Moral values vs. Promiscuity

[Siphon9a]

I have been reading posts lately and alot of them signal alot of relationship problems due the non-acceptance of the "past being the past" type of thing. I myself have been dealing with that sort of thing as some may know. But aside from that I have been wondering the same thing as I read each post.

 

Regardless of your ability or determination to get over or through certain things in a relationship, is there a moral wall that in some, cannot be overcome? By that I mean if a person who views certain things that a person does as morally wrong, can that be overcome? Can a person change the moral values given to them based on parental guidance, religion, whatever it is that instills this belief inside of them to have a completely stable relationship. We all know people change over time as they learn about life and what it's really all about to them. But on the flip side there are those, like many of the posters here that seem to not be able to deal with the "hard lessons" that so many learn. In this case it's not a feeling of a threat to a relationship so retroactive jealousy surfaces but more of a character stance on certain things being wrong, regardless of the circumstance that lead up to the events.

 

Could it be that no matter how a person feels about someone now and everything in the actual relationship could be perfect, things might not ever work based on the choices a person made due to moral value differences? Even if the person now realizes what they did to find some kind of value in themselves was wrong and "plans" to no longer do those things?

 

I'm curious as to the responses from people that didn't do those things that bother them the most. By that I mean, you were presented with opportunites to indulge but didn't because of your own personal strong moral stance.

[rproctor]

I remember one night at a new years eve party, my friends sister asked me to shag her in the bathroom after quite a few drinks. She was sexy, ready, and willing. I declined, it seemed against my morals. Another time there was a married woman who I used to work with at the local bar. One night, she came on to me, and even though I wanted it, I declined. Throughout my life, other similar situations and opportunities have occurred, but I have always declined seeing as I valued sex as more than just a one nighter. A couple years ago, I came out of a long committed relationship and one night, after a lot of drinking, I met up with this chick at a bar and brought her back home and screwed her. I knew it was just this one night, and I knew it would never be anything more. It was the lousiest sexual experience I had ever had.

 

Did it mean that I had week morals, not at all. I had come from a string of serious relationships, and after feeling as though committed relationships were not working for me, I decided to try another avenue. Well, I quickly realized that it was a mistake, and marked it off as so. Shortly after, I met up with a chick who I did like, and did work into a relationship. She was the exact opposite of ALL my previous relationships. Most of my girlfriends were conservative, for the most part. This girl was the devils advocate, but I liked it... Temporarily... After that short, failed, and horrible relationship I realized what I wanted, and what I didnt want. I kid you not, this girl was a whore, literally... She had done porn, exotic services, etc. Anyways, for what its worth, it never bothered me, but probably because I knew she was only temporary.

 

But, what separates her from the one night stand? I knew both were temporary, both disposable. So even though one was a committed relationship and the other a fling, what was the difference? Nothing. What I realized about myself, is that I was still in this downward spiral. I wouldn't say that I was immoral with my decision, or that I was loose, but just naive, or unaware of what I was really searching for in someone else. The reason my past relationships never worked was due to the fact that the women I was with were so conservative that it was troublesome in my lifestyle, and the women I was chasing were in a complete different lifestyle than my own.

 

I am, in no way, a womanizer. I don't feel justified using women to my own advantage, but I had done it, on several different occasions. I think, what the point of my story here is, sometimes we do things without really taking into consideration the morality of our actions. I never meant to use those women, and I am sure that a lot of women never meant to be used. It shouldn't reflect my morals or who I am, because that is definitely not who I am, even though I have done those things. I'm sure there are many women out there, who fall into this same category.

 

Someones morals and values should be based on who they are now, and what they have taken from their past actions, not the other way around. A lot of people here, including myself, have had to deal with issues of their lovers and their sometimes seemingly shaded past. I can say, from first hand experience, that people are not their past. Sometimes we get too focused on the facts of our lovers past and dont take into consideration the outcome of their past. Knowing your lover was either used by others or was using others for sexual gratification is always a difficult thought, but if you find yourself in such a situation its best to realize that people are a sum of their life. You cant define someone based on single moments of their lives, because who I was last year is in no way the person I am today! Every day I make mistakes, and every day I learn from them. Its life. Morality cant be defined as a single definition of right and wrong, its a combination of all that is that person.

 

If you met a woman who cured cancer, cured world hunger, made peace for the entire world, and screwed 30 guys would you consider her to be immoral? If you met a woman who cheated, lied, stole and killed but never slept with anyone outside of marriage would you think she was moral? You cant justify someones self worth based on events that 1) you really dont know anything about, and 2) were rectified in their past. Dont be a fool and let love slip through your fingers because you think your partner is wrong for experimenting with their life and finding out for themselves what love and hate is all about. You will regret it your entire life.

[Javelin]

I have been reading posts lately and alot of them signal alot of relationship problems due the non-acceptance of the "past being the past" type of thing. I myself have been dealing with that sort of thing as some may know. But aside from that I have been wondering the same thing as I read each post.

 

Regardless of your ability or determination to get over or through certain things in a relationship, is there a moral wall that in some, cannot be overcome? By that I mean if a person who views certain things that a person does as morally wrong, can that be overcome? Can a person change the moral values given to them based on parental guidance, religion, whatever it is that instills this belief inside of them to have a completely stable relationship. We all know people change over time as they learn about life and what it's really all about to them. But on the flip side there are those, like many of the posters here that seem to not be able to deal with the "hard lessons" that so many learn. In this case it's not a feeling of a threat to a relationship so retroactive jealousy surfaces but more of a character stance on certain things being wrong, regardless of the circumstance that lead up to the events.

 

Could it be that no matter how a person feels about someone now and everything in the actual relationship could be perfect, things might not ever work based on the choices a person made due to moral value differences? Even if the person now realizes what they did to find some kind of value in themselves was wrong and "plans" to no longer do those things?

 

I'm curious as to the responses from people that didn't do those things that bother them the most. By that I mean, you were presented with opportunites to indulge but didn't because of your own personal strong moral stance.

 

In reality, not one person has the right to judge another. It isn't fair and it's a selfish thing to do, but in some circumstances it is necessary.

 

Now towards current relationships where a person has past issues.

 

I would guess about 9 out of 10 posts that are related to this topic are full blown, 1-3 year relationships, some even going into the engaged status! How you can stay with someone that long and still have issues with their past? It seriously boggles the mind, I mean, this is stuff you learn early, not later. You don't wait 4 years to tell someone, ' I can't marry you because of your past! ' That is a waste of time on both parts and just sounds stupid. Especially if there are double standards involved.

 

Everyone should know what they're getting into when a partnership because serious. If you don't then maybe you should change the way you date. If you do, then why the hell are you dating them in the first place?

 

To be truthfully honest, if I met someone and we hit it off really well and I knew she was loyal and trustworthy, but had a track record over 10, that would be fine. However if I started getting close to a friend that I knew was very promiscuous, with a TR over say, 30, then that would be a HELL NO...! No exceptions..

[Trialbyfire]

I doubt anyone can debate that historical patterns reveal a lot about how a person functions. While people can change, more often than not, when it hits the fan during times of high stress, they tend to revert to foundational patterns of behaviour.

 

With this in mind, everyone has the right to know about a partner's sexual history. If one partner withholds this information, be it actively, lying or lying by omission, which partner is now being selfish, particularly in knowing that it could easily affect the relationship due to their partner's beliefs?

 

Every partner has the right to accept or reject anyone for any reason.

[verve]

Pass 'em to me, I'll bang 'em and enjoy every minute.

 

What if none of them want to with you?

[Ronni_W]

I think, as adults, we ought to establish our own set of morals, values and principles -- which may or may not include some or all of our ancestors' beliefs and opinions.

 

And yes, those will guide how we view the world and inform us when we choose friends and partners. Difficulties arise when we want and expect others to live according to our own standards, instead of allowing that they get to live by their standards.

 

For me, moral differences require me to extricate myself from that situation...NOT try to get the other person to change their own morals and values to match mine. And not from a place of judging them as being immoral and unprincipled but rather just choosing what I want and distancing myself from what I don't want.

 

As someone else said, it also is misguided to judge people harshly because they didn't demonstrate as much will-power as we think we have, and ended up "indulging" in ways of which we do not approve. Self-righteousness is NOT attractive, according to my value system

[Arcanum]

I think it's easy to say that you would distance yourself from people that do not value the same morals as yourself but I'm finding, although I have always felt like that in the past, now when I am in love with someone who has a morally questionable past it's much harder to put into practice.

My partner rarely turned down sexual opoortunities and never used protection. His number is 10 times my own and all in all it makes one facet of our relationship very difficult.

I do think we are a sum of our parts and pasts. Everything we have experienced up to this very point in time has made us who we are. I think it's natural to try and find out as much as possible as someone including where they stand concerning sexual morals.

Self righteousness is indeed unattractive. And I find myself guilty of it. And I'm pretty sure the reason I sometimes feel it is because I'm hurt by my otherwise wonderful mans actions. That his choices has cast huge doubts over our future and that because when I was faced with those decisions they were easy to refuse because it wasn't what I wanted.

Not to say I'm an angel. I've made mistakes too. But it's hard when the mistakes you have both made are leagues apart. And how whereas I learned from mine and changed he did not.

So the idea that he is not the right person for me now makes me sad because of how good everything else is, and then it makes me mad.

But I think it was a good point that someone made about how we should try not to judge someone else just because it took them longer to figure out lifes lessons.....so now I'm posed with question do I want to share my life with someone who seems unable to learn from life without making mistake after mistake time and time again. It's hard to believe the wonderful words I hear now saying how all of those actions over so many years were mistakes. To me they sound like they just were not morally important enough. And that's not cool.

Ugh sad again now.

I read all sorts of these posts and all I keep seeing is that people still have the same problems years down the line.

Is it worth the heartache?

[Arcanum]

I doubt anyone can debate that historical patterns reveal a lot about how a person functions. While people can change, more often than not, when it hits the fan during times of high stress, they tend to revert to foundational patterns of behaviour.

 

 

This is something I keep coming across the more and more I research personality. You find that people follow the same patterns in life through out their whole life in all areas of that life.

Not wholly comforting.

Yet I feel very different to who I was 5 and 10 years ago.

Can anyone change fundamental morals?

And does promiscuity fall within the margins of stressed periods of life?

[AAlike]

I doubt anyone can debate that historical patterns reveal a lot about how a person functions. While people can change, more often than not, when it hits the fan during times of high stress, they tend to revert to foundational patterns of behaviour.

 

You say this in every one of these threads - and while I think that the statement itself has some truth, I'm not sure that a lot of the stuff that creates problems in a lot of these threads constitutes "foundational patterns of behaviour." I mean, it would be one thing if someone was a swinger or having weekly one night stands - but a few isolated incidents are not a behavioral pattern - they're anomalies.

 

With this in mind, everyone has the right to know about a partner's sexual history. If one partner withholds this information, be it actively, lying or lying by omission, which partner is now being selfish, particularly in knowing that it could easily affect the relationship due to their partner's beliefs?

 

Every partner has the right to accept or reject anyone for any reason.

 

This I completely agree with. If you know for a fact that the past actions of a potential partner need to lie within your belief system then yes, you should certainly find out this information. In other words, if your partner having ANY casual sexual history would bother you, then yes, you should know if they have one.

 

HOWEVER - what people need to be wary of is that there is a HUGE difference between knowing that your partner has a sexual history and knowing the DETAILS of that sexual history. What might not bother you morally or logically can wreak havoc on you emotionally - and that's what I think happens in a lot of these cases in which people torture themselves because they get so flustered by what they now know but don't even really know why.

[Trialbyfire]

This is something I keep coming across the more and more I research personality. You find that people follow the same patterns in life through out their whole life in all areas of that life.

Not wholly comforting.

Yet I feel very different to who I was 5 and 10 years ago.

Can anyone change fundamental morals?

And does promiscuity fall within the margins of stressed periods of life?

I'm of the school of thought that people only change fundamental morals through personal trauma, unless it's a relaxing of fundamental morals for personal gain.

 

Not all but many people use promiscuity for the purposes of external validation v. a purely physical release.

 

"He/she wants me so I must be hawt/interesting/great/the best...whatever."

 

If people need to be sexually validated often for internal needs, it can manifest itself through infidelity/cheating, during times of stress in a marriage/relationship whether their internal needs are reasonable or unreasonable. A form of coping mechanism.

[Arcanum]

I mean, it would be one thing if someone was a swinger or having weekly one night stands - but a few isolated incidents are not a behavioral pattern - they're anomalies.

 

Aalike

I like reading your posts.

Isolated incidents. My guy has slept with 18 people and every one of them the last being 4 months before we began our relationship was unprotected. Even the flings and one weekers or nighters.

Anomolies? Or pattern?

Because now all I hear is how he changed just before meeting me.

I'm having such a hard time with it all.

[Ronni_W]

...so now I'm posed with question do I want to share my life with someone who seems unable to learn from life without making mistake after mistake

Perhaps a more, er, valuable question is what value does he currently place on being more sexually discriminating? Wouldn't that help you determine if you can count on, what for you would be, an improvement in this area, in the future?

 

Because. Let's say that in the past he did not place a high priority on being too sexually discerning -- his actions would have reflected his low priority. Within YOUR set of priorities, had you acted like that you may well have considered it a series of "mistakes" on your part, and demonstration of your lack of self-discipline, etc.

But is it accurate that his actions, within HIS then-current priorities, were what HE would have called "mistakes" that he needed to learn from?

 

That is, might it not be more useful to 'judge' him by HIS values at any given stage of his life, see how well he lived up to his own morals...and THEN find out if his current values are more in line with your current values?

[AAlike]

Perhaps a more, er, valuable question is what value does he currently place on being more sexually discriminating? Wouldn't that help you determine if you can count on, what for you would be, an improvement in this area, in the future?

 

Because. Let's say that in the past he did not place a high priority on being too sexually discerning -- his actions would have reflected his low priority. Within YOUR set of priorities, had you acted like that you may well have considered it a series of "mistakes" on your part, and demonstration of your lack of self-discipline, etc.

But is it accurate that his actions, within HIS then-current priorities, were what HE would have called "mistakes" that he needed to learn from?

 

That is, might it not be more useful to 'judge' him by HIS values at any given stage of his life, see how well he lived up to his own morals...and THEN find out if his current values are more in line with your current values?

 

right!

 

let's use a similar example...I've done drugs before while I was in college -tried pretty much everything that doesn't involve a needle or a rock. I was never hardcore into them and always felt that I used restraint and never disrupted my life on a grand scale with them...I just happened to attend a college where people partied prominently with drugs.

 

I am now in my early 30's, have a very professional and demanding career, and have a younger brother that has had extensive drug problems. I haven't touched any intoxicant other than my pretentious beer selections in a decade, and have no desire to do so again. When I look back at the two years in which I did that stuff - was it stupid? in retrospect, sure, but I don't have any deep-seated regret towards it...it just WAS at the time.

 

if I were single now, my only criteria regarding drug usage would be that the girl doesn't currently do anything other than have some drinks. I wouldn't care what she did in college or before we dated, nor would I expect her to care what I did 13 years ago.

 

have my "fundamental morals" changed? no, probably not, and I agree that in most cases they aren't going to. I still believe that if you choose to experiment with drugs and can handle it that it's your prerogative. But am I going to revert to using drugs when my life gets stressful? god no - I don't even have access to that avenue anymore.

[Arcanum]

Perhaps a more, er, valuable question is what value does he currently place on being more sexually discriminating? Wouldn't that help you determine if you can count on, what for you would be, an improvement in this area, in the future?

 

Because. Let's say that in the past he did not place a high priority on being too sexually discerning -- his actions would have reflected his low priority. Within YOUR set of priorities, had you acted like that you may well have considered it a series of "mistakes" on your part, and demonstration of your lack of self-discipline, etc.

But is it accurate that his actions, within HIS then-current priorities, were what HE would have called "mistakes" that he needed to learn from?

 

That is, might it not be more useful to 'judge' him by HIS values at any given stage of his life, see how well he lived up to his own morals...and THEN find out if his current values are more in line with your current values?

 

Now that's a good point. And something well worth talking to him about.

It's a starneg concept for me though as in my life my morals have held fast. not to say they won't change in the future, but i can't see it happening.

I've always regarded sex as more meaningful than cheap thrills. I've always made sure I was safe for me and for my loved ones and my future and it's still the same. Can someone really change those basic morals?

I hope so.

Anyone with experience of that??

[Arcanum]

Perhaps a more, er, valuable question is what value does he currently place on being more sexually discriminating? Wouldn't that help you determine if you can count on, what for you would be, an improvement in this area, in the future?

 

Because. Let's say that in the past he did not place a high priority on being too sexually discerning -- his actions would have reflected his low priority. Within YOUR set of priorities, had you acted like that you may well have considered it a series of "mistakes" on your part, and demonstration of your lack of self-discipline, etc.

But is it accurate that his actions, within HIS then-current priorities, were what HE would have called "mistakes" that he needed to learn from?

 

That is, might it not be more useful to 'judge' him by HIS values at any given stage of his life, see how well he lived up to his own morals...and THEN find out if his current values are more in line with your current values?

 

right!

 

let's use a similar example...I've done drugs before while I was in college -tried pretty much everything that doesn't involve a needle or a rock. I was never hardcore into them and always felt that I used restraint and never disrupted my life on a grand scale with them...I just happened to attend a college where people partied prominently with drugs.

 

I am now in my early 30's, have a very professional and demanding career, and have a younger brother that has had extensive drug problems. I haven't touched any intoxicant other than my pretentious beer selections in a decade, and have no desire to do so again. When I look back at the two years in which I did that stuff - was it stupid? in retrospect, sure, but I don't have any deep-seated regret towards it...it just WAS at the time.

 

if I were single now, my only criteria regarding drug usage would be that the girl doesn't currently do anything other than have some drinks. I wouldn't care what she did in college or before we dated, nor would I expect her to care what I did 13 years ago.

 

have my "fundamental morals" changed? no, probably not, and I agree that in most cases they aren't going to. I still believe that if you choose to experiment with drugs and can handle it that it's your prerogative. But am I going to revert to using drugs when my life gets stressful? god no - I don't even have access to that avenue anymore.

 

I love that you gave an example of that as I was asking!!

[AAlike]

Aalike

I like reading your posts.

Isolated incidents. My guy has slept with 18 people and every one of them the last being 4 months before we began our relationship was unprotected. Even the flings and one weekers or nighters.

Anomolies? Or pattern?

 

Because now all I hear is how he changed just before meeting me.

I'm having such a hard time with it all.

 

Ah, see I think that this would concern me too - not because I would be worried about him jumping into bed with someone else when times are tough, but if he has NEVER protected himself then there does seem to be a pattern of reckless behavior, which could manifest itself in other aspects of his daily life.

 

I certainly don't think that it's not something that can be rectified - and perhaps his feelings for you could be the exact thing to do that...however, I would certainly keep it in the back of my mind and look for signs of this behavior elsewhere.

[littlekitty]

I believe morals and values CAN change from your younger years as you get older.

 

For example someone mentioned promiscuity in relation to looking for external validation. What if that was caused by a life occurance, or upbringing. And what if that person then had counselling which resolved that belief? Would and could that not change their fundamental moral value with regard to sex?

 

My husband and I have never discussed our sexual history. We are both clean obviously. The rest has never been discussed and never will be. It's the past and it stays there. I trust him and love him, and I have no requirement to judge him on that past basis nor him me.

 

If your moral value regarding sex is strong, and you feel it 100% necessary to know your partners past. Be prepared to lose the relationship over it if you hear what you don't like.

[Ronni_W]

Can someone really change those basic morals? I hope so. Anyone with experience of that??

Well, it almost goes first to personal definitions of "morals" -- for example, my grandmother thought it was "immoral" to play card games on Sundays -- not even gambling, 'go fish' was also off limits. BUT many of my friends' grandmothers didn't label me "immoral" whenever I was "go fishing" on a Sunday! (which, btw, my grandmother was WRONG to label me that way.)

 

And some people do NOT feel that having many different sexual experiences is "immoral" (while some people still do.) It's more about a personal choice and preference. And societal 'norms' also come into play -- for the most part, young, single guys are still "supposed to" and almost expected to chase after anything in a skirt.

 

So, for stuff like sex, drugs (and rock 'n roll? )...maybe it's more of what people self-determine are age-appropriate behaviours rather than making it a "morality issue"? Just as AAlike said. When we're young and single, there are certain behaviours that we happily engage in, that we KNOW we will not continue to do as we grow older and/or get into committed relationships.

 

Put another way, YOU are making your partner's prior sex life into a moral issue (like my g/mother did with my Sunday card playing) and that will keep you wondering whether he can change his "morals" -- but it was never about that for him, so in his mind there ARE NO morals that he needs to change, as related to sex...just his sexual behaviour -- but your mind is gonna end up getting you caught in an unresolvable conundrum unless you change things so you are also encompassing his perspective.

 

Better yet...why not set about appreciating him for all his current positives and good qualities, and just resolve to have a wonderful, happy, inspiring and successful relationship with him?

[AAlike]

Well, it almost goes first to personal definitions of "morals" -- for example, my grandmother thought it was "immoral" to play card games on Sundays -- not even gambling, 'go fish' was also off limits. BUT many of my friends' grandmothers didn't label me "immoral" whenever I was "go fishing" on a Sunday! (which, btw, my grandmother was WRONG to label me that way.)

 

And some people do NOT feel that having many different sexual experiences is "immoral" (while some people still do.) It's more about a personal choice and preference. And societal 'norms' also come into play -- for the most part, young, single guys are still "supposed to" and almost expected to chase after anything in a skirt.

 

So, for stuff like sex, drugs (and rock 'n roll? )...maybe it's more of what people self-determine are age-appropriate behaviours rather than making it a "morality issue"? Just as AAlike said. When we're young and single, there are certain behaviours that we happily engage in, that we KNOW we will not continue to do as we grow older and/or get into committed relationships.

 

Put another way, YOU are making your partner's prior sex life into a moral issue (like my g/mother did with my Sunday card playing) and that will keep you wondering whether he can change his "morals" -- but it was never about that for him, so in his mind there ARE NO morals that he needs to change, as related to sex -- but your mind is gonna end up getting you caught in an unresolvable conundrum unless you change things so you are also encompassing his perspective.

 

Better yet...why not set about appreciating him for all his current positives and good qualities, and just resolve to have a wonderful, happy, inspiring and successful relationship with him?

 

wow this is a great post. you are the (wo?)man Ronni.

[Ronni_W]

wow this is a great post. you are the (wo?)man Ronni.

TY, AA -- I am, er, dah WOman...but that just doesn't have the same ring, does it? Guess I'm stuck with, "I am woman, hear me roar" -- to age myself in a fierce way...with a crappy song, to boot.

[AAlike]

TY, AA -- I am, er, dah WOman...but that just doesn't have the same ring, does it? Guess I'm stuck with, "I am woman, hear me roar" -- to age myself in a fierce way...with a crappy song, to boot.

 

well, Ms. Reddy (or "Hel Red" as we youngsters call her) ain't got nothin' on you when it comes to droppin' science!

[Walk]

As an analogy... A student takes several college level courses and chooses to spend the night before the final exams going out with his friends drinking. He fails all his classes. He acted irresponsibly and without considering the consequences of his actions. His actions show he is more concerned with having fun, then on succeeding in college.

 

The next semester the student registers for the same courses. Should the instructors fail the student again due to his behavior during the first semester? His behaviors were indicative of future performance. Should he be given a second attempt?

 

Sometimes this is what people on LS due when they're talking about a gf who had a 3 way once. Or a bf who had a string of 1 night stands in the course of 6-8 months. They judge a relatively small period of their partners life as an indicator for all future actions. Especially if you're only looking at 1 year out of 6, 8, 10 years of dating. I know I've made some piss poor decisions at least 1/7 of the time I've been dating.

 

The other aspect that bugs me when people take situations out of context (not saying everyone does this, but some do), is when a poster will judge a gf on having a high number of past partners and this will carry more weight then any other characteristic the girl may have. Instead of taking the whole person into consideration, weighting the parts as slices of the whole, they focus solely on that portion and judge the whole person for it.

 

For example... there was one thread consisted of a bf who felt his gf's number of sexual partners showed she doesn't care for, or respect, her body. Yes, that is true to a degree. But if (hypothetically) the girl is an avid fitness enthusiast, eats well, uses free time to develop interests and hobbies, works on creating a strong personal network, and consistently see's her physician, then is the girl really showing a lack of respect, or lack of care, for her body? Or is it more likely showing that her a lack of knowledge into the percentage rates of STDs? Or an irrational belief that her healthy lifestyle and regular check ups will prevent or remove the bad consequences? Both potential possibilities could be seen as a lack of knowledge versus a lack of care for her body.

 

I think as you grow older, and the number of stupid azz mistakes you make increases, you start to become more tolerant of others past behaviors. You learn to recognize when those behaviors were relatively insignificant, and when those behaviors forecast future behaviors. I have 20 years of dating under my belt, and I've got bad past experiences mixed in there. Those "bad" experiences are about 15% of my total past dating years. To judge me solely on those to prove my "moral" attitude would be narrow-minded and short sighted. Luckily my H is a man of wisedom and weighed my full history instead of just the 15% of it.

[Taramere]

My parents were pretty liberal with me as regards teaching morals. Punishments tended to be dished out on a "you annoyed me" basis than a "you did something wrong one". Not very good, I know....but there were other, better aspects to them that helped me form opinions about morality. They're both very bright academically, so from an early age I was exposed to ideas that related to philosophy and morality. Also, there were always books available. I was addicted to anything related to psychology, and that probably helped me form a view of "here's how doing X to someone can affect them. It can have serious outcomes for them. You owe it to other people to take some care with their emotions and to try to avoid breaching their trust.

 

Tied up with that certain things like don't lie (unless you really have to, or unless you're obviously kidding around), don't steal and generally try to treat other people as you'd like to be treated are consistents insofar as my own moral guidance goes. Also, giving people the freedom and opportunity to make informed decisions about how they want to live their lives, provided they don't impinge on the rights of others.

 

Promiscuity immoral? To me, it's only immoral insofar as anyone whose choice in the matter has somehow been taken away gets hurt by it. So for instance, sex without the consent of one of the parties - rape. Knowingly transmitting an STD to an unwitting partner who wouldn't have slept with you had they known about the STD. Being promiscuous without using protection and without getting regularly checked for STDS - thereby being reckless with other people's health and safety as well as your own. Cheating on a partner who's with you in the belief that the two of you are sexually exclusive and who didn't consent/wouldn't have consented to being in a non-exclusive sexual relationship with you.

[Jake Barnes]

I'm sorry, but a woman having had a high number of sexual partners is indicative of promiscuity and shouldnt be overlooked.

 

Why you may ask?

 

Because if shes had a high number of sex partners it means that shes come to view sex as no big deal and as simply a recreational activity to have fun and if thats the case then shes much more likely to justify cheating as simply having some meaningless fun.

[Arcanum]

Well, it almost goes first to personal definitions of "morals" -- for example, my grandmother thought it was "immoral" to play card games on Sundays -- not even gambling, 'go fish' was also off limits. BUT many of my friends' grandmothers didn't label me "immoral" whenever I was "go fishing" on a Sunday! (which, btw, my grandmother was WRONG to label me that way.)

 

And some people do NOT feel that having many different sexual experiences is "immoral" (while some people still do.) It's more about a personal choice and preference. And societal 'norms' also come into play -- for the most part, young, single guys are still "supposed to" and almost expected to chase after anything in a skirt.

 

So, for stuff like sex, drugs (and rock 'n roll? )...maybe it's more of what people self-determine are age-appropriate behaviours rather than making it a "morality issue"? Just as AAlike said. When we're young and single, there are certain behaviours that we happily engage in, that we KNOW we will not continue to do as we grow older and/or get into committed relationships.

 

Put another way, YOU are making your partner's prior sex life into a moral issue (like my g/mother did with my Sunday card playing) and that will keep you wondering whether he can change his "morals" -- but it was never about that for him, so in his mind there ARE NO morals that he needs to change, as related to sex...just his sexual behaviour -- but your mind is gonna end up getting you caught in an unresolvable conundrum unless you change things so you are also encompassing his perspective.

 

Better yet...why not set about appreciating him for all his current positives and good qualities, and just resolve to have a wonderful, happy, inspiring and successful relationship with him?

 

At first I did think it was the amount of sexual partners that bothered me but it really isn't. And I don't think having a few is immoral either.

What I find difficult to contend with is that for this mans whole sexually active life he has had unprotected sex. We got tested when we first started dating and he was clean but to me this is pure luck. That whole "but I didn't catch anything" slant is just not the issue. It's the morailty of not giving a damn about his own health or the health of others or indeed popping kids out here there and everywhere.

Granted the man I know and love doesn't seem to fit into this description, that's why I'm still with him, but that is the life he has led up until now.

So it's not a numbers issue primarily. It's the pure lack of respect, responsibility and forethought that bothers me. These things are important to me. They are some of my morals.