How to start from scratch in 12 mo separation ?

[Owl]

Yes - Owl it makes sense... Looks like I screwed that one up terribly.

 

It will just be so difficult to obey her orders and be able to keep my own self-respect - to have the slim chance of winning her back.

 

She will get everything she wants and I have to suck it up and absorb all of her criticism...learn to live under the rules of a dictator who rules both houses.

 

She has won either way.

 

As I've just posted on your other thread...

 

KNOCK IT OFF.

 

If you want to sit there and cry woe is me...don't expect advice or help.

 

That's USELESS.

 

Its NOT her way or your way. Its THE BEST FOR YOUR CHILD way.

 

Compromises...getting a PROFESSIONAL to help the two of you work out the best way, and then agreeing jointly on it.

 

If you want to act like your only choices are yours or hers...then you're just throwing yourself a pity party.

 

There are ALWAYS ways to work things out...

 

You don't have to agree with everything she says...but you SHOULD agree with the things she says that make sense! And find compromises on the things that don't, and refuse to change on the things that you KNOW are flat wrong and can't find a compromise on.

 

Seriously...this is silly.

[Ladyjane14]

It will just be so difficult to obey her orders and be able to keep my own self-respect - to have the slim chance of winning her back.

 

She will get everything she wants and I have to suck it up and absorb all of her criticism...learn to live under the rules of a dictator who rules both houses.

 

She has won either way.

 

 

This is temporary though, kiddo. If you're going to follow Harley's approach... then you'll address all that in "Plan B".

[SingleDad]

LJ and Owl - I know and I'll work to raise our daughter my wife's way.

 

Yet I do not agree that is the best way for our daughter.

 

My wife uses a very authoritarian controlling approach - with constant threats of "time-outs"... reminds me of what Boot camp would be like... She is 2 1/2 - she should have time as a kid.

 

I guess I can use her approach - but be more gentle about it at my house.

 

I want to do the best for my daughter.

[TrustInYourself]

SD, I have some tough advice for you. It's not about your wife winning, or you winning. It's about your family winning.

 

Give up the illusion of control. It's not about you at the moment. It's about understanding her. Are you giving up a fundamental sense of your self by doing what she wants? That's debatable. What you are trying to accomplish is disarm her anger, fear, hurt. How are you going to accomplish that by adding fuel to the fire by disagreement? Sometimes you just have to listen. Simply listen.

 

Also, you are clinging to the relationship. Everything you say shows your motivation is to hold on to the relationship. That's not helping, when she feels like the only reason you communicate is to hold together a relationship that doesn't work. Even you recognize that what you are doing, doesn't work.

 

Owl and LadyJane, you guys are on point as well. Isn't compromise what marriage is all about? Haha, yeah marriage is great!

 

Try and understand things from your wife's perspective. That could help ease your sense of losing yourself if you try and understand. Also you have to be careful about holding the marriage and what's best for your family over your wife's head. You are just going to make her run away.

 

Imagine if you will, I came up to you trying to sell you a vehicle that was perfect for you. I show you all the sweet features and safety ratings. I show you how fast it can go and how it's great on gas. You're sold. You know the vehicle is perfect for you. Then I start telling you how much I think that I should be your car dealer for the rest of your life. I'm what's best for you. I'm the man who can give you the perfect car and you should realize that.

 

Most likely your reflex is to pull away and say, "What the hell is this guy doing, trying to manipulate me?".

 

Stop holding the marriage over her head. If you want her to consider working on the marriage it's going to take the actions and understanding that are atypical from what you have been doing towards the end of when you were together. Steps that you have taken. Your mindset however is locked on to "Getting your marriage together". It should be, "Loving your wife". That means understanding her, rather than winning.

[Ladyjane14]

LJ and Owl - I know and I'll work to raise our daughter my wife's way.

 

Yet I do not agree that is the best way for our daughter.

 

My wife uses a very authoritarian controlling approach - with constant threats of "time-outs"... reminds me of what Boot camp would be like... She is 2 1/2 - she should have time as a kid.

 

I guess I can use her approach - but be more gentle about it at my house.

 

I want to do the best for my daughter.

 

Honey, we're not recommending that you do ANYTHING that would be harmful for your daughter... and certainly not in order to save a marriage to someone who would advocate harmful methods. That would just be WRONG.

 

I think your wife is right though on the idea that a kid should sleep in their own bed. I think it leads to insecurities and behavioral problems when they're not provided with structure.

 

Have you ever watched that Nanny 911 program??

It's about the group of British nannies who go into people's homes and tackle parenting issues. I really do like their methods. Their approach is to set up structure for the child and then to INVOLVE, not only the parents, but the children themselves, in adherence to the structure. IOW, the kids LEARN how their behavior affects the harmony of the home and how their actions have direct consequences... and they learn it earlier rather than later.

 

They've put out a book on the subject... and you can ever peruse excerpts online if you're interested. I think Owl's right... work through a professional or even a single parenting program so that you've got some guidance. That way, you can put away the adversarial approach to common goals.

[SingleDad]

TIY - advice at the perfect time as usual.

 

I now in a mindset to completely agree. It is no longer about winning my wife back... but making sure there is a great family - be it one or two households.

 

I am tired of the emotional turmoil and her twisting of everything I say into her into somoething completely different.

 

I just want to avoid turmoil... and have a family dynamic.

 

I have to really listen to my W and try to see everything from her point of view... And do things with my daughter her way (for the most part, anyway)

 

Some good news is that I apologized for the arguments and disagreements last night and this morning and as of right now - my W has agreed to go to dinner with me for my 40th birthday (but I need to give her $50,000 tonight for the second step of the marital settlement). Nice party huh ?

[TrustInYourself]

Haha, yeah. Well at least you can smile while you do it. Don't worry man, you are taking all the right steps. It's only a matter of time before she realizes how good a man you are. She will remember.

 

Just don't give her fuel to push you away. That bitch comes out when you fight her, or try and convince her of something she's not ready to feel or believe. Become the master of listening and smiling and disarming the anger and hurt.

 

I have come to realize a big part of being a man, is shouldering all the pain, hurt, and anger on our shoulders. That's what so important and special about us in a relationship. We can be counted on. Allow her to remember that. On the downside, we live 10 years less. Haha.

 

Have fun. Enjoy your dinner. Life is short. Perhaps you won't ever have another chance at dinner with her. Take it for what it's worth. Best wishes and lots of care and luck.

 

Oh yeah and happy 40th. You're old!

[SingleDad]

TIY - thanks for your words and encouragement - they are sorely needed....

 

except for the being old part.

[n9688m]

It will just be so difficult to obey her orders and be able to keep my own self-respect - to have the slim chance of winning her back.

 

Negative.

 

"Obeying her orders" will reduce both your self-respect and your respect for yourself.

 

You are an equal parent. Your opinions are as valid as hers. Behave that way and you will both increase your own self-esteem and increase her respect for you.

[TrustInYourself]

Negative.

 

"Obeying her orders" will reduce both your self-respect and your respect for yourself.

 

You are an equal parent. Your opinions are as valid as hers. Behave that way and you will both increase your own self-esteem and increase her respect for you.

 

Hey cranky divorced guy. Stop giving advice. I don't think he wants to end up in your shoes.

[GreenEyedLady]

I don't see why parenting has to be one or the other.

 

Why can't it be both?

 

My XH and I have very different parenting approaches. (I have rules, he doesn't.)

 

But we both love our children and I can't say a DAMN THING about how he parents at his house because I don't live there. And vice versa. Now unless the child is being abused, then that's a different story.

 

My children are very happily adjusted now (my daughter was 2 at the time of the separation) and they know what's expected at both their homes.

 

The joy of being separated/divorced is that your estranged/xspouse doesn't get to tell you what to do anymore.

 

Am I just a rebel or what?!

[TrustInYourself]

I don't see why parenting has to be one or the other.

 

Why can't it be both?

 

My XH and I have very different parenting approaches. (I have rules, he doesn't.)

 

But we both love our children and I can't say a DAMN THING about how he parents at his house because I don't live there. And vice versa. Now unless the child is being abused, then that's a different story.

 

My children are very happily adjusted now (my daughter was 2 at the time of the separation) and they know what's expected at both their homes.

 

The joy of being separated/divorced is that your estranged/xspouse doesn't get to tell you what to do anymore.

 

Am I just a rebel or what?!

 

You rebel. I bet you drive a lifted pickup truck. Tatoos?

[SingleDad]

I am so sad and lonely... I am trying to live life on my own - but I just can't fill my hole. I have not expressed anything to my W - just keeping any contact friendly.

 

Mal and TIY seem to be back on the road to reconciliation - I am happy for them - but also jealous... The three of us have young children and their wives (even after likely affairs) have come to learn that family is important and are at least working toward reconciliation... While my W is not... still adament in getting a divorce.

 

Almost seems like I am doing something wrong - I guess my situation was just more dire and further set in destruction.

 

Maybe I also set my wife up too well - no reason for her to come back - though that is what she was entitled to - too friendly of a separation/divorce. I blew it.

[Owl]

What are you DOING in that free time that you've got now?

 

What are you DOING to try to fill that hole? I don't mean with someone else, but what are you putting your energy and focus and time into?

 

Working out? Running? Old hobby you can resume? New hobby you've wanted to try?

 

What friends and family can you lean on for emotional support right now?

 

None of this will fill the whole gap...but the sooner you start working on some of this, the easier it will be.

 

AND...all of this is part of that plan A I've been harping...if you're not just sitting around pining for her, but instead showing you're a man on the move, that is FAR more attractive.

 

What are you doing tonite when you get home that will fill that time?

[SingleDad]

I have been running about once a week. Reading most nights. Getting my house back in order. Mother's house once a week. Church every Sunday. Have daughter 3 overnights each week. Garage sales. And usually have some event to take my daughter to when I have her on weekends.

 

I do not enjoy bars - they just depress me. And not much for going out. I am more of a home body - like doing things around the house.

 

I am not miserable - just have an emptiness inside me... much better than a few months ago.

[Owl]

I can relate, more than you'd think. I'm not one for the bars or anything like that.

 

But, I know that working out is the best form of antidepressant out there. Reading is great...I both read and write. But, that's not a good way to occupy a lot of your time.

 

Seriously...have you considered looking for a cheap weight set at those yard/garage sales? Or a bike/elliptical exerciser?

 

What about an actual hobby/activity that takes concentration and effort? Woodworking, fixing cars, whatever.

 

I suggest this because doing something like this can help you so much in this arena.

 

It doesn't have to be an 'out of home' activity. But you need to get focused on SOMETHING so that you're not staying focused on the divorce.

[SingleDad]

I have a weightroom in my basement which I use a bit - but could use more.

 

I have thought about getting back into my charity which a few friends and I started in 1997 called "Computers for Children" (CFC). We were the first charity in the U.S. which upgraded used computers to pentium level and donated back to area schools and other children focused charities. Two other computer charities existed in the U.S. but did not perform upgrading. Kid volunteers are taught how to do the upgrades themselves, get to keep one of the computers they built for themselves, and are given both software and hardware training. CFC has put about 14,000 upgraded computers in area schools since we started it.

 

I was a founder and the treasurer and financial director for the first 6 years... The time committment got to be overwhelming and had to give it up.

 

I was thinking about going back to do the bookkeeping and get a little payment - which would also help offset some of the child support outlay.

 

I will also see many people who are in much worse situations than I am in.

[dgiirl]

I have a weightroom in my basement which I use a bit - but could use more.

 

I have thought about getting back into my charity which a few friends and I started in 1997 called "Computers for Children" (CFC). We were the first charity in the U.S. which upgraded used computers to pentium level and donated back to area schools and other children focused charities. Two other computer charities existed in the U.S. but did not perform upgrading. Kid volunteers are taught how to do the upgrades themselves, get to keep one of the computers they built for themselves, and are given both software and hardware training. CFC has put about 14,000 upgraded computers in area schools since we started it.

 

I was a founder and the treasurer and financial director for the first 6 years... The time committment got to be overwhelming and had to give it up.

 

I was thinking about going back to do the bookkeeping and get a little payment - which would also help offset some of the child support outlay.

 

I will also see many people who are in much worse situations than I am in.

 

This is an awesome idea! The best thing a person can do while going through a breakup is to get out and meet people. I'm not talking about dating. I'm talking about getting out and meeting new people, young, old, men and women, all just as friends. By meeting new people, you open yourself up to new ideas and new viewpoints, people get to know YOU for YOU, not you as a couple, and when they start to like YOU for you, it's a huge boost to your self esteem. Plus, it sounds like you are doing a good deed, which will give you good karma. It might not get you exactly what you want right now, but I strongly believe the type of karma you give out, you will receive. If you give out good karma, you will receive good karma. If you give out bad karma, all you will get is bad karma.

 

It sounds like for the last little while, all you've been generating is bad karma by fighting with your wife which you will continue to do until one of you guys stop. I understand WHY you are fighting with your wife, and I understand that you are feeling torn by "giving in" and feeling walked over, or standing up for what you believe is right. I always believe you should stand up for what you believe is right. But SOMEtimes what you believe is right, is not always right. And other people have just as much of a right to stand up for what they believe is right as you do. This is what your marriage seems to have come to. You BOTH believe you are RIGHT and are both refusing to acknowledge the other persons right to feel the way they do. You also both seem to be so focused on what you each believe is right instead of realizing the other party has as much of good intentions as you do. Dont you believe your wife loves your child as much as you do? Do you honestly believe your wife would cause harm to your child intentionally? Dont you see that your wife will fight and protect as hard for her child as much as you would fight and protect for your child? You both share the exact same goals and yet it is driving a wedge between you two and your marriage. I dont know what other martial problems you guys currently have, but this is at least ONE MAJOR issue that is destroying your marriage. And until you learn to fix it, you have no chance at reconciling. This does not mean being a wimp and letting your wife walk all over you. But it does mean you being a responsible mature man and learning that there are other people in the world who have different opinions and beliefs and feelings and they are entitled to theirs JUST as much as you are entitled to yours, and first giving THEM the benefit of doubt that just maybe they can produce the same good results you are fighting so hard to obtain. What is more important to you in regards to your child? Does the method to get there or the end result mean more to you? Is doing it "YOUR" way more important to you? Or is raising a healthy loving child more important? Surly you can see that what both you and your wife are currently doing is far from what you both want for your child, and far from what your child deserves.

[SingleDad]

My wife is not happy - and believes that I am the cause of her unhappiness -so she left to re-build herself. Says she can't raise our daughter right when she is not happy. And says she doesn't want to raise our daughter in a place where the parents don't show each other love.

 

That is her POV. I do love my wife... we were going through a period where neither of us were happy. I was stressed out and frustrated and she was exhausted and depressed... I never expected divorce - I just thought we were going through a rough patch... I still have trouble believing this is actually happening.

 

And yes our troubles mounted after our daughter was about 1.5. Wife wants to hard to raise our daughter right (believing that her mother did a terrible job) and seems to believe only she can do it right - became very controlling of everybody else and of our daughter - like boot camp. I wish she would ease up a bit. When she tell our daughter "do you want a time out" every 5 minutes - it is like nails on a chalkboard.

 

I do believe that she loves our daughter dearly and it doing the best job she can. I think she also know that I am doing a much better job than she was expecting (before the D). But still she is adament on getting the divorce - that I "cannot love her the way she needs to be loved" And I admit that I didn't know what that meant before - I do now... and wish I had another chance to show her my love...

 

Unfortunately - She has become so angry and distant and set in her mindset... I cannot get close to her - and do not want to at this point...

 

What happened to the person I knew for 6 of the past 7 years ?

[GreenEyedLady]

You rebel. I bet you drive a lifted pickup truck. Tatoos?

 

Naw, I drive a good old dependable Honda.

 

But I did get my first tattoo a couple months ago. No one can see it though unless I'm wearing a bathing suit.

[GreenEyedLady]

I do not enjoy bars - they just depress me. And not much for going out. I am more of a home body - like doing things around the house.

 

I am not miserable - just have an emptiness inside me... much better than a few months ago.

 

What about a coffeehouse? You could read there, enjoy the atmosphere and maybe even meet a new friend or two.

[TrustInYourself]

My wife is not happy - and believes that I am the cause of her unhappiness -so she left to re-build herself. Says she can't raise our daughter right when she is not happy. And says she doesn't want to raise our daughter in a place where the parents don't show each other love.

 

That is her POV. I do love my wife... we were going through a period where neither of us were happy. I was stressed out and frustrated and she was exhausted and depressed... I never expected divorce - I just thought we were going through a rough patch... I still have trouble believing this is actually happening.

 

And yes our troubles mounted after our daughter was about 1.5. Wife wants to hard to raise our daughter right (believing that her mother did a terrible job) and seems to believe only she can do it right - became very controlling of everybody else and of our daughter - like boot camp. I wish she would ease up a bit. When she tell our daughter "do you want a time out" every 5 minutes - it is like nails on a chalkboard.

 

I do believe that she loves our daughter dearly and it doing the best job she can. I think she also know that I am doing a much better job than she was expecting (before the D). But still she is adament on getting the divorce - that I "cannot love her the way she needs to be loved" And I admit that I didn't know what that meant before - I do now... and wish I had another chance to show her my love...

 

Unfortunately - She has become so angry and distant and set in her mindset... I cannot get close to her - and do not want to at this point...

 

What happened to the person I knew for 6 of the past 7 years ?

 

Number one priority. Kill your wife. I mean kill your need for your wife.

[SingleDad]

I am learning that I do not "need" my wife... But I do "want" her in my life - well not the way she is now, but the way she was for the 6 years prior to this last year.

 

And maybe it is not my wife per se... I want the family, things happening around the house - and not me trying to think of something to do to occupy myself.

 

Before I seemed to busy that I could not find the time to relax, spend time doing fun things with the family, and do the things I enjoy. Now I have too much time that I can't think of what to do to enjoy myself - have no will to enjoy myself - do not remember what I enjoy doing.

 

Strange twist of thought patterns.

[pelicanpreacher]

I've read all of your posts in this thread and have come to the conclusion that you may have grown apart from your wife in some very significant areas. Your spiritual growth for example through your involvement in the local church has transformed you in unexpected ways that causes your wife to reject and maybe even resent you for what she's been doing because of a guilty conscience. Throughout your marriage how important was religion and spirituality?

 

Also, when you have your daughter with you do you question her about what goes on in your wife's home? The truth told from the "mouth of babes" is innocent of guile or adulteration and can often be believed at face value. I believe you are being "gas lighted" when your wife has you to do babysitting on her time for if she is involved in an affair having a 2 year old child underfoot can sometimes dampen the mood and make building a new relationship with an OM difficult. You need to refrain from remaining at her beck and call for you may be enabling and sustaining her affair through your incidental investment of time, money and services provided in an attempt to befriend her.

 

You mentioned possibly getting involved again with CSC. Have you thought of pursuing other more social interests like taking a gormet cooking class, or ballroom dancing, or whatever activity that's safe and popular to do in your area's social scene? You seemed at a loss about what your personal interests were before you got married and I believe that you not only need to reconnect with your old self but to also expand your horizons to include more facets to your being and become more well rounded in your maturity. You need to spend as much time allotted to yourself when its your wife's turn to have your child in devotion to your own self-improvement making yourself a more universally interesting, attractive and engaging person to everyone around you. Balance this time with your involvement with CSC, church activities and an excercise regiment so you'll be far too busy to find the time or energy to long for your wife. Soon enough indifference through abstinence of thought will take over your desparation to get your wife back and allow you to move more comfortably into your role as a single father.

 

I can't tell you that this will guarantee a reconcilliation but it should help your wife see you in a new or more favorable light which is a start on the road to recapturing her interest in you as an individual again!

[pelicanpreacher]

Number one priority. Kill your wife. I mean kill your need for your wife.

 

:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao: Freudian slip?