How to start from scratch in 12 mo separation ?

[dead-dyke]

Sometimes you have to ask yourself...... Are womens' souls created in hell?

You should know where she lives in case of emergency, IMO. Sorry this is not getting better for you.

[TrustInYourself]

Yes, this clothes situation sounds very, very familiar. I get the same **** when I don't just return the clothes.

 

I know where my wife lives. It's a matter of emergency as dead spoke of.

 

Why is she telling me she doesn't want to do anything until she gets more counseling. What the ****.

[n9688m]

Easier to talk about moving on than actually doing it. Part of my not asking where she lives is to let my STBXW think that I have moved on and I am independent.

 

That is not a reason to not ask her where she lives. For emergency reasons if nothing else you must know where your daughter lives; for you to not ask (or not be told) is frankly irresponsible.

 

Hard to move on when there is a 2.5yo completely dependent on me.

 

That is understanable - but surveillance for a boyfriend will not help you nor your daughter nor your relationship with your ex.

[SingleDad]

I sent an email to my STBXW asking for my daughter's address of her 2nd home for emergency reasons. (so that my request is in writing).

 

Auto response was that she was out of office until Wed.

 

She has my daughter tonight and tommorrow night... I am assuming she took a couple of days off work to paint and organize her new house. Hoping reason is not to spend time w BF.

[n9688m]

Hoping reason is not to spend time w BF.

 

I think verifying she has a BF would be very good for you at this point - I mean that sincerely. That would make this "real" to you, reduce your false hope, and probably encourage you to begin dating yourself. In other words, it would begin your healing process.

[TrustInYourself]

Haha. Yeah, knowing that would be great wouldn't it.

[Billy Bob]

Going on three weeks since she moved out and I still do not know where my STBXW and daughter actually live... When should I demand to know where my daughter's other house is located ? Part of me does not want to know beacuse I would be tempted to monitor her house for boyfriend activity...

 

Yep, she's probably pole dancing on someone else's pole... Get out there and live a little.. this relationship is over between you and the stbxw. She's getting a pounding by some other dude and you are still wollowing in sorow for yourself. Time to man up!

[Billy Bob]

I think verifying she has a BF would be very good for you at this point - I mean that sincerely. That would make this "real" to you, reduce your false hope, and probably encourage you to begin dating yourself. In other words, it would begin your healing process.

 

I agree 100%.. you have been deluding yourself for far too long SingleDad. Stop being a pussy and fight back. She isn't coming back. There is nothing here to salvage.. that is obvious. You are hanging on to the past which has come and gone. Life goes on.. start living. Plenty of other women out there for you. One's that would love to have a step-daughter.

[TrustInYourself]

Destroy yourself for the sake of becoming stronger. Let the man who loved your wife die. Kill your love for the sake of future happiness.

 

Is that the key?

[SingleDad]

cta - you are a bitter and blunt man. I do not need to hear such vivid reality.

 

I need to keep some shread of hope. The thought of being only a part time father for the next two decades completely devistates me.

 

I am getting to be very lonely... going from 7 years of being with someone to completely alone is tough... from a family to a part time dad is hard to adjust to so quickly..

 

I am still married legally. I find it immoral to date others when still married... and I know I am not ready - though I may need to succumb to being immoral (I am only human).

 

fyi - I have emailed my STBXW for my daughter's address to her 2nd home for emergency reasons - haven't yet got a response.

[TrustInYourself]

I've lost my perspective completely. Hope is dead or dying inside me. It's not my fault but constant reinforcement from the wife that our marriage is over. I've tried and I still want to try, but I can't force my wife to feel something.

 

I want to just step back and not be so deep in all my emotions and this horrible sense of loss. This feeling of losing out is so overpowering at the moment. It's hard. I'm trying to soak in this grief and push out positivity. Not working. Haha, gotta love this separation crap.

[SingleDad]

I have my first good evening by myself since this started. I went for a 5 mile run, long shower, then listened to my favorite music Spyro Gyra (Jazz fusion) while relaxing on my patio with two beers and my Ex's dogs.

 

Ex tried calling 2x last night - I didn't answer the phone. This morning she called and wanted me to jump start her car - I told her She never told her where she lived so I can't help her and then hung up. I call back 5 min later - she was pissed and found someone else to help her. Told me she was going to cancel my free cell phone (her Co. employee phone plan). I e-mailed back that I would have loved to help her but she refuses to give me her daughter's address - negligence. If she cancels the cell phone, she will not have any access to talk to her daugher when we are not at the house.

[TrustInYourself]

I have my first good evening by myself since this started. I went for a 5 mile run, long shower, then listened to my favorite music Spyro Gyra (Jazz fusion) while relaxing on my patio with two beers and my Ex's dogs.

 

Ex tried calling 2x last night - I didn't answer the phone. This morning she called and wanted me to jump start her car - I told her She never told her where she lived so I can't help her and then hung up. I call back 5 min later - she was pissed and found someone else to help her. Told me she was going to cancel my free cell phone (her Co. employee phone plan). I e-mailed back that I would have loved to help her but she refuses to give me her daughter's address - negligence. If she cancels the cell phone, she will not have any access to talk to her daugher when we are not at the house.

 

LOL, feels good eh? I know the sensations you are feeling now. Mad props.

 

Jazz fusion huh? I should check that out.

[dead-dyke]

Way to go - Maybe she'll start getting the drift.

[dead-dyke]

People think it's bulls**t, but what the hell. When all else fails.http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=45923190156659217&q=the+secret&ei=PCF-SNicFIv8-gHrro3YDQ

You could find it w/out subs and stuff, but its in English.

[SingleDad]

I just spoke at length with my STBXW after 3 weeks of LC. We had exchanged several nasty e-mails this morning first. Then things became very bitter.

 

I requested my daughter's address.

 

She wanted me to help her jump her car this morning - I said I couldn't as you refused to give me the address.

 

She said I can't tell you because I do not want you stalking me.

 

I threatened a court order and that not letting a father know where his daughter could be construed as kidnapping.

 

She gave me the adddress but told me she would cancel my cell phone because I am not there for her.

 

The whole thing just got out of hand and nasty- how she felt I treated her during the marriage. In-laws not liking each of us, etc.

 

Like the devil has taken over her...fire coming our of her eyes. She acted that way 3 or 4 times after she initiated the divorce. Scary thing to see.

 

I just sent another e-mail apologizing, how did it get this way... I want to work things out... It is just my anger over she actions that make me feel this way... I want to work things out, etc. etc.

 

What a rollercoaster.... I though I was done with the ride after the separation and move apart.

 

How and why do things get so nasty.

[dead-dyke]

Well, for me, it's just like you said, because of no kids, it's easy to break contact. For you, it's just not possible. But my wife turned into someone I had no idea who she was anymore, accusing me of things I could not even fathom. After a few months of this, cause I didn't want to give up either, but finally having enough, and telling her once and for all, - and I had to raise my voice considerably - if she was going to treat me like a second class citizen, and show off her power in front of her friends, etc., and ranting about her behavior, which I won't get into, but the fact that I had enough, and was through taking her s**t, she actually settled down and listened to me.

 

You are doing the right thing. Don't let her belittle you. She is threatening because she see's her actions are not as successful anymore,and she is more or less backing herself into a corner. Don't apologize in the future. I'm sure this will come naturally in the near future as you are already exhibiting a more aggressive attitude. But don't say sorry. It falls on deaf ears. Hold your ground. Demand her address or else court action is required just like you said. She has no right to accuse you of stalking. It's just an excuse.

[TrustInYourself]

Well, for me, it's just like you said, because of no kids, it's easy to break contact. For you, it's just not possible. But my wife turned into someone I had no idea who she was anymore, accusing me of things I could not even fathom. After a few months of this, cause I didn't want to give up either, but finally having enough, and telling her once and for all, - and I had to raise my voice considerably - if she was going to treat me like a second class citizen, and show off her power in front of her friends, etc., and ranting about her behavior, which I won't get into, but the fact that I had enough, and was through taking her s**t, she actually settled down and listened to me.

 

You are doing the right thing. Don't let her belittle you. She is threatening because she see's her actions are not as successful anymore,and she is more or less backing herself into a corner. Don't apologize in the future. I'm sure this will come naturally in the near future as you are already exhibiting a more aggressive attitude. But don't say sorry. It falls on deaf ears. Hold your ground. Demand her address or else court action is required just like you said. She has no right to accuse you of stalking. It's just an excuse.

 

I agree. Next time, keep a lid on the emotions and play it cool. Don't play her game. Everytime you lose it, you show how much control she has over you. If you are not in control of your emotions, than your emotions are in control of you.

 

Also, do not apologize. Why? Because now you are reinforcing her angry behavior. She knows that if she wants you to bow down, all she has to do is get an argument with you. It's only a matter of time before she can get a reaction from you. Don't play that game with her either.

 

It's all about stepping away and taking control. Control of yourself, your life, and your marriage. I'm sorry to hear you lost it, but we're all human. Keep up your strides of your own independence. That's important.

[Owl]

OK...go over to marriagebuilders and read up on plan A and plan B.

 

I'm going to be totally blunt...the reason she doesn't want you to have her address is BECAUSE SHE'S HIDING SOMETHING.

 

She's involved with (and probably has been since well before you seperated) with another man.

 

Seriously...there are a ton of 'red flags' here that indicate that.

 

I heartily suggest you read up on those plans...and consider what your goals are from here.

 

If you truly want to try a reconciliation...you need to start "plan A" right now.

 

Don't threaten her with anything anymore...simply DO what you're going to do. Like with the discussion about the lawyer...you should have simply gone to him to begin with when she first refused to give the address.

 

Today COULD have been a moment for you to have moved forward in fixing things...you could have had a great "plan A" moment. If you had AGREED to jumpstart her car from the beginning...without issue...and then simply asked for the address on where her car was at...you could have shown her some love and caring...AND gotten the address without issue.

 

Instead...you PROVED to her exactly what she wants to see about you. That you don't love her or care for her, but have to have your OWN agenda. (I'm not saying this is true...I'm saying that she set the stage to see this in you, and got what she wanted out of it)

 

See what I'm talking about here?

 

Seriously...go read the marriagebuilders material...all the "free stuff" on that website...use that to start working this. I know that LJ knows those plans "inside and out" as well...and can give you great advice on implementing them as well.

[SingleDad]

I printed out the info on marriage builders and had just started getting the book "His wants, her wants" not knowing it was from the author of marriage builders program.

 

... I just do not fully know what I did to hurt her so bad the way she claims... she manifests so much pain and agony when I broach any discussion of working things out... doesn't she understand that we are even as far as pain and agony go through this divorce process. Yet I am not willing to throw in the towel after 7 years and a daughter together.

 

Why is it that men and women think so differently and have such different needs and expectations from marriage. I grew up with the idea that it is what you do for a person, show them through your actions, your love for them, be there for them, be stable and be a provider.

 

With STBXW it is all about emotions, communication, understanding unspoken inner thoughts, really listening (empathizing with their feelings).

 

I just do not know how we will be able to truly understand each other... We need a marriage builders weekend , but she refuses to go.

 

I fear that men and women will never think the same way and the same issues would just manifest themselves in future relationships.

 

I'm at a loss...

[TrustInYourself]

I read that book. Good stuff in regards to the differences in men and women's needs in a relationship.

 

It hasn't saved my marriage, but our communication has been improved. I should probably read it again.

[Owl]

SD, here's the thing.

 

You probably haven't hurt her that bad. If you can't see it...its very possibly not there.

 

BUT...when someone begins in an affair, one of the first things they do is re-write their own marital history.

 

I saw my wife do this during her affair.

 

She screamed at me that she "hadn't been happy in YEARS!!!". I couldn't see it. I could see where she'd been unhappy for that past year or so leading up to d-day...but for YEARS? Not at all. So, I asked the kids if THEY had seen her unhappy, or what she might have been unhappy about (we have older kids). Couldn't see anything...nor could her sister, her friends, etc...

 

So, I asked for SPECIFIC INSTANCES of what I'd done to make her so unhappy. She couldn't think of a SINGLE THING, other than specifics in that last year.

 

I could agree with that last year...she'd gone into a downward spiral of depression and online gaming addiction that finally culminated in her online emotional affair.

 

Even then...she couldn't see how HER actions had led to her unhappiness...ONLY I was to blame for it.

 

The funny thing is, as we went through marriage counseling, as NC got in place between her and OM, and as we began rebuilding our relationship, that time went from YEARS down to "the last couple of years"...and then finally down to what we could agree on as the truth.

 

I suspect you're seeing something very similar. And that's part of the reason why I'd cautioned you...because I also suspect she's deliberatly BAITING you into behaving exactly the way she's WANTING you to...badly. She's justifying her actions by saying "see how rotten he treats me?!!! ALL I asked for was some help with my car and he turned it into this huge fight over my address!!!!".

 

Get the idea?

 

Seriously...I'd start doing some of that snooping she's worried that you'll start. My money says you're going to find that there's been someone else in the picture for a while prior to the beginning of the seperation...and its still going strong.

 

Look at her cell phone history, her email/IM history, her texting patterns. Look at her spending habits over the last year leading up to the seperation. See if there are unexplained receipts for meals/trips/motel rooms/gifts that you never saw.

 

Ask around some of her friends that you think might actually support you.

 

I really think there's part of this story that you've not seen yet.

[Gunny376]

SD, here's the thing.

 

You probably haven't hurt her that bad. If you can't see it...its very possibly not there.

 

BUT...when someone begins in an affair, one of the first things they do is re-write their own marital history.

 

I saw my wife do this during her affair.

 

She screamed at me that she "hadn't been happy in YEARS!!!". I couldn't see it. I could see where she'd been unhappy for that past year or so leading up to d-day...but for YEARS? Not at all. So, I asked the kids if THEY had seen her unhappy, or what she might have been unhappy about (we have older kids). Couldn't see anything...nor could her sister, her friends, etc...

 

So, I asked for SPECIFIC INSTANCES of what I'd done to make her so unhappy. She couldn't think of a SINGLE THING, other than specifics in that last year.

 

I could agree with that last year...she'd gone into a downward spiral of depression and online gaming addiction that finally culminated in her online emotional affair.

 

Even then...she couldn't see how HER actions had led to her unhappiness...ONLY I was to blame for it.

 

The funny thing is, as we went through marriage counseling, as NC got in place between her and OM, and as we began rebuilding our relationship, that time went from YEARS down to "the last couple of years"...and then finally down to what we could agree on as the truth.

 

I suspect you're seeing something very similar. And that's part of the reason why I'd cautioned you...because I also suspect she's deliberatly BAITING you into behaving exactly the way she's WANTING you to...badly. She's justifying her actions by saying "see how rotten he treats me?!!! ALL I asked for was some help with my car and he turned it into this huge fight over my address!!!!".

 

Get the idea?

 

Seriously...I'd start doing some of that snooping she's worried that you'll start. My money says you're going to find that there's been someone else in the picture for a while prior to the beginning of the seperation...and its still going strong.

 

Look at her cell phone history, her email/IM history, her texting patterns. Look at her spending habits over the last year leading up to the seperation. See if there are unexplained receipts for meals/trips/motel rooms/gifts that you never saw.

 

Ask around some of her friends that you think might actually support you.

 

I really think there's part of this story that you've not seen yet.

 

If there's no other rational justification for you not to know where she' living ~ and giving the erratic emotional behavior and on her part ~ I would say based on my past personal experiences and obversations of others ~ that she's either (a) scroggin someone else, or (b) wanting to very badly.

 

Her accussations of your potentially stalking her is more a fear grounded that you will discover the affair.

[OGrtMaker]

Wow, I just read through this thread and I don't know if I should even post on this board because it seems like there is a lot of women-hating stuff being written (ex. the line about women's souls being created in hell, or some crap like that). Well, regardless, I am going to give you my opinion because I feel that someone here needs to play devil's advocate. I think a lot of people who have gone through sep/divorce are still hurt and angry and are going to tell you "kick the B to the curb" in so many words. But the truth is none of us know you or your wife personally or live your life. You obviously have your reasons for holding on to hope for your marriage (your child, being the first) and I respect you for that. Separations do not all have to end in divorce and I happen to agree with you that if you cut her off completely and play hard ball that you will most likely squash any chance to reconcile with her. I do believe you should not let her walk over you or be unfair (and I think it is completely wrong she did not immediately give you her new address!!). Right now her emotions are on high and it's not right or fair how she's treating you, especially since it sounds like you are really trying to be kind and civil towards her. The clothing issue is ridiculous ~ she is being petty, probably because she's angry and emotional. That's not fair to you or your daughter and I hope she will see that and change her behavior. The main thing I want to say is there seems to be a lot of negativity on this board towards any separation being capable of resulting in getting back together & I hope that you will look at your own situation and follow your heart. I also don't think that just because she hasn't given you her address it means she is seeing someone else. Yes, it's possible, but unless you have some sort of proof then who knows, she could have other reasons (again, no valid reason because you have every right to know where your child is living). You seem like a really good person who wants more than anything to save his marriage ~ don't let the naysayers convince you that it is hopeless. I wish more people here would post about separations that ultimately brought about a lasting reconciliation. It would give me some hope, too! Good luck!

[SingleDad]

STBXW is just so bitter and angry about the "lack of love and attention" that "I have hurt her so bad she will never want to feel that pain again" (I feel terrible she feels that way - we were focusing on our 2 yo daughter and I had huge stress from work responsible for a $500k/yr revenue client that consumed me) . Yet, I truly believe her talk is a deflection of the guilt and cover-up from an afffair she might be having.

 

As of now, we are very likely even as far as the pain and agony we inflicted upon each other through the divorce process... again we moved it to a 12 month legal separation which began June 12. All of the terms are settled and payments laid out - a divorce which could occur in 11 mos would only be a piece of paper.

 

Talked to STBXW last night after our fight in the morning:

 

These are the things I told her: We certainly had/have our issues and I will be the first to admit my mistakes (she will not admit to doing anything wrong unfortunately). But we have been together for 7 years, decided to get married after 3.5 years and have a child a year after that, and re-model the kitchen spring of 2007 - we couldn't have had such a terrible relationship that whole time or we wouldn't have done those things. I told her that I continue to love her very much and we just need help learning how to communicate with each other and work to rebuild respect and trust for each other. As much as I enjoy the one-on-one time and raising my daughter, it was never my intention to be a single dad. I do not want to raise her by myself I want to be a family again. Neither of us were really happpy since summer of 2007, but I didn't realize how good I had it until after I lost it.

 

My STBXW desires to be friends/friendly for the sake of our daughter. But I am not sure if a large part of this is just so she can feel she is making the right decision to divorce and we can still get along and be good parents to our daughter. I told her I'd like to start from scratch and be friends and build from there. She said she doesn't want to be friends is I have an alterior motive like "loving my wife and wanting to stay married." I said that is not an alterior motive, that is how I feel. She said that is too much burden to bear and too much pressure - I'd just be pushing her.

 

So how I build a friendship without any intent on us getting back together ?