Loving a Younger Woman from Afar

[confounded]

Please, forgive the length of this post. The detail will hopefully make my situation clearer...I hope.

 

Everyone, I would say I am right at the "edge" of either complete happiness or complete stupidity. I would love for someone to set me straight on this issue. That is, even if it's possible to do so at this point.

 

You see folks, I have strong feelings for a younger woman (about 20 or so - unsure of her exact age), and I'm 32. She is about to start her second year of university, moving toward a degree, and I am in a permanent position at my job. I am single, have no kids, and have never been married. Yes, yes...I know that raises questions like..."Why is he 32 years old and still single?"

 

I guess some background on myself is needed.

 

I like to consider myself to be a warm person, and I am not a person with a bad heart or selfish intentions. I feel I am very easy to talk to, etc. Nonetheless, like us all, I have my faults. For instance, I am overweight, and I have been for years. I guess that, given our society's idea of "thin is in," I have never really "rated" that highly among the female population in our area. I could understand this, insofar as I understand that we are often attracted to what we see first. We are all human.

 

To be fair to myself though, I should note that I have had very close friendships with women in person. Just not many that could lead to a "love relationship" in the traditional sense. I even met a single, 27 year-old woman about 2 yrs ago on the internet. Although we really care for each other and would like to be together, I don't honestly see that happening. She's several provinces away, close to her family there (as I am to mine here), has a steady job, etc. So, although we both like to feel that an "us" actually is feasible, reality is probably less encouraging on that being the case.

 

In any event, the young woman for whom I have feelings is working at a local restaurant (for the summer season). Although I have no idea if I am accurate on this or not, (my radar appears to be permanently offline ), I get "vibes" that she feels an attraction to me as well. We have been talking more and more while I am there. About a week ago, I was picking up some takeout. Previous to this, I had stayed to eat there for the past couple of times, and (I suppose), seeing that I was just getting takeout to go, she asked me why I wasn't staying. I told her that it was just for a change of pace, etc.

 

Friday, she asked me if I was at the restaurant on a certain day (can't remember when exactly) last week, adding that she had gone back home to help her parents pack. You see, they have purchased a home in this area, and evidently they're all moving from where they were to this area. I said that I had been at the restaurant, and that I had thought at the time that it was strange that she wasn't working there. The truth really is that I had actually wondered if she had quit and left that position.

 

While there, she also asked me if I have any plans for this summer. I explained that, right now, I haven't planned anything in particular. She added that she expected that she would be working all summer. She asked me if I was related to/knew a particular guy (who happened to have the same family name as mine.) Turns out I wasn't related to him.

 

At a later point, she was folding napkins, and said "I'll be able to fold napkins in my sleep". I said..."Yeah, you'll wake up and your bedclothes will be one giant napkin." She had a great laugh on that one.

 

To make a very very long story short, as I was getting ready to pay, we talked a little, and she said "I don't think I caught your name". Of course, I told her my name, and paid the tab. Sadly, I couldn't find enough change for a nice tip for her, so I said "I was going to give a tip, but I can't find anything big enough for ya."

 

{{{Yes, yes, I know ... LMAO ... It's only AFTER you say that kind of thing do you realize. }}}

 

In any case, I bid her goodbye and left.

 

I was at the restaurant again today (Monday), having popped in there under the guise of looking to have lunch but...well, we all know why I was there in reality. When I went in through the door, you would not believe the look of surprise she gave me (unless this is all in my mind). Well, we talked a bit, then I went to my table. At one point she noted how beautiful a day it was, etc. I told her that I was going for a drive afterwards. She asked where, and I told her. Anyways, at the end of the meal, I talked to her a little bit more, she asked about my work, etc. (I think I did way to much blathering on today...nerves I guess.

 

As I was leaving I said "I guess I will get to my drive" or something to that effect. Then, I looked at her, as I started heading for the door..."Well, it was nice to see ya again." Smooth or what!!!

 

You know, (and I know this is going to sound corney), my heart was in knots after I left that room. It's difficult to explain, but I feel so wonderful when I talk to her, and when I am around her everything feels newer. I don't know why but today, it appeared that the air was charged emotionally. I know I have to do something soon (or go completely nutty). I haven't been able to get her out of my mind as of late, and today did not help matters.

 

I know the reasons that are said to lead to a relationship with a big age gap. For example, some authors say that it's just because the older guy is looking to be appreciated by a younger woman, or that he is infatuated with the idea of having a young thing on his arm, status of having a younger woman, etc. etc. etc. Young woman looking for attention from a "sugar daddy" type...blah blah blah. Parental figure for her....etc.

 

Fact is, I don't even know how she feels. Maybe if I had said that I was related to this other guy before I would have heard she was really interested in him. To make matters worse, I don't know if something like this could ever work between us even if she feels exactly the same way about me. I am just plain unsure, period.

 

What should I do ? What is the take of "the world" on this one?

 

Confounded

[Ryan]

You're thinking way too much about something that doesn't exist.

 

Something that won't exist.

[clia]

Yes, yes...I know that raises questions like..."Why is he 32 years old and still single?"

 

Actually, there's nothing at all odd about being 32 and single. For me, your situation raises the question of "What does a 32 year old guy want with a 19 year old?" (If she's entering 2nd year of university, she likely turned/is turning 19 this year.) It's not the age difference that I find bothersome per se, it's the world of difference between a 19 year old and a 32 year old. I just don't see how you can be on the same wavelength, although I guess for some people it works out fine.

 

What should I do ? What is the take of "the world" on this one?

 

She seems like a nice person who is friendly to the customers in the restaurant. As I see it, you either ask her out on a date and see if she says yes, or you continue building up a fantasy relationship with her in your mind.

[Just A Girl2]

Originally posted by Ryan

You're thinking way too much about something that doesn't exist.

 

Something that won't exist.

 

Doesn't exist? WON'T exist? How can you have such certainty about this guy's situation? Frankly, it sounds like she is interested in him, cautiously.....I'm sure if she wasn't at all, she wouldn't give him the time of day or make chit chat with him as she does.

[Ryan]

Doesn't exist? WON'T exist? How can you have such certainty about this guy's situation? Frankly, it sounds like she is interested in him, cautiously.....I'm sure if she wasn't at all, she wouldn't give him the time of day or make chit chat with him as she does.

 

It seems like she might...but I wouldn't bet on it. This is a professional situation where young women are often hired if they are friendly and talkative. There are many young women who act like this even in a casual sense. I don't think this one-sided crush based on a few encounters is enough to get one's hopes up. I've been in his shoes numerous times, as have many of my friends. She's giving female attention to our leading man here....something I'd guess he does not receive in regular and sizeable quantities, so it is a big deal TO HIM. Heightened desire on his side plus friendly banter on her side leads to misconstrued motives.

 

I would also say this won't exist if he's smart about it. This lass is not even close to being at the same point in her life as he is. Lifestyle, goals, desires, opinions, etc. are DRASTICALLY different. I know people want to say, "Age ain't nothin but a numbah!" That's naieve. The only people who say that are the ones who live by it (and little else). Acting on the impulse of emotion without the temper of rationale is asking for trouble.

 

I'm not trying to get the fellow down here...I'm just giving my honest perspective.

[Curt]

First of all, I want to thank those of you who have taken time to respond to the post, and am looking forward to opinions from others.

 

Truth is, I have argued all of Ryan's points to myself in my own head too. I understand the issues that are at hand here, and that this may very well be as Ryan put it...

 

[color=darkblue]Heightened desire on his side plus friendly banter on her side leads to misconstrued motives.[/color]

 

That, in essence, has made me feel that this is all an invention in my mind. God knows that I want this to be real, and therefore might be making mountains out of mounds of clay.

 

Ryan also said:

 

[color=darkblue]Acting on the impulse of emotion without the temper of rationale is asking for trouble.[/color]

 

Yup, you're right my friend. But see, I guess the problem is this:

 

Have you ever had that feeling when you meet someone, you look into their eyes, they smile and flush a bit, and then you both chat, talking about little things for no apparent reason, etc. You're feeling this, almost psychic "pull" that you can't quite explain. It's not lust, I don't just want to undress her and have wild sex with her or anything. I know it's not love, I just don't know enough about her yet to feel that kind of connection. It's just inexplicable.

 

To make matters more complex, she says at one juncture, "I meant to ask you last time, etc." Then, when you tell her the answer to that question she smiles and sorta gives a chuckle, and says "she was thinking that was what you do...etc." It just seems all to ... hmmm ... out of the blue. (Is it just being friendly....I dunno? LMAO)

 

Combine that with the idea that she asked if I was at the restaurant one week when she was gone, and then apparently saw the opportunity/need to tell me that she was gone back to help her parents pack some things for their move. LOL .... Know what I mean?

 

Nonetheless, I realize it could all be a matter of her being friendly.

 

Still, I would so hate to look back at this in time to come, and regret not taking a chance.

At the same time, I look at myself and her as being from completely different cohorts, and wondering "what the hell is wrong with you Curt, she's from so different worlds."

 

I am going to that restaurant tomorrow...any ideas as to how to proceed? Or, for that matter if to proceed at all?

 

Ladies...gentlemen...opinions, directions, etc. requested and appreciated.

[Ryan]

Have you ever had that feeling when you meet someone, you look into their eyes, they smile and flush a bit, and then you both chat, talking about little things for no apparent reason, etc. You're feeling this, almost psychic "pull" that you can't quite explain. It's not lust, I don't just want to undress her and have wild sex with her or anything. I know it's not love, I just don't know enough about her yet to feel that kind of connection. It's just inexplicable.

 

Hell yes I have and I friggin hate that shi...stuff. It totally messes with your mind.

 

That feeling is you wanting SOMEBODY in general. You want companionship and connection. She (whoever she may be, since I'm speaking generically) appears to be receptive in the fact that she's not evasive or dismissive. It becomes frighteningly easy to take that little bit and runnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn with it in your own head.

 

That's why you ask people...and hope to find those that have done the same silly things. I don't think it will serve in your longer-term favor to pursue this....even if she is reciprocating.

[pepa]

I don't know if something like this could ever work between us even if she feels exactly the same way about me. I am just plain unsure, period.

 

I think your problem is indecision. Talk to her. Let her know how you feel. Ask her for a date… let’s see if you two connect and something happens.

 

BTW Have you read “New York, New York. A Poetic Journey”? it is a book of poems about a woman in her mid twenties who dates a man some thirty years older. I don’t know whether it is autobiographical or not, but the feelings described are intense and beautiful. Why should age make a difference?

 

The author/the character of this book had the balls to leave everything behind because she thought she had found TRUE LOVE. In short, you’ll never know if you can have a RELATIONSHIP with this woman unless you try.

 

Don’t listen to your pessimist side, and give your self a chance

[Curt]

Hi everyone,

 

I just wanted to give this post as an update on what happened when I went to the restaurant.

 

I did go to the restaurant, and actually left about 10 minutes or so ago.

 

I did talk to her at the end of my visit. I leave it to the forum and my own feelings to decide on whether I could have done things better or not.

 

I went up to pay the tab, and I started out by saying what I guess most guys would not. I told her very mildly but honestly that I thought I owed her an apology.

 

I told her that, when I gave her the note the other day, I think I made her uncomfortable, and that it wasn't what I meant to do.

 

I told her that I thought she was a fantastic young woman, and I felt that, and I just wanted to talk about that.

 

When I told her that I thought she was a fantastic young woman, I saw the greatest, warmest smile come from her that I ever did see.

 

She admitted to me that she was made a little uncomfortable by what I wrote on the note, but that it's ok.

 

I said, well, I guess that's it (or something similar), said thank-you, and left the building.

 

I would be a liar to say that I am not disappointed and heartbroken, but ... even still, I think I took the high road

 

I suppose now that I know how she feels, and she knows how I feels, I have achieved all I could.

 

Was I a complete numbskull? Hard to say...

 

Comments welcomed.

[Ryan]

I told her that, when I gave her the note the other day, I think I made her uncomfortable, and that it wasn't what I meant to do.

 

Note? Did I miss something? I'm assuming you left something in writing that professed your thoughts and feelings.

 

I would be a liar to say that I am not disappointed and heartbroken, but ... even still, I think I took the high road

 

I'd say you handled it pretty well. Then again, I don't think there was ever a worry about you being respectful in the matter.

 

Was I a complete numbskull? Hard to say...

 

Only if you didn't learn anything.

It's tough to open yourself up to rejection...regardless of the target. I know you're going to mull over what you COULD have done better...but there really wasn't much else to do.

[Curt]

Yeah Ryan, I apologize...never added in the detail from a couple days.

 

Well, last Wednesday, (July 9, 2003), I went back to the restaurant. I went in, and we chatted for a bit. She mentioned how she hadn't seen anyone for about 2 hours. She showed me a book that she had been looking at. Apparently, the owner of the restaurant (who is Chinese) had a book there of Common Chinese to English translations of daily used phrases. She was trying out writing the symbols, etc. We both looked through the book, and then I went to order my food, adding, "I dunno, it's beyond me." (The Chinese language that is...)

 

As I was eating (with my mind going about 1000 miles a minute wondering what to say to her) another couple came in and started eating, thus ruining my little plan. As there was nobody else there, I was intending to get her to come over and sit with me and chat. I noticed as I was eating that she was talking to someone on the telephone, and as I was starting to leave, she picked up her jacket. She was evidently on the way out.

 

Anyways, I paid her for the food, and asked her for a piece of paper.

 

She got it, and then I wrote down, as she watched..."too bad they came, I was gonna ask you over for a chat". She replied "Yeah." Well, to explain better, she said yeah in an almost hesitant, "I dunno" type of voice. (THAT WAS THE WARNING I GUESS). I said thanks, walked out, and as I was getting out of the rain into my car, she walked past, towards her car, and got in. She never said a word, or even looked back. I didn't know what to think.

 

Anyways, this past Friday I went there and I was advised to play it cool as I was there. Well, the visit ended up being a complete screw up, because my mother was there, and her friend. I sat with them, back on to her for the whole time practically. Anyways, as I was going up to pay the tab, I said nothing out of the way. After a few seconds pause, she says to me "Did you hear the thunder last night" (or something similar) {We had a bad thunderstorm the night before). Anyway, I told her yes, but that I didn't mind it. She said she didn't either.

 

I know I should have probably seen the writing on the wall clearer, but...why the hell the other probing questions, on earlier visits. Was she just playing with my head or ?

 

Oh well, I f#%@n well don't know.

 

No figuring them out.

[clia]

No offense, but you seem to spend an inordinate amount of time at that restaurant!

 

So, let me get this straight. You, a 32 year old man, gave her a note? Umm...okay.

 

She admitted to me that she was made a little uncomfortable by what I wrote on the note, but that it's ok. I said, well, I guess that's it (or something similar), said thank-you, and left the building.

 

Of course she was uncomfortable. Dude, you passed her a note. I mean...be an adult and ask her out on a date. Then, instead of following through, you ran away with your tail between your legs. What did you expect her to do? Ask you out? Profess her love?

 

I would be a liar to say that I am not disappointed and heartbroken, but ... even still, I think I took the high road

 

Don't waste time being heartbroken over something that never was.

 

I suppose now that I know how she feels, and she knows how I feels, I have achieved all I could.

 

I don't see how you know this at all, given what you posted. By her hesitancy? Because she was uncomfortable? The way you went about things was creepy. (At least IMO.) I think you would've been better off just asking her out instead of writing a note.

 

I know I should have probably seen the writing on the wall clearer, but...why the hell the other probing questions, on earlier visits. Was she just playing with my head or ?

 

Just because a woman is nice to you doesn't mean she wants to marry you and have, like, 10,000 of your babies. You read too much into everything she did, IMO.

[Curt]

OK Clia,

 

Given the tenure of the posts you have made in the forum, I am not surprised that you would interpret the things I did and said in the way you did.

 

Nonetheless, I suppose I should attempt to explain why I did things the way I did. I'm sure you won't agree with my rationale, but right now I couldn't care less.

 

Of course she was uncomfortable. Dude, you passed her a note. I mean...be an adult and ask her out on a date. Then, instead of following through, you ran away with your tail between your legs. What did you expect her to do? Ask you out? Profess her love?

 

I passed her a note because I really thought that, given there were more people in the place, it would be even more awkward if I were to out and ask her in the middle of the place. I was attempting to be tactful. You say I was running with my tail between my legs? That I expected her to PROFESS HER LOVE????Fine, be vicious. I expect no different from you.

 

Oh, just a bit of a lesson in logic...if you are saying:

 

The way you went about things was creepy. (At least IMO.) I think you would've been better off just asking her out instead of writing a note.

 

...given that you already said:

 

Don't waste time being heartbroken over something that never was.

 

It would have made NO difference if I did or didn't...because it never was.

 

Just because a woman is nice to you doesn't mean she wants to marry you and have, like, 10,000 of your babies. You read too much into everything she did, IMO.

 

Thanks so much Clia. Silly me....and here I had the ring already picked out, a honeymoon suite booked, even my vacation time scheduled to coincide with the wedding. I so wish I had things figured out as well as you.

 

Curt

[clia]

Given the tenure of the posts you have made in the forum, I am not surprised that you would interpret the things I did and said in the way you did.

 

I gave you my impression because you asked for it over on the other thread. The tenure of my posts? What does that mean? If it's too much to ask for a guy who is interested to ask me out on a date rather than pass me a cryptic note, then I guess I'm guilty as charged.

 

I passed her a note because I really thought that, given there were more people in the place, it would be even more awkward if I were to out and ask her in the middle of the place.

 

I'm just unclear on why you didn't wait until the next time you were speaking with her and simply ask her out on a date during the normal flow of conversation. My impression, as a girl, is that the note thing is juvenile and weird.

 

It would have made NO difference if I did or didn't...because it never was.

 

My logic is that it might have been if you had asked her out to begin with. But now you are heartbroken over something that never existed, even though you took no steps to try and make it exist. Trying is not overrated.

 

I so wish I had things figured out as well as you.

 

Your posts indicated that you thought she was hard to figure out and that you thought she was playing with your head. I'm pointing out to you that you read too much into things. She wasn't playing any games, she was being nice. Not hard to figure out there. And the only way to find out if nice translates into dating interest is to ask.

[Curt]

If it's too much to ask for a guy who is interested to ask me out on a date rather than pass me a cryptic note, then I guess I'm guilty as charged.

 

Clia, I was trying to take things slow. I didn't want to rush things too much, as I'm sure that doing so would have been read as more than weird, and probably more "stalker" like than anything.

 

I would certainly have loved to ask her out, when the time was right. Fact is, I was also otherwise advised by a female friend to take it slow. In retrospect, of course I would do things differently. One just does what s/he feels is best to do at the time.

 

I'm just unclear on why you didn't wait until the next time you were speaking with her and simply ask her out on a date during the normal flow of conversation. My impression, as a girl, is that the note thing is juvenile and weird.

 

I gave you my reasoning as to why beforehand. If it was juvenile and weird, then so be it.

 

My logic is that it might have been if you had asked her out to begin with.

 

I'm not sure anymore if it could have been.

 

And even so, could the note have been THAT juvenile, THAT weird, that it could ruin a chance if there actually was one? If so...jeeesh...good luck to whomever she chooses...make one mistake and ... see ya.

 

I'm tending towards Ryan's earlier viewpoint.

 

you took no steps to try and make it exist. Trying is not overrated.

 

 

No comment on this one. I have many to say, but I don't believe I could really address my frustration and irritation at those words very well right now.

 

I'm pointing out to you that you read too much into things. She wasn't playing any games, she was being nice. Not hard to figure out there. And the only way to find out if nice translates into dating interest is to ask.

 

Not hard to figure out!!!!!!!!!! Just being nice!!!!!!!!!!

 

Listen, thanks for your input Clia. But if after interacting with her on many occasions (in a FRIENDLY way), after asking about each other's school and work lives, family, etc., and after seeing that I was not some stalker or S.O.B., Karen still couldn't see past a well-meant (but perhaps ill-fated) note on a piece of paper, then maybe not having a chance with her right now is a good thing.

 

Do I truly believe that? I leave that to you to decide.

 

"For those who do not understand, no explanation shall ever suffice. For those who do understand, no explanation shall ever be required."