Well, the phone bill came today

[stampdaddy]

for $15 , he can do a reverse search, and it WILL give you the name of the person with theat number. I would pick pick up!!, you csan always say it was an accident!! Good luck!

I tried to do a reverse search, yes for $15.. but it had old info... either way, H "knows".. I will not pick up..

[frannie]

Not my style.. If she can't step up to the plate this time, then we are doomed.. He WILL figure this out... I really don't think he has confronted her about it yet.. Why wouldnt he just call from HER phone, or have her call the number in front of him? I'd pick it up then, thinking it was HER calling.. BUT, with this said, this is NOT how I want this to play out, I WANT HER TO TELL THE DAMN TRUTH, FOR ONCE!!!!!

 

I know how you feel, stamp.

[norajane]

BUT, with this said, this is NOT how I want this to play out, I WANT HER TO TELL THE DAMN TRUTH, FOR ONCE!!!!!

 

That's the thing with cheaters, especially long term cheaters. They don't tell the truth, to anyone, not even themselves. They lie and lie and lie so much, it becomes ingrained. Plus the (double) lives they've built are so dependent on all the lies, they lose sight of what the truth is. And, ultimately, they don't want to tell the truth. When confronted, they lie some more.

[stampdaddy]

That's the thing with cheaters, especially long term cheaters. They don't tell the truth, to anyone, not even themselves. They lie and lie and lie so much, it becomes ingrained. Plus the (double) lives they've built are so dependent on all the lies, they lose sight of what the truth is. And, ultimately, they don't want to tell the truth. When confronted, they lie some more.

can this EVER be fixed? I believe everything you just said.. IT IS HER NOW...

[norajane]

can this EVER be fixed? I believe everything you just said.. IT IS HER NOW...

 

It's been her for a while, hasn't it? Probably long before you came along.

 

Change is always possible, but real change only comes from within, from recognizing and believing there is something very wrong with your behavior, taking responsibility for it, coming clean, and taking active, honest steps to behave differently. For starters, she would need to take a good, hard, honest look at herself and realize that she no longer wants to be that person. And most liars can't do that, because they are so used to manipulating everyone in order to get what they want...they have no sense of integrity in dealing with others, so can't quite believe they are doing anything wrong...it's everyone else's fault they have to lie to them, you see?

Edited February 24, 2008 by norajane

[OWoman]

It's been her for a while, hasn't it? Probably long before you came along.

 

Change is always possible, but real change only comes from within, from recognizing and believing there is something very wrong with your behavior, taking responsibility for it, coming clean, and taking active, honest steps to behave differently. For starters, she would need to take a good, hard, honest look at herself and realize that she no longer wants to be that person. And most liars can't do that, because they are so used to manipulating everyone in order to get what they want...they have no sense of integrity in dealing with others, so can't quite believe they are doing anything wrong...it's everyone else's fault they have to lie to them, you see?

 

Agreed - I posted something similar on that other thread about it being only she who can save herself, not Stamp's knight in shining armour.

 

Stamp, I know you want her to rise to the occasion. But why would she do so now, when all of her past behaviour all along has been not to? What has changed FOR HER, IN HER that she's going to do it differently now?

[stampdaddy]

Agreed - I posted something similar on that other thread about it being only she who can save herself, not Stamp's knight in shining armour.

 

Stamp, I know you want her to rise to the occasion. But why would she do so now, when all of her past behaviour all along has been not to? What has changed FOR HER, IN HER that she's going to do it differently now?

 

The realization that enough is enough.. again, Friday on the phone, she said "she is SUCH a liar.. She is such a F***ing liar.." and she completely broke down.. H is on to her AGAIN, and this time for me is the last time.. I WILL NOT be able to keep doing this, I have done enough. I don't see how she can lie anymore.. H will ask, who's # is this, and how can she just say, "I don't know". There are probably 40-50 calls, how can she "not know"..

[norajane]

The realization that enough is enough.. again, Friday on the phone, she said "she is SUCH a liar.. She is such a F***ing liar.." and she completely broke down.. H is on to her AGAIN, and this time for me is the last time.. I WILL NOT be able to keep doing this, I have done enough. I don't see how she can lie anymore.. H will ask, who's # is this, and how can she just say, "I don't know". There are probably 40-50 calls, how can she "not know"..

 

Even if she told him the calls were to you, she'll lie to him about everything else. About why she was calling (to end things, b/c you kept wanting to talk to her and wouldn't let her go, whatever), she'll lie in the form of going to IC when she's not really engaged in it, that she wants to save the marriage, she'll lie by not telling him that she saw you recently, whatever. She'll keep lying about everything she can, even if she is forced to admit to the lie she got caught in.

 

She'll even lie to you - by telling you she's such a "f*cking liar" so you start to believe that she sees the error of her ways, but then won't do a damn thing to change anything. That's manipulation.

[Trimmer]

Not my style.. If she can't step up to the plate this time, then we are doomed.. He WILL figure this out... I really don't think he has confronted her about it yet.. Why wouldnt he just call from HER phone, or have her call the number in front of him? I'd pick it up then, thinking it was HER calling.. BUT, with this said, this is NOT how I want this to play out, I WANT HER TO TELL THE DAMN TRUTH, FOR ONCE!!!!!

Stamp, I mean this gently, but do you think that you might be in a bit of denial here too, in a sense? You know what her pattern is, you know what her behavior is, yet you believe that she might actually change suddenly and step up and do the right thing for once?

 

Her H has talked directly with you about your relationship with MW, "caught" you at a romantic lunch and threatened divorce, and you think he is still trying to "figure it out?" What's left for him to figure out?

 

You know that he knows already. Any more evidence only adds to the pile of fuel, it isn't some new mystery that he is puzzling over.

 

And you know her well enough to know whether you can expect her to make a 180° turn and become honest and honorable for everyone else's sake all of a sudden... As OWoman said:

Stamp, I know you want her to rise to the occasion. But why would she do so now, when all of her past behaviour all along has been not to? What has changed FOR HER, IN HER that she's going to do it differently now?

[BetrayedMM]

Stamp, they just keep right on lying even when they KNOW you know they're lying. It's mind boggling. Defending the lies becomes more important than any reality, they desperately cling to them as long as possible. When her husband is ready to end it, she might tell him the truth. Might. But, until then she will keep lying in a desperate attempt to stay married. You really are her second choice, no matter what she has said to you, she has shown you this.

 

You, my friend, have been used as an emotional tampon, you are there to absorb the overflow from her marriage. I really think(in spite of your situation) that you deserve a real relationship. It sounds like you have much to offer.

[stampdaddy]

I do.... Things arent as "dark" as they have been, it just sucks figuring this out as I am, especially since I loved her SO dearly.. Keep the posts coming at me... It is helping

[BetrayedMM]

Imagine this- you are deeply in love. The woman you love is completely unattached, except for you. No husband. No lies. No sneaking around. In fact, instead of a pillow, you get a woman.

 

It does happen. It's common. It's normal. It could be you. But, not with this woman.

 

There are more than 3.5 BILLION women to choose from. I guarantee you are compatible with more than just this one, and some of the ones you are compatible with are actually available. This woman is simply not available.

 

Soulmates? Meh, that's just a myth. Or more accurately, there are certainly many more potential soulmates than just this one. Your soulmate is who YOU decide to share your soul with, not pre-determined.

[stampdaddy]

Imagine this- you are deeply in love. The woman you love is completely unattached, except for you. No husband. No lies. No sneaking around. In fact, instead of a pillow, you get a woman.

 

It does happen. It's common. It's normal. It could be you. But, not with this woman.

 

There are more than 3.5 BILLION women to choose from. I guarantee you are compatible with more than just this one, and some of the ones you are compatible with are actually available. This woman is simply not available.

 

Soulmates? Meh, that's just a myth. Or more accurately, there are certainly many more potential soulmates than just this one. Your soulmate is who YOU decide to share your soul with, not pre-determined.

I appreciate your (and everybodies) kind words and advice, it IS helping.. I am not so lost, and won't get too lost to believe that there isn't anyone out there for me, I could go out tonight and probably meet someone that I could "date".. I am in a period right now, where I am having a hard time giving up on ALL that I believed. AND I am having a very hard time coming to the realization that ALL I believed wasn't real..... This is the hardest part for me

[OWoman]

AND I am having a very hard time coming to the realization that ALL I believed wasn't real..... This is the hardest part for me

 

Stamp it was real. But it was your creation. You created it, and you laid it at her feet as a gift. You're having a hard time accepting that she stomped on it. Is stomping on it still, while beating herself up for stomping on it.

 

But you created it. It's in you to do that. It's plenty real, and it can happen again, when you're ready.

[Owl]

Stamp-

 

You need to move on for YOU...now.

 

I don't understand why you're still "holding back" on your decision to move on...given all that you've described.

 

Make up your mind already...the only person dragging this out...dragging your heart through broken glass...is YOU.

 

The sooner you move on...the sooner you'll start to feel better.

 

That first step is YOURS to make.

 

How about right now?

[stampdaddy]

Stamp-

 

You need to move on for YOU...now.

 

I don't understand why you're still "holding back" on your decision to move on...given all that you've described.

 

Make up your mind already...the only person dragging this out...dragging your heart through broken glass...is YOU.

 

The sooner you move on...the sooner you'll start to feel better.

 

That first step is YOURS to make.

 

How about right now?

How about in another day or so..? j/k H just called again.. STILL trying to figure out who's number it is, but he "knows" This is just flat out of hand and just stupid.. She claimed she had "no idea" who's number it was.. there must be 40-50 calls.. ANYWAY, now is as good a time as ever, huh?

[whichwayisup]

Why don't you answer the phone? Or if you're not going to answer it, turn it off.

 

Why are you protecting her, is that why you aren't answering? Or is it you just don't want to deal with him...to answer his questions.

 

I just hope he doesn't try to find you and meet up with you in person. That could be next.

[stampdaddy]

Why don't you answer the phone? Or if you're not going to answer it, turn it off.

 

Why are you protecting her, is that why you aren't answering? Or is it you just don't want to deal with him...to answer his questions.

 

I just hope he doesn't try to find you and meet up with you in person. That could be next.

If I answer the phone, I am the rat.. This is got to stop.. It is SO sad watching her right now, and I don't pity her at all....

[whichwayisup]

Why are you the rat? You answering the phone will actually make something, anything happen instead of both you and him wondering WTF is going on with her. You know she's omitted various truths to you and has done the same thing with her husband.

 

OR..

 

Are you scared that if you do answer the phone he may actually leave for good and then she'll come running to you? And you'll have to deal with MORE drama? Make a decision once and for all? Right now everything still hangs...You say you want it over but it isn't really over. She knows she's pushing it with you, but she also knows you haven't shut the door completely.

[Tomcat33]

Hi Stamp - wow lot's of developments as of late.

Look I know some people are telling you that you need to move on NOW, and I would clarify that notion, from my point of view, that you need to move on in actions but I can undestand it has to happen from within. By that I mean you need to close the door on this woman's waffling and accept the idea that she does not have the guts to practice what she preaches.

 

Now it terms of moving on emotionally this will be a whole process and there is no shelf life or time limit on how long this will take you NOR should you force yourself to rush through the emotions. It will take you as long as it takes you and as much as people can say you to hurry up and move past things, it won't happen like that for you unless you are ready. NOR can they tell you go out and find a single woman already and forget this other woman, that's not the answer. A person doesn't just "forget" a person they were deeply in love with and whom they had a lot of high hopes with, especially while they are still coming out of the haze. Time and patience will let you see things as they are and let you make the BEST choices for yourself in the meantime you do what is right for you, and if you feel it in your hear that you need to hang to this hope even if everyone else sees it differently on then so be it. Sometimes we need to hit rock bottom before we see the light, some of us see the light sooner than others but the key is you have to have power of conviction in order to move on. I don't think you are convinced yet, and there is nothing we can say or do to make you see that. You will know when that time comes.

 

 

To suggest that you go out and find a single woman undermines what you have in your heart for this woman for the past 3 years, so the last thing you need is to feel pressured into having to go jump into another relationship with someone else. You will do it when you are good an ready. You are NOWHERE near being ready now for the simple fact that you are still in love with someone else.

 

 

Why are you the rat? You answering the phone will actually make something, anything happen instead of both you and him wondering WTF is going on with her. You know she's omitted various truths to you and has done the same thing with her husband.

 

OR..

 

Are you scared that if you do answer the phone he may actually leave for good and then she'll come running to you? And you'll have to deal with MORE drama? Make a decision once and for all? Right now everything still hangs...You say you want it over but it isn't really over. She knows she's pushing it with you, but she also knows you haven't shut the door completely.

 

good points! I think Stamp might be afraid that if he does talk to him and they still don't do anything about it that it will be nail on the coffin...that would kill the hope forever.

[Owl]

I agree with WWIU.

 

And, my thought on all of this is this...why not just answer the phone, tell him who it is, tell him she's been calling you, and that you're done with being involved in THEIR MESS.

 

Have him put you on speakerphone...tell them both you want no more calls/visits/etc... That you're tired of being asked to lie to protect her. That you're tired of the game playing. That you're tired...and that you're no longer going to play in this fiasco. Ask her directly to stop.

 

Then hang up.

 

Its clear what's going on. The REAL question is...how much longer do you want to be involved in it?

[stampdaddy]

I appreciate everybody's insight and it IS working.. Not quite there yet, but am damn close... H is closing in fast with MULTIPLE calls to her saying as much.. We had a LONG talk and I pretty much told her that her behavior is disgusting.. AND THAT I AM WATCHING all of this go down.. I told her how hurt I am and that just about any hope of me is gone... NOW she says that she will tell the truth tonight, well some of it... I said no thanks to "some of it"... You can't tell the truth while you are lying about it..

[whichwayisup]

W she says that she will tell the truth tonight, well some of it... I said no thanks to "some of it"... You can't tell the truth while you are lying about it..

 

WTF? She will tell you 'some of the truth' but not all? Either you're pregnant or not so the expression goes...One cannot be sort of pregnant. She owes you the truth and the only reason why she's holding back is because her truth isn't the one she's been promising you. She doesn't want to be the bad guy (gal) now and is doing just about everything possible to make sure she comes out smelling like a rose, as someone else said, the blame game...She'll put it on anyone but herself.

 

Stay strong SD.

[Trimmer]

WTF? She will tell you 'some of the truth' but not all? Either you're pregnant or not so the expression goes...One cannot be sort of pregnant. She owes you the truth and the only reason why she's holding back is because her truth isn't the one she's been promising you.

Unless I misread, I get the impression that it's more that SD thinks she owes her husband the truth, and that's where she's not coming clean...

[whichwayisup]

She isn't coming clean to EITHER of them, that's the thing. She has told SD one thing and her husband another. I do agree, she first off does owe her husband the real truth and nothing but.

 

I think she doesn't know anymore so I hope thearpy helps her find herself again.