platonic Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 I am in my late 30's, male, and have been working with a woman for 2 years now. We are both married and relatively happy. She has two children, myself, none. I am finding myself falling in love with her and am finding a wonderful satisfaction in these feelings. We both have not experienced this sort of thing for well over a decade. I am proposing to her that we allow ourselves to express our feelings for one another, allow ourselves to nurture and revel in the sweet pain that comes from 'falling in love'. I am also suggesting that manifesting our love through sex, is not necessary for us to enjoy what we are feeling. Initially she felt that having sex was a natural progression in our relationship, but I feel that I may have convinced her that that is not the case. My sex life is wonderful with my wife, and I feel no necessity to find more sex outside of marriage. What I do desire from my co-worker is an intense intimacy of touching, perhaps kissing, but nothing more, yet to be able to enjoy those exciting few months as we explore our feelings for one another. I know most will feel that this is impossible without resorting to some form of intercourse, but I feel it is worth a try. Ethically though, is sharing my emotional love and caring with a person other than my wife so evil? Many thanks Plato Link to post Share on other sites
Neo Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 Have you talked to your wife about this? Link to post Share on other sites
Jamie31 Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 Hell yeah it's evil!!! It's cheating!! Even if you don't intend to sleep with this woman, more than likely you WILL end up doing just that. And then you will have to start hiding your affair, as will she, cause you know these things never stop with just one boink especially when there are "feelings" involved and then eventually, as they always do, your affair will be discovered by your wife or her husband and two marriages will be wrecked and two poor children will be stuck in a broken home. Now is that really worth exploring a few "feelings"? Explore the feelings with your wife. Get out with your wife more and fall in love with HER all over again. Don't let this ruin two seemingly happy marriages. It's not worth it to either of you. Dude, here's a thought - switch jobs. Quick!! Link to post Share on other sites
Author platonic Posted July 23, 2003 Author Share Posted July 23, 2003 No. As convinced as I am that there is a certain innocence to this, I am not convinced that my wife would see it that way. I don't know if this is more about recapturing my/our fading youth, or if it is about a strong attraction. I am strongly convinced that it is not lust though. Link to post Share on other sites
mandykisses Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 My advice to you being a married woman and all is this. Do what you want because if your thinking this already then something is wrong. Did you not marry your wife with the same feeling that your having now for someone else. Its all great with someone else when your not in a relationship with them. Im sure the feelings would change after you see her pick her teeth or the way she snores at night. You have to think in reality not fantasy. In your mind everything would be great and such a good feeling. But what happens when you really need that person for support in any way. Will she be there for you as your wife has been. I dont know if your marriage is good or bad but i didnt hear you complain about your wife at all. Maybe she deserves better then you and you should let her free from someone like you. Once again im the married woman and if my husband was feeling that way about someone i would want him to talk to me about it and then seek help. Sorry to be so mean but im a woman Link to post Share on other sites
Jamie31 Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 You're not being mean, mandykisses. I totally agree with you. Except dude - I would really think twice about telling your wife about this. She may not be as willing to hear it as mandykisses. It could possibly ruin your marriage...you really need to think about what is important in life. Link to post Share on other sites
cindy0039 Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 I'm with the others on this one. STOP what you're doing right now and retreat from this woman! If you love your wife you won't continue any kind of relationship with this person. You admitted having feelings for her and wanting to kiss her, which is not acceptable within a marriage. And Nurse_Jamie is right - it won't stop there. That's how it starts and it'll be all downhill from there. Be strong and resist temptation. That's what marriage is all about. Link to post Share on other sites
Jamie31 Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 [color=red]WORD UP, CINDY!![/color] Link to post Share on other sites
mandykisses Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 I agree with Jamie in the fact that you should try and fall "in love" with your wife again. Maybe you need another man to respond to what your saying. I understand to a point. You cant expect to go threw a lifetime being only attracted to you wife. But knowing what is harmless and harmful are two different things. And there are so many stages of being "in love" and loving someone. I agree with the other girls. Try to find something between you and your wife again. Put yourself in her shoes. Picture her having these feelings for another man and doing what you want to do. Could you handle it? Would you understand? Link to post Share on other sites
Author platonic Posted July 23, 2003 Author Share Posted July 23, 2003 I would like to thank all of you for the feedback. I really didn't expect to get so many answers, and thus did leave out two details that may have some bearing on this, or at least illustrate some motivation behind it. Firstly, her husband is heavy drinker who despite numerous efforts, cannot seem to quit. He loves her and their kids, but is impatient and is not terribly active as a father. My little dilemma is that I am almost 39, and my wife is 40. I want children, and she doesn't. We have talked about it, but she is intractable. I love her deeply, but am fearful of the bitterness I may hold for her 10 or even 20 years from now when we are childless. I don't want to leave her though. So, perhaps this at least explains why both of us seem open to some sort of relationship. It has not as yet progressed any farther than discussions and the faintest of physical contact. If I thought that I could rediscover these feelings again with my wife, I am certain that I would pursue it, even if the whole concept seems a bit hokey to me. I just don't buy into though. I know of some couples that have had all out affairs, have started swinging or some who have turned to a deep religious faith in order to recapture those original feelings. None of that would work for my wife or myself though. I do understand what you are saying, but is it not possible that there are grey areas around the notion of infidelity? Link to post Share on other sites
Author platonic Posted July 23, 2003 Author Share Posted July 23, 2003 Originally posted by mandykisses Its all great with someone else when your not in a relationship with them. I'm sure the feelings would change after you see her pick her teeth or the way she snores at night. You have to think in reality not fantasy. In your mind everything would be great and such a good feeling. But what happens when you really need that person for support in any way. Will she be there for you as your wife has been. I don't know if your marriage is good or bad but I didn't hear you complain about your wife at all. Maybe she deserves better then you and you should let her free from someone like you. Once again I'm the married woman and if my husband was feeling that way about someone i would want him to talk to me about it and then seek help. Sorry to be so mean but I'm a woman Mandykisses, You mention some interesting points in your email. The wonderful thing is that we have seen the 'less attractive' side of each other many times over the last few years. I can already see past them though, and I believe she is the same. It is way past the physical side of things. I am not sure how anyone could help as I think it is human nature, both of males and of females to relish those early feelings in a relationship. I feel that with a plan and a firm commitment to where we want to go and to what the boundaries are, this could remain a duplicitous love affair. Then again, perhaps that is only my arrogance showing. Time will no doubt tell. Link to post Share on other sites
cindy0039 Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 Originally posted by platonic I would like to thank all of you for the feedback. I really didn't expect to get so many answers, and thus did leave out two details that may have some bearing on this, or at least illustrate some motivation behind it. Firstly, her husband is heavy drinker who despite numerous efforts, cannot seem to quit. He loves her and their kids, but is impatient and is not terribly active as a father. My little dilemma is that I am almost 39, and my wife is 40. I want children, and she doesn't. We have talked about it, but she is intractable. I love her deeply, but am fearful of the bitterness I may hold for her 10 or even 20 years from now when we are childless. I don't want to leave her though. So, perhaps this at least explains why both of us seem open to some sort of relationship. It has not as yet progressed any farther than discussions and the faintest of physical contact. If I thought that I could rediscover these feelings again with my wife, I am certain that I would pursue it, even if the whole concept seems a bit hokey to me. I just don't buy into though. I know of some couples that have had all out affairs, have started swinging or some who have turned to a deep religious faith in order to recapture those original feelings. None of that would work for my wife or myself though. I do understand what you are saying, but is it not possible that there are grey areas around the notion of infidelity? Well, if she's not happy in her marriage and you're not happy in yours, then both of you GET A DIVORCE -- then start a relationship free and clear of anyone else. And in my opinion, NO there are no gray areas around the notion of infidility. You're either a cheater or you're not. Link to post Share on other sites
Jamie31 Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 Platonic - You seem dead set on having an affair with this woman and obviously you see nothing wrong with it. And I am almost positive you will disregard any advice we give you and go ahead with this affair. I mean, what are you wanting us to say...."Go ahead and bang her...there's nothing wrong with it...it's not cheating"? Well..it is cheating, in every since of the word. But you seem to have your mind made up, so do what you will. All I can say is you better know what you are getting into, because once you do it, it's done and it can't be taken back. How much do you love your wife? Obviously not enough. Link to post Share on other sites
Author platonic Posted July 23, 2003 Author Share Posted July 23, 2003 You are both right of course. My hope was that you would both say - "It's fine". I suppose in some ways I have almost convinced myself that this is more like flirting than anything else. Perhaps after a good nights sleep things will be clearer. I thank you both for your time and insights. I am grateful. Have a good night. Link to post Share on other sites
mandykisses Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 Im thinking that it sounds like you want to do this but if it doesnt work out then you will always have your wife there for you. I agree split up and start over with the other woman if thats what you both really want. Link to post Share on other sites
wideawake Posted July 23, 2003 Share Posted July 23, 2003 Originally posted by platonic is it not possible that there are grey areas around the notion of infidelity? Bro, In your heart you already know the answer to this question or you wouldn't even be here posting. Cheating is cheating and I think you've already crossed the line just from having these types of conversations with your female co-worker. Take care of your situation at home like an adult and than if you choose to end your relationship with your wife you can work on another one. Don't do anything that will hurt your wife though...come on man, you know all of this already. Link to post Share on other sites
aries Posted July 25, 2003 Share Posted July 25, 2003 Platonic, Take advice from someone that has already been in an affair, DON'T DO IT!! You are justifying your situation by trying to set boundries in this relationship, but believe me that is how most affairs start out. You think you can control what you are doing, but the next thing you know you are in a full blown affair. Your logic goes out the window and your emotions take over. You may feel that this other woman will be able to stay within the boundries physically, but emotionally do you think that can happen also? I think most women will agree with me when I say that if we are wanting to spend time with someone or share ourselves with someone, then we usually really care and want that relationship to grow to the fullest. In other words, you may be able to control your emotions and your heart(maybe that is a male thing)but the other woman will most likely expect more commitment from you over time, and may even expect or want you to leave your wife for her. If she is in a bad marriage or even a marriage where she is lacking something that is not keeping her committed to her husband, then she will most likely start to fall in love with you, if like you say, she already has strong feelings for you. If you have no desire to leave your marriage, then believe me you will eventually be hurting the other woman greatly. I have been there. I tried to control my feelings also, and she may be telling you this is possible just so she can be with you and not scare you away. I think you are not being realistic when it comes to what you are expecting to happen from all of this. I guarantee you this will turn into an affair. I do not think you are evil. I think it is possible to fall in love with more than one person in a lifetime, but you are committed to your wife. I think you need to analyze your marriage and figure out if this is the person you want to spend the rest of your life with. People can love each other but not fufill each other within a long term relationship. I think you need to decide if you really want your marriage to work or if it can, without resentment from not having children,etc.(I think there is more to it than that.) I hate to say it because it is so cliche, but you can't have your cake and eat it too. There will be a fallout from all of this if you continue any further. You will either hurt your wife or the other woman eventually, and I do not think you want that to happen. Be responsible and just think before you act. I wish I had. Support Always, Aries Link to post Share on other sites
Gator Posted August 10, 2003 Share Posted August 10, 2003 I have three words from a hurtin' Gator: RUN FORREST, RUN!! It's not worth the pain that comes later, believe me! LOL Link to post Share on other sites
moimeme Posted August 10, 2003 Share Posted August 10, 2003 As convinced as I am that there is a certain innocence to this, I am not convinced that my wife would see it that way. And that, precisely, is your clue that this is NOT innocent. Convinced as you think you are, that you have to hide it shows that deep down you know darn well that there is nothing innocent about this. That you want any sort of physical contact with this woman means you have already hurt your wife because you are in an emotional affair. You are trying to rationalize it to yourself by saying the equivalent of "oral sex isn't really sex". You say you don't want to leave your wife - but why? It sounds like you are very dissatisfied with your relationship. End the marriage and move on, but don't try to fool yourself that you won't be cheating if you proceed. And if you have any more questions, the litmus test about whether you are doing something wrong is whether you can tell your wife about it. Link to post Share on other sites
Author platonic Posted September 28, 2003 Author Share Posted September 28, 2003 Well, I should have listened to the people on this site. I told my wife that I wanted children and that if she did not, then I felt that we should sell the house and move on. We both talked a lot about it, but my wife was adamant that she did not want children. So the house is up for sale, and I continued my relationship with the other woman. I guess the fact that my wife and I had broken up, gave me a sense that I could 'honourably' pursue the relationship with the other woman. Although I did try to control the situation with the other woman we failed and over a month ago we ended up in a hotel for the day. Since then we meet regularly. Now, I have just returned home from a weekend with the other woman to find a note from my wife telling me that I should have been honest with her, and told her the truth about where I was going. My wife has cleaned out her stuff and has left - to where, I don't know. There are two things plaguing my mind now. Firstly, I no longer know if I broke up my marriage to be with another woman, or to find someone who wants children. The 'other' woman has told me that at this time, she would not leave her husband, so there is really no heavenly future there in the short term - at least a year anyway. The other thing is that i lied to my wife only to protect her feelings. I suppose that if we rented an apartment, we would already be separated, but with a house, you have to sell it, then there are closing dates - we could be here together for another 4 months or so. I didn't want to hurt, but I wanted to move on. Now, some how, she has found out, and has left me and she is must be hurting unbearably - something I never wanted to do to her. Unfortunately, not a happy ending, but I felt that I should at least post an epilogue to my situation. So it ends that I am still in love with my wife, but our life would have no children. I also love the other woman, and although she has two children, she can have no more and she is unwilling to leave her husband at this time (reason being only for the sake of the children). So I am left alone now. A sad fate, but I suppose well earned. Link to post Share on other sites
timdale Posted September 29, 2003 Share Posted September 29, 2003 How much do you really think of this woman with whom you want a platonic + affair? I am also married and have feelings about another lady who herself is married. I hold her in very high esteem and she deserves so much better than to have messy complications, because of the fantastic person she is. I have thought of simply not seeing her again because i know deep down that i'm too fond of her. I have posted further details about this under "The Other Man / Woman" forum. My point is this: I want HER to be happy, not messed about by me or any one else. Perhaps you should see your friend in a similar light. CHILDREN The children need the stability of a mother and a father. Go easy for their sake. Don't mess their lives up. Relationships can go further than originally intended and children can be deeply affected by sush things. Do you really want that on your conscience? Link to post Share on other sites
Author platonic Posted September 30, 2003 Author Share Posted September 30, 2003 Timdale, I appreciate your thoughts, and admit to feeling the same way about her being too good for such complications. Yet, alas, it has already gone too far and there is no going back now. Her children are uppermost in her concerns, as they are for me. The fact is, the father is an alcoholic, spiralling down into oblivion. The children are still young enough not to really know what is going on, but in a few years, they will begin to understand that "Daddy is not really tired after-all, just drunk". As alcoholism can be a learned trait as well as a genetic one, I personally feel that in the end, I would be a much better father/mentor, than the biological one. The plan is at any rate, that should my love decide to leave her husband, she would get her own place very close to mine. I would visit often, but not stay the night or anything, and attempt to build somekind of relationship with the children. I would also help her out with the daily living stuff. In time, perhaps 2 years down the road, we could look at actually living together. I will read your own thread for more insight. Thanks for writing! Link to post Share on other sites
Bird Posted September 30, 2003 Share Posted September 30, 2003 What a saga. First of, I'm a married man, so I feel that I can relate. I am sorry to hear that your marriage did not work out - but you made sure it wouldn't. I can understand your position on the wanting to have kids thing, but that was your excuse/justification for doing what you did. That became your line in the sand, but the bottom line is that when one person decides to leave another they will find reasons to leave - the same ones that weren't an issue when the love was strong. Let's be honest - the no-kids-thing was not the real reason you left your wife. The new woman already had 2 kids of her own and probably wouldn't have any more - with you or anyone else - so you already knew that any kids you'd share with her wouldn't be yours. ANd how long did you know your wife didn't want kids? I'm betting you knew for a while, so you've had plenty of time to decide how big of an issue that would be for you. You should have been honest with your wife - she deserved the truth (just like you think the other woman deserves better) - what has your (ex)wife done to you to deserve any less? You lied to your wife about more than just the other woman - you tried to make her feel like it was her fault that the relationship was at a dead end - and that my friend is dirty, mean, and just flat out f***ed up. You also lied to yourself by convincing yourself that it was your wife's fault that you were wanting to leave - "she's leaving me no choice." My feelings are that the other woman was reaching out to you because her alcoholic husband was not living up to his part of the bargain and you so dearly wanted to help - you wanted to feel wanted, needed. It's only human, and sometimes us married folk forget to make our significant others feel that way. Maybe you didn't feel wanted by your wife, but you sure as hell were not making her feel any better. All the time, energy and effort you were putting into the other woman you should have been putting into your relationship with your wife. I know you wanted to bail that other woman out of her situation, but she's the one who has control over that. She is the one who has decided to stay with her alcoholic husband. And don't be so sure she'll leave him any time soon. Even IF she does, she may not even want to hook up with you. At the time, she was looking for someone to give her what her husband couldn't because he was a drunk, and she reached out to you - but she was reaching out for anyone - it just happened to be you. You should have taken her emotional state of mind into account when she was telling you how she felt about you. She just needed love and affection from you, or anyone that she cared about. Probably, the things she was telling you and feelings she was displaying for you were the same things you wanted from your wife, but weren't getting because somewhere along the way you guys forgot how to C-O-M-M-U-N-I-C-A-T-E your feelings to one another, let the other know how you felt, what you needed. So, you let your little head think for the big one and now you've estranged the wife you still love and you're still not with the other woman you love. You are alone. My advice at this point, if you care to hear it, would be to search your soul and reflect on what you've done so that it doesn't happen again. Let the other woman get her life straight - that's not your job. If she has't left him by now she may never, so don't let her drag you down with her. Now I think it's time to draw the line in the sand with her - leave your husband and commit to us or lets cut it off now so you can focus on getting your life straight. Also, you owe it to your (ex)wife to explain everything - not that it will make any difference to the relationship - but just so she knows. Think of it as damage control. It will help the both of you to better understand (maybe) what happened, what went wrong, and take away some of the guilt you wrongfully put on her. Hell, I think you might actually have done her a favor - in the long run; maybe she'll find someone more compatible for her. Sorry if this reply has a harsh tone to it, but please understand that it's not personal - I don't know you from Adam. If it does sound harsh it's because it's reality and, by it's very nature, is harsh. Link to post Share on other sites
joeg Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 if you both chose the wrong marriage partners and then that means that you probably are making the wrong choice of getting together in the first place... you met as a lie, you are lying to your wife, she is lying to her husband... you both divorce and marry each other... and sooner or later.... cos u met unfaithfully, and you are assuming that now its alright to cheat... that means u are gonna say its alright to cheat on each other and yeh endless circle... once a cheater always a cheater Link to post Share on other sites
guest Posted October 15, 2003 Share Posted October 15, 2003 "You lied to your wife about more than just the other woman - you tried to make her feel like it was her fault that the relationship was at a dead end" I agree with Bird - you are one messed up a-hole. You're not even a man. A real man would be able to acknowledge and admit to what he did wrong and do what it takes to make amends. It's called being a responsible adult. You expect people to feel sorry for you because now you're all alone. Well boo f-ing hoo. Don't expect me to show up at your pity party. You're not really sorry about what you did or what happened. You still don't think you did anything wrong because you were "justified." That's some really evil sh*t you pulled. Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts