Sal Paradise Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 Interesting how it's ok to paint all men with one brush but if a guy wrote a post claiming "all women are fill in the blank" he'd be called a sexist. Just as many women cheat as men. Hell this forum is pretty much proof of that. Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 There's a line between a family with too rigid a structure' date=' creating dysfunction and a family with hard but reasonable boundaries. [/quote'] It's easy to draw those lines post hoc, on the basis of outcome (kids become dysfunctional => boundaries too rigid; kids thrive => boundaries just right) but I'll bet in every one of those "too rigid" households those parents thought they were doing as you suggested - providing good examples for their kids to follow. Survivor skills are different than skills to excel. In a functional family unit' date=' skills to excel when times get tough are a must. This includes learning to work hard for what you have and learning to be responsible for your actions, including the impact on other families. Case in point, learning not to break up families and not to get involved with cheaters. Or, learning not to cheat, as defined by this thread.[/quote'] "Coping skills" can be used to survive or to excel. Mine have done me just great in all aspects of my life, as has been the case for many others. I think the distinction you're trying to draw is fictitious and based on personal prejudice ("people who cheat are losers, people who don't are paragons of excellence") whereas others would draw more reality-based distinctions. Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 Interesting how it's ok to paint all men with one brush but if a guy wrote a post claiming "all women are fill in the blank" he'd be called a sexist. Agreed... though I've picked up only two people on this thread suggesting that "all men are cheaters". Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 I will never understand people who enter into an affair' date=' whether it's the cheater or the OW/OM. [/quote'] As has been illustrated repeatedly. Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 As much as you claim you do charity and what-not' date=' so do I and my family.[/quote'] I have never claimed to do "charity" (though what-not sounds a little more interesting ). "Charity" is patronising those one deems "less fortunate" - which I can understand makes it appealing to some people here. Link to post Share on other sites
grogster Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 I wish they would get it. It makes me sad that people risk the happiness of their children and other peoples' children, for what? Children survive divorce, particularly when it's amicable, where at minimum the children aren't used as a battleground. Add in the devastating ripple effect of infidelity and most don't stand a chance. Isn't it better in the long run to walk away from something that isn't the right fit? Isn't it better to be able to look at yourself and say, hey, I feel good that my integrity is intact? I will never understand people who enter into an affair, whether it's the cheater or the OW/OM. Having said that, once again, not all men cheat. There's a portion that do cheat so the trick is to learn to filter out the dysfunctionals. This can be said about men, whether it's cheating or some other substantial character flaw. I agree with your honest self-assessment. Keep trying, though. Link to post Share on other sites
OpenBook Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 Agreed... though I've picked up only two people on this thread suggesting that "all men are cheaters". And I'm one of them. But Sal nailed me, right between the eyes. (Ouch!) Sal, you're absolutely right. I know it's sexist (and probably inaccurate) to believe that ALL men cheat. It just seems that way to me sometimes. Interesting how it's ok to paint all men with one brush but if a guy wrote a post claiming "all women are fill in the blank" he'd be called a sexist. Just as many women cheat as men. Hell this forum is pretty much proof of that. Link to post Share on other sites
Jersey Shortie Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 I don't think most men are very loyal. If they don't physically cheat, they are cheating with porn or things like that. Which makes it really hard for me to trust men actually. I don't really believe men are every happy with what they have because I have seen so many examples of men in my life that turn to other things, other their their SO, for sex. And turning to porn, is something that means he is turning to someone else/something else for sex. Link to post Share on other sites
Tomcat33 Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 I don't think most men are very loyal. If they don't physically cheat, they are cheating with porn or things like that. Which makes it really hard for me to trust men actually. WOW so now using porn is cheating? No wonder men are so lost these days this the kind of stuff that they are dealing with from our end? Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 Porn isnt' cheating unless he is choosing it over having sex with you, allowing it to become more than just a fun jerk-off session and into an obsession and it gets in the way of your sex life. It's also more or less saying that if someone in a relationship or a marriage masterbates alone to their own fantasies, that's cheating too! Link to post Share on other sites
grogster Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 So true. If everything is cheating, then nothing is cheating. Through overuse and inappropriate use the very term is debased and stripped of meaning. Cheating occurs when the straying partner devotes harmful emotional and/or physical erotic interest in a carbon-based non-partner and the betrayed partner has a reasonable expectation of commitment, fidelity and sexual exclusivity. Link to post Share on other sites
OpenBook Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 if someone in a relationship or a marriage masterbates alone to their own fantasies, that's cheating too! Ok, I'm reversing my position again. ALL men - and ALL women - cheat.:D:D:D Link to post Share on other sites
OpenBook Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 So true. If everything is cheating, then nothing is cheating. Through overuse and inappropriate use the very term is debased and stripped of meaning. Cheating occurs when the straying partner devotes harmful emotional and/or physical erotic interest in a carbon-based non-partner and the betrayed partner has a reasonable expectation of commitment, fidelity and sexual exclusivity. But isn't everything in our universe carbon-based?? Link to post Share on other sites
Trialbyfire Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 Porn isnt' cheating unless he is choosing it over having sex with you, allowing it to become more than just a fun jerk-off session and into an obsession and it gets in the way of your sex life. It's also more or less saying that if someone in a relationship or a marriage masterbates alone to their own fantasies, that's cheating too! There are different types of porn, of which some are interactive such as telephone or internet sex. This type of porn is arguably the same as sleeping with a hooker, without the possibility of STD transmission. Link to post Share on other sites
Tomcat33 Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 There are different types of porn, of which some are interactive such as telephone or internet sex. This type of porn is arguably the same as sleeping with a hooker, without the possibility of STD transmission. It's not the same, please! How can you EVEN compare the act of having live sex with a prostitute to getting off to some skanky conversation with a complete stranger on the phone? Or telling some chick on a vid cam do this do that...? Link to post Share on other sites
grogster Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 But isn't everything in our universe carbon-based?? Ouch! You're correct. I meant natural, flesh and blood individuals as opposed to pictorial or cinematic depictions. Good catch! Link to post Share on other sites
blair08 Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 It's not the same, please! How can you EVEN compare the act of having live sex with a prostitute to getting off to some skanky conversation with a complete stranger on the phone? Or telling some chick on a vid cam do this do that...? So why not go talk skanky to their spouse or partner then? If they feel the need to have their sexual needs met and get off to another by phone and not their spouse, then yeah to me it would be cheating. Link to post Share on other sites
OpenBook Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 Ouch! You're correct. I meant natural, flesh and blood individuals as opposed to pictorial or cinematic depictions. Good catch! Thanks Grog, your post was rational and clear (as always) but I couldn't resist using the carbon thing to illustrate my point. It's becoming obvious to me that before we all decide whether ALL men (or women) cheat, maybe we should first come to a consensus about "what the definition of IS, is" (thank you Bubba!!). I have this sinking feeling that there are as many definitions of "cheating" as there are people. Link to post Share on other sites
Tomcat33 Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 So why not go talk skanky to their spouse or partner then? If they feel the need to have their sexual needs met and get off to another by phone and not their spouse, then yeah to me it would be cheating. Fantasy. Why look at pictures of people you can't touch and get off on that, instead of touching real interactive live flesh to get off? Because you can do that every day and you have already done it a million times and so you want to a different experience. Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 Cheating occurs when the straying partner devotes harmful emotional and/or physical erotic interest in a carbon-based non-partner and the betrayed partner has a reasonable expectation of commitment, fidelity and sexual exclusivity. My bicycle has a graphite frame. Guess I should stop rubbing up against it quite so much... Link to post Share on other sites
Tomcat33 Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 I have this sinking feeling that there are as many definitions of "cheating" as there are people. Seriously!!! Then NO WONDER comments such as "yes everyone cheats" are being said, if everything is cheating then what's the problem here? Let's embrace it and make the best of it then? Stop crying over our egos being bruised because our partners do things behind our backs and learn to live with reality? C'mon EVERY isn't cheating. People who start to nit pick at everything and consider everything cheating, are just control freaks. so there is nothing their partners could do that would be right in their eyes. Link to post Share on other sites
OpenBook Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 My bicycle has a graphite frame. Guess I should stop rubbing up against it quite so much... Cheater. Link to post Share on other sites
Trialbyfire Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 Fantasy. Why look at pictures of people you can't touch and get off on that, instead of touching real interactive live flesh to get off? Because you can do that every day and you have already done it a million times and so you want to a different experience. Based on your logic, since you can't touch, what's different about going to a dating site, finding someone who's 5000 miles away and having cyber sex/webcam or telephone sex with them; and interactive porn? In either situation, it includes live people on the other end, both include interactive communication but neither will ever get to the point of touching. Would you be okay with a partner doing this to you? Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 But isn't everything in our universe carbon-based?? Well, not everything. Water isn't carbon-based, and nor are minerals like Platinum or Gold (though the diamond for the rest of the ring would be). Link to post Share on other sites
OWoman Posted May 26, 2008 Share Posted May 26, 2008 Cheater. Damn! Caught out! (Must I replace the saddle now?) Link to post Share on other sites
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