Do you dislike business owners ?

[Art_Critic]

Most people who run highly profitable businesses are either born into or happen to be in the right place at the right time, or have the right skills on demand at the right time. Having the guts to invest in something that is not profitable is stupidity not courage.

This is exactly the attitude that makes me condemn business owners in my own mind. This 'holier than thou' I dare say like the world owes them everything because they happened to start a business.

 

'Sour grapes' again, name calling and the infamous 'you're just jealous' defense. Like I said in my original post the hard working little guys that start with nothing, seldom come out with anything at all. Those who succeed usually have some god given edge that had nothing at all to do with hard work. Entrenched elite's with a superiority complex, just like the landed elite of old.

 

Your posts are hard to follow and your message is kind of confusing..

 

Every business is OWNED.. even a public corporation is OWNED.. there is also a majority stockholder who OWNS the most stock.

If you work then you work for someone you hate..

 

Are you saying that you hate all those people ?.. You hate all business owners ?

 

If you don't want to work with people who OWN companies then why not go work for yourself ?.. that would make you a business owner though ..

 

Do you work ?

 

for the record.. my company was started with nothing..absolutely nothing.. a drawing board and a space heater as the drawing board was in the garage with all the bikes from the kids..

Selling during the day and coming home to do all the work that was sold during the day.. It would take all night..

I worked side by side with my father during those times... I worked each day and would go to school without any sleep because the work he sold had deadlines and had to be done..

When I was no longer in school I had to work no less than 18-20 hour days and even more at times..

I have gone 56 hours without sleep before and worked that 56 hours straight.. so employees could have paychecks...

 

Your reasoning is flawed... I may have been born into this company but I have earned the right to to be here...

[Karyyk]

I don't have a problem with the business owners. Most of them are practical, straight-forward people who took a shot at doing something for themselves. What's to dislike about that? Sure, there's some luck involved, but I'll say that the idea that all business owners are already rich is dead wrong. Right now I'm looking for a way to go into business for myself, and I'm hardly a man of means.

 

My problem is generally with the people they bring in once to run the company once it's grown. The CEO/CFO types are the ones that generally see everyone as mere resources, and when the owner turns the reigns of the company over to them, that's when the abuses begin.

[MaxManwell]

Your posts are hard to follow and your message is kind of confusing..

 

Every business is OWNED.. even a public corporation is OWNED.. there is also a majority stockholder who OWNS the most stock.

If you work then you work for someone you hate..

 

Are you saying that you hate all those people ?.. You hate all business owners ?

 

If you don't want to work with people who OWN companies then why not go work for yourself ?.. that would make you a business owner though ..

 

Do you work ?

 

for the record.. my company was started with nothing..absolutely nothing.. a drawing board and a space heater as the drawing board was in the garage with all the bikes from the kids..

Selling during the day and coming home to do all the work that was sold during the day.. It would take all night..

I worked side by side with my father during those times... I worked each day and would go to school without any sleep because the work he sold had deadlines and had to be done..

When I was no longer in school I had to work no less than 18-20 hour days and even more at times..

I have gone 56 hours without sleep before and worked that 56 hours straight.. so employees could have paychecks...

 

Your reasoning is flawed... I may have been born into this company but I have earned the right to to be here...

 

No not so employee's can have a paycheck you do it for profit. Employee's have a paycheck so you can profit from their work.

 

If I had the opportunity to be part of a profitable business, yes I would work 20 hours in a day. Anyone who was thinking clearly would do that same thing. Its the opportunity that counts. Working is nothing if there is opportunity people will work at it. That is what a lot of people are missing - the opportunity to start a business.

 

What am I going to do ? open a pizza shop ? I'd end up making more money at my job.

 

Similar to most college degree's all the degree gives you is an opportunity, all a degree gives you is an opportunity that you still might not get - and you certainly get a lot of opportunities with a half decent degree.

 

I obviously don't hate all business owners by the way.

[lovestruck818]

Who paid for your food? clothing?

 

So you never had to really work....... interesting.

 

Not even a summer job?

 

and isn't your house a 400sq ft studio?

 

yes to the last question but here what u pay for that is what you would pay for a house in other parts of the country- Long Island real estate is not cheap.

[lovestruck818]

Have you owned a small business before??? Geez...

 

I just lost my business after years of working it to the bone...

I finally had to declare bankruptcy because my fixed expenses and salaries outweighed my profit. The rent kept going up and up- and people started shuffling off to malls and box stores.

 

Running a small business is difficult and complicated.

I had to carry $100,000 worth of stock a season- anticipate what trends people would appreciate... and hope I could sell it all - or lose everything.

 

I worked my own business myself- with only part time staff I paid well and treated well. 7 days a week I was there working the floor to make ends meet. Always smiling and giving expert service to people that often tried to barter with me for a better deal. The public was often rude and unappreciative. I also had to deal with a lot of theft!

 

When you run a business- you have to pay your rent, your staff, fixed costs and your suppliers before you can take a paycheque for yourself. I sometimes went 2 months without taking a salary out of my business. I poured everything I owned into it and it finally got the best of me.

 

You're way off with your assumptions.

 

The risk hardly sounds worth it to me. I mean, yeah I work for someone, so no, I can't say I own my business, but at the end of the day, I am 99.9% sure I will have a job the next day and I don't have to deal with all the BS you stated above.

[lovestruck818]

The risk hardly sounds worth it to me. I mean, yeah I work for someone, so no, I can't say I own my business, but at the end of the day, I am 99.9% sure I will have a job the next day and I don't have to deal with all the BS you stated above.

 

To boot, I make a good salary!

[Art_Critic]

No not so employee's can have a paycheck you do it for profit. Employee's have a paycheck so you can profit from their work.

 

Actually it was so employees could have paychecks.. have you ever had to try and make a 25 employee payroll where those people were counting on their paycheck ?..

There is more push to work harder the more responsibility you have..

If all I had to do was make my liquor bill then I might have worked so hard..

 

Even today years later after all the tough grueling hard work I do it for their paychecks..

They work hard and are the biggest part of the reason why everything works out though.. so the least I can do is make my motivation supportive of them..

Without good employees you are sunk..

 

 

Making the most of an opportunity is part of my success.. I may have had the opportunity land in my lap but I didn't waste it either..

 

Open that Pizza Shop MM.. I'll come and buy a slice and sit down with you...

[MaxManwell]

Actually it was so employees could have paychecks.. have you ever had to try and make a 25 employee payroll where those people were counting on their paycheck ?..

There is more push to work harder the more responsibility you have..

If all I had to do was make my liquor bill then I might have worked so hard..

 

Even today years later after all the tough grueling hard work I do it for their paychecks..

They work hard and are the biggest part of the reason why everything works out though.. so the least I can do is make my motivation supportive of them..

Without good employees you are sunk..

 

 

Making the most of an opportunity is part of my success.. I may have had the opportunity land in my lap but I didn't waste it either..

 

Open that Pizza Shop MM.. I'll come and buy a slice and sit down with you...

 

I guess what I am really arguing against is economic rents and not necessarily small business owners. The problems start appearing when the earnings of the business become disproportionate to the amount being paid out in salaries. People that are born into a family business and don't understand that for the rest of the world, working menial job almost never leads to becoming an owner let alone a wealthy owner.

[lovestruck818]

Who paid for your food? clothing?

 

So you never had to really work....... interesting.

 

Not even a summer job?

 

and isn't your house a 400sq ft studio?

 

Even if I did work a little summer job...I don't now...thanks to the fact that I have a college degree, b/c honestly if i didn't, i can't imagine how I would be making my living.

[MaxManwell]

Even if I did work a little summer job...I don't now...thanks to the fact that I have a college degree, b/c honestly if i didn't, i can't imagine how I would be making my living.

 

I got my first job after school when I was 14 and worked in that capacity right up until after I graduated college. So did many, many others. Not all college kids are spoiled rich kids. Most of us are just people of average ability trying to get ahead, for most of us that will never be the case.

 

Don't get me started on educated people most of the are just as bad. Apparently I have something against almost everyone.

[Moose]

Most people who run highly profitable businesses are either born into or happen to be in the right place at the right time, or have the right skills on demand at the right time. Having the guts to invest in something that is not profitable is stupidity not courage.

Then there are some of us that started their business with absolutely NOTHING.....nada......but the drive to succeed.

 

Yes, we've went hungry multiple times and we've suffered through harsh times. But we were never without the means to continue.

 

I say open your pizza shop......I just opened a BBQ Hut 2 weeks ago for my boys to run for their own turnkey business.....no it hasn't made one dime yet but projections indicate it will make each of them, (and myself) at least 24k a year. (Seasonal)

 

All I had to do was build the Hut, set it up and train them.....now I don't even need to touch it.....

 

My welding shop.....haven't been there in 4 months but the checks keep comin' in.....

 

Rental houses......in debt with them right now.....but will turn around this summer....

 

Diversity.....it's my key.....

[lovestruck818]

I got my first job after school when I was 14 and worked in that capacity right up until after I graduated college. So did many, many others. Not all college kids are spoiled rich kids. Most of us are just people of average ability trying to get ahead, for most of us that will never be the case.

 

Don't get me started on educated people most of the are just as bad. Apparently I have something against almost everyone.

 

Are you calling me a spoiled rich kid? B/c I don't believe I ever uttered the words "my parents paid for college."...or anything for that matter. I wanted to go and I knew they didn't have the money so I worked my @ss off, got good grades and got scholarships. I own a "house", a car and everything else that i have I paid for with my own money...from the good job I got...b/c I have a degree. Not to say jobs that don't require a degree are not good, they can be, BUT my job requires a degree. I enjoy it, I make a good living, and to boot I am educated.

[lovestruck818]

Then there are some of us that started their business with absolutely NOTHING.....nada......but the drive to succeed.

 

Yes, we've went hungry multiple times and we've suffered through harsh times. But we were never without the means to continue.

 

I say open your pizza shop......I just opened a BBQ Hut 2 weeks ago for my boys to run for their own turnkey business.....no it hasn't made one dime yet but projections indicate it will make each of them, (and myself) at least 24k a year. (Seasonal)

 

All I had to do was build the Hut, set it up and train them.....now I don't even need to touch it.....

 

My welding shop.....haven't been there in 4 months but the checks keep comin' in.....

 

Rental houses......in debt with them right now.....but will turn around this summer....

 

Diversity.....it's my key.....

 

But are the hard times worth the uncertainty of not knowing whether your business will fail or succeed? I like the fact that I have job stability and a stable liveable income every 2 weeks.

[lovestruck818]

But are the hard times worth the uncertainty of not knowing whether your business will fail or succeed? I like the fact that I have job stability and a stable liveable income every 2 weeks.

 

401k & benefits as well

[Art_Critic]

401k & benefits as well

 

Stability when you own your own business can be a double edged sword..

 

There is stability but it go go away just as fast as you can lose your job that pays you every 2 weeks...

 

There is more to lose however when you own the business..

 

LoveStruck.. 401-k and benefits are provided here..

We pay for all of the cost's attributed to providing health care.. we have a 401-k and many other benefits..

 

Even as an owner there are benefits that that other employees don't get the chance to get.. such as a company car, certain type of life insurance.. etc etc...

[lovestruck818]

Stability when you own your own business can be a double edged sword..

 

There is stability but it go go away just as fast as you can lose your job that pays you every 2 weeks...

 

There is more to lose however when you own the business..

 

LoveStruck.. 401-k and benefits are provided here..

We pay for all of the cost's attributed to providing health care.. we have a 401-k and many other benefits..

 

Even as an owner there are benefits that that other employees don't get the chance to get.. such as a company car, certain type of life insurance.. etc etc...

 

alot of business owners can't afford or don't want to provide 401k & bens to their employees though

[Moose]

But are the hard times worth the uncertainty of not knowing whether your business will fail or succeed? I like the fact that I have job stability and a stable liveable income every 2 weeks.

Yes, well worth it.

 

It's called a challenge......I've had businesses fail, and fail miserably they did....

 

However, when one succeeds there's nothing like it! It's my baby and watching it grow brings me the sense of accomplishment and drive to do more.....

 

No one can fire me, no one can tell me I'm late, no one is in charge of my destiny but me.

 

It's all hard work but now I'm secure in knowing there is money in the bank, investments have paid for themselves and then some, my family will always have that security as well.....even if I were hit by a truck they, my grandchildren and their children will be set for life.....can you say that?

[lovestruck818]

Yes, well worth it.

 

It's called a challenge......I've had businesses fail, and fail miserably they did....

 

However, when one succeeds there's nothing like it! It's my baby and watching it grow brings me the sense of accomplishment and drive to do more.....

 

No one can fire me, no one can tell me I'm late, no one is in charge of my destiny but me.

 

It's all hard work but now I'm secure in knowing there is money in the bank, investments have paid for themselves and then some, my family will always have that security as well.....even if I were hit by a truck they, my grandchildren and their children will be set for life.....can you say that?

 

but what happens when a business doesn't succeed? I for one will never be on the street, that I know for sure.

[Moose]

but what happens when a business doesn't succeed? I for one will never be on the street, that I know for sure.

You don' seem to understand what I'm saying.....

 

Let them fail....I've already earned enough to retire on and then some....

 

I could literally walk away right now and I'll be fine.....not only will I be fine, my children, their children and their children and so on will be fine....you can't say that and you'll never be able to say that working for someone else....degree or not.....

[lovestruck818]

You don' seem to understand what I'm saying.....

 

Let them fail....I've already earned enough to retire on and then some....

 

I could literally walk away right now and I'll be fine.....not only will I be fine, my children, their children and their children and so on will be fine....you can't say that and you'll never be able to say that working for someone else....degree or not.....

 

no i mean what if you were just starting out and it failed...if it failed now is not what I am asking...you were lucky it succeeded...but what if it hadn't?

[Moose]

no i mean what if you were just starting out and it failed...if it failed now is not what I am asking...you were lucky it succeeded...but what if it hadn't?

Lucky? Interesting.....

 

I had enough credits in High School to graduate my Sophmore year....so I took welding for the last two years......left home at 15 and got my first job welding for a huge tank manufacturer.

 

I earned enough to buy my own truck, portable welding equipment and "All Type Welding" was born....

 

Luck had nothing to do with that, it was all SKILL.....from there I earned enough to become a CAD reseller on the side which is now my full time, "j.o.b."

 

This company grew from 1 to 40 in 6 years.....luck had nothing to do with it....SKILL....

[lovestruck818]

Lucky? Interesting.....

 

I had enough credits in High School to graduate my Sophmore year....so I took welding for the last two years......left home at 15 and got my first job welding for a huge tank manufacturer.

 

I earned enough to buy my own truck, portable welding equipment and "All Type Welding" was born....

 

Luck had nothing to do with that, it was all SKILL.....from there I earned enough to become a CAD reseller on the side which is now my full time, "j.o.b."

 

This company grew from 1 to 40 in 6 years.....luck had nothing to do with it....SKILL....

 

but you were lucky you had those skills and that drive, no? You really didn't answer my question...

[Moose]

but you were lucky you had those skills and that drive, no? You really didn't answer my question...

No, I wasn't lucky that I had those skills.....I earned them just like you've earned your degree.....there's a huge difference.....

 

Had I failed, I wouldn't of stopped trying. That, my friend, is the difference between success and failure.

 

Does that answer your question?

[Art_Critic]

but you were lucky you had those skills and that drive, no? You really didn't answer my question...

 

LS.. it wasn't luck.. he wasn't lucky.. he worked hard.. he wasn't born with the ability to weld.. he had to learn it and then apply what he learned to make a go of it from there..

 

 

so I took welding for the last two years......left home at 15 and got my first job welding for a huge tank manufacturer.

[sb129]

They are sheisters. Also, many business owners do not have education. Education is something i respect very highly of. It's awesome if you own a business, but get the degree to go with it.

 

I have both. My degree is highly specialised and I can't do my job without it, however it also requires manual skills, and people skills, not all of which I learned at university.

Running a successful business in my field takes much, much more than the degree on the wall.

 

 

You learn idealized theory in school. When it comes time to run a business, the application of theory can and will shock you sometimes...

Absolutely.

Such as dealing with the public. No "course" can fully teach you how to do that until you are faced with it, day in, day out.

 

On an unrelated yet maybe partially related note, I just bought a house not too long ago. My college offered a course in real estate. Had I not taken that class, the whole home-buying experience would have been a lot more terrifying & blind to me. There are courses one can take in college on how to start and run a successful business...

 

You ARE kidding, right? Buying a home is something that many, many uneducated people do every day.

 

$15/hr...if you had to go back to that, yeah, but...had you a degree, you wouldn't have to. Most people with degrees don't make $15/hr. They don't even start anywhere near that. It's much higher.

That isn't entirely true.

I know a few people who because they have a "degree", they think they are automatically entitled to a higher wage, however, their degrees are in such obscure subjects, to employers of the companies they want to work in (banks etc) they mean nothing, so they put these people on the bottom rung of the ladder. (where, without any relevant experience, they belong)

 

That's my point right there. Many jobs that you don't need a degree for don't give you that stuff...trades, construction, painting, mechanics, things like that. They are not bad job- not at all- and one can earn a nice living- but benefits and 401k are extremely important.

 

What if you had the opportunity to have MORE than 401k?

The trades are suffering in the UK and my home country because people who shouldn't be doing degrees are going to university.

There is such a demand for plumbers, carpenters, roofers, etc etc that these businesses are booming, and many of them make excellent money. i know people with degrees who have switched to careers like these because they make a better living.

 

I think it's WAY harder to start and succeed in business than it is to get a degree. Hands down. It takes a lot more thinking "outside the box" to succeed on your own than to get a college degree. No question.

I respect a self-made person WAY more than just a college graduate.

 

Me too. I know lots of people who started with nothing (and no degree) and now have ALOT more for their retirement than 401k. Some of the richest people in the UK have no degrees and started with nothing, and have SO many businesses, of one fails, they can fall back on another.

 

My grandfather was almost illiterate. (You probably couldn't succeed as well as he did in todays world, granted). He arrived as an immigrant in my home country with nothing, and died a rich man with alot of property and a successful farming business that my father (who doesn't have a degree) took over and doubled in size.

Farming in my country is incredibly risky, and many people have lost their livelihoods as a result of bad weather or poor judgement. My father and grandfather have succeeded where many others have failed- I think they just "know" their business, their acumen for what they do is so astute, and THAT is the reason for their success.

 

but what happens when a business doesn't succeed? I for one will never be on the street, that I know for sure.

How do you know that for sure?

You can't predict the future. The business you work for may fold. The industry you work for isn't a guarantee of constant employment.

 

I know unemployed doctors- which is really strange seeing as they have "degrees", and people are always going to get sick, so medicine is something you would think you could have constant guaranteed employment.

 

I think that you simply cannot lump all business owners in one pot, nor can you lump all people with degrees in one pot.

 

There is a wide spectrum for both.