Moral Delamma

[Pixie]

Hello, I sort of have a moral dilemma. I was raised with the belief that masturbation is a sin. Also that you shouldn't think sexual thoughts or look at porn. But I am torn because I like these things. Not all of the time but every now and then.

What should I do?

[HokeyReligions]

For some people it is wrong. I was raised that way too. I'd rather not look at porn myself because why deal with guilt when you don't have to.

 

I've never tried masturbation because personally I think it is nasty. Other people don't feel that way and they enjoy it. I don't think any less of those who practice this - I probably know a lot of people who do, but I've yet to meet anyone and discuss it in person! It's an embarassing topic for many people.

 

Well, let me clarify that - I have never discussed it with any females who practice it - but I joke about it with my male friends who don't seem to be embarassed about it. It doesn't carry the same stigma with men as it does with women.

 

I've looked at porn because I was curious, but it never did anything for me except make me feel dirty and guilty. I'm not a prude, but like I said, why suffer the guilt for some momentary physical thrill?

 

That's just my opinion - to each his own.

[Onnie]

I know it’s a scary thing but…. I think you should analyze your beliefs. If the words spoken in your church don’t match the ones spoken in your heart…that church is not the place for you.

I was raised in a deeply southern Baptist family and over came the sexual boundaries that where mostly imposed on women.

 

I believe that if I cannot love myself totally…how can I ever expect someone else to love me? And to love myself the way I am is to be comfortable with my natural sexuality. I like porn, I like masturbating, and I love sex.

 

I’m not going to let any pastor, family member, or book tell me what I feel is wrong.

You should have the courage to do the same.

[turtle]

If you enjoy masterbation and porn...go ahead...enjoy. Who are you hurting if you indulge in these things?

 

Some people are raised that sex before marriage is a sin. Please! Most couples would not ever dream of tieing the knot until they've had intercourse and lived together.

[Gray]

Hokey :

 

Can I ask why you feel masturbating is dirty? I guess I just want a better understanding. What about wetdreams then? Do you feel guilty or dirty after one of those (because those are universal)?

 

I really am curious, I was raise Lutheran but masturbation was never really talked badly about. I experimented with it, never thinking it "bad" persay but definately something you didn't do at the dinner table. So I've never had a problem with it. My friends and I are comfortable around each other too, so we talk about it openly, not ya know in detail, but "What'd you do last night?" "Oh, I got off work. Came home. Beat one off. Watched tv." That sort of thing.

 

Pixie :

 

I'd follow everyone's advice. If you yourself feel guilty about it, then why subject yourself to that guilt? Just avoid doing it. If the guilt is externally imposed shame then... well, imo, screw them, you're not hurting yourself or anyone else, and I really can't see God judging you for it.

[Pixie]

Just to let you know. It's not that I feel that masturbation is "dirty." I know that it is a natural thing and I do feel that everyone should enjoy their body. I enjoy it. And I enjoy looking at porn every now and then I just sort of have a little self conflict going because I was taught growing up that if you thought

sexual thoughts other than to procreate I was going to hell.

So in a way I'm just deeply afraid that if I do these things that I'm going straight to hell. But I do enjoy them.

 

Thank you all for you comments. I would still like to hear from you if you have more to say.

[Pixie]

It is sort of hard to have a wet dream if your a female. But No I don't feel that they are dirty.

[cindy0039]

Originally posted by Pixie

It is sort of hard to have a wet dream if your a female. But No I don't feel that they are dirty.

 

Au contraire! I've had wet dreams before. Women get wet when sexually aroused. Haven't you ever had a really nice dream and awoken in that state? You don't have any control over your dreams, so how can you worry what God thinks about that?

 

It's something to think about.

[HokeyReligions]

Originally posted by Gray

Hokey :

 

Can I ask why you feel masturbating is dirty? I guess I just want a better understanding. What about wetdreams then? Do you feel guilty or dirty after one of those (because those are universal)?

 

I really am curious, I was raise Lutheran but masturbation was never really talked badly about. I experimented with it, never thinking it "bad" persay but definately something you didn't do at the dinner table. So I've never had a problem with it. My friends and I are comfortable around each other too, so we talk about it openly, not ya know in detail, but "What'd you do last night?" "Oh, I got off work. Came home. Beat one off. Watched tv." That sort of thing.

We all have morals and beliefs that stem from the way we were raised. We can change or challenge them, but quite often our actions conflict with our deepest feelings and beliefs - thus baggage and guilt.

 

I haven't ever had a wet dream that I can remember (unless it was when I had to go to the bathroom so bad that in my dreams I was searching for a lavatory and only woke up when I found one in my dream and began "going" only to wake up and realize I really DID have to go!)

 

I don't condem anyone for masterbation, but to me it is a dirty act - it makes me feel dirty to think of a woman doing that (I normally don't think about it!) and it's a joke in a way to think of men doing that, but its never been a topic of any kind of serious discussion among my family or friends. I'm not wrong to think it's dirty because to me, it is. It's the way I was raised and growing up it might have been whispered about as some "nasty" thing that little boys did until they were tought better. Grow hair on their palms, eyes stay crossed, that sort of thing.

 

Just because I am of a different generation and upbringing doesn't make me a prude or old-fashioned - it just makes me, me. I'm not niaeve about sex, and I've done my share of experiementing with my husband, but it goes back to if it doesn't feel good - don't do it. That means feel good physically or emotionally.

 

I wouldn't feel comfortable talking about it in person, but here on an anonymous internet board it doesn't bother me.

 

I am quite certain that I am not the only person, of any age, in the world who feels this way.

 

It reminds me of religion. If a person is raised to believe in God (any God) and that belief/faith is instilled in them as a child, odds are that as an adult they will continue to believe. They may change churches or practices, but the core belief is still there. That's why I consider myself an agnostic. I don't have the faith that my family does and I have serious doubts in there being any kind of God, but I also don't discount the possibility that they are right, and I accept that there might be some truth to their chosen faith, but I'm not comfortable practicing something I don't believe in.

 

So, with masterbation I don't condem someone or lose respect for them because their belief or feeling about it differ from mine.

[moimeme]

I don't think masturbation is bad per se, however I do think that there is reason for caution about it. I have a theory (and not the means to prove or disprove it so I've passed it to people who can do so) that some 'abnormal' (and I mean really so, not just kink) practices arose when people became aroused and climaxed in conjuction with something which later became a trigger. So, for instance, if someone feels like masturbating while watching violence, I suspect that the connection of the violence with the orgasm can actually 'pattern' people to become aroused by violence.

 

So while masturbation in itself may not be morally wrong, I'd be careful about the circumstances one chooses for one's masturbation. I hope somebody will look into this theory soon because I'm really interested in the outcome. I thought about it when I read about people's fantasies and found out how many people become aroused by things (music, smells, location, etc.) which they associate with their early sexual experiences. For instance, one man who got aroused when his mom spanked him while wearing rubber gloves ended up with a rubber fetish.

[Gray]

Hmm, Hokey, I think you took my curiosity to be accusitory and I don't really know why. I don't think you niaeve (well, because of the masturbation, I have opinions about your closeness with religion but thats for another forum, ), and I don't think you a prude either. But saying "Its how I was raised" doesn't really answer, why you think its dirty/wrong.

 

Lemme give you an example. Is it wrong to kill someone? Well of course it is. Why? Well, its not our right to pass judgement on someone else. Its not our right to take something, including life, from someone else.

 

Obviously you're mature enough now to realize that masturbation doesn't grow hair on your palms, or make you go blind. So is the continuing digust of it just leftover preconceived notions? Or is it something along the lines of giving yourself pleasure (because then that could be aruged that feeding yourself chocolate is masturbation).

 

Oh, final thing, the wet-dream thing. Hmm, I thought they went over this in sex-ed, but a wet-dream isn't when you urinate in bed, but rather you release sexual fluids in your sleep; orgasming in your sleep. I don't have a link, but I'm pretty sure this is a universal that happens to everyone at some point in time of their life. So along those lines, is it still wrong since it was from your subconscience?

[moimeme]

I, too was raised to not touch my 'thingy'. But I grew up and realized that the whole anti-sex aspect that is ascribed to religion is a later development. Mind you, Jesus did actually say that nobody should marry but He had to mean it only for his immediate followers or the people He died to save would have died out by now.

 

I don't have the history down to a fine point, but there is a point at which it was decided that Adam and Eve's 'sin' was to have sex and that sullied every human from then on. Problem with that is that prior to Adam and Eve meeting the snake, God had already told them to 'be fruitful and multiply' and since they weren't amoebas, they pretty much were told to have sex.

 

However somehow this idea of the 'impurity' of sex permeated religion so of course sex (unless it's to make babies) is icky in certain philosophies. It's just an attitude. Again, the same people who insist on 'following the Bible word for word' refer to Onan to justify condemning masturbation but will find excuses not to follow other teachings which are also in the Bible.

 

Having said that, I still think there are good reasons to be extremely careful about having sex or masturbating. My theory on masturbation is above (wish somebody had commented! ); my theory on sex in general is that we are constructed such that the hormones which get flowing when we have sex (or even kiss) can make us feel attached to another. It is hearts, not bodies, that are in danger if sex is misused. Sex isn't dirty but it is dangerous because it can cause you to wound hearts or be wounded and that, IMHO, is the real sin.