Fun2BMe Posted February 12, 2008 Share Posted February 12, 2008 I've been drinking lately but know I could stop whenever I want to. I just don't want to right now. How does someone deterine at what point someone is an alcoholic? Is it only if they have to have a drink the morning because that is not the case with me at all. Link to post Share on other sites
juliegeraci Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 I'm an alcoholic who was sober 16 months and relapsed 2 years ago. Sometimes I drink 2 drinks, other times 5-6 even more. I think the one tail sign is that you crave alcohol. Typically day 3 is the worse. Right now I have cut down to 2 a day so I'm hoping it will be okay. Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Alcoholism is all about your relationship with alcohol - why you use it, as much as how you use it. I'm a recovering alcoholic - I NEVER drank in the AM, nor did I drink every day. I would binge drink when I did drink, though. Ask yourself why you drink - do you do it to achieve a certain state of mind? To forget problem? Because of social anxiety? To relax at the end of the day? Do you feel dependent on it? If you can quit any time you want, why not try not drinking for a while? Link to post Share on other sites
JamesM Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 I've been drinking lately but know I could stop whenever I want to. I just don't want to right now. How does someone deterine at what point someone is an alcoholic? Is it only if they have to have a drink the morning because that is not the case with me at all. The comments you just made are common ones said by alcoholics and other addicts. "I could quit, but I don't want to quit." Not saying you are an alcoholic, but your reasoning is not adequate. Here is a link to read. Notice #11. http://www.healthyperspectives.net/denial.htm 11. Minimizing The substance abuser often minimizes his behavior and actions by talking about it in such a way that it seems insignificant. They discount the significance of their behavior. You will see minimizing when confronting substance abuser about irresponsible behavior. Example: “I only drank three beers and I could have drank allot more, but I didn’t.” Here is another link. http://www.bma-wellness.com/papers/Excuses_Alcoholics.html And notice one of the excuses listed.... * I can stop any time I want to! Unaware that his addiction and not he himself is calling the shots, the addict genuinely believes that he is choosing to behave the way he does and therefore he can stop doing so any time he makes up his mind. Unfortunately for him and for those who must deal with him, he seldom makes up his mind to stop(even though he most certainly could if he wanted to, &etc. &etc. &etc.) I think the questions are...why do you do it? and CAN you quit? If you don't WANT to quit, why not? Link to post Share on other sites
MakeLemonade Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 It seems to me the above links are worded as such that anyone who drinks w/ any regularity, could be made out to be an alcoholic regardless of what the actual case is. While I understand that they are things that alcoholics say, they are also things people who aren't alcoholics, but just enjoy drinking say if perhaps someone makes a comment to them about their drinking. Fun - an adequate way to see whether you are/aren't/other is don't do it, for a week, if you can do it without thinking much about it, you are probably ok, if by the second day you are heading to the liquor cabinet/aisle/store/nyquil, you may want to consider that you might have a problem. If you can't make it one day, call AA. Link to post Share on other sites
blind_otter Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 It seems to me the above links are worded as such that anyone who drinks w/ any regularity, could be made out to be an alcoholic regardless of what the actual case is. While I understand that they are things that alcoholics say, they are also things people who aren't alcoholics, but just enjoy drinking say if perhaps someone makes a comment to them about their drinking. Fun - an adequate way to see whether you are/aren't/other is don't do it, for a week, if you can do it without thinking much about it, you are probably ok, if by the second day you are heading to the liquor cabinet/aisle/store/nyquil, you may want to consider that you might have a problem. If you can't make it one day, call AA. I dunno, dude. There are all sorts of alcoholics, from personal experience and also the AA meetings I've attended. Some alcoholics can be alcohol free for years and still be considered alcoholics - "dry" alcoholics. It's not just about alcohol, it's how you deal with life, too. When I drank, I would drink to excess - but only once or twice a week, if that. I could go for weeks without drinking. But once things got stressful, I would always reach for the bottle. IMO HOW you use alcohol is more important that "how often" you use alcohol. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 While I understand that they are things that alcoholics say, they are also things people who aren't alcoholics, but just enjoy drinking say if perhaps someone makes a comment to them about their drinking. There is one thing that an Alcoholic or problem drinker says to themselves that someone with no drinking problem doesn't -- " I wonder if I have a problem with drinking " Fun.. if you are wondering if you have a drinking problem then you do... Saying that you can quit anytime is denial.. Someone who doesn't have a problem drinking doesn't say that they can quit anytime.. Only you Fun can decide if you are an Alcoholic.. but it sounds to me that you do have a drinking problem and are on your way to drinking Alcoholically.. Just my opinion based on my experiences... Link to post Share on other sites
juliegeraci Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 I am a working, normal, mother of 2 who is an alcoholic admittedly. I drink every day no matter if its 1 drink or 5. I think if you drink every day you need to consider it an addiction none the less. Especially if you crave it. Link to post Share on other sites
JamesM Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 It seems to me the above links are worded as such that anyone who drinks w/ any regularity, could be made out to be an alcoholic regardless of what the actual case is. While I understand that they are things that alcoholics say, they are also things people who aren't alcoholics, but just enjoy drinking say if perhaps someone makes a comment to them about their drinking. I agree. But the reasons that Fun gave so far are not enough to convince ME (FWIW) that she is not. However, I also do not say she is. The question is why does one drink with regularity. Personally, I don't, so I don't know that I am an expert in determining if someone is an alcoholic. Fun - an adequate way to see whether you are/aren't/other is don't do it, for a week, if you can do it without thinking much about it, you are probably ok, if by the second day you are heading to the liquor cabinet/aisle/store/nyquil, you may want to consider that you might have a problem. If you can't make it one day, call AA. The question is still why alcohol is needed. AA is not needed unless you do not feel that you CAN quit on your own. Not everyone needs AA, and the fact is many people simply quit and never feel the urge to continue drinking or can drink at social occasions only. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 AA is not needed unless you do not feel that you CAN quit on your own. Not everyone needs AA, and the fact is many people simply quit and never feel the urge to continue drinking or can drink at social occasions only. This is true James.. but one must address the reasons for having the drinking problem in order to stay sober.. There is such a thing as a dry drunk.. someone who no longer drinks but continues his/her behavior as if she was still drinking.. That type of person in my definition would not be sober but dry.. Sober to me is addressing the issues that drive a person to drink and staying off the Alcohol.. Link to post Share on other sites
Touche Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 I've been drinking lately but know I could stop whenever I want to. I just don't want to right now. How does someone deterine at what point someone is an alcoholic? Is it only if they have to have a drink the morning because that is not the case with me at all. This is just from my own experience but are there times when you feel you just HAVE to have it? (Be honest.) Or is it just that you would like to have it? Also, in my experience, if people really have to ask generally that's your answer. People who have no issue with alcohol whatsoever rarely (not always) ask whether they're alcoholics. Do you often drink more than you intended to? Also, the fact that you say you can stop any time but don't want to, is kind of a red flag to me. Why don't you want to? And are you sure you can stop whenever you want to? How long have you been able to go without a drink in the past? All questions to ask yourself. But in all honesty, it does sound like you have your answer already. And no, just because you never drink in the morning, it doesn't mean you're not an alcoholic. One more question...do you ever drink and don't remember much the next day? Another red flag. Link to post Share on other sites
MakeLemonade Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 I dunno, dude. There are all sorts of alcoholics, from personal experience and also the AA meetings I've attended. Some alcoholics can be alcohol free for years and still be considered alcoholics - "dry" alcoholics. It's not just about alcohol, it's how you deal with life, too. When I drank, I would drink to excess - but only once or twice a week, if that. I could go for weeks without drinking. But once things got stressful, I would always reach for the bottle. IMO HOW you use alcohol is more important that "how often" you use alcohol. I agree with this, it really is not about how much you drink, but how it effects your life. However, the few alcoholics and by that I mean admittedly so, I have known, have to drink EVERYDAY. They have to have it purchased and on hand, and preferably drinking it. Whether at a slow steady pace thoughout the day, or binge on it in the evening. I think it is also a matter of control - this is where the how does it effect your life comes into play. Do you drink alone? Do you drink and then drive? Do you pick fights w/ your H,SO,family when you have been drinking? Do you make important decisions/poor choices when you have been drinking? These are all factors. Link to post Share on other sites
MakeLemonade Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 (edited) And as all the different replies attest to, there is really no true "formula" for determining this. You may just be a conscientious person wondering how much is too much, wanting to make sure you keep yourself in control. It is a drug, and things can escalate over time, wondering if you may have a problem doesn't mean you have a problem. I don't agree with the PP who said that. (Sorry I didn't quote) I think it actually makes you a responsible drinker/person/earth-dweller to wonder if you might have a problem and how much is too much. This is a good thread topic. Edited February 13, 2008 by MakeLemonade Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 wondering if you may have a problem doesn't mean you have a problem. What would it mean then ?.. because someone who doesn't have a problem with drinking doesn't wonder if they do .. Maybe you could explain what you mean ? Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 (edited) I think it actually makes you a responsible drinker/person/earth-dweller to wonder if you might have a problem and how much is too much. This is a good thread topic. I didn't see your edit... I guess we see just see it differently.. I am making a distinction with the term problem drinker and Alcoholic in my point.. Edited February 13, 2008 by Art_Critic Link to post Share on other sites
MakeLemonade Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 What would it mean then ?.. because someone who doesn't have a problem with drinking doesn't wonder if they do .. Maybe you could explain what you mean ? I just mean, you can have a few drinks here and there, maybe a little more on the weekends, you're relaxing, having fun. Not using it to bury emotions or avoid problems, and yet you might still wonder if you are drinking too much, based on what society says, or what we here at LS say or what an AA website, etc. says, and yet your drinking if you do it at home with your SO or w/ friends, is not causing problems, is not a problem for you, you really can quit anytime without wanting it more and more. You really don't have a problem and yet, based on what you have heard or read or whatever, you may start to wonder if you do. Actually, what you are asking didn't make much sense to me because that was exactly my point and I realize we disagree. You say someone who doesn't have a drinking problem wouldn't wonder if they do and I say they just might. Link to post Share on other sites
MakeLemonade Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 I didn't see your edit... I guess we see just see it differently.. I am making a distinction with the term problem drinker and Alcoholic in my point.. Sorry, didn't see this reply, we agree to disagree then! Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 and yet you might still wonder if you are drinking too much, base. I think we are using different terms here... If a person wonders if they are drinking too much they I don't think that means they have a drinking problem... But... If a person wonders if they have a drinking problem then I believe they have one.. I also I don't believe that it means a person is an Alcoholic.. just that they have a drinking problem.. Sorry about the wording of my previous post.. I didn't see your edit and I was changing things in my post till I couldn't edit any longer Link to post Share on other sites
MakeLemonade Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 (edited) I think we are using different terms here... If a person wonders if they are drinking too much they I don't think that means they have a drinking problem... But... If a person wonders if they have a drinking problem then I believe they have one.. I also I don't believe that it means a person is an Alcoholic.. just that they have a drinking problem.. drinking too much = drinking more than what you, yourself, believe to be acceptable and crosses into excessive drinking problem = drinking too much, even when you shouldn't + not being able to stop (A fine little step from here to AA, IMO) However, I don't think drinking too much or having a drinking problem makes you an alcoholic. Necessarily. The why of your drinking comes much more into play as far as what crosses into alcoholism IMHO. This brings us back to the question of how much is too much and really that is an individual thing. And I guess further to that question, when does drinking too much or having a problem escalate into alcoholism. (And I hope none of this is hijacking the thread at all, I am really just trying to bring about some helpful dialogue so the OP can hopefully use it to help her decide) Art Critic, my head is going in circles now. Thanks ALOT! Edited February 13, 2008 by MakeLemonade Link to post Share on other sites
Author Fun2BMe Posted February 13, 2008 Author Share Posted February 13, 2008 Here is some additional info. I don't know why, but it feels hard to write about for some reason. The reason I am now wondering is due to a conversation I had with my therapist a couple of days ago. A few months ago he called in the afternoon responding to my email to set up an appointment and wanted to have it that afternoon instead of the following day and I agreed but i had been drinking already. I thought it was a little bit and he wouldn't notice but it became obvious I was intoxicated. He never brought it up but a couple days ago he asked about my drinking and I ended up arguing with him about it and the more I told him it wasn't a problem he kept asking more and more questions. Basically when I do drink, it has to be until I get drunk or pass out. A couple of times I have woken up to find broken things and stuff turned over that I don't even remember or throw up on the floor i don't remember happening. The thing is I can stop whenever I want and I dono't have to have a drink. I don't get a craving like people describe, but instead make a decision to drink. I got mad the therapist turned it into a conversation and it made me feel bad like he was wasting his time on an issue i have control over. I still function and do my work and just like some people might eat a lot sometimes, what's the difference if instead I choose to drink a lot sometimes whenever I want to without a craving like for coffee or food some people have. It helps me cope with my problems and I see it as a positive thing even so I am just asking to find out of the T is trying to make an issue out of nothing. Link to post Share on other sites
juliegeraci Posted February 13, 2008 Share Posted February 13, 2008 Hi Sweetie, if you have black outs and you wake up not knowing what has happened that is a tell tail sign at the very least you have alcohol abuse. You can still be a heavy drinker and not an alcoholic so to speak. I think you need to really look at whether or not you can easily give it up. The part of the story that concerns me the most is the fact that you do it because it makes you feel good. A way to escape. The folks in AA on this thread will clearly say that is a sign of alcoholism. Not being able to live your life well without alcohol. You may want to attend a local AA meeting and talk to some people there. When I was sober I really enjoyed the interaction and it really does help you deal with life. Good luck. Link to post Share on other sites
Touche Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 Here is some additional info. I don't know why, but it feels hard to write about for some reason. The reason I am now wondering is due to a conversation I had with my therapist a couple of days ago. A few months ago he called in the afternoon responding to my email to set up an appointment and wanted to have it that afternoon instead of the following day and I agreed but i had been drinking already. I thought it was a little bit and he wouldn't notice but it became obvious I was intoxicated. He never brought it up but a couple days ago he asked about my drinking and I ended up arguing with him about it and the more I told him it wasn't a problem he kept asking more and more questions. Basically when I do drink, it has to be until I get drunk or pass out. A couple of times I have woken up to find broken things and stuff turned over that I don't even remember or throw up on the floor i don't remember happening. The thing is I can stop whenever I want and I dono't have to have a drink. I don't get a craving like people describe, but instead make a decision to drink. I got mad the therapist turned it into a conversation and it made me feel bad like he was wasting his time on an issue i have control over. I still function and do my work and just like some people might eat a lot sometimes, what's the difference if instead I choose to drink a lot sometimes whenever I want to without a craving like for coffee or food some people have. It helps me cope with my problems and I see it as a positive thing even so I am just asking to find out of the T is trying to make an issue out of nothing. The bolded parts plus the fact that you black out tell the whole story. Also, You may say you don't crave it but instead make a deliberate decision to drink, but trust me, I used to say that too. It takes one to know one, Fun..and you my dear have a drinking problem. And it gets worse the older you get. Trust me on that one too. Just curious is there any alcoholism in your family? (Not that that matters either way...you clearly have a problem, no two ways about it.) Could this be why your life has been out of control in other areas of your life? Julie gave you good advice. Link to post Share on other sites
Touche Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 I just wanted to say one more thing. The part about when you do drink it's always until you get drunk and/or pass out...see it doesn't even matter if you drink once a week or once a month or whatever or not in the mornings, etc.etc. The fact that you drink until you're drunk tells the whole story. "Normal" drinkers don't drink like that. They rarely if ever drink until they're blind drunk each and every time they drink. I know you know this to be true. Link to post Share on other sites
Art_Critic Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 (edited) . I don't get a craving like people describe, but instead make a decision to drink. Fun.. You do have an issue with Alcohol.. you do need to seek help.. Call your local AA chapter and find a meeting near you and please go.. Talk to some of the people and listen to their stories... I have been sober for over 20 years and when I drank I never got a craving or desire that said I needed it.. I drank each time to pass out to.. it was easier that way for me... The reason I drank was mostly I was running away from a poor relationship that I had with my father.. I drank to show him I wasn't a drunk..To show him I could handle Alcohol and not turn into what he was.. He was a dry drunk not a sober one.. I sought help thru AA after I realized that I did meet his expectations of me ( I was a drunk like he told me ) and couldn't drink like most people do... Admitting that I was powerless over Alcohol was the best thing I ever did for myself.. I made a decision to give it up for good and for all... Day by day... Place that call...You owe it to yourself Edited February 14, 2008 by Art_Critic Link to post Share on other sites
Green Posted February 14, 2008 Share Posted February 14, 2008 I'm not going to call you an alcoholic because then your going to get into the semantics of how you don't fit the definition and you can stop when ever you want to. If this therapist asked good questions and you answered truthfully, and he gave you his oppionion that you have a problem maybe you do. I turn pure evil when I start drinking so there Link to post Share on other sites
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