I'm an idiot (distant) husband.

[Ronni_W]

they give me added hope ... and they were not met with indifference until only recently

"Only recently" is that only thing that is counting these days, Highfive, as far as your wife is concerned -- that's exactly what I was cautioning, and am again trying to caution, about.

 

Give "oxygen" to the person who has only one breath left...not to the person who has 2 or more. Focus on giving YOUR WIFE some hope, any hope, a tiny smidgen of hope...not on giving yourself 'added' hope. This is NOT your turn to be needy and/or gluttonous (for hope.)

 

From your wife's perspective, her current-day feelings are the uppermost in her heart. Spousal indifference is a significant and SERIOUS "tell". You can pretend it's not (that is, BS yourself that it's not), but you do so at your own peril.

 

There's nothing ELSE your wife can do, right now, to show you the clear and present danger that exists for your marriage, if you continue on your same old path, doing things that USED TO work and USED TO be received by her in a positive way. Good luck with that, as they say in the classics.

[highfive]

"Only recently" is that only thing that is counting these days, Highfive, as far as your wife is concerned -- that's exactly what I was cautioning, and am again trying to caution, about.

 

Give "oxygen" to the person who has only one breath left...not to the person who has 2 or more. Focus on giving YOUR WIFE some hope, any hope, a tiny smidgen of hope...not on giving yourself 'added' hope. This is NOT your turn to be needy and/or gluttonous (for hope.)

 

From your wife's perspective, her current-day feelings are the uppermost in her heart. Spousal indifference is a significant and SERIOUS "tell". You can pretend it's not (that is, BS yourself that it's not), but you do so at your own peril.

 

There's nothing ELSE your wife can do, right now, to show you the clear and present danger that exists for your marriage, if you continue on your same old path, doing things that USED TO work and USED TO be received by her in a positive way. Good luck with that, as they say in the classics.

 

Now I'm sooooo confused! Sounds like you want me to stop being affectionate, loving, supportive, in the way that I used to. But how to do these things with my new insight?

[Ronni_W]

Sounds like you want me to stop being affectionate, loving, supportive, in the way that I used to. But how to do these things with my new insight?

You are a GREAT listener...and, er, "comprehensioner", too!!! That's exactly what I am saying. Because...

SHE NO LONGER SEES THAT AS LOVE, SUPPORT AND AFFECTION, when it comes from you. (She likely will still accept the exact same things as love, support and affection...but only if comes from someone ELSE.)

 

But, when it (the "old-style" love, etc.) comes from you, she has stopped feeling the love. Instead, she has come to see it as you just piling on more of your crap, arrogance and BS. (It's become her "new normal and/or "new habit" to NOT see any 'love'; to just dismiss that there MIGHT be any 'love' in your words and actions, if that makes sense?)

 

This is a VITAL part of messages of 'indifference' that anyone in relationship ought not ignore. (Spousal, parental, sibling, colleague...it does not matter which relationship we're talking about.)

 

I have been trying to help with HOW to show (express) your new insights in a way that will be totally, 100%, brand-new for her. The goal is NOT so much to "show affection" but to change how she hears you. That's what you need to do, first...to help her re-open her heart and her mind to your love, affection and support. Does that make any sense?

 

I'm not sure...I know it is somewhat complicated. Maybe try putting yourself in EXACTLY her shoes (try to see how your years and years of neglect, avoidance and BS has resulted in her closing off both her heart and her mind to you...

Almost as if, (currently, when you try to show love, etc.) you're knocking on a door but the person on the other side is BEYOND fed-up with your visits. If you just keep knocking, you are NOT gonna be let in, no way, no how. You must FIRST give that person a NEW IMPRESSION (hope) that your future visits are not going to be like your old visits.

You must GET AWAY from that person's front door and stop knocking, and try something TOTALLY different that is intended to show some hope about how delightful your future visits are gonna be.

 

(Sorry -- I'm getting all entangled in words and images -- hopefully there is something useful that you can uncover/decipher .)

[Ronni_W]

You must GET AWAY from that person's front door and stop knocking, and try something TOTALLY different...

 

By which I do NOT mean ignore and avoid and pretend everything is alright!

I mean start doing things, acting and speaking in ways that, yes, definitely will make you uncomfortable and put you at risk -- show your freakin' nads, for Chrissake, is what I mean when I say "stop [just timidly] knocking at the door."

 

STOP BS'ing yourself that you can't do it cos you "know" that SHE'S not ready. That is just your (cowardly) BS, intended to protect your (new) self from rejection and whatever else you are fearing.

 

Of course, we do not KNOW if she will be at all receptive, nor the level of her receptivity, if there is at least some. That is the risk that your marriage is calling upon you to take. You are being asked to put your very Self "out there" for your wife to see and comment upon. Yes, it is scary. Yes, it must be done.

 

You can say, "Well, I'm not going to make myself vulnerable to my wife."

Or you can say, "I'm totally willing to try to facilitate a deeper, more meaningful way of communicating with my wife. I'm totally willing to do my part about that, and hope, pray and trust that I will have a terrific outcome."

 

It is your choice whether you are going to be cowardly or courageous about this. And honestly, no matter the outcome, it's still ALWAYS gonna be that you chose one or the other as YOUR way of being.

[highfive]

You must GET AWAY from that person's front door and stop knocking, and try something TOTALLY different...

 

STOP BS'ing yourself that you can't do it cos you "know" that SHE'S not ready. That is just your (cowardly) BS, intended to protect your (new) self from rejection and whatever else you are fearing.

 

You can say, "Well, I'm not going to make myself vulnerable to my wife."

Or you can say, "I'm totally willing to try to facilitate a deeper, more meaningful way of communicating with my wife. I'm totally willing to do my part about that, and hope, pray and trust that I will have a terrific outcome."

 

Thanks. I hear you. I think maybe some clarification is required.

 

I'm not BS'ing myself that I can't do it, I AM doing it. I have a new attitude, I'm learning to listen better and I have REAL understanding of how my neglectfulness (not listening when preoccupied) has harmed our relationship. Aside from that, I have always been open and vulnerable to my wife. I tell her everything, my fears, dreams, everything. She is also very open with me, and we talk a great deal, but this last few months of intense work has been a strain because I have been away and not fully there when I am there. I am home now, and things between us our improving.

 

We are not suffering from years of my neglect, just sporadic periods when I am busy with a crazy project. We are lucky because they come and go, with breaks for reconnecting in between. My biggest fault in the past, the one she complains about, is that I don't always listen. That I am fixing, for good! I am making it better, once and for all, using the helpful suggestions and guidence I have received in this forum. At this point, I don't see the need to change everything about the way I love her (love bank deposits), just focus on the things (away too much, not listening, too focused on my work) that she is unhappy about.

 

The next step for me is to finish writing the letter. Today I have been too busy..........................spent the day reconnecting with my wife

 

Hugs,

[Ronni_W]

I'm not BS'ing myself that I can't do it, I AM doing it.

 

YOU know that, and everyone who is reading your thread knows that. But the person who ACTUALLY counts, does NOT know that. FOR YOUR WIFE, there is no difference (that you've yet posted about...and excluding your reconnection today, of course.)

But. As long as your new understandings and real changes are only happening in your head, well, lemme ask it as a question: how do you want her to know about them? (The BS to which I referred was you 'telling yourself' that you can't yet share it with her...like you are sharing with the rest of us, here.)

 

Aside from that, I have always been open and vulnerable to my wife. I tell her everything, my fears, dreams, everything.

 

What you are describing, I'd call 'being intimate' instead of being vulnerable. But. I would have to guess that you would have been sharing things that you already KNEW would meet with her 'agreement' or 'approval' or 'acceptance'. (In contrast, your unwillingness to let her know that you do need, and are using, external resources/support -- you said you know that she would NOT go for that, she does NOT believe that you ought to need that...and guess what? -- you are afraid to tell her YOUR truth, about it. THAT is the kind of vulnerability to which I referred -- ALL the stuff that you do NOT know for sure if or not you will just get a 'rubber stamp' and pat on the head.)

 

We are not suffering from years of my neglect, just sporadic periods

 

I know the entity that you call "we" is not. It is only HER who is. It is the accumulation of the years of "sporadic periods", then, that has caused her to be indifferent to your current-day attempts at showing love, affection and support.

 

YOU have not be building up your feelings of BEING (feeling) neglected, uncared for and basically emotionally abandoned. I know that. And I know that was not your conscious intention to ever act in ways that would facilitate her feeling like that.

But it would be unwise for you to keep on believing that the YEARS are not a factor in her current-day feelings.

 

Erosion happens over a period of years. Even though there may only be "sporadic" ice storms or acid rain or just plain old rain. It is about the ultimate, negative impact, isn't it? Not how the current level of decay happened due to these "sporadic" atmospheric influences.

 

[edit] But even thought it HAS only been "sporadically" subjected to harsh weather, it still is reduced to rubble at some point. There is that one, final storm (indifference), and it just all goes crumbling down, comes crashing down. Whether or not one might call the cause of it "sporadic". [/edit]

 

My biggest fault in the past, the one she complains about, is that I don't always listen.

 

STOP just focusing on the "biggest" one. And why/how are you minimizing (BS'ing) that she hasn't ALSO mentioned your emotional distance? THAT is even the one you chose as your thread title -- Why are you now telling yourself something else, something LESS THAN the whole truth of your marriage and your wife's feelings?

 

I'm gonna guess: Because you realize that "fixing" the 'not listening' complaint is relatively MUCH easier than starting to reveal your truths that you don't know how she'll receive, accept, approve of. (You're gonna resist this guess of mine, perhaps...that's cool. File it away and maybe look at it in a month or two.)

 

I don't see the need to change everything about the way I love her (love bank deposits),

 

Me, either! Just change EVERYTHING to which she has become indifferent, and ONLY the things to which she has become indifferent. Those things are NO LONGER deposits. (Look at it as HER being the banker, not you. Don't ignore her subtle and not-so-subtle messages about what is CURRENTLY constituting as deposits in HER bank.)

 

Hugs to you, too. I know it is tough. I know there is a lot of very different things to (try to) keep track of. You ARE doing great, as far as what is going on inside of your head. Really, really GREAT!!!

[taylor]

Hello High Five,

 

How did the reconnecting go this weekend with your wife?

 

Did she agree to spend some "date" time with you?

 

How was her attitude toward you?

 

Like Ronni says, your wife's INDIFFERENCE is your greatest enemy. Focusing on changing your wife's attitude is THE GOAL.

 

I also agree with Ronni that for your wife to "take notice" you are going to have to change things up a bit. Our marriage counselor calls it "thinking outside the box." I'm sure you are familiar with this expression in business. It can apply just as easily to your marriage. Our marriage counselor challenged both my husband and I to "step outside our comfort zone," surprise each other.

 

When was the last time you and your wife did something NEW..Adventurous...something friends and family would be envious of?

 

When was the last time you had a makeover...changed up your wardrobe, bought a new cologne, styled your hair differently, took up a new hobby or interest?

 

Also, just a suggestion..not sure if it's feasible but..what about the possibility of taking your wife with you sometime when you go out of town on business?

 

Also, just curious...does your wife work outside the home? How does she occupy her time while you are busy with work?

 

You are a good guy, high five. I think the only thing you are guilty of is deriving alot of satisfaction out of your job. Many people "stuck" in jobs they hate would be envious of your ability to find that much fulfillment in their work.

 

I may be going way out on a limb here, but I wonder if your wife finds as much personal fulfillment in what she does all day, independent of you. Thoughts?

[Konfuzion]

- HER BIGGEST COMPLAINT ?: I DON'T LISTEN: I must learn to listen, with understanding, to every word that she says. Even when I am preoccupied, I am still very affectionate, caring and active around the house, I just don't listen well. I hear her words but my brain does not properly record what she is saying. Its not that I don't care about what is saying, it is just that my mind is too busy to comprehend.

 

Are there any tips, websites or books on how to listen attentively? I think if I start with this, the rest will come fairly naturally. My mind is often too busy too listen. Sounds like I should get some counseling.

 

Stay tuned...

 

Easiest way to listen attentively is to repeat back what you heard your partner say, it also opens up conversation for any misinterpretations.

 

So something to the effect of, So what I heard you say is ________

[highfive]

Hello High Five,

 

How did the reconnecting go this weekend with your wife?

 

Did she agree to spend some "date" time with you?

 

How was her attitude toward you?

 

Like Ronni says, your wife's INDIFFERENCE is your greatest enemy. Focusing on changing your wife's attitude is THE GOAL.

 

I also agree with Ronni that for your wife to "take notice" you are going to have to change things up a bit. Our marriage counselor calls it "thinking outside the box." I'm sure you are familiar with this expression in business. It can apply just as easily to your marriage. Our marriage counselor challenged both my husband and I to "step outside our comfort zone," surprise each other.

 

When was the last time you and your wife did something NEW..Adventurous...something friends and family would be envious of?

 

When was the last time you had a makeover...changed up your wardrobe, bought a new cologne, styled your hair differently, took up a new hobby or interest?

 

Also, just a suggestion..not sure if it's feasible but..what about the possibility of taking your wife with you sometime when you go out of town on business?

 

Also, just curious...does your wife work outside the home? How does she occupy her time while you are busy with work?

 

You are a good guy, high five. I think the only thing you are guilty of is deriving alot of satisfaction out of your job. Many people "stuck" in jobs they hate would be envious of your ability to find that much fulfillment in their work.

 

I may be going way out on a limb here, but I wonder if your wife finds as much personal fulfillment in what she does all day, independent of you. Thoughts?

 

Thanks Taylor.

 

Things are much better between us at the moment. Over the weekend we spent time together (mini-dates) just to talk and reconnect.

 

We have done adventurous things together in the past but need to find some new ones now.

 

Yes, she does travel with me sometimes.

 

She works at home at the moment but is looking for other work outside of the home as she is bored.

[taylor]

Once your wife finds work outside the home she may become way more tolerant of your absences. She will have other things in her life to keep her busy while you are gone. It will probably do alot to boost her self-esteem. And the change of scenery will do her alot of good as well.

 

Glad to hear you are reconnecting!

[highfive]

 

My biggest fault in the past, the one she complains about, is that I don't always listen.

 

STOP just focusing on the "biggest" one. And why/how are you minimizing (BS'ing) that she hasn't ALSO mentioned your emotional distance? THAT is even the one you chose as your thread title -- Why are you now telling yourself something else, something LESS THAN the whole truth of your marriage and your wife's feelings?

 

I don't see the need to change everything about the way I love her (love bank deposits),

 

Me, either! Just change EVERYTHING to which she has become indifferent, and ONLY the things to which she has become indifferent. Those things are NO LONGER deposits. (Look at it as HER being the banker, not you. Don't ignore her subtle and not-so-subtle messages about what is CURRENTLY constituting as deposits in HER bank.)

 

Hugs to you, too. I know it is tough. I know there is a lot of very different things to (try to) keep track of. You ARE doing great, as far as what is going on inside of your head. Really, really GREAT!!!

 

Thanks Ronni,

 

Actually, she has never said that I am emotionally distant, just preoccupied. I guess I use "distant" to describe being preoccupied and giving work way too much priority. However, I now know that this was neglectful, and made her feel emotionally distant from me, and like I didn't care about her. Thanks also for saying that I am doing great. I am committed to making this better, and I am starting to see results. I must now be careful not to get complacent. I have to heal the scars of my neglect, and this will take time.

 

I hope other husbands are reading this thread and learning from my experiences.

[Ronni_W]

Hey, Highfive,

How's it going over there? I hope and trust all is looking extremely rosy and bright .

Hugs,

Ronni

[highfive]

Hey, Highfive,

How's it going over there? I hope and trust all is looking extremely rosy and bright .

Hugs,

Ronni

 

Hey Ronni, thanks for checking in. Things seem to be improving, slowly. We have been spending time together reconnecting, and my new attitude seems to be taking hold. I have to ask School Boy to be quiet from time to time, but so far so good. I have been reading some of books and sites that people suggested which has helped.

 

I know it will take time, but I am committed to my marriage.

 

I'll update again soon. In the meantime, any further tips and suggestions are very welcome

[Ronni_W]

Things seem to be improving, slowly. We have been spending time together reconnecting

Excellent! So happy to hear your good news -- success stories are THE best .

 

Tips & Suggestions: Keep on doing exactly what you are doing...cos you are doing great!!! I think if you focus on honing your effective communication and active listening skills, it will further anchor your new understandings and attitudes.

 

Reminders only: 1. 'Check-in' with your wife often by asking questions, especially about how you are doing and what she needs more/less of. Also get her input instead of just deciding/assuming. ("What do you think of ___ ?" instead of "I think it will be good if we ___ " type of conversations.

2. Be brave about revealing your 'secret' self...the Highfive she doesn't yet know. She will love and cherish him, too.

 

Other suggestion: When you get around to it, start seeing and feeling that this is your "new way of being" instead of just your "new attitude" -- it's a mind programming thing.

 

Yes, please do keep us updated. In the meantime, tell School Boy I say 'hi', and am very proud of how well he is behaving these days

[highfive]

Just when I thought things had improved, we had a discussion today and she told me again of her feelings of isolation and abandonment. I expressed that I understand how I hurt her by not listening and that I was taking action, but she did not want to hear it. She did say that she understood that I was very busy with work, and that it was not my fault, but I told her that was no excuse for my actions.

 

I gave her time to vent and some good things were discussed, but she said her self esteem is very low. I know I share some of the blame but I think there are other things at work here. She says she has no friends, no job and feels that she has not accomplished anything. I tried my best to reassure her but I don't think it helped.

 

I am worried sick. How can I help her?

 

Not a good day...

[Loving Wife]

Seems to me she is a dummy also. If she is missing you or needing you she needs to tell you.. Unless you are a mind reader. I have been married also for 20 years and when I need my man I take it! LOL You all need to re-connect and stop wasting time on negative feelings. Romance her and get busy and you all will be fine.

[Ronni_W]

(((hugs))). Sorry to hear about a bad day. You knew that her long-time resentments and stuff could not be "made all better" in a week or two, so perhaps best to just take it in stride as being a necessary part of the healing/recovery process. Though I know that's easier said than done.

 

I expressed that I understand how I hurt her by not listening and that I was taking action,

Same old, same old. .

You must, therefore, have been extremely well-prepared for the event that "she did not want to hear it."

She says she has no friends, no job and feels that she has not accomplished anything. I tried my best to reassure her

Well, there's actually nothing to "reassure" -- just to hear. Cos if you say anything that suggests that she HAS accomplished many things and she DOES have a good friend or two, your message is that you didn't hear that SHE FEELS that she hasn't. (That is, it's not about what YOU or anyone else would view as an accomplishment. And it's not about how many friends YOU or anyone else might want/need.)

 

You could ask her if she wants to get back in the workforce and, if so, ask what would be the best way for you to support her in achieving her goals.

You could also say that you know it can be difficult to make friends once out of "college age", but it's not impossible. Ask if she has considered joining a special-interest club (book, nature walks, art appreciation, whatever she's into), volunteering, signing up for a yoga, cooking or painting class, learning a new language... That is, ask what she thinks about putting herself in those places where there are people who share her interests.

 

"Worry" ain't gonna resolve anything...it ain't even gonna slightly help anything. So quit it. It is an emotional indulgence that you can ill afford.

 

Chin up and soldier on. To me it's a good sign that she has started to see/focus on her own underlying reasons for some of her unhappiness ~ you're no longer the ONLY cause (she's not putting it all on you), and the new items are things that are within her own control to change.

SUPPORT and ENCOURAGE her in making her own decisions about what and how she wants to change. Don't try to "reassure" that she is doing fine exactly as she is. She is not feeling that. Hear her.

[lonelyandfrustrated]

Just when I thought things had improved, we had a discussion today and she told me again of her feelings of isolation and abandonment. I expressed that I understand how I hurt her by not listening and that I was taking action, but she did not want to hear it. She did say that she understood that I was very busy with work, and that it was not my fault, but I told her that was no excuse for my actions.

 

I gave her time to vent and some good things were discussed, but she said her self esteem is very low. I know I share some of the blame but I think there are other things at work here. She says she has no friends, no job and feels that she has not accomplished anything. I tried my best to reassure her but I don't think it helped.

 

I am worried sick. How can I help her?

 

Not a good day...

 

hey, I'm right there with your wife...gave up a lot to be a sahm...have taken out my frustrations on the H. I've even been jealous of his COMMUTE. Why don't I get to be alone for an hour in the car? lol.

 

Anyway, I just wanted to say that you can't repair her self-esteem issues. You didn't cause them. You may feel responsible, but more so, she allowed it to happen. When we (well, me) allowed ourselves to become cut off from the rest of the world, our dependence on you increased to the point that any slight or neglect is amplified. Instead of taking control over our own happiness, we expected you to provide it.

 

I dunno, maybe that will give you some insight into her head. I wish my husband was as concerned about the M as you are.

[highfive]

Thanks Ronni, but now I am confused again about what I should have said. I told her that I had a letter written, and asked if she would me to read it, but she said that she did not want any more letters. So, I said most of the things that were in the letter. That I finally, after all these years, now understood that I was hurting her when I did not listen to her and that it must have seemed to her that I did not care and that work was more important than what she was saying. I also told her that I was taking real action to change for good using help from websites and books. Her reaction told me that she is not buying it so I don't know what else I can do except show her, that I have changed, that I REALLY do understand now. I also revealed that I have been pulling away because I felt her pulling away, but that I know now that she was pulling away because of my neglect (not listening).

 

She then said that she understands when I don't listen because I have been very busy with the big project and that she was not worth listening to anyway because her life is boring. I did not know what to say to that except that she is far from boring, and she means the world to me.

 

I did not push it too much but she told me that she needs me to not push her and to give her space for a while.

 

She is looking for work and I have been helping. I have always been very supportive of her finding work because I know she needs work; not for the money but for her own self-esteem and happiness. I think all I can do at this point is to continue to offer support.

 

I will also suggest that she volunteer.

 

I know that worry is useless and I am trying very hard not to. It's hard not to because I fear I am losing her.

 

Tomorrow is a new day...

[highfive]

hey, I'm right there with your wife...gave up a lot to be a sahm...have taken out my frustrations on the H. I've even been jealous of his COMMUTE. Why don't I get to be alone for an hour in the car? lol.

 

Anyway, I just wanted to say that you can't repair her self-esteem issues. You didn't cause them. You may feel responsible, but more so, she allowed it to happen. When we (well, me) allowed ourselves to become cut off from the rest of the world, our dependence on you increased to the point that any slight or neglect is amplified. Instead of taking control over our own happiness, we expected you to provide it.

 

I dunno, maybe that will give you some insight into her head. I wish my husband was as concerned about the M as you are.

 

Thanks for the insight. She has been a sahm for many years, and it was our choice. I am very concerned about my marriage. I have always been committed to my marriage, but have just realized the hurt that my neglect (not listening, preoccupied) has caused. Perhaps your husband should read this post? It might help him to understand.

[Ronni_W]

now I am confused again about what I should have said. ... I did not know what to say to that except that she is far from boring, and she means the world to me.

Say ANYTHING different. Do ANYTHING different.

 

~~ "I was wrong to believe that it was okay to make my work projects such an important part of my thoughts."

~~ "I don't know how to make you feel any less boring. All I can tell you is that I never thought of you like that."

 

When you don't know, say you don't know!!! Don't let something else fall out of your mouth just cos you can't admit that you don't know.

"I don't know...what to say, how to react to that, what you need from me right now, how to support you with that, what is best for me to do about our marriage."

 

I did not suggest that you "suggest" that she volunteer. In fact, I would (and probably already have) advise against you suggesting anything to her for a long, long time to come.

 

And now I'm gonna suggest that you go back and read what I did suggest -- see where/how it is that you didn't hear what *I* said, and figure out WHY you chose to put your own spin on my words, instead.

 

The fact is, whether or not you worry about it, you either will not lose her or you will lose her.

The problem is, when you throw 'worry' into your thought processes, it makes you think LESS clearly and act MORE needy/desperate.

 

You can't do anything about the fact. You CAN do something to eliminate or at least minimize the problem.

 

Hugs, ^5. I know it is feeling a bit dim, right now. I do share that feeling...but I am also being as optimistic as you are and thinking, "tomorrow is a new day"

[2sunny]

i sense something here that we're not seeing... just the fact that you have made attempts to improve the marriage and she is still staying in the same place she was is concerning and makes me think that different action needs to be taken.

 

send her on that trip away since she's asked for it - and it's what you seem to fear the most. i don't see her being much of a giver at the moment... only a "poor me" attitude that dumps it on you to fix. so i see your efforts as futile as long as she doesn't work on her willingness to improve as well.

 

see what newfound attitude she returns with. that will tell you what to do next...

 

in the meantime, do all these positive things because YOU want to be a better person for yourself... not necessarily for your marriage. if you do it for yourself- it will naturally only affect your marriage in a positive light whether or not you two work things out in the long run.

[highfive]

i sense something here that we're not seeing... just the fact that you have made attempts to improve the marriage and she is still staying in the same place she was is concerning and makes me think that different action needs to be taken.

 

send her on that trip away since she's asked for it - and it's what you seem to fear the most. i don't see her being much of a giver at the moment... only a "poor me" attitude that dumps it on you to fix. so i see your efforts as futile as long as she doesn't work on her willingness to improve as well.

 

see what newfound attitude she returns with. that will tell you what to do next...

 

in the meantime, do all these positive things because YOU want to be a better person for yourself... not necessarily for your marriage. if you do it for yourself- it will naturally only affect your marriage in a positive light whether or not you two work things out in the long run.

 

Thanks 2Sunny,

 

Yes, I am making positive changes and she has not really responded, but its not that long yet so I must be patient. I am doing these positive things for myself, and will continue to do so.

 

^5

[carhill]

OP, if she truly is open to your changes, even if she's now emotionally detached, she should notice and comment on them. Noting and appreciating the efforts of another is the mature adult thing to do. Be patient, but don't become a groveling doormat. That's my advice as a man. She has to take responsibility for her role in the marriage too. You didn't get where you are today all by yourself

[highfive]

OP, if she truly is open to your changes, even if she's now emotionally detached, she should notice and comment on them. Noting and appreciating the efforts of another is the mature adult thing to do. Be patient, but don't become a groveling doormat. That's my advice as a man. She has to take responsibility for her role in the marriage too. You didn't get where you are today all by yourself

 

Thanks, yes, I should be patient and strong in my new resolve but not needy or insecure.