Why are women so Catty with each other?

[Virgo1982]

That indirect aggression is a true friendship killer to me. You can't trust someone who can't be honest with you. Why can't we just accept what we can't change about ourselves and improve/enhance what we can?

Why can't we appreciate the talent/beauty/good attributes in our fellow woman? I know one female friend who is capable of this. As for the others, I consider them associates because they can not relate to other women in this way. I make an attempt to lead by example and it does not matter in the end-They take it the wrong way.

 

Here's my post

[Virgo1982]

It's very possible they don't want to be led and prefer to lead or interact in a particular fashion. I guess you have to look at yourself and whomever you're attempting to interact with, to see if you can't find common ground. It doesn't always have to be battle grounds drawn, regardless if your opinions differ. As an example, LS: Sometimes debates or disagreements happen within one thread that really doesn't have to be dragged to other threads.

 

If all else fails, instead of battle lines, avoid each other with civility.

 

Here's your response.

[D-Lish]

I always thought the catty behaviour was something most women would leave behind in high school... That's not the case though.

 

I in no way feel any need whatsoever to compete with looks, intelligence, wit, or personality with another female. If I am out and about and I see another woman wearing something I think is nice or if I meet someone who has an attractive quality, I immediately tell them. I have told strangers I am impressed by something about them.

 

I don't know why women don't do more of that. Human being in general are insecure... saying something nice to a stranger is the best gift you can give to someone. I've disarmed catty women in the past by complimenting them about something.

 

Being catty is simply a projection of one's own insecurities.

 

I have my own insecurities- but since I know how it feels to have them, I enjoy giving unsolicited compliments to other women. I know it makes me feel good- so why not spread the good feelings instead of wallowing in one's own misery and insecurity.

 

My best friend is super attractive, and she makes a habit out of sneering at other attractive women. I always chastise her for it. I always tell her "you're smart and beautiful- why bother engaging in that".

 

However- there are a few women I have known in my life that make a habit out of being mean to other women.

 

I had an old neighbour who dates this incredibly catty mean girl. She hated me from day one and was habitually mean and rude to me. I never responded with being mean back to her. I went back to my old place to pick him and her up last weekend to go out. She knew how sensitive it was for me to have to lose my loft and business and move home. Someone made a comment about whether or not I was still carrying on with young hot guys since I'd seen them last...and she responded in front of everyone "why would they want her now... she no longer has a cool place or money to keep them interested".... Now that is catty.

 

Everyone just looked at her is shock and she started backtracking and saying "oh I didn't mean it that way". Of course she meant it that way!

She's insecure and projects her dislike of herself onto other women she deems to have what she feels she is missing.

 

I can't stand the girl- but I never let her know she affects me. I always smile and even told her that night it was okay, I wasn't offended. I just won't engage in it. It's her problem- not mine.

 

You just have to recognize that when women engage in this behaviour that they don't feel good about themselves- if they did... they wouldn't enage in that kind of behaviour.

 

It's jealousy and insecurity... They don't realize how ugly it makes them to act like this. My neighbours gf isn't bad looking- but her personality makes her UGLY, UGLY, UGLY.

[Trialbyfire]

The original post you responded to was not directed toward you. My response to your reply was directed toward you.

Ah, okay, so we're taking it back to that. Yes I do know it wasn't directed towards me but found something within the content of your post that was interesting to me. So, I responded to it with some thoughts. There was nothing catty within my response or at least that wasn't my intent. Did you take it as a form of criticism?

[Virgo1982]

I tend to take each situation, examine the facts, then proceed. I can't bother with being catty because it's wasted energy. The problem comes in when some women feel the need to be catty, subtle, and underhanded. Where are their balls? Oh, thats right...

 

I don't think being a sly bitch earns you the title of strong woman. I think it takes a strong woman to be real about her feelings. I think a strong woman would be able to socialize with another woman without trying to find faults to make herself feel better. I think it takes a strong woman to know when she's wrong and admit it.

 

Anyway, I am referring to women I interact with IRL. In another thread, I remember agreeing with that statement: disagreements or debates in other threads do not have to be dragged into other threads. I can't see myself disagreeing with something I agree with just to "win" some non-existent battle.

 

The fact of the matter is, whether a suspected misogynist says it or not, some women do exhibit catty behavior. Calling him a misogynist and referring to his other posts is kinda like bringing beef from another thread into this one, but I don't know the complete story. This thread didn't ask if he was a misogynist or why men were catty. So, either I'm or your ...

 

If you weren't in a disagreement with Von before this thread, please accept my apology in advance.

 

 

And my response to your reply...

[Virgo1982]

I have my own insecurities- but since I know how it feels to have them, I enjoy giving unsolicited compliments to other women. I know it makes me feel good- so why not spread the good feelings instead of wallowing in one's own misery and insecurity.

 

My best friend is super attractive, and she makes a habit out of sneering at other attractive women. I always chastise her for it. I always tell her "you're smart and beautiful- why bother engaging in that".

 

 

That's what I try to do, but the insecurity is just so strong. It's like the mind makes a desperate attempt to get the complimentary thought out of her head. "Must...not think other...woman is...attractive. Must find something wrong...with her..." or "Does she really think I'm smart and beautiful? What does she mean 'why do you bother engaging in that? I'm going to put her in her place."

 

I do mess up when some are calling to talk about relationship issues and I don't agree with everything they're saying. I should simply say that he is wrong every time and whatever you want will be good for the relationship. Otherwise, I'm in for some catty behavior...

[Taramere]

I know, I noticed the same thing.

 

The women claiming women are not "catty" treat other women in a catty manner on the same thread, lol.

 

You're a guy - but to me this is exactly the kind of indirect cattiness that women are constantly being accused of. As an aside, I don't think anyone has claimed here that women aren't catty. I think the point is that cattiness a behaviour that both genders can indulge in...and as grogster has said, it's often more related to temperament than anything else.

 

This notion that men are straight up in dealing with conflict is something I have seen contradicted by behaviour and actions in real life time and time again. Some men are, indeed, very direct and straightforward - but certainly not all of the ones I've encountered in life. That's why it annoys me when the claim is made so often. Not because it's sexist, but because it's dishonest. Why should a cowardly, conflict avoidant individual get to be tagged with the flattering "upfront and direct" label simply because he's male? Lay claim, by virtue of his gender, to a quality he doesn't personally possess?

 

The "certain people here" approach casts doubt on a variety of people. That reminds me of a bit in the Fountainhead - an anecdote about Ellsworth Toohey as a child. He helps another (bright) boy in the class to cheat. Then he goes to the teacher and asks to be punished on the basis that he helped someone to cheat. No...he won't name the boy in question (implication, he's far too honourable to do that). All he can say is that it was one of the brightest boys in the class. Thereby throwing doubt on all the smart kids, while retaining an aura of "honourability". When honourability has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with it.

 

It's not easy to confront people directly, because it tends to lead to conflict which won't necessarily stop when you want it to. On the other hand, at least it's clear and honest. It's saying "I don't like what you said just here. This is why...." It clarifies who you're talking to. It also gives the person you are confronting an opportunity to respond, without their intelligence being insulted by that "you're so paranoid, but if the cap fits etc etc."

 

Say a few catty digs seem to be getting directed to one particular person, but none of them are direct enough for the person to answer without being accused of paranoia or being self centred. I've been in that situation. What lucky person hasn't? You hear comments/see meaningful glances floating around which you suspect might be directed at you. It makes you uncomfortable. You'd like to respond, but you can't really do that because it's all too vague and indirect. Then finally someone challenges you directly about whatever it is others are bitching about. It clarifies to you that you're not paranoid, and that these other comments were in fact directed at you. The direct challenge gives you an opportunity to answer all of it.

 

Direct confrontation in public can easily look like bullying, but that isn't necessarily the case. Sometimes it's an opportunity for the person who's being gossiped or bitched about/targeted with side swipes to respond directly to a direct criticism. Instead of hearing/reading comments that they think may well be about them - but not feeling able to respond.

[grogster]

Tara, I'm personally offended as a guy when you write, "Why should a cowardly, conflict avoidant individual get to be tagged with the flattering "upfront and direct" label simply because he's male? Lay claim, by virtue of his gender, to a quality he doesn't personally possess?"

 

I prefer viewing particular individuals through the distorting lens of gender. Looking at individual differences is much too difficult, and so unrewarding.

 

Plus, everybody knows from a wealth of personal experience that we men are direct, forthright, honest and frank. Why? Because we're men. See my halo?

 

Conversely, everybody knows, again from a wealth of personal experience, that women are subtle snipers, jealous jezebels-- masters of the indirect attack shot. Why? Because they're woman. I love your horns!

 

I'm getting dizzy.

 

Think in terms of gender stereotypes and you don't need to do much thinking at all.

 

I like that.

 

Wait, am I being catty?

 

Ayn Rand!?

[Taramere]

Ayn Rand!?

 

Yes, I'm afraid so. My heart's with altruism, my brain's with objectivism. Help me, grogster!!

 

Plus, everybody knows from a wealth of personal experience that we men are direct, forthright, honest and frank. Why? Because we're men. See my halo?

 

Maybe I do, and then again....maybe I don't! You might find out, or you might not. I'm a womanly creature of magick, mystery and suspense. Who knows what colour of steam might spring from my cauldron next?

[grogster]

Follow your heart. Objectivism, like many ism's, is better read than lived

 

Ayn Rand, however, was a "cougar" before cougars were "cougars." She enjoyed the young men.

 

Who is John Galt?

[Taramere]

Follow your heart. Objectivism, like many ism's, is better read than lived

 

I think she found that out herself, didn't she!

 

Ayn Rand, however, was a "cougar" before cougars were "cougars." She enjoyed the young men.

 

She was like an early Margaret Thatcher. This should be a man's world! With me at the helm! And preferably not so much as a feeble little mew out of any other woman.

 

 

Who is John Galt?

 

One was enough for me. Finding out who John Galt was would probably hurtle me into an early menopause.

[grogster]

This should be a man's world! With me at the helm! And preferably not so much as a feeble little mew out of any other woman.

 

You're being catty, Tara. Retract your claws.

 

 

 

Finding out who John Galt was would probably hurtle me into an early menopause

 

 

That it would: 700 pages later I couldn't wait for Atlas to shrug.

[LolitaAnastasia]

As another poster mentioned it has to do with emotions, when I was in highschool, I always tried to beat my friend at things, from assignments to getting our licence.

 

She isn't jealous of me but I can admit I am heaps jealous of her.

 

I was jealous that she got a boyfriend before I did (hey even though she isn't physically attractive, she is a bag of bones in a sense). I envied that she got her full licence before I did and just recently I was jealous she got a message on her Facebook wall from an old class friend while said class friend didn't send me one.

 

It's all emotion.

[Taramere]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lS9odVqyC2g&NR=1

 

I've never seen that film, but that video was the kind of freaky scene that sticks in your mind. You could see it coming. Even as that lame alien was scooping up dirty water to drink, while the others laid gazed with expressions of kindly interest, you sense that glee groups get when they're about to devour a weakling.

 

When I was a kid, my friends and I used to play this game at lunchtime where one of the group would go and hide under a desk. They'd be given 10 seconds to hide (the group shouted a countdown) then after one the group would yell "GET HER!!!" The person would be dragged out from under the table then once they'd been dragged past a certain point they'd be tickled.

 

When I was under that table, even though I knew they were my friends and that nothing bad was going to happen to me, I'd feel that fairground-induced style of terror/adrenalin rush when I saw all those feet thundering towards me. Likewise, I'd feel that same adrenalin rush when I was part of the mob.

 

Looking back, it was a pretty intelligent game for a group of 10 year olds to devise. It gave everyone a chance to role play both victim and mob member without anyone seriously getting hurt or being genuinely victimised. You get to see both sides of the coin. Develop an understanding of the fear people experience when they know they're about to be mobbed, and also get to understand what feelings a person has when they're part of that mob. Realise a bit more what motivates mobs to group together.

 

Not that we had that in mind when we made the game up. It just felt like fun and gave everyone a rush without anybody getting hurt or offended. It shows the value of play, really - and how it can help children to see/experience things from a variety of perspectives. You can talk and talk all day to a person about what's right and wrong, but ultimately there's no better teacher than direct experience.

[stillafool]

As another poster mentioned it has to do with emotions, when I was in highschool, I always tried to beat my friend at things, from assignments to getting our licence.

 

She isn't jealous of me but I can admit I am heaps jealous of her.

 

I was jealous that she got a boyfriend before I did (hey even though she isn't physically attractive, she is a bag of bones in a sense). I envied that she got her full licence before I did and just recently I was jealous she got a message on her Facebook wall from an old class friend while said class friend didn't send me one.

 

It's all emotion.

 

 

Geesh, I'm surprised this girl is still your friend. Why do you hang out with someone you are so jealous of?

 

I've noticed "cattiness" among the men on this forum towards the so called "bad guy". They go on and on about how these guys are losers and all the girls want them. Yet they all read books that teach them to be just like these guys so they can get girls. :sick:

[vonerik012]

Poor example of "cattiness".. Try again stillafool.

[stillafool]

Well if you don't believe me read on my friend. The men here say quite a few mean and spiteful things about "the bad boy" because of no other reason than pure jealousy.

[almost famous]

I really don't see that with my colleagues and friends at all, to be honest.

[vonerik012]

Well if you don't believe me read on my friend. The men here say quite a few mean and spiteful things about "the bad boy" because of no other reason than pure jealousy.

 

Those are more or less jabs at women's poor judgment, not ripping on "bad boys"

[almost famous]

Men like you, V, are catty the way that you try to bring women down and make them think that they will never be happy and men will never fall in love with them.

[J2FT1]

Lol, women are so in denial these days it's not even funny. Why can't they think of the positives of their traits and not just the negatives. When guys say that women react on emotions and men react on reason, Most women will think it's a put down when it's the general truth.