If I was the OW....

[Dark-N-Romantic]

There are three types of people who play the other person...

 

1) The ones who find that their lovers lied and had the strength to tell them to get the heck away. (Strong people.)

2) The ones who don't have the strength to do what is right for themselves and others. (Weak people.)

3) The ones who don't give a damn about anyone but themselves. (Weak people.)

 

While I understand where people are coming from and from the various degrees you all have truthful points.

 

Being a party to a affair should be a very guilt ridden and shameful thing. Especially if you keep it up for your own selfish motives (and an affair is ALWAYS selfish). You feel pain from where ever it comes from because the inner you who is crying out "DON'T DO THIS! THIS IS NOT RIGHT!" is hammering at you. Society has a very good reason why affairs are seen as dirty and disgusting and nothing of any good, even the universe/God its/Himself. If it were okay, we would not have a man winning his lawsuit against his wife's lover, we would not have a woman carrying around the ashes of her husband killed by her ex-lover, we would not have two families destroyed because one mother was brutally slain by a rival and another mother never again free to walk among society (these children will not have a normal life. Why do you think these people skulk around?

 

Now as far as support... Yes, we all understand a lot of you come to these places for support. But, in an open forum like this, you better be ready to deal with the victims or people who want the message to go out that this is NOT acceptable behavior or conducive to peace and harmony. And in my opinion, from what I read here, more times than not, the support is for a more pity me kind of thing. A lot of the posters aren't trying to get out of the relationship. They are trying to find ways to justify their activities. They are trying to continue in what their wrong doing. And these are the dangerous ones that men and women need to look out for if they want a healthy marriage.

 

Those few who can acknowledge what they did was wrong, not only for themselves, but to others, they are the ones who find the support they are looking for. Because people and sympathize with that. It is like a kid who hurt themselves by doing something like jumping from a roof. Yes, the parents will feel sorry for them a few times, but when they see the child refuse to learn their lesson, they stop feeling sympathy. The same is here. How can one show sympathy when what we are being asked to support you in hurting another being and yourselves?

 

 

DNR

[Billie63]

I've always believed OW and less so OM are a valued part of society.

 

A lot of them are actually what keeps the marriage together, the OW stops the H from doing anything rash like walking out on his marriage.

 

The OW is often the glue that binds the marriage even if the wife doesn't know the OW exist.

 

For example, the wife who doesn't want as much intimacy as before - the OW does it for her.

 

When a marriage is going through a rocky patch, the H has got the OW to talk to about it.

 

I think OW/OM should get a bit more credit for their services to society.

 

Obviously some marriages just aren't destined to last till death us do part, couples fall out of love and fall in love with other people. But some marriages need a helping hand and that's where the OW/OM come in.

[Dark-N-Romantic]

I've always believed OW and less so OM are a valued part of society.

 

A lot of them are actually what keeps the marriage together, the OW stops the H from doing anything rash like walking out on his marriage.

 

The OW is often the glue that binds the marriage even if the wife doesn't know the OW exist.

 

For example, the wife who doesn't want as much intimacy as before - the OW does it for her.

 

When a marriage is going through a rocky patch, the H has got the OW to talk to about it.

 

I think OW/OM should get a bit more credit for their services to society.

 

Obviously some marriages just aren't destined to last till death us do part, couples fall out of love and fall in love with other people. But some marriages need a helping hand and that's where the OW/OM come in.

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! So does putting a sword through the back and chest of a wife and her lover. Oh, and the guy was lucky, he died instantly from what the military records say. But, the woman lingered a few hours before she expired. I bet that was really therapeutic for the married Marine who is putting his life on the line for such ingrates (Oh, he only got like 5 or 6 years for the murders).

 

So, I guess that other man or woman is doing a service by being a party to the destruction of a marriage (more marriages end because of infidelity). Talk to those men and women who have never had STDs and now have HIV/AIDS because of the great services an affair brought them. Talk to the children who's lives are permanently altered (and studies have shown this if you want to look it up on line) their lives and not for the good. Talk to children who are born to mistresses who more times than not, never get anything from the married man, and who never acknowledge their child(ren). Talk to that married man who has be taking care of a child that was never his all these years. Talk to the husband or wife who is dead because of a jealous lover (or ex-lover). Talk to the dead husband or wife who's spouse hired a hitperson to take care of the problem instead of getting a divorce so they could be with their lover. Talk to these people and tell them to their face that an affair did them good.

 

 

DNR

Further proof the moral decay of people is still going strong.

[Adunaphel]

I wouldn't tell a soul. Anywhere. Period.

 

While I don't respect or condone what an OW is doing, you have bigger cahones than you give yourselves credit for if you are posting about it here in this forum.

 

I couldn't handle the disapproval for doing something that I know or feel to be wrong (for those that don't feel what they are doing is wrong, this doesn't really apply to you).

 

I don't do well having my own medicine given back to me. Eating crow is an especially unpleasant meal.

 

For those that are attempting to end the A, kudos and good luck. You obviously have more strength than you know of. And you aren't afraid to ask for help even though you may be harshly criticized here for the kind of help you need here.

 

Although I do like the idea of having less laundry....

 

For me it is the other way around.

I wouldn't do anything that I would feel the need to hide from everyone I know or even from a bunch of strangers on the internet.

I have no problem subjecting myself to judgement or critics from other people when I do something wrong, in exactly the same way I do not need other people to know when I do something "right", or something "good" or "nice".

[noforgiveness]

You know what that's just it, you HAVE to put your foot down and mean what you say and let the guy prove to you HE also means what he says if you keep giving in to your weakside and don't stand your ground you are inviting disrespect.

 

I did the exact same thing.

 

I said I won't be the OW move out and look me up when you are free he did just that two months later we were dating.

 

Then it was D and come and look for me no more, and again he did just that. And I stuck to my word, you have to earn that kind of respect. And no offense to those that are in it way over their heads WE ALL are at one point or another but it is never too late to pull the reigns back and say NO it stops here and there is no more waffling.

 

What power you have. wow. You told him and just like a puppy dog he followed your ultimatums. Divorces and all and then you dump him. Wow. Such control and power over so many lives. It must have been so exciting.

[bentnotbroken]

I've always believed OW and less so OM are a valued part of society.

 

A lot of them are actually what keeps the marriage together, the OW stops the H from doing anything rash like walking out on his marriage.

 

The OW is often the glue that binds the marriage even if the wife doesn't know the OW exist.

 

For example, the wife who doesn't want as much intimacy as before - the OW does it for her.

 

When a marriage is going through a rocky patch, the H has got the OW to talk to about it.

 

I think OW/OM should get a bit more credit for their services to society.

 

Obviously some marriages just aren't destined to last till death us do part, couples fall out of love and fall in love with other people. But some marriages need a helping hand and that's where the OW/OM come in.

 

 

 

I'll be sure to tell my children that when the questions start again. And to make sure that they seek this "wonderful service" when they are in marriages. Maybe there should be a certifying program of study for this service so that some can be labeled professionals and they can get tax exemptions or something to that effect:lmao:

[Lizzie60]

I've always believed OW and less so OM are a valued part of society.

 

A lot of them are actually what keeps the marriage together, the OW stops the H from doing anything rash like walking out on his marriage.

 

The OW is often the glue that binds the marriage even if the wife doesn't know the OW exist.

 

For example, the wife who doesn't want as much intimacy as before - the OW does it for her.

 

When a marriage is going through a rocky patch, the H has got the OW to talk to about it.

 

I think OW/OM should get a bit more credit for their services to society.

 

Obviously some marriages just aren't destined to last till death us do part, couples fall out of love and fall in love with other people. But some marriages need a helping hand and that's where the OW/OM come in.

 

 

Totally agree.. with the bold parts..

 

I am the H Whisperer...

[angie2443]

Totally agree.. with the bold parts..

 

I am the H Whisperer...

 

I often feel bad for you when I read your posts. I know, it doesn't make sense. It just seems like you fell in with some pretty low charectors when you were too young to understand and you are forever tainted. I know you say you are happy and everything is wonderful for you, but I often wonder. The fact that you come on these boards bragging about yourself so much makes me feel like there's something missing in you.

[NoIDidn't]

I see that no one has actually tried to answer my question as to how I was insulting.

 

The name-calling, and not-so-veiled insults don't cover it.

 

Anyone actually going to answer the question? I don't see where I've been insulting.

[noforgiveness]

I see that no one has actually tried to answer my question as to how I was insulting.

 

The name-calling, and not-so-veiled insults don't cover it.

 

Anyone actually going to answer the question? I don't see where I've been insulting.

 

 

It's insulting because they don't like to be reminded that they are in a situation that much of society does not condone. Yoou insulted them by pointing out their reality.

[Dark-N-Romantic]

I see that no one has actually tried to answer my question as to how I was insulting.

 

The name-calling, and not-so-veiled insults don't cover it.

 

Anyone actually going to answer the question? I don't see where I've been insulting.

 

You were not insulting. One thing you have to realize, career other persons won't face the facts that they are wrong. They are too far gone to see they are hurting people. And so, any attempt at getting them to see, understand, accept, and hopefully change is seen as an attack. So what you said to them will seem insulting.

 

Another thing I noticed is such people who hide in the shadows (even if they claim to be coming into the light) won't answer questions to their activities and those who do answer won't be honest. This is why you may not get an answer. This is why I know a lot of other people are avoiding my comments about the more horrifying side effects of adultery.

 

 

DNR

[NoIDidn't]

You were not insulting. One thing you have to realize, career other persons won't face the facts that they are wrong. They are too far gone to see they are hurting people. And so, any attempt at getting them to see, understand, accept, and hopefully change is seen as an attack. So what you said to them will seem insulting.

 

 

DNR

 

But that's just it, I was not trying to point out that they are hurting anyone. That's not even a part of my post. So I am really shocked at the reaction this is getting.

 

I guess saying that part about "eating crow" was insulting. But what else could it be called when you crow on and on about what you would or wouldn't do and then have to eat your own words? I don't like eating crow.

 

But, ah well. Thanks NF and DNR. I know that I didn't intend to insult. But intention doesn't mean diddly when it really comes down to it.

[Adunaphel]

Imagine yourself in a situation a nice person is not supposed to be.

Stealing, bullying, being rude, cheating, backstabbing a friend, not being there for someone who needs you, whatever suits your fancy better, or whatever relates more to something you have done.

 

Imagine someone telling you

 

I wouldn't tell a soul. Anywhere. Period.

.

 

Would it stike some unpleasant chord? Would the comment make you feel unconfortable, or hurt you?

 

If so, here is (IMO) one of the possible explanations why someone might have felt offended. No real offence, just perceived lack of empathy, or not very fortunate wording, so to speak. And perhaps the feeling that you are distancing yourself from OW (it's difficult to translate such a feeling in words"), like they were "bad people". (I do not actually personally get such a feeling from your post, but I get it a lot from other posters).

 

Said that, I do not think you were trying to offend anyone, I did not perceive the post as an attack at all - it is actually interesting- but I can see how it could be perceived differently.

 

I don't do well having my own medicine given back to me.

did it ever happen to you on here? just being curious.

[NoIDidn't]

Imagine yourself in a situation a nice person is not supposed to be.

Stealing, bullying, being rude, cheating, backstabbing a friend, not being there for someone who needs you, whatever suits your fancy better, or whatever relates more to something you have done.

 

Imagine someone telling you

 

.

 

Would it stike some unpleasant chord? Would the comment make you feel unconfortable, or hurt you?

 

If so, here is (IMO) one of the possible explanations why someone might have felt offended. No real offence, just perceived lack of empathy, or not very fortunate wording, so to speak. And perhaps the feeling that you are distancing yourself from OW (it's difficult to translate such a feeling in words"), like they were "bad people". (I do not actually personally get such a feeling from your post, but I get it a lot from other posters).

 

Said that, I do not think you were trying to offend anyone, I did not perceive the post as an attack at all - it is actually interesting- but I can see how it could be perceived differently.

 

 

did it ever happen to you on here? just being curious.

 

Thank you, I never thought of it that way.

 

I just used that as my opening to say that I don't have it in me to say out loud, even anonymously, to tell my own perceived wrong-doings. And I say perceived because some don't think that adultery is wrong.

 

As far as having to eat my own words. That has happened on the boards before, but not in regards to me doing something that I perceived to be wrong. I have misunderstood a poster or misquoted a source and got called on it. (and apologized)KWIM? I can take criticism, including that in this thread. But when I know I am wrong, I am a little more sensitive to it. If that makes any sense. What I find interesting here is that no one is even acknowledging the apology for the perceived offense. I wonder what that is about.

 

I was certainly not saying that anyone should suffer in silence. I was only saying that I would probably make that choice. And the reference to the laundry was the fact that so many OW say that they don't have the drudgery of the W, and I admit not doing a spouse's laundry would actually be appealing.

 

Again, thanks for your perspective on the insult thing. I totally missed where I put my foot in my mouth from jump.

[Adunaphel]

Thank you, I never thought of it that way.

 

I just used that as my opening to say that I don't have it in me to say out loud, even anonymously, to tell my own perceived wrong-doings. And I say perceived because some don't think that adultery is wrong.

 

As far as having to eat my own words. That has happened on the boards before, but not in regards to me doing something that I perceived to be wrong. I have misunderstood a poster or misquoted a source and got called on it. (and apologized)KWIM? I can take criticism, including that in this thread. But when I know I am wrong, I am a little more sensitive to it. If that makes any sense. What I find interesting here is that no one is even acknowledging the apology for the perceived offense. I wonder what that is about.

 

I was certainly not saying that anyone should suffer in silence. I was only saying that I would probably make that choice. And the reference to the laundry was the fact that so many OW say that they don't have the drudgery of the W, and I admit not doing a spouse's laundry would actually be appealing.

 

Again, thanks for your perspective on the insult thing. I totally missed where I put my foot in my mouth from jump.

 

You are very welcome. Had I felt insulted (which I haven't) I'd have certainly acknowledged the apology and thanked you fore it.

 

I guess that in some parts of this forum wording posts must be a bit like walking in a minefield - I unwillingly struck a number of painful chords myself from time to time and did not even realize it!

 

I find it kind of funny about how OW are either enjoying not having to do MM's laundry, or desperately hoping to get the chance of being the one doing it.

I personally look forward to when (and if) I'll be able to do MM's laundry - assuming of course he takes care of the ironing.

[Tomcat33]

I see that no one has actually tried to answer my question as to how I was insulting.

 

The name-calling, and not-so-veiled insults don't cover it.

 

Anyone actually going to answer the question? I don't see where I've been insulting.

 

I'll answer your question hope you are ok with brutal honesty:

 

People find it insulting because we have read enough of your posts and it's hard to see this as anything more than mockery. If it was meant with no harm I suppose you lost credibility along the way and that's why people second guess your true intentions. Sort of like a cheater that has called "wolf" one too many times, after a while you stop believing them.

 

I asked you a question as well and you never answered it:

 

What makes you assume that OP's don't give themselves credit?

 

you have bigger cahones than you give yourselves credit for if you are posting about it here in this forum.

 

On that idea alone you are projecting your true feelings. The irony in your words is palpable.

[Lyssa]

I personally look forward to when (and if) I'll be able to do MM's laundry - assuming of course he takes care of the ironing.

 

Yup - I wish it was that way with us! FMM and I hate ironing so we send our clothes to the 5-a-Sec to get them ironed. But when it comes to dishes, cooking - we do them together or take turns. I actually enjoy doing chores/cooking for him - probably culture has something to do with it.

[Owl]

 

I am the H Whisperer...

 

I'm sorry Lizzie...I'm not sure if turning to him in the "afterglow" and whispering "Leave the money on the nightstand" counts...

 

But I've got to say...you've made me view the concept of the "dog whisperer" in a whole new light! :) :)

[NoIDidn't]

I guess that in some parts of this forum wording posts must be a bit like walking in a minefield - I unwillingly struck a number of painful chords myself from time to time and did not even realize it!

 

Very much so. Minefield is an excellent choice of 'word'. LOL.

 

I personally look forward to when (and if) I'll be able to do MM's laundry - assuming of course he takes care of the ironing.

 

I don't iron. I can sooooo relate to that. I don't mind washing - most of the time - but ironing is the ultimate in drudgery. LOL.

[GreenEyedLady]

I see that no one has actually tried to answer my question as to how I was insulting.

 

The name-calling, and not-so-veiled insults don't cover it.

 

Anyone actually going to answer the question? I don't see where I've been insulting.

 

I'm coming in a little late here.

 

It wasn't that you were insulting, per se, it just came across as condescending. I wasn't offended or insulted, I just see it as a "teaching moment."

 

You see, the thing is that when you find yourself in these circumstances, you can't tell those you know (in most cases). But it's such an emotional, stressful situation that you need to talk about it. You need the support from others to make it through the day. No matter how good the MM is to you, it still gets to you. Or else no one would care if their MM left or not.

 

I came here and made lots of friends. I discovered lots of patterns in behavior of the MM, BS and the OW. I came here to help others cope and find strength in themselves, and that helped me find my own strength. To know I wasn't alone. To know that there wasn't something wrong with me.

 

This forum gives anonymity (sp?) which the OW needs. Which is why I am always the first to say TMI! We need a place where we can be with others like ourselves so we can find what we need. To move on, to stay in, to find strength and self-love.

 

Without the constant paranoia that someone will "out" us or that we will be judged.

 

So while you say you wouldn't tell anyone, you don't know until you walk in those shoes. Talking about it helps you find your own answer. And if you bottle it up inside, you will continue the hurt and the self-loathing.

 

IMO

 

GEL

[NoIDidn't]

I'll answer your question hope you are ok with brutal honesty:

 

People find it insulting because we have read enough of your posts and it's hard to see this as anything more than mockery. If it was meant with no harm I suppose you lost credibility along the way and that's why people second guess your true intentions. Sort of like a cheater that has called "wolf" one too many times, after a while you stop believing them.

 

I asked you a question as well and you never answered it:

 

What makes you assume that OP's don't give themselves credit?

 

 

 

On that idea alone you are projecting your true feelings. The irony in your words is palpable.

 

I would like to think that we are all adults here, but your response was little more than a rehash of the past and not even an accurate one.

 

My posts have been far more open-minded than you would ever be willing to give me credit for. So, its unfortunate that you are unable to respond to what is actually written than to take the opportunity to rehash previous posts or previous perceptions of those posts.

 

I know you won't accept this answer, but I really appreciate your answer to my question. I am certainly able to take the truth of another's perception. I saw nothing brutal about what was posted. Its how you feel.

 

But I will say, those that didn't acknowledge the apology have revealed far more about their own motivations than anything that they can claim about mine. You included.

 

I understand how my initial post was taken as insulting a little better now, but that certainly doesn't excuse the rudeness displayed by some of the *offended* responders.

[NoIDidn't]

I'm coming in a little late here.

 

It wasn't that you were insulting, per se, it just came across as condescending. I wasn't offended or insulted, I just see it as a "teaching moment."

 

You see, the thing is that when you find yourself in these circumstances, you can't tell those you know (in most cases). But it's such an emotional, stressful situation that you need to talk about it. You need the support from others to make it through the day. No matter how good the MM is to you, it still gets to you. Or else no one would care if their MM left or not.

 

I came here and made lots of friends. I discovered lots of patterns in behavior of the MM, BS and the OW. I came here to help others cope and find strength in themselves, and that helped me find my own strength. To know I wasn't alone. To know that there wasn't something wrong with me.

 

This forum gives anonymity (sp?) which the OW needs. Which is why I am always the first to say TMI! We need a place where we can be with others like ourselves so we can find what we need. To move on, to stay in, to find strength and self-love.

 

Without the constant paranoia that someone will "out" us or that we will be judged.

 

So while you say you wouldn't tell anyone, you don't know until you walk in those shoes. Talking about it helps you find your own answer. And if you bottle it up inside, you will continue the hurt and the self-loathing.

 

IMO

 

GEL

 

Thanks GEL. I can always count on you to give an answer that I can understand the first time. You are a very clear, and concise poster.

 

Again, I do apologize to those that took my post as a "teaching point" or in any way insulting. I really did not mean it in that way at all.

 

Yet, I really wouldn't tell anyone. And it has nothing to do with not walking in those shoes but more to do with the "crow" part. But I don't think that I have ever posted that I could never be an OP. That wouldn't be anywhere near the truth. I could be. I just wouldn't open up about it.

 

Its so unfortunate that tempers in this part of LS are so volatile (mine, included at times), because I have learned so much about myself, first, and others. This place has taught me more empathy than I usually have, and I am a very empathic person IRL.

 

So, thanks for adding your response. I really appreciate at it.

[Billie63]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! So does putting a sword through the back and chest of a wife and her lover. Oh, and the guy was lucky, he died instantly from what the military records say. But, the woman lingered a few hours before she expired. I bet that was really therapeutic for the married Marine who is putting his life on the line for such ingrates (Oh, he only got like 5 or 6 years for the murders).

 

So, I guess that other man or woman is doing a service by being a party to the destruction of a marriage (more marriages end because of infidelity). Talk to those men and women who have never had STDs and now have HIV/AIDS because of the great services an affair brought them. Talk to the children who's lives are permanently altered (and studies have shown this if you want to look it up on line) their lives and not for the good. Talk to children who are born to mistresses who more times than not, never get anything from the married man, and who never acknowledge their child(ren). Talk to that married man who has be taking care of a child that was never his all these years. Talk to the husband or wife who is dead because of a jealous lover (or ex-lover). Talk to the dead husband or wife who's spouse hired a hitperson to take care of the problem instead of getting a divorce so they could be with their lover. Talk to these people and tell them to their face that an affair did them good.

 

 

DNR

Further proof the moral decay of people is still going strong.

 

Sorry, I was actually talking tongue in cheek. Although I stand by my belief that some marriages have survived because of an affair.

[Agent_99]

It does take a lot of guts to come on here and post about being someone's dirty little secret. But if someone felt it was such a shameful secret that they couldn't share it AT ALL, then they need WAY more help than the support and criticism that an online forum provides.

 

I am not proud of being the OW. But even still the personal benefits are WAY more than the shame that I feel over certain aspects. They just aren't always overshadowing the pain of it. And the pain does NOT come from a moral place. I have been to counseling and was told the same thing, BUT it isn't true for me at least. The pain comes from being part of an unbalanced, unhealthy relationship. It is personal, not moral.

 

There are some very judgemental posters here. There are very judgemental people in the community I live in as well. There are people who only see things in black and white here and in RL life as well. Then there are the people who see the shades of grey.

 

Affairs are selfish. So are people who stay in marriages when they are damaging themselves and their children. People who try to shove their opinions on morality down others throats are selfish as well. Their way is the only way. And NO one has the right to say someone else is wrong.

 

To have an affect (that is allow them to truly hear what you are saying) you have to understand where they are coming from, if you don't, then the things that you have to say will NOT be heard unless by some coincidence what you said strikes a cord. There are people who don't understand this, but are truly just trying to help others find the 'correct' path. But like all things in life, each person has to choose their own path, whether or not it is the correct one.

 

I didn't see anything insulting about the original post. It seemed like just curiosity from one person's perspective.

 

~99

[Billie63]

I'll be sure to tell my children that when the questions start again. And to make sure that they seek this "wonderful service" when they are in marriages. Maybe there should be a certifying program of study for this service so that some can be labeled professionals and they can get tax exemptions or something to that effect:lmao:

No program of study required here. It's called the oldest profession in the world with good reason.