Why not tell the wife?

[luvmy2ns]

Luv, "Cheating" is "Cheating" period. I don't care if it's an ea or pa.. it's still a form of betrayl to the marriage.

 

AP:)

 

But what I'm saying is, in your situation, you may have misconstrued his intent. He IS the one who ended whatever it was that was going on, right? Or at the very least, he can at least make his wife believe so as nothing really came of it.

 

If someone is f'ing someone else for any length of time, there will be proof to be provided. Where is your "proof" of this EA?

[Meaplus3]

I see your point. I'd also like to make sure you realize that I didn't mean to single you out, either. I wanted to comment on what you said, but by no means felt that this was an "Answerplease" only thing or issue. None of this was meant as a personal attack. I just want to make sure that you know that.

 

Here's the thing. In your case, the TRUTH of what went on was undoubtedly somewhere between HIS view, YOUR view, and HER view. In order to get the truth, she needed all three views. ESPECIALLY since he was unlikely to admit to the affair on his own...so she was only left with HER view, and neither yours nor his.

 

I'd tend to agree, that the primary onus for telling should be on the WS. However, often they WON'T tell the truth...so that they can continue to avoid the responsibility for their actions. Or they'll LIE about what happened (how many OW have been thrown 'under the bus' around here by their MM???).

 

So at the end of the day...SOMEONE should tell the BS what really happened. Since the OW/OM had their part in it too, and ESPECIALLY if they were "friends" or acquaintences with the BS...they too should have a part in the revelation of what really went on.

 

If you were friends with your neighbor, don't you feel that you would have owed her the truth as her friend, regardless of anything else?

 

Again, I don't mean to pick on you...I'm using your situation to illustrate my point.

 

 

First off Owl you did not offend me, I have some tough skin now.

 

I do see your point's as well however, IMO I don't think it makes much sense for the OW to tell the Ws. What are the chances that the Ws would even believe a shred of what they were told by the OW? Think about it.

 

AP:)

 

.

[luvmy2ns]

First off Owl you did not offend me, I have some tough skin now.

 

I do see your point's as well however, IMO I don't think it makes much sense for the OW to tell the Ws. What are the chances that the Ws would even believe a shred of what they were told by the OW? Think about it.

 

AP:)

 

.

 

See, this is what I was saying. A full blown affair usually involves e-mails, texts, voice messages. Moles in certain places that only a lover would know about. For a couple examples.

[Meaplus3]

But what I'm saying is, in your situation, you may have misconstrued his intent. He IS the one who ended whatever it was that was going on, right? Or at the very least, he can at least make his wife believe so as nothing really came of it.

 

If someone is f'ing someone else for any length of time, there will be proof to be provided. Where is your "proof" of this EA?

 

Luv, Please don't get me started..I did not misconstrue his intent. He's a grown man and knows exactly that his part of the ea was just a wrong as mine and that's all I have to say about that. This is Herenows thread and I don't want to over take it.

 

AP:)

[luvmy2ns]

Luv, Please don't get me started..I did not misconstrue his intent. He's a grown man and knows exactly that his part of the ea was just a wrong as mine and that's all I have to say about that. This is Herenows thread and I don't want to over take it.

 

AP:)

 

I'm not saying YOU misconstrued anything. I'm saying he could probably convince his wife of it unless you have hard evidence. Most affairs have hard evidence. And you're right. This is Herenow's thread, which is why I'm keying on MOST affairs and NOT yours.

[Owl]

First off Owl you did not offend me, I have some tough skin now.

 

I do see your point's as well however, IMO I don't think it makes much sense for the OW to tell the Ws. What are the chances that the Ws would even believe a shred of what they were told by the OW? Think about it.

 

AP, good points as always.

 

Something to think about...a LOT of BS's begin to suspect something, but don't have that "proof".

 

Your neighbor's wife could very possibly have been in the same boat. She could have suspected. She could have sensed that something was wrong in the way he was acting/behaving/etc... , but not had that 'proof'. Telling her could have been that proof.

 

I suspected my wife for sometime, but didn't have that proof, and gave her the benifit of the doubt. Had OM told me that something was going on...I would have believed him, because it would have explained so much of my 'gut feeling'.

 

She might not have believed you. So what? You still would have done the right thing by telling her. Her choice to ignore/deny from there is outside of your control...but you still would have done the right thing in view of the things that you COULD control.

 

Yes, he could have done damage control. He could have spun things around to avoid the blame. Or he might not have. Again, that's all outside of your sphere of influence. But you could have done the right thing in the areas that you DO control.

 

And...he might NOT have been successful. It might have been a wake up call for HER to see the truth about him, and make her own informed decisions on her future. Right now, he controls the situation because of her ignorance of what went on...destroy the ignorance, and you destroy his forced control. Or at least give her the opportunity to take control if she chooses to.

 

I get Herenow's point. I agree with it.

 

I also see your side, and while I don't agree, I see what you're trying to say.

[pelicanpreacher]

You're right, sort of. But not in the sense of having an actual relationship with the wife.

 

And exactly how intertwined do you want to be? What if wife has serious mental issues? What if MM is trying to deal with the situation as best and delicately as he can, moving his D along in the best way he knows... then you blow the whole thing open and she murder-suicides them and their kids?

 

"Oops, my bad."

 

 

 

Okay, you've got some interesting sense of duty or something going on there.

 

I imagine myself in the wife's shoes. What if my wife were cheating on me? I'd have a lot of questions of course, same as anyone: "How long has this been going on?", "Do you love him?", "Are we getting divorced then?", "What about the kids?" etc.

 

It would be hard enough if she told me, but what if the other man told me? I'd feel shocked, humiliated, ashamed and confused. I'd want to speak to my wife about it, not him. No way. What would I say, or what could I learn from some guy I don't even know, and who I obviously have every reason not to trust?

 

So thinking of the effects, the consequences, I'd say that an OW might tell the wife if she really wanted to humiliate her -- stick the knife in and twist it. Make the whole disaster as painful and bitter as possible, probably breaking all the relationships (including with MM). Yeah, that makes sense.

 

Let's all hop on our moral high-horses and gallop around blurting the truth at everyone. By the way, you're fat (only kidding!).

 

If MM knows his wife is so mentally unstable that she is a danger to herself and children then why would he knowingly engage in an affair or any activity, that if she uncovered by her own means, would send this woman on a killing spree? I would think his focus would be better served by proceeding amicably with a divorce obtaining full custody of the kids and do as little as possible to rock her boat!

 

Say your wife confessed to an affair...what emotions would you exhibit? Relief, joy, enthusiasm, revived hope? I believe that you'd experience the same range of emotions you expressed when hearing it from the OM so there's little difference in what you'll feel based upon the source of this revelation. As far as saying anything to the OM you're right...you wouldn't have anything to discuss with him for the problem lies exclusively with your W.

 

Laws are established to protect the interests of the group against the deviant behavior of the individual. We, as a society, believe that we are in some way responsible for each other so telling the W of your affair is not seen as twisting the knife but, intead, coming to the aid of the injured by removing the knife of betrayal. When we allow laws and common decency established for the common good to break down and force us to become disparate under the "divide and conquer" influence of our own selfishness then we invite anarchy and ALL individuals become vulnerable to whatever comes down the pipe!

[OldMan]

If MM knows his wife is so mentally unstable that she is a danger to herself and children then why would he knowingly engage in an affair or any activity, that if she uncovered by her own means, would send this woman on a killing spree? I would think his focus would be better served by proceeding amicably with a divorce obtaining full custody of the kids and do as little as possible to rock her boat!

 

Of course, what you say makes perfect sense...

 

...And we both know that people always behave rationally, and that relationships are always carefully planned out and considered in advance. (Sorry, I'm being too sarcastic tonight. I'll stop now.)

 

Seriously, my point is that you don't know, so you can't just say "that shouldn't happen" and just hope it doesn't. Do you really think that would make you feel vindicated if things went badly wrong?

 

Say your wife confessed to an affair...what emotions would you exhibit? Relief, joy, enthusiasm, revived hope? I believe that you'd experience the same range of emotions you expressed when hearing it from the OM.

 

Sorry, I completely disagree. I wouldn't.

 

If I had a problem with my penis I'd have no problems showing it to my doctor. But if I noticed some random, pervy gay guy looking at me in a public toilet I'd feel very different.

 

It's all about who, why, the context, appropriacy.

 

Laws are established to protect the interests of the group against the deviant behavior of the individual. We, as a society, believe that we are in some way responsible for each other...

 

Thank God I don't live in America. I don't want society, or the government, or anyone else I don't invite interfering with my private business -- especially when it comes to interpersonal relationships.

 

Perhaps we could agree on one thing: even if you personally feel it's okay to meddle in other people's personal business because you have some kind of civic duty, would you at least acknowledge that not everyone shares your perspective?

 

And then what if MM and his wife didn't share your perspective either? What if your intrusion would be grossly unwelcome and hurtful to the wife? Would you respect their feelings on the issue, and stay out of their business?

[OWoman]

You're twisting the definition of self-preservation of an unsuspecting wife into selfishness when you trivialize her financial input into the marriage as well as her interest in maintaining her health. Remember, the assets of a marriage are built over time through steady investment and require sacrifice on the part of both parties to achieve and maintain them. Since most young men show a tendancy toward being irresponsible with money, in many cases, its the wife who pulls the reins on spending in order for them to build assets for the future.

 

IME, most BWs are spendthrift shopaholics who get their jollies from flexing their plastic since they're not getting it in the bedroom. So of course they want to screw the WS financially - since it's the only screwing they know, and it's the screwing they (seem to) prefer.

 

Since selfishness goes hand in hand with greed I can't help but wonder how much incentive those marital assets and his earning power may have on an OW's desire and designs for the MM. If the union of the MM and OW were based strictly on the love they espoused for each other and the OW was willing to take him penniless and destitute while financially supporting him for the remainder of his days then more power to the new union. But that's not the real world though is it. If we're being being truthful you, the OW, want him to divorce his wife and take her for everthing she's got! Since you feel that the best way for you to play the W is by keeping her in the dark while you build and develop your affair with her husband then why should you be expected to be noble and fair in her treatment during the divorce?

 

The way the law used to read across all 50 states stipulated that adultery was a criminally punishable offence and that the courts were allowed to typically award the BS with the majority of the assets of the estate along with a hefty chunk of his future income awarded for child and spousal support. Thanks to the Women's Liberation Movement the laws have become more liberal and accepting of deviant behavior which has improved the OW's advantage at gaining a windfall of those assets and a minimization of MM's obligations to support his wife and children after the marriage is concluded.

 

So, beyond the desire for a soulmate, the OW is also calculating her MM's earning potential, his maturity (trained by his wife) with finances in building assets, and his willingness to part with those assets in support of a new life together.

 

Frankly, my MM's financial assets are the least of my interest in him. I find conspicuous consumption awkward and would sooner live in abject poverty - as I have done before - than loll about among the beautiful people knowing that there are others starving to maintain that kind of lifestyle.

 

And I'm not sure how you link the WLM to lack of child support - certainly in my country, the strengthening of the maintenance court system and the criminalising of "deadbeat dads" has been a direct result of the WLM.

 

On a second note, what about the exposure the OW subjects the W to regarding venereal diseases? Certain STD's can take years off the life of an individual so, if the OW has been exposed to STDs, including HPVs in the past, wouldn't common human decency compel an OW to let the W know she's sexually active with her husband to ensure she doesn't become the inadvertent victim of disease?

 

Why should the OW be more of a STD risk than the W? Were all BWs virgins before they married, who had no sexual experience besides the MM ever, and all OWs consummate sluts? That's a bit of an assumption there, I reckon....

[OWoman]

An Affair, to breathe, needs secrecy.[

 

Mine was open from the start. No secrecy at all. Only person who didn't know was the W - and she refused to believe it even after MM told her.

 

It's only after the Affair ends (and end they all do)

 

All Rs end. Either through divorce, death or other means. As can - and do - last as long as any other R - though sometimes in another form, such as a M between the MM and former OW.

[luvmy2ns]

It's really difficult to mix your situation into these threads, OWoman, because yours is WAY beyond "an affair."

[OWoman]

And exactly how intertwined do you want to be? What if wife has serious mental issues? What if MM is trying to deal with the situation as best and delicately as he can, moving his D along in the best way he knows... then you blow the whole thing open and she murder-suicides them and their kids?

 

"Oops, my bad."

 

 

This was a serious risk in my MM's case. Luckily he played it safe, arranged for the kids to be elsewhere when the told and ensured that it was public enough for the situation to be contained if she did got completely over the edge.

 

As it happened, she chose the denial route. But the possibility does still exist that at some future point - particularly once she physically sees him and me together - that she may try something like that. The kids have discussed the possibility in counselling. They're on continual high alert for signs. Once the D is final, they will have better protection.

[OWoman]

It's really difficult to mix your situation into these threads, OWoman, because yours is WAY beyond "an affair."

 

It is now. It did begin life as an A, way back when that was what I wanted.

[jon01]

You forgot this one:

 

#5: the OW is afraid that if the wife finds out, she will hunt her down and give her the worst ass kicking of her life (and deservedly so).

[luvmy2ns]

It is now. It did begin life as an A, way back when that was what I wanted.

 

And in your situation, your MM is different than many who are currently in A's. Judging from the many threads on LS, anyway.

[OWoman]

Thank God I don't live in America. I don't want society, or the government, or anyone else I don't invite interfering with my private business -- especially when it comes to interpersonal relationships.

 

Perhaps we could agree on one thing: even if you personally feel it's okay to meddle in other people's personal business because you have some kind of civic duty, would you at least acknowledge that not everyone shares your perspective?

 

And then what if MM and his wife didn't share your perspective either? What if your intrusion would be grossly unwelcome and hurtful to the wife? Would you respect their feelings on the issue, and stay out of their business?

 

Davo, I must confess I'm with you on this one!

[pelicanpreacher]

Of course, what you say makes perfect sense...

 

...And we both know that people always behave rationally, and that relationships are always carefully planned out and considered in advance. (Sorry, I'm being too sarcastic tonight. I'll stop now.)

 

Seriously, my point is that you don't know, so you can't just say "that shouldn't happen" and just hope it doesn't. Do you really think that would make you feel vindicated if things went badly wrong?

 

 

 

Sorry, I completely disagree. I wouldn't.

 

If I had a problem with my penis I'd have no problems showing it to my doctor. But if I noticed some random, pervy gay guy looking at me in a public toilet I'd feel very different.

 

It's all about who, why, the context, appropriacy.

 

 

 

Thank God I don't live in America. I don't want society, or the government, or anyone else I don't invite interfering with my private business -- especially when it comes to interpersonal relationships.

 

Perhaps we could agree on one thing: even if you personally feel it's okay to meddle in other people's personal business because you have some kind of civic duty, would you at least acknowledge that not everyone shares your perspective?

 

And then what if MM and his wife didn't share your perspective either? What if your intrusion would be grossly unwelcome and hurtful to the wife? Would you respect their feelings on the issue, and stay out of their business?

 

If I knew someone was going through a divorce and his wife was homicidally unstable then I'd have the sense and sympathy to keep my fingers crossed and hope she didn't find out about the affair by her own means, even if she was someone near and dear to me! My common sense and understanding of the big picture would make my determination in this case. Don't ask for me to cover for you though because I would confront you and we both might lose some teeth!

 

If you found out that someone you held dear, who wasn't mentally unstable, was secretly being harmed by someone else's backstabbing actions wouldn't you lift a finger to at least give them a head's up! In my example I didn't mean to imply it to include random individuals meddling in the business of other random individuals. I also didn't mean to imply, unless faced with dire circumstances, such as the knowledge of physical abuse or child molestation, that direct confrontation is necessary but, instead, supplying whatever evidence anonymously and leaving the situation alone! I'd have to have a fairly close relationship with a couple's life to have the necessary empathy to interfere with their lives by disclosing backstabbing actions of one person against another anyway. I hold my family and friends dear so I'd hope they'd look after me if they knew someone was lining my back up for a knife strike!

 

I also agree that I may not have the same levels of shock, humiliation, anger, confusion and etc... hearing the news from the OM as opposed to my SO but I'd still feel them at random times and they'd likely grow over time as I mulled over the revelations and questions of the affair! But, again, that's just me!

[OWoman]

Was his W in any way responsible for his rise through the ranks? Did she make sacrifices to her own dreams, needs, and wants to support him and his endeavors throughout the marriage? Does he have any responsibility to support his wife and her endeavors now that he's achieved success?

 

Maybe I just live in PC Hell, but my experience has been that in most cases the Ws call the shots on most of this! They decide if, and when, there are to be kids; that their Hs must work (extra hard, if necessary) to finance the breeding, whether or not they want the kids, so that they can take time off of their choosing to stay at home - for years, if necessary - to spend time with the kids; that the H must then take double load on the home-front (as well as the extra effort on the work front, because of added added expense) when W decides she needs to return to college for an advanced degree to address the loss of self-esteem she suffered as a result of her own decision to withdraw from the labour market for a few years as a SAHM and has to work on assignments at home instead of sharing cooking, cleaning and child care; that the H must support her return to the workplace by actively massaging his own professional networks to get her appointed at a level at which she feels she's best placed, irrespective of any objective assessment of whether she warrants that or not... and then somehow take the blame for her feeling less than self-actualised because she's seen as a "token appointment" by her work colleagues when she was appointed above better qualified, more experienced applicants simply because of "connections"!

 

Heads she wins, tails he loses....

[pelicanpreacher]

Maybe I just live in PC Hell, but my experience has been that in most cases the Ws call the shots on most of this! They decide if, and when, there are to be kids; that their Hs must work (extra hard, if necessary) to finance the breeding, whether or not they want the kids, so that they can take time off of their choosing to stay at home - for years, if necessary - to spend time with the kids; that the H must then take double load on the home-front (as well as the extra effort on the work front, because of added added expense) when W decides she needs to return to college for an advanced degree to address the loss of self-esteem she suffered as a result of her own decision to withdraw from the labour market for a few years as a SAHM and has to work on assignments at home instead of sharing cooking, cleaning and child care; that the H must support her return to the workplace by actively massaging his own professional networks to get her appointed at a level at which she feels she's best placed, irrespective of any objective assessment of whether she warrants that or not... and then somehow take the blame for her feeling less than self-actualised because she's seen as a "token appointment" by her work colleagues when she was appointed above better qualified, more experienced applicants simply because of "connections"!

 

Heads she wins, tails he loses....

 

That was a complete flip of my script!

[pelicanpreacher]

Davo, I must confess I'm with you on this one!

 

Yeah! And we've got that pesky "death penalty" to contend with too!..

[OWoman]

That was a complete flip of my script!

 

I guess that's "equal opportunity" then....

[Owl]

IME, most BWs are spendthrift shopaholics who get their jollies from flexing their plastic since they're not getting it in the bedroom. So of course they want to screw the WS financially - since it's the only screwing they know, and it's the screwing they (seem to) prefer.

 

Owoman...I have to say, I have to give you credit for probably the most offensive bit of horsecrap I've heard from you.

 

I normally have a bit of respect for your posts...but absolutely not this one.

 

Wow. Anything further I want to say will definitely result in an infraction, if my comment here hasn't already.

[pelicanpreacher]

Maybe I just live in PC Hell, but my experience has been that in most cases the Ws call the shots on most of this! They decide if, and when, there are to be kids; that their Hs must work (extra hard, if necessary) to finance the breeding, whether or not they want the kids, so that they can take time off of their choosing to stay at home - for years, if necessary - to spend time with the kids; that the H must then take double load on the home-front (as well as the extra effort on the work front, because of added added expense) when W decides she needs to return to college for an advanced degree to address the loss of self-esteem she suffered as a result of her own decision to withdraw from the labour market for a few years as a SAHM and has to work on assignments at home instead of sharing cooking, cleaning and child care; that the H must support her return to the workplace by actively massaging his own professional networks to get her appointed at a level at which she feels she's best placed, irrespective of any objective assessment of whether she warrants that or not... and then somehow take the blame for her feeling less than self-actualised because she's seen as a "token appointment" by her work colleagues when she was appointed above better qualified, more experienced applicants simply because of "connections"!

 

Heads she wins, tails he loses....

 

In all seriousness, here in the good old USA, you'll find that most middle income families require the incomes from both spouses just to make ends meet on the basics while still socking something away for a rainy day. Both spouses often work their fingers to the bone to achieve what they have and it is often the case that the wife makes the majority sacrifices to her career aspirations to follow her husband's or she makes the sacrifice of working two jobs to put him through school to improve the family's earning potential.

 

It's also often the case, however, that she's traded in for a younger prettier woman once he's risen in his career and now making substantially more money than she is because of her sacrifice to work instead of pursuing an advanced degree. In the end, her financial investment on future returns of the marriage she poured her heart and soul into has been stripped leaving her severely financially weakened and bitter in the process.

 

You've got to stop watching those "Hollywood" style shows portraying everyone's life in the USA as a land of milk and honey!

[Owl]

You've got to stop watching those "Hollywood" style shows portraying everyone's life in the USA as a land of milk and honey!

 

NO KIDDING!!!

 

Imagine if we all believed Hollywood's version of Owoman's country, or OldMan's?????

[mopar crazy]

But how would you know to make that choice if you never knew he had that OW on the side?

 

If I had no clue there was an OW on the side then I would stay w/ my H. I wouldn't know, therefore I wouldn't D him for having an A. D my H b/c I think he has an OW is jumping the gun. I would have to have some red flags b4 I started questioning his faithfulness. Does that make sense?

 

Some BW don't know there is an OW on the side and continue to stay M their WH. Why would they D (unless they are unhappy or other M problems) if they have no idea their H is messing around?