. (I suppose) went to bed at nine (so she said) then went to work the next day. One of her chillins is across the country starting a new family, the other in an adjoining state being typical mid twenties jerk (male). Anything else I need to report sir, or will the above suffice? Link to post Share on other sites
signedin2008 Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 Anything else I need to report sir, or will the above suffice? Yes. One of her chillins is across the country starting a new family, the other in an adjoining state being typical mid twenties jerk (male). What do you mean being a typical mid twenties jerk? I hope you know that my question didn't mean to put you down or anything in that nature. I was just trying to put things into perspective and into reality, which was she spend Thanksgiving and that night with her husband. Link to post Share on other sites
Author LakesideDream Posted December 5, 2008 Author Share Posted December 5, 2008 Yes. What do you mean being a typical mid twenties jerk? I hope you know that my question didn't mean to put you down or anything in that nature. I was just trying to put things into perspective and into reality, which was she spend Thanksgiving and that night with her husband. signedin2008, you don't bother me at all. You know that this thread has been running nearly a year right? I've pretty much heard it all from A-Z. I have all the "perspective" I can assimilate. I'm "perspectivized" till the cows come home. Truth is, to your chagrin I would guess... she didn't have any holiday celebration, and neither did I. He life is hers, and while I don't pry, I do know that it is not a happy homelife, at best it is boring sameness combined with large doses of sameness bordering on depression. Mid 20's Jerk? I have two chillins, one daughter who is wildley successful in her field, and a son a year younger who has never found his way. To put it mildly he's a bum, with the help of illegal chemicals. Sadly she is in exactly the same situation, successful girl, wayward son. It's a thing we share. Link to post Share on other sites
Author LakesideDream Posted December 5, 2008 Author Share Posted December 5, 2008 Great example of how intent and perception define the reality. Thanks for that I've experimented with this and have found the reality does indeed reside within my intent, rather than the visible actions/words. The sticky wicket is in the perception. One cannot control the perceptions of others. Influence to some small degree, but control of how the message is received is impossible IMO. I really can empathize here but am trying to view things from a neutral standpoint. Your story has been very instructive Reality resides within intent. That's an interesting concept. I'm going to have to spend some thought on that one. I do agree that reality is often not found in words. We all are guilty of saying things that are not rooted in the real world. Wants and needs past those of basic survival are often rooted in our emotions. Perception is another thing altogether. I can say with some certainty that as I grow older I care less about the perception others have. Peer pressure for me is almost non existant. If I observe something that I admire, I may emulate and integrate it into my life by choice. In relationships I largely do what pleases me, and my partner, not what peers decide is "normal" or laudable. Life at my age has truely become to short to "compete with the Jones's". Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 I was just trying to put things into perspective and into reality, which was she spend Thanksgiving and that night with her husband. And, to counter your "perspective and reality", I can report that I'll be spending Christmas, Boxing Day and New Year (I'm not American, so thanksgiving doesn't exist for us) with MM, and his xW (as she'll be by then) won't. So guess what, naysayer - things don't always work out the way YOU'D like, either. Fact is, LsD had a great time (albeit with someone else) over Thanksgiving (and I'm willing to bet his companion had a ball too!); the Lady of the Lake had a pretty miserable time with her H. I'm not sure that that proves anything at all beyond that the Lady of the Lake drew the short straw this year, and perhaps she'll come to her senses before next Thanksgiving? Link to post Share on other sites
pelicanpreacher Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 And, to counter your "perspective and reality", I can report that I'll be spending Christmas, Boxing Day and New Year (I'm not American, so thanksgiving doesn't exist for us) with MM, and his xW (as she'll be by then) won't. So guess what, naysayer - things don't always work out the way YOU'D like, either. Fact is, LsD had a great time (albeit with someone else) over Thanksgiving (and I'm willing to bet his companion had a ball too!); the Lady of the Lake had a pretty miserable time with her H. I'm not sure that that proves anything at all beyond that the Lady of the Lake drew the short straw this year, and perhaps she'll come to her senses before next Thanksgiving? Your churlishness over MW's unseen deeper connection with her BS cracks me up! Do keep posting for I'll need a laugh or two in these coming trying times! Link to post Share on other sites
Author LakesideDream Posted December 5, 2008 Author Share Posted December 5, 2008 And, to counter your "perspective and reality", I can report that I'll be spending Christmas, Boxing Day and New Year (I'm not American, so thanksgiving doesn't exist for us) with MM, and his xW (as she'll be by then) won't. So guess what, naysayer - things don't always work out the way YOU'D like, either. Fact is, LsD had a great time (albeit with someone else) over Thanksgiving (and I'm willing to bet his companion had a ball too!); the Lady of the Lake had a pretty miserable time with her H. I'm not sure that that proves anything at all beyond that the Lady of the Lake drew the short straw this year, and perhaps she'll come to her senses before next Thanksgiving? I did have a great time, firmed up a friendship with a great gal, and got away from the drudge of work, and the drama that lays like whispy low lying fog where I live. I can't think of a better weekend spent in the last 4-5 years. Wouldn't have missed it for a bag of chips. Next year? I would think that things should have become settled by then. In actuality, once friendly communication was opened (Oct. 15) thing have progresssed in a satisfying manner. I never believed or even hoped that this would be an instant transformation. I've typed for almost a year now that I thought this would be a "process". That being said, I'd be very pleased to spend next Thanksgiving in San Francisco... I know some great places to eat, and be entertained there. I'm itching to revisit them. Squiring my Lake Lady around the City by the Bay would be marvelous. Patience is a virtue, it's the waiting that's difficult ! Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 I did have a great time, firmed up a friendship with a great gal, and got away from the drudge of work, and the drama that lays like whispy low lying fog where I live. I can't think of a better weekend spent in the last 4-5 years. Wouldn't have missed it for a bag of chips. Next year? I would think that things should have become settled by then. In actuality, once friendly communication was opened (Oct. 15) thing have progresssed in a satisfying manner. I never believed or even hoped that this would be an instant transformation. I've typed for almost a year now that I thought this would be a "process". That being said, I'd be very pleased to spend next Thanksgiving in San Francisco... I know some great places to eat, and be entertained there. I'm itching to revisit them. Squiring my Lake Lady around the City by the Bay would be marvelous. Patience is a virtue, it's the waiting that's difficult ! Next Thanksgiving I want to make a point of being somewhere warm! White Christmases are all very well but I've been snowed in now once and I'm happy to put the btdt tick in the box and move on! The only white I'd like in next year's christmas is the beach sand, as the fish simmers gently on the bbq... Link to post Share on other sites
pelicanpreacher Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 As to Lakeside's situation, there lies the mature introspection that assures he and MW are walking forward with eyes riveted wide open! Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 As to Lakeside's situation, there lies the mature introspection that assures he and MW are walking forward with eyes riveted wide open! That's just too much coffee.... Link to post Share on other sites
bernaserra Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 I hope you find what you are looking for. Link to post Share on other sites
White Flower Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 Next Thanksgiving I want to make a point of being somewhere warm! White Christmases are all very well but I've been snowed in now once and I'm happy to put the btdt tick in the box and move on! The only white I'd like in next year's christmas is the beach sand, as the fish simmers gently on the bbq...OWoman, You are always welcome at my place. Bring the STB available man along with as well as the kids. Hey, we can crash Lakey's plans in San Francisco! Link to post Share on other sites
pelicanpreacher Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 Lake, I know you're long past your ex but don't you ever wonder if she's struggling financially in this crashing economy. If so, you'd probably do so with a wry smile since you seem to be doing so well I imagine. Also, as to your son and daughter, did they have any inkling of what your ex was up to before you did and do you think this may be the root of your son's aberrant behavior? Link to post Share on other sites
Author LakesideDream Posted December 6, 2008 Author Share Posted December 6, 2008 Lake, I know you're long past your ex but don't you ever wonder if she's struggling financially in this crashing economy. If so, you'd probably do so with a wry smile since you seem to be doing so well I imagine. CloisteredSeabird, She's doing fine with her OM/Hubbie. I chatted for a few minutes with her after the holiday, first phone conversation in 4 years or so. My daughter was visiting her and handed her the phone to say hi. "Long past" ain't the word for it. It's so far gone there are no hard feelings at all. I can't even muster the emotion to wish her ill. Link to post Share on other sites
Author LakesideDream Posted December 6, 2008 Author Share Posted December 6, 2008 Lake, I know you're long past your ex but don't you ever wonder if she's struggling financially in this crashing economy. If so, you'd probably do so with a wry smile since you seem to be doing so well I imagine. Also, as to your son and daughter, did they have any inkling of what your ex was up to before you did and do you think this may be the root of your son's aberrant behavior? Sorry I missed your second paragraph.. My daughter was completely caught by suprise. On the other hand my son had been keeping what he knew to himself for over a year. It was hard on him, maybe still is. I don't know if that's the "root" of his "aberrant behavior" though. I suspect it's more complex than that. I may be a factor. Link to post Share on other sites
Author LakesideDream Posted December 6, 2008 Author Share Posted December 6, 2008 OWoman, You are always welcome at my place. Bring the STB available man along with as well as the kids. Hey, we can crash Lakey's plans in San Francisco! It's always warm here. Two spare rooms at my place... twin beds in both so you might have to bring your own. I'm up for the City (that's what they call S.F. if you live there) if OWomans crowd ponies up! No goldbrickers allowed. WF's always welcome, and has a pass. We can have a Lakeside Bash! Link to post Share on other sites
pelicanpreacher Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 I sensed your dissappointment in him and figured you may have had a strained relationship maybe even prior to his knowledge of your ex's affair. Couple that with his newfound knowledge of his mother's betrayal of you he probably became so disenchanted with life that he threw on his hazards and gave up. Link to post Share on other sites
Author LakesideDream Posted December 6, 2008 Author Share Posted December 6, 2008 I sensed your dissappointment in him and figured you may have had a strained relationship maybe even prior to his knowledge of your ex's affair. Couple that with his newfound knowledge of his mother's betrayal of you he probably became so disenchanted with life that he threw on his hazards and gave up. Not at all. I was very close to both my children throughout their childhoods. His troubles began surfacing earlier than the troubles in the marriage did. He was always a handfull. I certainly hope he pulls out of it soon, he's nearing 30 years of age. Link to post Share on other sites
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