Why all the focus on the OW - is it sexual jealousy?

[angie2443]

WF that is a perfect example of how people cheat on their partners.

I'm sorry to hear that, and like your story there are many many stories of deceit that don't involve another woman or man.

 

I can't remember if I saw it on LS or where but I read something the other day that said the OW/OM can be:

 

- the bottle

- work

- sports

- addictions

- porn

- drugs

- untreated depression

- outings with friends

- friends

- hobbies

 

My mother always said this too. The OW can come in many forms.

 

Don't forget LS. This is my OM. My husband hates that I come here and doesn't like that I'm talking to the people on the message boards.

 

Of course his OM, and sometimes mine, is video games. I know what it feels to be a WoW widow!

[Owl]

Don't forget LS. This is my OM. My husband hates that I come here and doesn't like that I'm talking to the people on the message boards.

 

Of course his OM, and sometimes mine, is video games. I know what it feels to be a WoW widow!

 

Not only was video gaming my wife's OM...its how she actually MET her OM!!!

 

When she first started playing EQ, she got immediately addicted...heavily so. She lost her job (and EQ was a small part of the reason for that, there were other bigger factors too), and started staying home logging 16+ hours/day in game. This became a HUGE source of contention between us, and led to a lot of the strife that created the start of the rift between us, contributing to her affair.

 

I believe she got into the very start of an EA with one OM in game...but when he basically showed what kind of dog he was, that ended that attraction.

 

Later, she met the guy who ended up becoming her OM while gaming in EQ. Very long story in all of this...but I've pretty much come to the conclusion that online gaming can be VERY risky to marriages that don't recognize the dangers.

 

We stopped all online gaming for a good while, and have SLOWLY gotten back into it in WoW. But HOW we play, WHEN we play are very, very different than before.

 

I've seen at least a dozen (and I'm NOT exaggerating in any way here) marriages that have been destroyed as a result of affiars started via online gaming in MMOPRG's. And many more that were destroyed by someone's addiction to online gaming, even if there was no "other person".

[White Flower]

I've seen at least a dozen (and I'm NOT exaggerating in any way here) marriages that have been destroyed as a result of affiars started via online gaming in MMOPRG's. And many more that were destroyed by someone's addiction to online gaming, even if there was no "other person".

Wow, this is so informational. My H likes to play backgammon online with strangers. I now wonder if they're strangers? I guess it doesn't matter any more, though.

 

I've never heard of the other games before. The part I bolded reminds me of my H's addiction with online investing. It was much like a game for him. He changed his orders like every ten minutes. Scary stuff.

[White Flower]

Don't forget LS. This is my OM. My husband hates that I come here and doesn't like that I'm talking to the people on the message boards.

 

Of course his OM, and sometimes mine, is video games. I know what it feels to be a WoW widow!

My H never knew I was on LS. He thought I was just chatting with someone. I almost told him once to relieve him of his worries but then I figured he'd read up and find out who I was. And since he never wanted to relieve me of my worries I figured why bother.

 

But your H can read anytime what you are posting and that it's all sound advice. Why is he threatened by that? It's like reading your diary and getting to know you better. Like you're an open book. I would think he would like that.

[angie2443]

We stopped all online gaming for a good while, and have SLOWLY gotten back into it in WoW. But HOW we play, WHEN we play are very, very different than before.

 

What is EQ? It sounds familiar.

 

I played WoW for a few days when I signed up for the trial version. I ended it on the third day because I knew I would be to addicted. I have a husband and children that need my attention and the game would compete with them if I played it.

 

My husband played a different online game and I can't remember the name now. Before the game, we would usually go to bed together, cuddle, talk or do other things. When He became hooked, he would play for hours on end. He would often stay up untill 4:00 am (he worked mid shift) He wouldn't help me with the baby or the house work. I became extremely lonely. Here's the funny part, though. When I tried to talk to him about how this was hurting our marriage, he'd say that it's just a game, and at least he wasn't out all hours of the night. Then, he'd ask his buddies what they thought, and they'd say that I should be happy that he was home at least. I think they were just siding with him to keep him happy. My husband remembers those days as bieng good and still can't see why I was unhappy:rolleyes:.

 

There are few things that I will tell my husband I can't handle in our marriage, online gaming is one of them. Maybe when the children are grown, or if he shows he can limit his time on them then we can play them again. Untill then, our marriage is too important to risk for them.

[angie2443]

My H never knew I was on LS. He thought I was just chatting with someone. I almost told him once to relieve him of his worries but then I figured he'd read up and find out who I was. And since he never wanted to relieve me of my worries I figured why bother.

 

But your H can read anytime what you are posting and that it's all sound advice. Why is he threatened by that? It's like reading your diary and getting to know you better. Like you're an open book. I would think he would like that.

 

 

I wish he would he see it like that, but I think he's worried that some people might agree with and, well, that would make it harder for him to convince me he is right and I am wrong.

 

Also, I think he's bothered that I give my time to other things besides him and the family. He seems to be more bothered too when I talk about the men on here than the women. I never say anything personal about the posters, I'm more talking about their situations and curious about he,my husband, feels they should be resolved. I don't completely understand my husband at times, probably never will, but I still love him.

[angie2443]

Wow, this is so informational. My H likes to play backgammon online with strangers. I now wonder if they're strangers? I guess it doesn't matter any more, though.

 

I've never heard of the other games before. The part I bolded reminds me of my H's addiction with online investing. It was much like a game for him. He changed his orders like every ten minutes. Scary stuff.

 

 

I could be wrong, but I don't think backgammon would be as dangerous as something like WoW. In WoW, you enter into another world wich is often more beautiful, exciting, and enchanting then your own. I know this sounds cheesy, but it's true. You're no longer the housewife, secretary, janitor, or whatever, but a beautiful or handsome elf with some real cool powers. When you pick up a mission or complete one, they play this music that kind of gets your beating. It's so easy to get hooked into the fantisy of it all.

 

I rarely watch South Park, but they had a really good episode which showed the reality the WoW is to some people. The four main kids (I think there's four) played WoW, but some player on line was so powerful that he was killing off all the other players in the game. They showed a quick glimpse of this guy, and he was overwheight, sickly looking, and drinking an energy drink.

 

The kids decided they had to do something. They decided that they would build up their charectors so they were strong enough to kill this guy. They would level up by killing elk or deer over and over. You spend hours and hours leveling up in these games by killing animals or whatever over and over. By the end of the show, the kids were sitting at their computers leveling up. They were over weight, sickly looking and drinking energy drinks.

 

The fantisy of on line games is great, but sometimes you have to turnn off the computer and enjoy real life.

[Owl]

Actually, backgammon could be as dangerous as EQ. A couple of years ago, there was a WW/FWW who went by the name "CARDSONLY"...because she'd met her OM online playing cards (maybe like pogo, dunno the site or forum)...and she'd insisted to her H that she was "only playing cards" with him. Until, of course it escalated into an EA.

 

Even forums like this can pose a risk, if you begin sharing PM's with others that you could be attracted to. Starts as PM, ends up escalating from there. I've seen it happen on another marriage forum, as a matter of fact.

 

The thing is, you can say whatever you want to say about yourself online...you can emphasize the good, you can minimize the bad. And the other person on the far end is whatever you picture them to be based on what they tell you. The 'fantasy factor' becomes much higher online.

 

The format of the interaction online doesn't matter much. Back in the day, everyone loved chat rooms. Then they turned "dirty"...everyone knew that if you were in a chat room, you were 'looking to hook up'. But online gaming, forums, gamesites...all provide the same kind of interaction you can get in a chat room, without the stigma. You can hide behind your char/avatar/forum name...and show only what you want to show of yourself. Its less "risky"...until you meet someone and start expanding that contact.

 

I learned a LOT about online interaction and the type of communication that leads to emotional bonding as a result of my wife's online EA.

 

Oh yeah...EQ=Everquest. Sorry about that.

[angie2443]

Actually, backgammon could be as dangerous as EQ. A couple of years ago, there was a WW/FWW who went by the name "CARDSONLY"...because she'd met her OM online playing cards (maybe like pogo, dunno the site or forum)...and she'd insisted to her H that she was "only playing cards" with him. Until, of course it escalated into an EA.

 

Even forums like this can pose a risk, if you begin sharing PM's with others that you could be attracted to. Starts as PM, ends up escalating from there. I've seen it happen on another marriage forum, as a matter of fact.

 

The thing is, you can say whatever you want to say about yourself online...you can emphasize the good, you can minimize the bad. And the other person on the far end is whatever you picture them to be based on what they tell you. The 'fantasy factor' becomes much higher online.

 

The format of the interaction online doesn't matter much. Back in the day, everyone loved chat rooms. Then they turned "dirty"...everyone knew that if you were in a chat room, you were 'looking to hook up'. But online gaming, forums, gamesites...all provide the same kind of interaction you can get in a chat room, without the stigma. You can hide behind your char/avatar/forum name...and show only what you want to show of yourself. Its less "risky"...until you meet someone and start expanding that contact.

 

I learned a LOT about online interaction and the type of communication that leads to emotional bonding as a result of my wife's online EA.

 

Oh yeah...EQ=Everquest. Sorry about that.

 

You've got a point. I didn't think about the PM's and so on.

[Lookingforward]

Of course some of the reason for the focus on the OW could be that some BS prefer to believe the existence of the OW is the ONLY reason their M was in jeopardy. Once the OW is dealt with all will be "fine in paradise" once again (from the BS pov at least)

 

Denial is a wonderful security blanket

[Owl]

LF, having successfully recovered a marriage, I can tell you that getting rid of the OM/OW is NOT the "end all" for recovering a marriage, and the majority of BS's out there know that clearly.

 

BUT...they also know VERY WELL, AND VERY ACCURATELY...that nothing can be done to recover the marriage at all while the OM/OW is still involved in the situation. Its a simple thing to see.

 

And there's no 'denial' in it.

 

Denial is an OW/OM claiming that there involvment with the MM/MW has no impact on the marriage situation.

[bentnotbroken]

Of course some of the reason for the focus on the OW could be that some BS prefer to believe the existence of the OW is the ONLY reason their M was in jeopardy. Once the OW is dealt with all will be "fine in paradise" once again (from the BS pov at least)

 

Denial is a wonderful security blanket

 

 

 

I can honestly say that I don't know any BS who believes this. Whether the M survives or not, there is a change that doesn't go away. And there me be one M that the AP is the soul reason for the problems.

[luvmy2ns]

Denial is an OW/OM claiming that there involvment with the MM/MW has no impact on the marriage situation.

 

And haven't we seen lots of that on LS!

[Lookingforward]

LF, having successfully recovered a marriage, I can tell you that getting rid of the OM/OW is NOT the "end all" for recovering a marriage, and the majority of BS's out there know that clearly.

 

BUT...they also know VERY WELL, AND VERY ACCURATELY...that nothing can be done to recover the marriage at all while the OM/OW is still involved in the situation. Its a simple thing to see.

 

And there's no 'denial' in it.

 

Denial is an OW/OM claiming that there involvment with the MM/MW has no impact on the marriage situation.

 

I DID say 'some' and I never at any time implied there wasn't an impact - what I stated was that SOME BS prefer to believe that once the OW/OM goes away all is fine.......

 

possibly the same BS that are getting their needs met so don't "see a problem" in the M , period ?

[Lookingforward]

I can honestly say that I don't know any BS who believes this. Whether the M survives or not, there is a change that doesn't go away. And there me be one M that the AP is the soul reason for the problems.

 

well none of us know someone that fits EVERY scenario, do we ? Doesn't mean it's not so

[Lookingforward]

LF, having successfully recovered a marriage, I can tell you that getting rid of the OM/OW is NOT the "end all" for recovering a marriage, and the majority of BS's out there know that clearly.

 

BUT...they also know VERY WELL, AND VERY ACCURATELY...that nothing can be done to recover the marriage at all while the OM/OW is still involved in the situation. Its a simple thing to see.

 

And there's no 'denial' in it.

 

Denial is an OW/OM claiming that there involvment with the MM/MW has no impact on the marriage situation.

 

 

oh , and please don't deny that some BS are more interested in recovering the 'status quo' than the M for it's own sake

[Owl]

LF, I'm not interested in playing your game of bashing back and forth.

 

I can tell you why I saved MY marriage. I can speculate why others save theirs. You're free to do the same thing, with your own point of view added in or not. Have fun.

[White Flower]

I wish he would he see it like that, but I think he's worried that some people might agree with and, well, that would make it harder for him to convince me he is right and I am wrong.

 

Also, I think he's bothered that I give my time to other things besides him and the family. He seems to be more bothered too when I talk about the men on here than the women. I never say anything personal about the posters, I'm more talking about their situations and curious about he,my husband, feels they should be resolved. I don't completely understand my husband at times, probably never will, but I still love him.

I'm glad you still love him;)

 

Many Hs don't want to deal with issues and feel cornered or belittled when a W offers a self-help book for him to read, counseling, or even LS. The truth is, he probably doesn't feel worthy enough to stand up for himself (because he might just be wrong) so would rather ignore the whole thing.

 

In Men are from Mars...Dr. John Gray suggests that men don't feel comfortable taking advice from anyone unless they are experts on the subject. They also like being problem solvers hence being reluctant to ask for directions. So, when a man can't solve his own problem, or talk to an expert he isn't going to accept anyone else's advice very often.

 

Sometimes we (both sexes) forget that years of experience can make us an expert on certain issues. Take OWL, for example, or LsD.

 

I couldn't get my H to read any of the books I bought or into more than a few counseling sessions. Every time a counselor pointed out that I might be in the right my H bolted. His pride was too great. I hope your H isn't as proud as mine in that regard. Hopefully, he'll become more understanding in hopes of keeping his M happy.

[Lookingforward]

LF, I'm not interested in playing your game of bashing back and forth.

 

I can tell you why I saved MY marriage. I can speculate why others save theirs. You're free to do the same thing, with your own point of view added in or not. Have fun.

 

I don't believe I was "bashing" I'm sorry your situation leads you to believe I was, and fwiw this IS the OW/OM board so I feel entitiled to chime in with what after all is MY opinion on the topic

[White Flower]

Of course some of the reason for the focus on the OW could be that some BS prefer to believe the existence of the OW is the ONLY reason their M was in jeopardy. Once the OW is dealt with all will be "fine in paradise" once again (from the BS pov at least)

 

Denial is a wonderful security blanket

I think what LF is trying to say is that some BSs really think that if OW never came along the M would be perfectly fine. Truth is, the OW was just a catalyst in discovering all the issues that lead up to him taking the OW on. Some BSs believe that their Hs can be stolen. Nobody can steal another person away. Choices. We all make choices.

[Lookingforward]

I think what LF is trying to say is that some BSs really think that if OW never came along the M would be perfectly fine. Truth is, the OW was just a catalyst in discovering all the issues that lead up to him taking the OW on. Some BSs believe that their Hs can be stolen. Nobody can steal another person away. Choices. We all make choices.

 

Thanks for clarifying WF - yes, pretty much what I was saying but it's interesting to see the kneejerk responses

[bentnotbroken]

LF, I'm not interested in playing your game of bashing back and forth.

 

I can tell you why I saved MY marriage. I can speculate why others save theirs. You're free to do the same thing, with your own point of view added in or not. Have fun.

 

 

Ditto, and they say it's the BS with the bugs up our butts.

[Owl]

I think what LF is trying to say is that some BSs really think that if OW never came along the M would be perfectly fine. Truth is, the OW was just a catalyst in discovering all the issues that lead up to him taking the OW on. Some BSs believe that their Hs can be stolen. Nobody can steal another person away. Choices. We all make choices.

 

Good clarification, and done with language deliberately phrased to be non-provoking. Makes it much easier to provide an intelligent response to...thank you, WF.

 

I agree with what you say. But I want to offer some "food for thought" for you.

 

I hear many OW/OM here say that if there was nothing wrong in the marriage, the WS wouldn't be willing to stray. And in many cases, that could well be the case.

 

But...if the "something wrong" isn't in the marriage...if its IN THE WS to begin with...

 

If its not the marital situation, but a mindset or personality characteristic or even a temporary emotional trouble (i.e...depression) that is WITHIN THE WS...

 

Where does that fit in here? MY case is a primary example of what I'm pointing out. Our marriage was GREAT for 16+ years. Then my wife busted an ankle, was unable to move around much, and became depressed when she lost her job as a result. During this time, she became addicted to online gaming...partially as a response to depression. The online gaming, and her depression...combined...led to the marital strain, and eventually to her affair.

 

Our marriage wasn't the "source" of the problem. I wasn't doing anything wrong to create the situation.

 

Now...OM didn't "steal her away". But...he DID take advantage of a temporary condition that made my wife vulnerable. I'm not attacking him here...he fell in love with the same things in my wife that I did. I understand his motivations.

 

 

 

But there's this huge assumption here that the BS created, or even participated in the situation that led to their spouse choosing to have an affair. SOMETIMES, there is.

 

If the OM hadn't come along in my case...my wife would have likely been forced to recognize the source of the problems (her untreated depression and gaming addiction) through another means. Likely one that would have been far less traumatic than the affair.

 

And again...I've not met anyone who felt that the affair was the ONLY issue that had to be dealt with, and that everything would be wonderful once the OW/OM was out of the picture. But the reason for the FOCUS on the OW/OM is often because they know that there's no hope to recover at all while they remain in the picture.

 

I have to 'semi' agree with LF. Its interesting to note those who respond only in emotional, provoking ways, and those who respond in thoughtful ways designed to discuss, rarther than attack or elicit an emotional response.

[silktricks]

The thing is, you can say whatever you want to say about yourself online...you can emphasize the good, you can minimize the bad. And the other person on the far end is whatever you picture them to be based on what they tell you. The 'fantasy factor' becomes much higher online.

 

So very true. Fantasizing that someone else is your perfect match in all ways is easy when you don't see the person. There's nothing real to hold onto.

[silktricks]

I hear many OW/OM here say that if there was nothing wrong in the marriage, the WS wouldn't be willing to stray. And in many cases, that could well be the case.

 

But...if the "something wrong" isn't in the marriage...if its IN THE WS to begin with...

 

If its not the marital situation, but a mindset or personality characteristic or even a temporary emotional trouble (i.e...depression) that is WITHIN THE WS...

 

Thank-you for this OWL. I was just beginning to formulate a response very similar to yours, and then lo and behold, it was here.

 

This is a very important point - possibly even more important for BS to read than for OW.

 

Of course what both LF and WF are saying has validity - the affair is a choice, and no person can be "stolen" but people can be swayed, especially people who are in temporary emotional trouble.

 

Oft times people who are depressed can get into the thought pattern that any change will improve their feelings and often will blame their depression on their partner. If the true source of the depression is resolved (unless of course it is the partner ) the marriage can happily go on. If, however, during the depth of the depression an affair takes place, all kinds of other forces are thrown into the mix.