PORN..what's really the deal?

[Jersey Shortie]

Ok, have it your way, 70 year old women are as attractive as 25 year olds.

 

That's not what I am saying. I just wish men would mature with their women instead of wanting to live a life of extended adolence. You never addressed the part where men keep getting older, as do their partner, but the women in porn that they view stay the same age. It's a continuous cycle of new women and new women and new women. When is enough enough? Or is it never enough?

 

 

 

We've been over the alleged misogyny in porn countless times.

 

I don't think I am so far off in considering porn misognyistic. There are quite a few men themselves who actually think it can be misogynistic as well. When you have videos that are degrading to women and refer to them in names, it not exactly something that makes it seem like men love and respect women.

 

If it seems like I defend it because porn is an extension of me, haha whatever.

 

My point was not personally addressed to you. I however do seem a strange thing among men where they rather bond together to defend porn instead of objectivily considering the negatives that porn brings.

 

But I am a man, and get sick of tired old accusations that we hate women, and should do anything and everything to keep them happy or are labelled misoginists.

 

As a woman, I get sick and tired of how dependent on porn men seem to be today and how often they stick up for it instead of real women. This isn't a manner of having to keep women happy or your labeled misoginists. It's a matter that porn doesn't treat women very nicely. In turn, you can't fault women for questioning what men really think of women

 

Hence I point out to you again, the vast majority of porn is not hateful to women, is not titled 'stupid bitches get their punishment Xii' or whatever, rarely features silicone implants and unrealistic women rather favouring natural (but pretty) girl next door types.....

 

Alot of porn does seem to be titled in such names as "bitch" or "slut" or "whore. And there seem to be many women with silicone implants in the movies as there might be natural. Although, I don't think I have ever seen a truly natural girl in porn.

 

Ever since porn became mainstream there has also been an increase in women getting breast surgery. The message they got from society and from their men was they were no longer good enough.

 

 

.....and any objectification or degradation that you do find is quite okay anyway as people are allowed to fantasize about what they like, as women do see previous list.

 

I don't argue that it's okay or not. We are free to do what we are free to do. What I do argue is how the objectification and degradation of women in these movies effects the way men view women in general. If these are the things men fantasize about, what does that say about what men wished women were?

 

 

But then you never address these points properly when put to you, and I doubt you will this time. Oh welll.

 

What am I suppose to address?

[The Collector]

In short, the list I posted of women's top sexual fantasies had rape at number one. What are we to infer from that?

 

How much porn have you actually watched JS? And why?

[soserious1]

I think this could be the way to go. What did he say?

 

lol, he laughed and said he couldn't think of a bigger waste of money if he tried.

 

He went on to say that he's offered to service me occasionally as long as I ask in advance and don't ask too often ie: x2 per month max, that he'll put me on his to do list. He feels he's being quite generous and is in fact humoring me. He says he's offered and I have refused his offer,he's honored our vows by offering to perform his marital duties however distasteful he finds the task and says he'll divorce me for infidelity in a heartbeat.

 

He also went on to say that he was disappointed that we were again having this conversation, he'd hoped that my refusal of his offer meant that I was coming to my senses and was going to gracefully accept the life role that's appropriate for decent middle class women of my age. ie: I am to continue to work, to take up a bigger interest in cooking,baking and crafts and of being of service to our family and the community. He also commented that unless I revert back to being kind, loving and concerned about his well being that he might well divorce me anyway"a lot of women your age have no husband at all, one would think you'd be grateful for what you've got"

 

 

long and the short of it .. he finds my continued interest in sex unseemly and inappropriate and that's where it's at.

[annieo]

lol, he laughed and said he couldn't think of a bigger waste of money if he tried.

 

He went on to say that he's offered to service me occasionally as long as I ask in advance and don't ask too often ie: x2 per month max, that he'll put me on his to do list. He feels he's being quite generous and is in fact humoring me. He says he's offered and I have refused his offer,he's honored our vows by offering to perform his marital duties however distasteful he finds the task and says he'll divorce me for infidelity in a heartbeat.

 

He also went on to say that he was disappointed that we were again having this conversation, he'd hoped that my refusal of his offer meant that I was coming to my senses and was going to gracefully accept the life role that's appropriate for decent middle class women of my age. ie: I am to continue to work, to take up a bigger interest in cooking,baking and crafts and of being of service to our family and the community. He also commented that unless I revert back to being kind, loving and concerned about his well being that he might well divorce me anyway"a lot of women your age have no husband at all, one would think you'd be grateful for what you've got"

 

 

long and the short of it .. he finds my continued interest in sex unseemly and inappropriate and that's where it's at.

 

I cannot think of ANY amount of money I would NOT be willing to part with to be rid of the a**hole who is your husband. I've been through a divorce, and yes, your lifestyle does suffer, especially at first. But it was worth it. And money isn't everything. How about some peace in your home? Your sanity?

And why is he not working? Is there a medical reason? If not, I cannot see why he would not have to retrain and get back in the workforce. I was a stay-at-home mom, and that's what I had to do. I had two years of spousal, then that was it.

He needs to be taught a lesson about how expendable HE is. He's an old fart, no income, arrogant, crap attitude, porn habit - DUMP HIM !!!!!!!

[Lizzie60]

How hot was she? There are a plenty of attractive 50 year old women, as has been mentioned. Helps if they keep their figure, dress well, etc, just like men. I'd even do some that weren't even that 'hot' but I dig their personality. How old is Camille Paglia these days?

 

She's over 60 now..

[soserious1]

I cannot think of ANY amount of money I would NOT be willing to part with to be rid of the a**hole who is your husband. I've been through a divorce, and yes, your lifestyle does suffer, especially at first. But it was worth it. And money isn't everything. How about some peace in your home? Your sanity?

And why is he not working? Is there a medical reason? If not, I cannot see why he would not have to retrain and get back in the workforce. I was a stay-at-home mom, and that's what I had to do. I had two years of spousal, then that was it.

He needs to be taught a lesson about how expendable HE is. He's an old fart, no income, arrogant, crap attitude, porn habit - DUMP HIM !!!!!!!

 

 

He's had a series of back operations over the years with little success. He's over 55, the "magic age" at which even social security wouldn't expect a worker of this age to retrain and neither will a divorce court judge according to the lawyers I've consulted. In fact,even the suggestion of such could result in him being given an even bigger portion of our assets and a larger spousal support award as I'd look like a heartless witch.

 

As to the rest of it.. reading it here in typed words makes it appear as if he's arrogant, I think he was more shocked, offended and angry and that his tone was reflective of that.My husband's initial reactions to things that upset him have always been rather blustery and defensive in tone and he always usually comes round later for calmer discussion on things so I'm not getting my feathers ruffled over his tone

 

I also suspect that his viewpoints on what activities and attitudes are suitable for middle aged women point to him having an even larger problem with his own aging than I'd suspected and this is what does get my feathers ruffled and deeply concerns me. What good is a life partner if you can't share fear together as we prepare for our walk into the long dark night?

 

I'm not sure where to go with all this from here.. I'll have to think on it.

[Jersey Shortie]

In short, the list I posted of women's top sexual fantasies had rape at number one. What are we to infer from that?

 

How much porn have you actually watched JS? And why?

 

The fantasy of rape is not one where women actually want to be raped. It's a fantasy about control.

 

Women aren't fantasizing about barely legal boys just out of high school and telling them what sluts they are or equally derogatory male names. And we certainly aren't getting excited of ideals about men with over inflated fake body parts.

 

I've seen porn before. I infact went through a period where I looked it up myself to try and understand why men were so into it. And I discovered that what men like to see in women is really disheartening.

[The Collector]

The fantasy of rape is not one where women actually want to be raped. It's a fantasy about control.

 

It's just not. It's a fantasy about having no control. The only control comes from the fact it's a fantasy. You are just refusing to admit that women's sexual fantasies, like the rest on that list, would be damning evidence of rampant misogyny if they came from men.

 

But if it were about control, which it isn't, wouldn't that be degrading to men?

 

Women aren't fantasizing about barely legal boys just out of high school and telling them what sluts they are or equally derogatory male names. And we certainly aren't getting excited of ideals about men with over inflated fake body parts.

 

Again, the vast majority of porn does not include women being called sluts. And equally, there are plenty of women - including my girlfriend who I treat like a princess - that enjoy being called sluts and whores as part of a sex-game.

 

And some women certainly do get excited over guys with big choppers. And even if they don't, how is that problematic or degrading to women?

 

T

I've seen porn before. I infact went through a period where I looked it up myself to try and understand why men were so into it. And I discovered that what men like to see in women is really disheartening.

 

Please give us an example of some theoretical porn that wouldn't dishearten you so. Please don't dodge this question, I want an actual erotic movie described in a way that you would be happy to see made available.

[The Collector]

I'd also like to ask all the LS women who have seen some porn - how misogynistic do you think it is? How often do you hear women being called bitches and whores, or feel that the women are made to look bad, (as opposed to horny and available).

 

That stuff, like Max Hardcore, is out there. But in your experience, is that typical of porn, or a more extreme form of woman-debasement that's in all porn, or a niche market compared to regular, two-or-more-people-having-sex-but-in-porn-world-that's nothing-to-be ashamed-about-porn.

 

Please answer or it's me and Jersey Shortie going back and forth forever...

[soserious1]

I'd also like to ask all the LS women who have seen some porn - how misogynistic do you think it is? How often do you hear women being called bitches and whores, or feel that the women are made to look bad, (as opposed to horny and available).

 

That stuff, like Max Hardcore, is out there. But in your experience, is that typical of porn, or a more extreme form of woman-debasement that's in all porn, or a niche market compared to regular, two-or-more-people-having-sex-but-in-porn-world-that's nothing-to-be ashamed-about-porn.

 

Please answer or it's me and Jersey Shortie going back and forth forever...

 

 

From what I've seen the spoken script in most of those video's is so lame it's almost sounds like sexual satire or like it was from some sort of sexual cartoon, the people in the vid might be hot to look at, they might be doing some pretty wild things but the dialogue? how can anybody take most of it seriously?

[The Collector]

Well, I think the only one taking it seriously is JS. Even men who enjoy porn tend to recognise it's not great art. We just like the naughty ladies. You think anyone ever took those Playboy sidebars seriously ' I love to go horse-back riding, and get naked in the country.' Sure you do 'Katyana...'

[almost famous]

I did just see a study that porn addiction is the most growing problem of marriages, and that is what counselors are seeing a lot more of, couples falling apart because of porn addiction.

[Jersey Shortie]

It's just not. It's a fantasy about having no control. The only control comes from the fact it's a fantasy. You are just refusing to admit that women's sexual fantasies, like the rest on that list, would be damning evidence of rampant misogyny if they came from men.

 

But if it were about control, which it isn't, wouldn't that be degrading to men?

 

When I said it was a fantasy of control, I wasn't saying that it was where the woman had the control. And I never said women had PC fantatasies. The fact remains, when you see men enjoy and support an entire medium that stereotypes women into one box and can be rather misognistic by alot of people's standards, as a woman, you question what men really think and feel about women. Can you really blame some of us for feelign that way? Be honest. Where does one drawl the line between misogyny and fantasty?

 

You never addressed my point that women don't fantasize about barely legal studs with fake body parts to nearly the same extent that men do in the reverse. And women don't refer to men in degrotatory names to nearly the same extent that women get refered to in the reverse.

 

Again, the vast majority of porn does not include women being called sluts. And equally, there are plenty of women - including my girlfriend who I treat like a princess - that enjoy being called sluts and whores as part of a sex-game.

 

All you have to do is type the word "porn" into a search engine and the word "slut" comes up somewhere. How many porn titles include a derogatory name about women then don't?

 

As for sex games you pay with your girlfriend, what goes on between two people who care about each other in the privacy of their bedroom is a far cry from what goes on in a porno.

 

Consider a man who takes a woman out to dinner that doesn't care about him and is only using him for a free meal and a man that is taking his partner out for dinner that does care about him. Two different situations! Men or women don't like to be disrespected. That is plain and simple to understand I think.

 

And some women certainly do get excited over guys with big choppers. And even if they don't, how is that problematic or degrading to women?

 

The fact is, men don't have to live up to the stereotypical ideals of fake body parts to have women be attracted to them. Apparently, women do.

 

 

Please give us an example of some theoretical porn that wouldn't dishearten you so. Please don't dodge this question, I want an actual erotic movie described in a way that you would be happy to see made available.

 

You've dodged plenty of my questions. As for a theoretical porn that woudln't dishearten me? I have no clue. I just know what I see is popular by the majority and it gets upsetting and frustrating. It can also be a direct shot on feminity and make a woman feel like "less" because the fantasy that men LOVE is so idealistic.

 

 

Well, I think the only one taking it seriously is JS. Even men who enjoy porn tend to recognise it's not great art. We just like the naughty ladies. You think anyone ever took those Playboy sidebars seriously ' I love to go horse-back riding, and get naked in the country.' Sure you do 'Katyana...'

 

There have been scientific studies that have had men view pornography and then they were asked questions about their own partner. They found that men that had viewed the porn were much more likely to think their partner was less and had more negative views about them.

 

I have no doubt that anyone doesn't understand that porn is fantasy. I also have no doubt that on some level, men want the fantasy to be real. Perhaps if men spent more time making their own lady feel cared for and gave her more of what she needed ,she wouldl be more of the naughty lady in the bedroom that men enjoy in return. Did you ever think about that?

 

For something you don't take seriously, you do enjoy defending it.

[Mr. Lucky]

For something you don't take seriously, you do enjoy defending it.

He's the opposite of you, Jersey. Because, for something that has so little real impact on the vast majority of relationships, you seem to enjoy attacking it...

 

Mr. Lucky

[The Collector]

All you have to do is type the word "porn" into a search engine and the word "slut" comes up somewhere. How many porn titles include a derogatory name about women then don't?

 

I just put 'porn' into google and the word 'slut' didn't come up at all on the first page. It came up twice on the second page though. However, I accept that derogatory names for women get bandied around in some (though by no means the amount you claim) porn - what you don't get is that it is a fantasy world where words like slut or whore are part of the deal. It's a term for a sexually promiscuous, sex-loving woman, unshackled by the inhibitions of the real world. I don't believe it is a message of hate towards women. Many women can see that distinction. And like I say, the majority of porn does not have such titles or terms anyway. Here's a link to Blast magazine's top 20 porn DVDs of all-time (not sure who Blast are, or how they compiled their list but anyway) - how many of these are misogynist?

20. Jesse Jane: Erotique

“Adult’s most acclaimed director teamed up with its freshest young talent in 2004, as Nic Andrews presents Jesse Jane: Erotique, a hot all-sex movie starring Digital Playground’s newest sensation: the sexy and sultry Jesse Jane!”

19. Space Nuts

“Led by the Evil Overlord and the Dark Witch, an ominous shadow has swept across the universe, destroying countless planets in its wake.”

Hell of a porn plot starting sultry blond bombshells Stormy Daniels, Jessica Drake, Katie Morgan.

18. Kelly the Coed 1

“Meet Kelly the Coed. Fresh out of high school and away from home for the first time, what’s a young freshman to do but get into trouble? Watch as Kelly experiences her first Rush Week on Greek Row as rowdy frat boys pledge new brothers and little sisters at wild toga parties. But the Greek system never saw a little sister quite like Kelly the Coed.”

17. Flesh Hunter

One of Aurora Snow’s (our November cover girl) early flicks, 2001’s Flesh Hunter was a hot one. Can’t even give you the synopsis of this one..

16. The New Devil In Miss Jones

“Savanna (Miss Jones) is a virgin suicide who begs Jenna (The Devil) to grant her just a little more time on earth before her descent into hell. Jenna obliges…but only if Miss Jones totally and completely surrenders herself to the sins of the flesh!”

15. Ancient Secrets Of The Kama Sutra

14. The Fashionistas

“This is a very high budget adult film with extensive story/action sequences, exquisite wardrobe and cutting edge, full length, very hard sex scenes. There are also several full on S&M scenes with very real action. These elements fit together in a dramatic mystery love story that takes our lead character Antonio (Rocco Siffredi), an Italian fashion designer, on a wild sexual ride into the underground S&M scene. His guide is Helena (portrayed by real life dominant, Taylor St. Claire). His phantom obsession is Jesse. Shot on 35mm film, with the lighting and production elements of a mainstream motion picture, this is by far my most ambitious project. It is a highly charged erotic experience, not intended for the novice porno viewer.”

13. Fade to Black

“There are no amateurs in porn, and three aspiring directors are about to find out the hard way. Join adult’s hottest star Taylor in a story about film making. And the drama that comes with it!”

12. Jenna Jameson is the Masseuse

11. Virtual Sex With Tera Patrick

10. Bad Wives

This award-winning hit included some of the best actual acting ever seen in pornography

9. Briana Loves Jenna

8. Virtual Sex With Jenna

“Virtual Sex with Jenna is the first true interactive sex for your DVD Video Player or DVD-Rom drive. Now as never before, experience all the lust and desire of having sex with one of the most beautiful women in the world, Jenna Jameson. Interact with her using your DVD Remote! You choose the sexual positions! You choose the camera angles! You choose her moods between innocent and nasty! Enter Jenna’s world where FantaVR allows you to control this gorgeous sexual animal and enjoy her countless times. The Virtual Sex Series has redefined interactive sex. Virtual Sex with Jenna is the most advanced cyber sex simulator on DVD.”

7. Dream Quest

“Jenna Jameson is Sara, an average blonde knockout that has had enough of her mundane life. Enter the faerie folk. They pull Jenna into a mystical world of seduction and danger. It’s up to her to save “fantasy” from banishment at the hands of the evil Vladimir.”

6. All Star

“Five average guys are wandering through Malibu in search of a mansion where the All-Stars play, a group of the hottest women known to man. They are on the age-old quest to ‘Get Some’”

5. Island Fever 3

“Relax. Take a deep breath and let Island Fever 3 transport you to a sensual world of pure, raw passion, unlike any you’ve ever known.”

4. Pirates

A 3-disc set in DVD and HD-DVD, this is one of the most advanced accomplishments in the stereotypically low-budget adult film industry.

“From the award-winning director Joone comes the bigest epic in the history of adult films. This electrifying, swashbuckling sex-adventure takes you on a humorous and mystical journey through haunted seas and deep into the abyss of our most lustful desires…

Pirates features deadly swordplay against skeleton warriors, Jesse Jane in her first girl/girl scene with Janine & Carmen Luvana, dirty pirate whores (Teagan Presley, Devon, Jenaveve Jolie and many more), awe-inspiring Incan magic, grandiose sea battles, loads of special features & hot extras within a 3 disc set, and 10 of the most arousing sex scenes in the history of erotic cinema!”

3. Island Fever

2. Award Winning Sex Scenes

1. Flashpoint

“Jenna’s Fighting Fire With Fire. Nothing you’ve seen can prepare you for the non-stop adult action of Brad Armstrong’s Flashpoint. This mega-budget feature delivers the heart stopping action sequences and the blistering sex that has made Wicked the Leader in Adult Video, Stunning Pyrotechnics, Incredible Locations, and the most awesomely beautiful and daringly decadent cast of today’s most incendiary performers will blaze across your screen. It’s Adult Video you’ve only dreamt of. Don’t miss it.”

[blair08]

I had thought of putting in a link or even in PM's to people who wanted to read about the other side of this issue. It talks about famous porn stars who got out of the industry. It talks about how they are paid big bucks to lie about how happy there are when they aren't. (I think they might start out happy.) It talks about how alot stay for the money no matter how miserable, just like some stay in relationships. It talks about the "fantasy world." It also talks about the bigger picture, of what you see on screen VS what really goes on off screen, which is in RL. However, I think the link wouldn't matter. I think its cut and dried and there is no inbetween for some. What matters to most I guess, is, the action and acting that takes place onscreen, and what it provides for those viewing.

[Jersey Shortie]

He's the opposite of you, Jersey. Because, for something that has so little real impact on the vast majority of relationships, you seem to enjoy attacking it...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

And alot men seem to enjoy defending it above all else Mr. Lucky. I do attack porn. Why is that bad? I see alot wrong with porn.

 

Let there be a clear distinction that I don't spend time defending or attacking things that have little impact of effect over me. He isn't so opposite of me in that regard. He is just on the opposite end of the spectrum in his views. I think it's silly to argue that something isn't a big deal for you but spend time arguing for it. I think we can safely say we have both been impacted porn, only in different ways.

 

 

I just put 'porn' into google and the word 'slut' didn't come up at all on the first page. It came up twice on the second page though.

 

I'm at work so I can't test it myself right now. But first page or second page..is that a huge distinction?

 

However, I accept that derogatory names for women get bandied around in some (though by no means the amount you claim) porn

 

And what is the amount I claim?

 

 

 

- what you don't get is that it is a fantasy world where words like slut or whore are part of the deal. It's a term for a sexually promiscuous, sex-loving woman, unshackled by the inhibitions of the real world. I don't believe it is a message of hate towards women.

 

 

Why do such derogatory names that put women down at the same time men are being turned on by them part of the deal?

 

I don't think men would feel good if women sat around calling men names like "fag" and "*******" while they were masturbating to them.

 

The irony in such words as "slut" is that men both love and hate the name at the same time. It is an oxymoron where it is both a compliment and a slight at the same time to women. Men call women sluts they have had alot of partners and enjoy sex, it's a negative name. No one would want a man to call his sister, mother or daughter a "slut". Yet at the same time men love sluts in their "fantasy" world. So women are told at the same time that they both should love sex and be "sluts" but that sluts are bad at the same time and shouldn't be sluts. What message do you think that gives? That men are good for liking sex and women are bad for liking sex because we get railed with names like slut and whore. And while "slut" is defined by a sexually promiscuous, sex-loving woman, unshackled by the inhibitions of the real world it is also defined by a woman that most men don't respect or would really want. So perhaps men should make up their minds and stop shooting themselves and women in the foot for liking sex too. If you don't think "slut" is meant to put down women, then you must not mind when another man calls your gf a slut.

 

Many women can see that distinction. And like I say, the majority of porn does not have such titles or terms anyway. Here's a link to Blast magazine's top 20 porn DVDs of all-time (not sure who Blast are, or how they compiled their list but anyway) - how many of these are misogynist?

 

One list from an unknown source that you don't even know about? Come on. If you think those titles of those movies are going to convince me that porn doesn't stereotype women and degrade them, then you aren't being objective.

 

But believe me, I have learned long ago that porn is extremely important to men. And what men want is Kelly the coed..not the real life woman that actually loves him. It's depresing and hurtful but that is what most men are like today unfortunetly. No wonder women just give up trying to make their man happy. Its obvious men are never happy and completely unable to please.

[The Collector]

A lot of my responses would be me just repeating myself, so I'm not going to bother. But I will say that society does indeed have a problem with women who like sex, and it is an unfair double standard. Personally I have no problem with women having as much sex with as many different partners as they like and they shouldn't feel ashamed of it.

 

I also get that women might feel uncomfortable with the porn that really seems to delight in the humiliation of women - the Max Hardcore stuff, etc. This is where it stops being playful, and becomes disturbing for me.

 

Do women's fantasies involve the humiliation of men? Sometimes. Male strippers are there for mockery and humiliation, for example. Does non-sexual female entertainment delight in the humiliation of men? All the time. Every chick flick seems to involve a man getting kicked in the balls or made to look foolish.

 

[patronize] JS, you seem to be going through a period of disillusionment with the opposite sex. Trust me, most men go through a similar stage at some point in their lives. When we are young we often have unrealistic idealistic views of the opposite sex, and are let down when we discover they are imperfect human beings like us. We often want our partners to be like the perfect parent we maybe never had, who has no difficult edges, who exists only to prioritise our needs and soothe our insecurities. But in the real world we are stuck with human beings just like us and have to compromise. Don't let this adjustment make you bitter, or it will be you who suffers most.

[/patronize]

[PandorasBox]

"I also get that women might feel uncomfortable with the porn that really seems to delight in the humiliation of women - the Max Hardcore stuff, etc. This is where it stops being playful, and becomes disturbing for me".

 

*Just out of curiosty what are some things that DO disturb you with porn? The reason I ask is you had listed some dvds of titles so those were obviously ok with you, but what kinds of things in porn DO disturb you. What kinds of things are no longer playful.

 

*blair, you can send me the link in PM's if you wish.

[Jersey Shortie]

A lot of my responses would be me just repeating myself, so I'm not going to bother. But I will say that society does indeed have a problem with women who like sex, and it is an unfair double standard. Personally I have no problem with women having as much sex with as many different partners as they like and they shouldn't feel ashamed of it.

 

But we are made to feel ashamed about it anyway. Mostly from men who use "slut" as some kind of strange compliment/degradation name.

 

 

Do women's fantasies involve the humiliation of men? Sometimes. Male strippers are there for mockery and humiliation, for example.

 

I never heard of such a thing where male strippers being there for women to mock and humilate.

 

Does non-sexual female entertainment delight in the humiliation of men? All the time. Every chick flick seems to involve a man getting kicked in the balls or made to look foolish.

 

Name one chick flick that shows a man getting kicked in the balls? This is usually something that is done in dumb-slap-stick comedies that are partial to what men like.

 

[patronize] JS, you seem to be going through a period of disillusionment with the opposite sex. Trust me, most men go through a similar stage at some point in their lives. When we are young we often have unrealistic idealistic views of the opposite sex, and are let down when we discover they are imperfect human beings like us.

 

You mean when men discover that women actually have imperfect bodies and bleminishes and their own wishes and desires?

 

We often want our partners to be like the perfect parent we maybe never had, who has no difficult edges, who exists only to prioritise our needs and soothe our insecurities. But in the real world we are stuck with human beings just like us and have to compromise. Don't let this adjustment make you bitter, or it will be you who suffers most.

[/patronize]

 

I don't expect perfection from my SO. And I don't think your speach is a justficiation for the way alot of men act when it comes to porn. I also don't know how you aren't suppose to be bitter when most men don't even care to listen to what you are saying. Men win out and women loose. Men get to have their porn and their real life women and women get men who might care about her but dont think she is as great as his fantasy of busty 18 year olds. And she can sit on the sidelines and watch and when he is done being worked over whatever new flavor of the month that got him going, can be there to service him.

[The Collector]

Some types of porn I am not interested in - grannies, she-males, gay, bondage/fetish, watersports, - but don't find disturbing or problematic.

 

Stuff that I find distasteful and would be underage for obvious reasons, and anything that delights in the humiliation of women I guess. I don't enjoy seeing women gagging, made to throw up, or do things I don't think many women enjoy in real life sex. I really haven't seen much of this sort of porn at all, outside of a documentary on Max Hardcore once. I accept it's out there, but it's pretty marginalised as far as I can see.

 

But it's hard to draw definite rules - sometimes a scenario might seem degrading - secretary must fellate boss for pay rise for example - but that's the kind of power-game scenario that I don't think is hateful to women and doesn't bother me. But if it was acted in a way where the woman didn't want to and the man was cackling like a maniac and calling her a stupid whore... then it's not erotic any more for me.

[Jersey Shortie]

I don't think the type of porn you are refering to is as marginalized as you like to paint it.

[Rorocher]

I'd also like to ask all the LS women who have seen some porn - how misogynistic do you think it is? How often do you hear women being called bitches and whores, or feel that the women are made to look bad, (as opposed to horny and available).

 

That stuff, like Max Hardcore, is out there. But in your experience, is that typical of porn, or a more extreme form of woman-debasement that's in all porn, or a niche market compared to regular, two-or-more-people-having-sex-but-in-porn-world-that's nothing-to-be ashamed-about-porn.

 

Please answer or it's me and Jersey Shortie going back and forth forever...

 

 

Oy!, the thread from hell that refuses to die.

 

Anyway, I have seen porn, I watch it often and I'm a woman. First of all, there is a ton and I mean ton of porn out there, all different kinds and varieties. Choose your taste. There is amature porn, hellooo, youporn.com anyone? where there are real couples having sex, fat, bald, unshaved and all. Real couples who make videos and post them online. Their sexual activity is loving and sweet with lots of foreplay. I never heard bitch or slut ever uttered. There is softcore porn which is like a romance novel acted out, complete with plotlines and all.

 

There is porn that feature only obese women, some feature flat chested women, some feature housewives, some feature natural "girl next door" types, etc.

And on the other extreme, there is porn that features transvestites, bondage and animals.

 

So you can't really put them all under one blanket and say they are all misogynistic because they are not.

[Jersey Shortie]

Oy!, the thread from hell that refuses to die

 

The forum is for discussion.

 

 

where there are real couples having sex, fat, bald, unshaved and all.

 

Usually it's the men that can be fat and bald... not the woman.

[Rorocher]

The forum is for discussion.

 

 

 

 

Usually it's the men that can be fat and bald... not the woman.

 

You are quite wrong there. The WOMEN are fat and unattractive. Check out youporn, seriously. It's quite a popular site because it's free and unpretentious. Average looking housewives and girlfriends, no fake boobs, no make-up. Just two people going at it in their bedroom, with a video camera. Some of them are even quiet, no moaning or groaning.

 

Not every female in porn is a plastic clone of Jenna Jameson.

 

Men do see plasticky, fake blonds in porn but these same men are dating the girl next door types, are they not?. Once again, difference between fantasy and reality. A lot of men know better than to hold real women to the standards of porn actors. Just like you can't expect every woman to look like Angelina Jolie.