Why won't he propose?

[torranceshipman]

I'm a woman, not a man If you were a guy asking why your girl wouldnt marry you, I'd say the same thing...stop pushing and respect their boundaries-this isnt about seeing it from the 'male' or 'female' view, it's just about respecting another persons wishes.

 

I get the impression you get p*ssed at anyone that doesn't agree with you tho (including your boyfriend by the sounds of things!), so I wont comment further. Good luck, peace out :D

[carhill]

By the end of the year...he'll either be a man of action or a man of walking. Either way, my problem will be solved within a year.

 

TBH, I really don't think so. Come back in a year and tell me I'm wrong

[lexi29]

TBH, I really don't think so. Come back in a year and tell me I'm wrong

 

 

I have to agree with carhill. I really didn't want to post this because I've been where you are and I know this isn't what you want to hear. I don't like being the bearer of bad news.I think your bf is just prolonging his security with you for another year. It is possible that by the end of that year he will want to propose but whats to say he won't do the same thing he's done in the past (you said he's set deadlines before and blows them off when the deadline approaches).Personally, because of my experiences with my ex I think he is stalling.

 

My ex would do the same thing- he would make all these promises and came up with all these excuses why he wouldnt propose. He said he was going to propose to me in April but then my grandfather died so he said he couldnt (told me this after my grandfather died but he hadnt bought a ring or anything.) did you ask your bf ever tell you WHY he returned the ring he let you pick out? My guess is that he doesnt' want to move out because he does love you and does enjoy all the benefits of living with you, but he's not interested in moving forward because he has it made as it is. If you did ask him to leave at least that would "wake him up" and possibly he would realize he's ready for more instead of losing you. But that is a gamble. I'm glad you had a talk with him and thats a step in the right direction and if you feel better about everything then thats all you need- our opinions shouldn't matter.

[Haloandhorns85]

I'm a woman, not a man If you were a guy asking why your girl wouldnt marry you, I'd say the same thing...stop pushing and respect their boundaries-this isnt about seeing it from the 'male' or 'female' view, it's just about respecting another persons wishes.

 

I get the impression you get p*ssed at anyone that doesn't agree with you tho (including your boyfriend by the sounds of things!), so I wont comment further. Good luck, peace out :D

 

 

I'm sorry, didn't mean to call you a man..my mistake. And it doesn't piss me off when someone doesn't agree with me...I just don't see how it's just his life when we have a life together. This affects my life too. What I don't like is being made to feel like my wants, needs, and life doesn't matter. It wouldn't be so bad if he would have just given me a real reason instead of BS in the first place. I know him...I know when he is giving me BS. And if he hadn't of let me pick out a ring, led me to believe we are heading that way, then backtrack, it wouldn't be that big of a deal. Since when does my life not matter? Yes I'm young, but no I don't have my life planned out like so many people think. I make short term goals for myself such as school and work. Not goals of marriage and kids by a certain age. It has nothing to do with that. It has to do with leading me on and not following thru. Not for just a few months. A year. I do respect what he wants, but I deserve to hear a good reason. I'm not going to put my wants and needs on the back shelf simply because his wants and needs are different from mine. They need to be heard and respected as well. Not given wishy-washy BS.

 

But it doesn't matter I suppose. His life, his wants, and his needs. Thats pretty much what people want to tell me. So I guess I could cater to him. Even more so.

 

Just wait for the year to fly by. We'll see.

[carhill]

I don't like being the bearer of bad news.I think your bf is just prolonging his security with you for another year.

I agree. I don't either, and I would be very pleased if our OP came back presently and announced her engagement. I'm happy to be wrong, but must post my instincts.

 

------------------

 

OP, I have a question. You say you and your BF bought a house together about a year or so into your R. That's pretty fast for a young unmarried couple. My compliments for taking on such a large responsibility. My question is....Who was the impetus behind this purchase? Such ideas always start somewhere, with someone. Who was it and what was the dynamic?

 

I have this theory, based on what I've read. BF likes that you bought very a illiquid asset together, which will make breaking up a lot harder financially. You seem to act as the "man" about the house, taking care of the financials, taxes, problems and some of the "manly" duties, besides many of the traditional "womanly" ones. You have a lot on your plate. You're really invested. He sees this. He likes this status quo. By smoothing over the rough spots and cognizant that it isn't easy for you to just leave, the status quo is maintained.

 

For all intents and purposes, you are married, but you're not (legally) and this appears to distress you. I'm sensing resentment too. You think he could be more of a partner than he currently is. This is eroding your love for him a bit.

 

Well, anyway, these are my thoughts. I can thank MC for any clarity I've provided. No charge

[Haloandhorns85]

My question is....Who was the impetus behind this purchase? Such ideas always start somewhere, with someone. Who was it and what was the dynamic?

 

I actually was thinking of buying a place myself. When I told him this, he seemed impressed, as I was only 20 yrs old when I purchased the place. Then he suggested we buy it together, which meant we could get a better place with his income also being considered for the loan. As far as your other question regarding the dynamic...I'm not sure what you mean. (The house is in my name with my dad as the co-signer. Couldn't put his name on the loan because his credit was so poor it would have brought the interest rate up too high. Since then, it's gotten better though. )

[carhill]

Ah, so you own the home as a single woman, then, correct? Interesting.

 

My interest in the dynamic was primarily how the discussions went as you and he made the decision to take this big step. Also, remembrances of how your relationship might have changed during that period. Buying a home, especially a first home, can be stressful. How did the challenges affect your relationship (assuming there were challenges)? Forgive me for my memory, but does BF contribute to the house payment now?

[torranceshipman]

This quote of yours says a lot: 'But it doesn't matter I suppose. His life, his wants, and his needs. Thats pretty much what people want to tell me. So I guess I could cater to him. Even more so.' NO-ONE is telling you that, and you sound resentful of him already (and you have a right to, if he isnt treating you well). What people are just saying is...stop being so pushy and accept what YOU want is different to what HE wants right now. Tbh, I think you're both quite young so maybe thats why he doesnt want to settle yet.

 

I'm not saying that the general way in which he is treating you is right - he seems a bit disrespectful to me and you have every right to be mad about that and to deal with it. But that is a different issue from trying to push him into a commitment when he isnt ready. If he is taking you for granted, deal with that, but I'd take marriage out of the equation for the forseeable future.If you give him an ultimatum about proposing, then you're forcing him to do something he isnt ready for and that isnt fair (and when push came to shove he might not go through with it).

 

Good luck!

[Haloandhorns85]

Ah, so you own the home as a single woman, then, correct? Interesting.

 

My interest in the dynamic was primarily how the discussions went as you and he made the decision to take this big step. Also, remembrances of how your relationship might have changed during that period. Buying a home, especially a first home, can be stressful. How did the challenges affect your relationship (assuming there were challenges)? Forgive me for my memory, but does BF contribute to the house payment now?

 

 

Yes, the house is really technically mine. But he does also contribute to the payment each month. Actually, we have a joint checking account and we both deposit our checks and the payments just come right out of there. Anyways, he was traveling for his job as he was a contractor. He was actually in Houston, TX when he told me to go start looking for a place to buy. Short time later I found the one I wanted. Bought it. Now we live in it. Really didn't affect our relationship in any bad way. Kinda made us a lil closer as we were both happy to quit wasting money on rent and have something to call our own. The funny thing is, now that his credit is better, he's been after me to put him on the house loan. To me, that's a big thing considering what's going on. My response to him when he says something about: Make a commitment to me and I'll make a commitment to you. When I get a ring, I'll put your name on the house. Not til then. I feel like that is protecting myself and is fair.

[carhill]

I think, considering all factors, that it would be prudent of you to direct his contributions to other household expenses.

 

I'll tell you why I say that....

 

He could perceive that helping with the mortgage payment without his name being on the house (as a joint tenant or tenant in common) and loan to be an inequity.

 

This perception and its expression could be used as leverage to maintain the status quo, ergo "I'm helping out with the mortgage, I love you, why do we need to get married right away? What's a piece of paper and a ring anyway?"

 

It also could be used as guilt leverage if you were to decide things weren't working out or progressing the way you wanted.

 

My opinion would be slightly different if he had been actively involved in the home purchase, like taking time to fly/drive from Houston to share parts of the process with you. It seems he took more of a passive approach, at least in this man's experience (I've owned a number of homes). I'm sharing my experience here, which may or may not reflect your personal situation.

 

BTW, what does your dad think of all this? I'm sure he has an opinion. I know I would

[I Luv the Chariot OH]

Hey, great job at blackmailing him into an ultimatum to marry you! I'm sure he won't resent you for it somewhere down the road, and your subsequent marriage won't suffer from it at all. But at least HE'll be the resentful one now, and not you!

[Haloandhorns85]

The way I look at it is this:

 

Wherever he lived, he'd be paying rent because with his credit still not great, he sure the hell wouldn't be able to buy anything. I don't see it as blackmail. The house is mine legally. Why should I put myself in a situation where if he decided he didn't want to marry me, I could lose my house if he were on it? He could be an ********* and demand I sell the house and split the profit. Ok...#1..its a mobile home...there wouldn't be enough profit on it to even be worth it. Mobile homes do not resell very well. And I would lose my home. To me, I am protecting myself in the event he decides he doesn't want to marry me. Seems to me, worrying about him constantly and how he looks at things leaves me extremely vulnerable. I'm not going to do that.

 

Carhill: My dad sees it the same way I do. He put his but on the line for me, his daughter, not my boyfriend. He is actually the one who advised me to not allow him to have any legal standpoint on my house until he can make a commitment to me. Allowing him to have an ownership interest in my home BEFORE he makes a commitment to me is stupid in my opinion. That is setting myself up for a bad situation. If he feels resentful for that, he has never mentioned it.

[carhill]

I would agree and advise you similarly if you were my daughter

 

Your story underscores the complexities of combining lives and finances (and the attendant emotions) without the legal partnership of marriage.

[Haloandhorns85]

I would agree and advise you similarly if you were my daughter

 

Your story underscores the complexities of combining lives and finances (and the attendant emotions) without the legal partnership of marriage.

 

 

Exactly my reason for posting in the first place. We are living it, why not make it legal?

[torranceshipman]

Because theres a HUGE difference between living together as girlfriend/boyfriend and actually getting married - the guy knows he'd be signing up for life as opposed to the simple here and now! That's scary...so you've gotta be truly ready for that.

 

I'm sure he sees the logic in your argument, but if that FEELING of being ready is missing for him (for whatever reason), understanding the logic is no where near enough to justify taking the big leap to proposing. If he isnt ready, it is his instinct telling him to wait, for good reason (whatever that reason is). It sucks if you want marriage and he doesn't (maybe in the future that'll change) but neither of you is wrong for feeling the different ways that you do.

[angelblue]

I'm sure he sees the logic in your argument, but if that FEELING of being ready is missing for him (for whatever reason), understanding the logic is no where near enough to justify taking the big leap to proposing. If he isnt ready, it is his instinct telling him to wait, for good reason (whatever that reason is). It sucks if you want marriage and he doesn't (maybe in the future that'll change) but neither of you is wrong for feeling the different ways that you do.

 

There isn't anything wrong with feeling differently about the subject, but I think that after 3 years she deserves to know why he FEELS he isn't ready. The excuse of timing is just an excuse - as stated before there will never be a "perfect time" unless he wants there to be. She deserves to know the exact reasons why he feels he isn't ready. Knowing the why and his feelings, she will have an easier time deciding if she is willing to wait for him to be ready.

[DragonSlayer]

A couple of things. Just because you're cooking and cleaning and paying the electric bill, etc, doesn't necessarily mean you're meeting his needs. And neither does the fact that "he never complains".

 

I bet your man is kind of quiet and passive compared to you. He probably isn't real vocal about getting his needs met, and he may not even know what his needs are, to be honest. Guys aren't trained to evaluate their relationships and whether we're getting our needs met. We're trained to try to keep our wives happy. You know..."As long as she's happy, I'm happy." Well, that's not true, becuase that's often at a huge expense to the husband/BF if the relationship is dysfunctional.

 

Keep in mind....his needs are also to be respected and to not be controlled, manipulated, and blackmailed. You seem like you usually get your way, and if you don't you don't go down without a fight, without solid answers, etc. If he feels like you put a lot of pressure on him and if he's feeling that you are coercing him or pressuring him (whether it's for marriage or whatever) it will put enough weight on his chest when he thinks about you to push off the marriage. He may not even be attuned enough to know this.

 

Honestly, you seem pretty high-strung, and if this is true then you may be tough to live with and not even know it....or be able to admit it. If you are, then there is a certain amount of tension and fear in the air that makes it tough for him to want to lock you in for the rest of his life. I feel a lot of tension and anxiousness coming from your posts...I can only imagine what it's like at home when you get on the subject of committment, marriage, etc.

 

I'm glad that you're happy about the timeframe agreement. I hope it works out for you guys.

[torranceshipman]

Everything that Dragon Slayer said

 

I agree she deserves a reason but he's kinda given her one already and she isn't listening...he doesn't want to get married because he doesn't want to get married. He can come up with excuses to placate her but ultimately, it's because she isn't the one, or he isn't ready, possibly because he is way too young to settle down. If you have to nag someone continually about a timeframe for marriage, it means that they are not really into the idea.

 

And he didn't agree to move in under the condition that he would HAVE to marry her at some point to 'validate' the living together thing, so it's not like he's being unfair by just being happy with that arrangement. It's simply different expectations.

 

Halo, I think you deserve a guy who thinks you are amazing and doesnt need to be nagged to commit...and your current boyfriend deserves a girlfriend who doesnt push him into doing things he doesnt want to do!

[carhill]

I think the interceding posts have underscored an important consideration for the OP, that being that she and her BF may be incompatible. Most couples have certain incompatibilities as it is nearly impossible to be completely symbiotic, but, as our MC says, one should be able to "bend" in the relationship without "breaking". The issue with a marital timeline here is akin to a really severe "bend" in the OP's relationship.

 

If indeed the OP is "high strung" and the BF is "passive", neither perspective is more "right" or "better"; they are merely different ways of processing and living life. In many ways, as the BF appears to care less (appearances can be deceptive), in reality he is in control. While such behavior perhaps is attractive in "getting" a woman, a man needs to engage with her once in a LTR or else he will "sour the milk" (the love) she has for him. I saw the reverse in my marriage, gender-wise, but, regardless, the dynamic is still the same. I don't want to see the OP's love die and I sense that she is at the beginning of that path now.

 

I'm sure someone has suggested CT upthread and I'll support that suggestion. I think such counseling will help with the incompatibilities extant in the R, even if just to help the couple understand them better. That way, decisions made can be as a result of full communication and clarity. That's a big change I've noted in myself. I don't "nag" as much anymore, rather clearly communicate the exact issue which is in conflict. I'm not saying it's any more pleasant , as conflict rarely is, but at least it's conflict about the proper subject and my wife knows what the h#ll I'm talking about, instead of some riddle

 

Hang in there, OP, it'll work out

[MichelleS1983]

Of course he doesn't want to get married - he just wants a nice to place to live because he'd have to pay rent SOMEWHERE, so why not pay it to Halo? He's completely irresponsible and couldn't get a loan to buy a pair of shoes, so why NOT latch onto someone where the living is easy? He'd be a fool NOT to.

 

But he ain't gonna MARRY her because that's not what he's looking to do. He's looking to go where the livin's easy and she's made it horribly easy for him, hasn't she?

 

He could live in an apartment complex (one that overlooks people who are considered bad credit risks, like him). Besides, in an apartment complex, they don't provide you a free maid, a free financial planner, a free cook, a free laundress, a free housekeeper, a free sex partner, AND another person with a decent job to help contribute to the finances.

 

Of COURSE he'd rather mooch off of Halo and feed her crap about wanting to get married. It's completely win/win for him.

 

Marriage couldn't be the FURTHEST thing from his mind - he's already PROVED it by being a little sneak and taking her ring off lay-away so she could look like a complete and utter fool in front of her friend at the jewelry store. What a wanker this guy is.

 

Halo, you and he didn't buy a house together - you and your dad did. He just lives there because it's a sweet deal for him. He's made no commitment to you financially - he could walk away tomorrow and the house ownership/responsibility wouldn't change one iota.

 

What utter bullsh*t excuses he's fed you for holding off on the proposal. What UTTER bullsh*t. You should have let him walk the other night when you had the chance.

 

You CLEARLY bring SO MUCH MORE to the table than this guy.

[carhill]

Thanks, Mom

 

Sounds like my mom back when I was in my 20's and already had a house and my own business. "Watch out for golddiggers and moochers" she'd always tell me...

[Lookingforward]

Halo, re-read your posts - just a caution - you may have become so focused on the goal of M that you've lost sight of whether M with this guy at any rate is really the best thing for you.....

 

I'd advise you to re-read your posts as well and take a step back to decide if that's a possibility.

[DragonSlayer]

I agree. I think you may need to work on your self-esteem and your sense of self. Being married should not define "you"...but I feel that you think that it does.

 

How about some of these destructive things...do you do any of these???

 

The Ten Demandments

 

1. Thou shalt make me happy

2. Thou shalt not have any other interests other than me

3. Thou shalt know what I want and what I feel without having me to say

4. Thou shalt return each one of my sacrifices with an equal or greater sacrifice

5. Thou shalt shield me from anxiety, worry, hurt, or any pain

6. Thou shalt give me my sense of self-worth and esteem

7. Thou shalt be grateful for everything I do

8. Thou shalt not be critical of me, show anger toward me, or otherwise disapprove of anything I do

9. Thou shalt so caring and loving that I need never take risks or be vulnerable in any way

10. Thou shalt love me with the whole heart, the whole soul, in the whole mind, even if I do not love myself

 

 

If so...I think you should be doing more of this...

 

 

My Happiness comes from within, and I share it with others.

Whenever I enter into a relationship with the idea that another person can make me happy and content, I have begun to fail in that relationship. When I view a relationship in this way, I become concerned over what I might or might not get back.

 

Today, I release my pattern of someone's having to live up to my ideal. I have no right to impose my performance requirements on anyone else.

Today I start relieving others of the responsibility for making me happy. In this way I can begin intimate relationships based upon mutual caring, not on need. This day I acknowledge that I am a full, rich and complete person.

 

I deserve a relationship, not to make me happy, but to share the richness of who I am in totality with another.

I read these things this morning in a book called Addictive Relationships by Joy Miller. They hit home for me...or for my wife, actually.

[GPFan]

I don't know. He didn't give me a reason. He didn't even tell me. I just sorta found out on my own. I went up to the store at the mall to show my best friend the ring I picked out and the lady at the store asked me if we were still together because the lay-a-way was cancelled.

Brutal!

 

 

 

Anyways, yeah...I get the same vibe, but what can you do? There really are not many men of action. But he gave me a year. By the end of the year...he'll either be a man of action or a man of walking. Either way, my problem will be solved within a year.

Good example of setting a personal boundary.

 

 

 

My response to him when he says something about: Make a commitment to me and I'll make a commitment to you. When I get a ring, I'll put your name on the house. Not til then. I feel like that is protecting myself and is fair.

I would change it to when you are in fact married. I would give you a ring in exchange for half of a house. What a deal!

 

Do you sometimes feel that this pursuit is so very hard and emotionally exhausting? I am exhausted just reading all this. Will the reward be worth it? Do you think maintaining and working on a marriage, household and raising children will be rewarding and satisfying with this man?

 

You have a year to ponder all of this, make good use of it.

[lexi29]

Please don't put his name on YOUR house until you get married. My cousin did this- she bought a house 10 years ago- a fixer upper. She was with her boyfriend for 8 years and he moved in with her and he did fix the house up a little bit. They got engaged and had two kids together and her fiance paid NONE of the house payments. She paid for everything by herself. He lived there and bought groceries once in awhile. After they had their first child, her fiance wanted her to put his name on her house and so she did this thinking they were going to get married soon. Well their 2nd child was born and for some reason she and her fiance started fighting all the time. He did not want their 2nd son for some unknown reason and this caused a lot of grief (the 2nd child was planned but after she had him her fiance resented him or something). Anyway to make a long story short, her fiance broke up with her, kicked herand their 2 kids out of THEIR house (the one she bought and paid all the payments on).

 

He could legally do this because he owned half of the house. She could have taken him to court to get him evicted but she was so depressed and broke that she just moved in with her parents and let him live there. She now owns another house that her dad helped her purchase and she got her name off of the first house. Her ex fiance still lives there and he never had to buy her out or anything (she would have had to go to court to get this settled and chose not to because it would be too expensive) So she lost her house, all the equity she had put into it and had to start all over. Her ex fiance has not paid a single payment (in 2 years) and the house is now in foreclosure.

 

Just a warning, not saying your boyfriend would ever do this but why take a chance.