Now what?

[Billy Bob]

You cannot change how she feels or use logic or even ask for an answer... because she doesn't know why she feels that way either..

 

BS, I really think all the postulation that these wayward spouses don't know why they want to "find themselves".. or "do it on my own" is a bunch of crap... Treating them like they have a mental disease or something.

 

They want out of the relationship and don't know how to be honest about it except by making up non-threatening reasons. Real reasons could be;

 

"Handsome single guy stud down the street has asked her out twice".. which translates into "I need to experience life by myself"..

 

Or.

 

"she's banging co-worker" which translates into "I need to find out who I truly am"..

 

Or.

 

"I've been banging a guy off and on for 3 months and we want to move into together" which translates into "I love you - but am not in-love with you"

 

Or

 

"Let's have a trial seperation" which translates into " I want to make sure I can pull it on my own before we file for divorce".

 

Just some examples... and they will never, never, ever admit to an affair. They will deny it two ways to Sunday..

 

6 months since you were intimate... something is up, up, UP! Don't be a dummy.

[Billy Bob]

If we have ever had anything in our relationship it is honesty. We agreed even before we got married that if either of us wanted to be with someone else we would breakup first and never do it behind each others back. That may seem like bull**** to some of you, but I based on our relationship I know it to be true. Even so, I felt I had to ask her that point blank as well and her answer was "No, I am not doing this because I have found someone else or want to go find someone else. I am trying to find me." To be honest I think the "trying to find me" stuff is buncha bull****...which is likely another red flag that we are still no where near understanding why we are where we are. Hopefully she will agree to the counseling and we can figure it out. I know neither of us really want to split (I think) but somehow we gotta get past this log jam.

 

OK, If you guys are so honest with one another, then take her point-blank answer to your question below at face value;

 

I asked her the other day if she wanted to remain married and she got pissed that I asked so directly (I told her "only Yes or No - no more "I don't knows". So she said "No".

 

She wants a divorce, but she doesn't want to hurt you. Whatever her reasons (probably an affair).

 

Stop trying to read into it, grasping at any hope... If she wanted to be married to you, she would say she does.. Time to MOVE ON! Let it sink in that you will not be living the rest of your life with this woman. You cannot control this. There are plenty of wonderful women out there that would love to have you.. Don't settle for scraps of affection and maybe's from someone who does not feel the same about you as you do her..

[Sum1'sGot2RepThe530]

OK, If you guys are so honest with one another, then take her point-blank answer to your question below at face value;

 

 

 

She wants a divorce, but she doesn't want to hurt you. Whatever her reasons (probably an affair).

 

Stop trying to read into it, grasping at any hope... If she wanted to be married to you, she would say she does.. Time to MOVE ON! Let it sink in that you will not be living the rest of your life with this woman. You cannot control this. There are plenty of wonderful women out there that would love to have you.. Don't settle for scraps of affection and maybe's from someone who does not feel the same about you as you do her..

Great two posts.

 

What he said.

[Chrome Barracuda]

Like I told someone else on his thread:

 

Dont matyr yourself.

 

The fact remains is she is probably going through a MLC.

 

She doesnt want to leave but she wants to sow her wild oats. it aint about you, it's all about her. And she knows it. She's too much of a coward to tell you what she really wants because she doesnt want to look like a bottom feeding whore.

 

But hey, it is what it is.

 

She wants to run the streets guilt free. bottom line.

 

Let her go. move on. because when it's all said and done. she'll be back. In some form or another. they always knock on your door.

[TrustInYourself]

I don't agree. She told you know because you demanded an answer. Ultimatums are not fair to give. If you told someone like your mom, clean my pants or I want you gone, how would she react?

[Chrome Barracuda]

I don't agree. She told you know because you demanded an answer. Ultimatums are not fair to give. If you told someone like your mom, clean my pants or I want you gone, how would she react?

 

Ultimatums arent fair but you need to know where you stand, how do you know what course to action to take if you arent getting a clear answer???

 

And why would I give my mom an ultimatum on cleaning my pants I can do it on my own. lol.

[Billy Bob]

She doesnt want to leave but she wants to sow her wild oats. it aint about you, it's all about her. And she knows it. She's too much of a coward to tell you what she really wants because she doesnt want to look like a bottom feeding whore.

 

I agree... CB is putting it pretty bluntly though. We really aren't trying to be a bunch of a-holes.. But are really trying to get you to open your eyes. maybe you need to write down all the facts and stare at them.

 

You are grasping at affection, trying to formulate some way in your mind that this isn't really happening or that she is dillusional and will just snap out of it. Marriages and relationships end, it's a part of life. The person leaving detaches much sooner than the unknowing spouse left behind. We have seen it all before. She does not have feelings for you like you still have for her.

 

Meh, I guess it just takes time and people have to realize it for themselves..

[Billy Bob]

I don't agree. She told you know because you demanded an answer. Ultimatums are not fair to give. If you told someone like your mom, clean my pants or I want you gone, how would she react?

 

I think an ultimatum like "Do you want to be married to me anymore" or "Do you want a divorce" are perfectly acceptable.. especially after getting so many "I'm not sure" or "I don't know" answers.

 

Put up or shut up mentality. I couldn't live in a limbo where I didn't know if my spouse loved me or wanted to stay married to me... That's torture.. and as soon as you can get out of that limbo and move on with your life the better.

[Chrome Barracuda]

I agree CTA limbo sucks!!!!

 

Thats what I gave my ex girl. I said him or me. And I chose for her when I walked away. took the choice outta her hands because I had more respect for myself not to be toyed with and I deserved better.

[TrustInYourself]

I see hope here. Honesty is important.

 

I just think you and the wife have gotten into the habit of drawing lines in the sand. For once, don't draw a line in the sand. Give her space to think. Give up control.

 

Here's something that could change everything if you are willing.

You can't do it if you don't care for her anymore. You can only do the following if you have love in your heart for your wife and if you're sorry about how you've ended up where you are at.

 

Take some time one morning to make coffee for your wife when you know she won't have plans or be too busy. Ask her if she has a moment, hold her hand, look into her eyes, and apologize for the way you've neglected her needs. Apologize for the pain and hurt that you regret. Afterwards, listen to what she says but don't say a thing. Just listen. Not a word.

 

Keep in mind, you're not apologizing for show. You have to be genuine and ready to give up your anger and contempt for just a few moments. Picture the happiest moments in your marriage and it should be something that you can do.

 

It's up to you. As I said, this isn't for cynical, no-love, angry types that are everywhere on this forum. They mean well!

[Billy Bob]

It's up to you. As I said, this isn't for cynical, no-love, angry types that are everywhere on this forum. They mean well!

 

I know some of us come across as mean and hateful, in reality we are experienced and realists.

 

I guess it's kind of like a bunch of little kids who all dream of becoming astronauts.. Yes anything is possible, but the reality is that 99,999 out of 100,000 kids dreaming of becoming an astronaut are not going to acheive their dream. As an experienced adult, this is pretty obvious. Although as you grow up in school you are fed lots of nonsense that you could become an astronaut or President, or...

 

A few of us lurkers on this board have been through the same place some of you newbies are in, we have also followed numerous threads over the years. For the most part you are blinded by love/obsession trying to get back a relationship that is over in your partner's eyes. Usually, in my opinion, when it gets to the point where there is an OM or they want a divorce.. it's inevitable...and usually even if you can get them to concede to try, there has been too much damage and the relationship fally apart a short time later once again.

 

A lot of you seem like a group of little kids all telling themselves you're going to be astronauts.. While it's a lofty goal, some of us just want to dose some reality into the threads.

[TrustInYourself]

Dream big, win big! lol

[cyabye]

Sorry but her reason (NOT enough kisses) for "not in love with you" is horse shrit. Sounds like she's got a thing for the grass is greener on the other side of the hill (or was it London?). Do yourself a favor and let it go.

 

cyabye

[B2112]

Well I've tried thousand ways now and she is showing no signs of budging from her position. I've done (as someone suggested here) the "Hold her hand and tell her I love her and apologized up and down for my past mistakes..." thing and while that seemed to result in a few days of us actually "talking", ultimately it lead nowhere. Last night she once again told me that she can't see herself changing the way she feels (loves me, thinks I'm a great dad...but doesn't LOVE me).

 

Okay so I think I finally got the hint...

 

So now, quite frankly, I'm pissed off. She wants a nice touchy-feely seperation (she still won't say divorce) and I'm sorry but I don't. As I told her "I am not gonna be your ex-husband-friend". (She was married before (no kids) and she and her ex still talk from time to time and even occasionally go out for a beer (I've always been cool with that and no they are not having an affair!). Call me what you will (spitefull, angry, vengefull) but when we split it's not gonna be "It was great, I'm just sorry it did not work out" - nope it's gonna be "F - you, you selfish Btch!! (just not in front of the kids). Other than working out things with our kids I have absolutely no desire for contact with her. I want a clean break ASAP so I can move on.

 

I'm sure many of you will say "In time you'll get over it..." but honestly I doubt it. I will have some kind of hate in me always towards her. Yep I made some mistakes, could have done better...but all in all I was damn good to her and always went above and beyond to try and make her happy but in my humble opinion ever since we have been married it's been "All about her" (She even has a t-shirt and hat that say that). Bitter - you bet I F-ing am.

 

So now for the messy part. Okay, I know everyone here will say "Whatever you do, make sure you don't do anything to hurt the kids". I pledge to all that I will never pit my children between her and I (though honestly it's gonna be really hard for me to say the "Mommy and daddy have just moved apart..."crap when I really want to say "Mommy wants to leave" (BUT I WON'T!!!). However, I do expect things to get touchy because I fully intend to get custody of my kids. I have already asked her to move out - suggesting she go live with her parents who only live 10 minutes from us...they even have a apartment on thier lakefront property she could move into (They have a nice house). But her repsonse was "no, I don't want to do that". Which really pisses me off because I have no such alternate choice of my own (my mom died a 2 months ago, my dad lives 3000 miles away, my one sibling that lives in the area could not even squeeze a new pet into her tiny house). Which leaves me with getting an apartment (which I really don't want to do). When I suggested this she talked about us "sharing" an apartment - one of us go there for two weeks and then rotate back to the house. My response "F -that!". This goes back to that touchy-feeling separation thing... Why in the hell would I want to go live in a apartment (part time) that I share with her??? Jeezus - does that sound as stupid as I think it does to anyone else? I know, I know, do it for the kids...but holy F, where do you draw the line. Right now I want about as much space between her and I as humanly possible.

 

I would love to hear from dads out there who have got custudy of their kids. Any advice you can give would be great. It seems like a no-brainer to me that I would get them, but I know she will fight me for some kinda joint custody - then her folks will end up taking care of my kids most of the time. For gawd sakes she has been away on business for 1/3 of 2008 so far! And that is not an exaggeration - I actually got out the calender where she marks down her travels and all totaled she has been away on travel 45 days this year. This does not include the late nights and almost every weekend she works. As I have said before - I supported her on all of this, but to me it just shows who really is the "parent" here. In a addition to that she has stated many times over the years "I really don't want to be a mom right now". Sure that was said in frustration...but who says that (often)? I'll tell ya who - someone who just wants out.

[Chrome Barracuda]

then you know what, you go a hard 180 on her ass!!!!!

 

I mean hard!!!

 

I agree if you dont want to be friends with her, then dont. That's her problem. Most exes' still want to be friends after they break your heart, that I dont understand. If a woman breaks your heart why would you want to still be in pain with her around. You want her to throw her OM in your face while your still in pain.

 

Some dudes can't do that, they'd rather she not exist at all if she 's gonna leave.

 

My rule is if she leaves, she stays gone.

 

Get a lawyer and start seperating finances, go get a strong female lawyer and prepare for a fight to get your kids.

 

If she doesnt want to be there, she has to leave, or you sell the house and split everything. Dont do that switching houses crap. Dont make it easy for her.

 

I wish you the best, when it's all said and done you'll land on your feet.

 

Good men all do. Like I said she wants to be single, then give it to her.

 

File for divorce and request full custody. She may be a decent woman but good mom she isnt.

 

What kind of woman says: I dont want to be a mother right now?

 

You dont have that choice when you have kids, throw them away when they dont suit you? WTF?

[B2112]

That's exactly what I plan to do.

[2sunny]

well -

 

if she wants more kissing etc. and you don't want to - and all this is held in such high priority - then divorce each other and find more compatible mates. or just be happy on your own.

 

you were given your guidelines to make her happy and you shrugged it off because "you didn't want to/ or didn't like it." also - the great husband you portray yourself as totally disregarded her needs in order for you to be selfish.

 

if you REALLY are a loving and giving person you would have bent over backwards for her request. you didn't want to - plain and simple. we all do things in life when we don't want to... that's called LIFE. maybe you don't love her as much as you think you did...

 

by the way - i think if you wanted a BJ or anything else from her everyday/week for your own happiness - there is nothing wrong with allowing her to understand that a regular BJ would make you a happy man too.

 

a give and take relationship requires communication and compromise - none of which i am seeing either of you willing to do - so just divorce and be happier and less frustrated for it.

[Gunny376]

Kissing stimulates testoserone in both women and men ~ in fact men can pass on additional testoserone via kissing by means of exhacnging saliva, thus further stimulating one's desire for intimate contact.

[2sunny]

Kissing stimulates testoserone in both women and men ~ in fact men can pass on additional testoserone via kissing by means of exhacnging saliva, thus further stimulating one's desire for intimate contact.

 

gunny -

 

i'm sure he recognizes that kissing can stimulate a lot of things - but it still doesn't mean he is willing to make the effort!

[Billy Bob]

I would love to hear from dads out there who have got custudy of their kids. Any advice you can give would be great. It seems like a no-brainer to me that I would get them, but I know she will fight me for some kinda joint custody - then her folks will end up taking care of my kids most of the time. For gawd sakes she has been away on business for 1/3 of 2008 so far! And that is not an exaggeration - I actually got out the calender where she marks down her travels and all totaled she has been away on travel 45 days this year. This does not include the late nights and almost every weekend she works. As I have said before - I supported her on all of this, but to me it just shows who really is the "parent" here. In a addition to that she has stated many times over the years "I really don't want to be a mom right now". Sure that was said in frustration...but who says that (often)? I'll tell ya who - someone who just wants out.

 

I have full physical custody of my kids (7 & 9)... While it is not easy being a single dad, I know I can raise them better than their dingbat mom.

 

You need to initiate divorce paperwork, a child custody plan.. don't even tell her you are doing this. Get your affairs in order, see a lawyer - check your credit, close any outstanding accounts in both your names.. Just time it all so you can drop the bomb. Once you serve her divorce (or legal seperation) papers, that date effectively serves as the cutoff date for joint financial and legal responsibilities. Any debts she runs up are hers. Don't let her go get legal council on your dime, hit her with the papers, cancel all the joint credit cards on the same date. STEALTH, then SHOCK and AWE!

 

Once the papers have been served (and legal/financial seperation is in effect) and your joint money supplies cut off, then if you want to negotiate go for it. Just protect yourself.

 

Don't give her a clue as to what is going on! Pretend like you are still trying to woo her back. Don't lose your cool, don't call her names, act wimpy and somewhat clingy.. pull off the best acting job in your life. Behind the scenes take action, be smart - not emotional.\

 

I spend 4 months feeding my ex-wife's dillusions, pleading with her to work it out, behind the scenes I knew I was done. My ex wanted a divorce too and played the same games your's has.. I was the one who filed. I dropped the paperwork on her and shed alligator tears, I continually asked her if she thought we could ever get back together after the divorce.. she thought she was still in-control, still had me wrapped around her finger.

 

Her work schedule is going to play against her big time in getting custody of those kids..

[B2112]

You know what? F the kissing thing. If that truley is what has destroyed our marriage then I find it almost laughable. Petty BS if you ask me, especially when you stack it up against everything else I bent over backwards doing for her.

 

I have pretty much messed up the sneak attack you (cta7978) suggested. I told her today that I want her to move out and I want custody of the kids. She balked big time at that - said there is no way she'll let me take her kids away from her. Said she didn't want to be a "weekend parent". The way I see it though, she may not have a say in the matter. She got really testy when I pointed out she had already been away 1/3 of 2008 (45 days) on business trips and therefore already qualifies as a part-time mom...ouch - the truth hurts huh?

[Billy Bob]

If she hasn't filed yet, then you still have the advantage... Don't even bring it up, just go and file.. it will probably take you a few weeks at the least to go through the paperwork. You want to be the first to file!

[Gunny376]

I was on the way out when I posted the thing about kissing, ~ and I was posting it for your consideration PD ~ Post Divorce

 

You still have the home-court advantage if you follow CTA's advice,, she probally still thinks your just trying to blow smoke up her skirt.about her moving out and your getting custody of the children.

 

Follow CTA's game-plan, (its really the only one you have) and throw in a little begging, pleading, whinning while getting your legal SWAT team in place.

 

I seriously doubt that its just about kissing, and all of that ~ but if that's all it takes for her to balk ~ then its time for you to walk.

 

You as the primary caregiver in fact, (her being gone 45 days out of the year on business sets up the precedent for you to get custody post-divorce.

 

Women get custody 90% of the time primary because the husband doesn't seek it, but in the 10% of the cases where the husband does seek custody they're awarded it 90% of the time.

 

It pretty much comes down to getting her in court and having your attorney ask her, "Mrs B112, what are your plans for the children when your out of town on business 1/3 of the year. Who's going to take them to ball practice, to the Dr's, care for them when they're sick or injured. Wouldn't the obvious choice be the person that's already doing that?"

[ktmrider]

Wow! You problem is almost identical to mine.

But she still kisses me in the morning before she goes to work and when she comes back but I'm different from your situation in that my wife has another guy on the side. She loves me differently from the way she loves the other guy (that's what she told me).

 

I think we are just both losers not good enough to be a good husband to our wives.

 

I'm glad to see that there is someone like me out there....