The Old Porno Argument!

[2nd-Best]

What is it you're hoping people would tell you?

 

I asked you what you wanted suggestions with and you never said.

 

Some told you to either break up or get into some counseling, well the way I see it, those were suggestions or options, not negativity. You said breaking up wasn't something you wanted to do, and thats ok, what about the counseling? Do you think he would go with you? You might could go by yourself and a counselor might could provide better suggestions for you.

 

I hope if the other thread has better, more positive things, to try then you will apply those to the relationship.

 

I guess I wanted to hear from anyone who went through something similar and what happened with them or what they did or couldnt do to help the situation.. not so much negative opinions telling me to dump him because we have issues.

 

 

There was actually a post from a man on the other one that i keep going back to and reading because its from a mans point of view and also because hes older and has gone through this first hand on the other side of the mirror, meaning he was the obsessive porno guy.

 

This is what he wrote:

 

 

"As you can see, there are plenty of varying opinions on the morality, usefulness, risks, and benefits of pornography. I respect all other opinions; after all, I once shared some of them.

 

In my humble opinion, at least as it relates to my own life, pornography is not something that grown,mature men - real men - want to do. I believe it is fundamentally a maturity issue, in fact. Real men, strangely enough, prefer real women; even stranger, real men not only prefer real women to pixels on a screen and a bottle of baby oil in a lonely room ... they also prefer THEIR woman.

 

You seem to have your own moral views; obviously some disagree. I don't look at it through a moral perspective - just through the prism of maturity.

 

And experience. I was heavily involved in pornography for a lot of years. I finally had to decide to change that. Not because it was immoral, but because it was doing damage to me. And to my lady love, even if she didn't know the cause. To my relationship. To my life.

 

It needed to go. So did my immaturity. I'm still nowhere close to where I want to be, but I found that losing the pornography sure made life better, sure made me closer to the man I wanted to be.

 

And a word to your husband: whether you believe in addiction or compulsion or whatever, trust me - porn can be habit forming. And it is pathetic. I know some want to defend it, and I'm happy to let them. Because there's no point in arguing with someone who has to defend sitting by yourself staring at a computer screen pounding your pud all day.

 

It can be dangerous. It can be habit forming. And it's not a good habit, certainly not for a man who wants to stay married.

 

And that's all assuming you were actually OKAY with pornography. You're not. Your man has to wise up, grow up, and love you. Ask him who his heroes are. Now ask him if he can picture his heroes spanking the stallion to [COLOR=#990000]www.dumbsmut.com[/COLOR]. (And no, you pervy mcpervypants ... thats not a real website. At least I hope not. )

 

For you, though, the bottom line isn't morality - and it isn't even whether you're right or wrong about pornography.

 

The bottom line is that you TOLD HIM ahead of time. You laid out a clear groundrule for your marriage - and he accepted it.

 

That is all that really matters. The porn, the damage it could do to him and to you, are both almost secondary. What matters is that he agreed to a rule, and then broke it over and over with impugnity.

 

For the record, real men don't do that, either. Certainly not to someone they love.

 

Tell him I said so. God bless."

[2nd-Best]

I think most of us are more than a little taken aback by the seeming number, variety, depth and width of his issues !!! I know love conquers all, but some here want to make sure that you understand that you might be banging your head against the wall for the next 5, 10 or 20 years.

 

Is that what you're willing to sign up for ???

 

Mr. Lucky

 

I suppose that I am hoping that It wont have to be like that, just because someone has problems doesnt mean they always will and if that were true, then there would be NO point to psychiatrists would there?

people are capable of change no matter how messed up they are.. Im hoping to NOT change who he is as a person but help him grow and mature into the person he has potential of becoming i guess.

[redfathom]

Maybe your BF is depressed and is using these things (drugs, alcohol, porn) as a quick fix to make him self feel better. I know in my H's case he was depressed and always angry and it took me leaving him (for over a month) for him to get help. During that time he said he was suicidal and it broke my heart but I told him the truth, "I can't help you." I told him that he needed to get help on his own but that I would support him. He had to prove to me that he wanted help and he did. He called a counselor and started going to therapy and got on the medication he needed and it's made such a difference.

 

Just know that you will be giving something up, you won't come out of this unharmed. It does seem like you are willing to make sacrafices for him, I think people on here just want you to be aware that you may get hurt in the process. Remember you still need to come first.

[PandorasBox]

"Just know that you will be giving something up, you won't come out of this unharmed. It does seem like you are willing to make sacrafices for him, I think people on here just want you to be aware that you may get hurt in the process. Remember you still need to come first."

 

Yep, its about seeing the whole picture not just the parts we want to see.

[2nd-Best]

I just read through some of these posts, and you were given other things to try than to just give up!

 

JUst because people give you the opinon to break up, doesn't mean you have to do that.

 

I'm going to take another approach here.

 

What do you want for this relationship and from your partner?

 

 

I would like for things to continue on the way they are in other aspects of our life, we are emotionally connected.. he can make me laugh more than anyone ive ever known... I cant seem to be mad at him which is a rarity for me because im pretty stubborn, I want all of this to continue.. I like living together, we have ALOT of fun together, the only time we seem to clash is about sex.. unless we're having it, then its usually pretty good.

I guess I want a mutual understanding of eachothers needs and wants, he doesnt understand why i dont understand him and i dont understand why he doesnt understand me.. its a big missunderstanding which I have no idea how to fix sometimes.

He says things to me like "I want you to be the one to have my children, I want to be with you for the rest of my life" and hes constantly re assuring me wihtout me asking for it, that he loves me... so that is something meaningful to me worth keeping.

 

I want him to take better care for himself, I want him to love himself, he also says stuff like "Im happy when im with you" and when i tell him he should always be happy he brushes it off, whcih i dont like.. i dont want him to live through me as his ROCK for happiness.. while making me unhappy through other things.

 

so anyways thats what i want for our relationship and for him.

[redfathom]

Sounds like you want what most of us want, a healthy relationship. But you can't have that with a "sick" partner and I am not to say he won't get better. Also, actions ALWAYS speak louder then words. This is a very new relationship that has a lot of baggage (his personal baggage). You can help him lugg it, but if you do he is never going to be able to carry it on his own.

 

For years I thought I could help my H, that it was worth it to me to give up some of my dreams, boundries, some of my being to help him. And I did give up those things, but it still took me telling him he had to help himself for things to actually change.

 

Now he goes to his appointments and I support him, I ask him how they went, with out prying (they are personal) I give him encourgement by telling him how he seems so much happier and that I am proud of him. Those are the ways you can help him, by not enabling him and not being his provider or mother. Just supportive, yes understanding but not so understanding that he get's the vibe that everything is honkey dorey.

[Rorocher]

I think most of us are more than a little taken aback by the seeming number, variety, depth and width of his issues !!! I know love conquers all, but some here want to make sure that you understand that you might be banging your head against the wall for the next 5, 10 or 20 years.

 

Is that what you're willing to sign up for ???

 

Mr. Lucky

 

ahem...actually Mr. Lucky, love doesn't conquer all:). This popular misconception is why we sometimes get stucked in unfufilling relationships for years because we are waiting on love to conquer all.

 

What's that song again, you gotta know when to fold it and walk away.

[CommitmentPhobe]

So long I know, so what do you all think of this situation??

 

If you want a nice clean decent respectful guy get one.

 

Otherwise accept your gambling, elephant tranquilser taking, teenage girl fantasising boyfriend for the person you already chose to be with.

 

People aren't projects, they are people. He likes his porn, his gambling rushes and to get off his head. Leave him to it or leave.

[2nd-Best]

Oh... Nice! well, Two thumbs up there "Commitment Phobe" when I start taking advice from someone with a name like that, then I think that is when I will have the real problem.. much bigger than my existing one.

 

When you start a long term relationship, you comprimise and grow with eachother , I personally dont think that when you care about soemone you just say "Oh I dont like this persons Vices, gotta check him off my list of the search for Mr.Perfect"

[CommitmentPhobe]

So , you think just because I told him that I'm not going to break up with him after he told me he watches it, but to have enough respect for me to not do it infront of me when he could just have sex with me instead, you think that is un-reasonable?

 

He's not doing it in front of you though. You purposely went to see what he was up to:

get home i look at the laptop to see what he was really doing and he was watching porn ALLLLLLLLLLLL ****ING DAY!!! I'm talking from when I left for work until just before I got home from work, I found some stuff about Barely legal teen and Teen girl gets gang banged or something ****ing crude liek that, i looked at it to see what he was trying to watch and noticed that thse barely legals who are prob about 18 look like 13-14 year old girls in pigtails and school girl type outfits... THIS is what set me off, I probably wouldnt have said anythign about the porn,

 

[FONT=Arial][sIZE=2][/sIZE][/FONT]SOOOO we have sex I think the next day after we make up, twice in one day and THAT is ALOT for us!! lol and then the other day Im in the shower and I have this weird feeling hes up to something weird because he turns the sound off on his laptop when he was playing poker and listening to music, I get out of the shower and go lay down and he comes into the room kisses me on the head and go goes back to the livignroom, the next day I find out that while i was in the shower he was watching PORNO again, while i was home instead of coming to me for it.

 

It's not like he was sat their in front of you cracking off, you went and found it like a mother would do to a 13 year old kid!

 

Once you've got him to stop porn, what's the next thing you're going to change about him?

 

You sound like you've got as much of an addiction as him. It sounds like you have some pretty serious issues!

[CommitmentPhobe]

Oh... Nice! well, Two thumbs up there "Commitment Phobe" when I start taking advice from someone with a name like that, then I think that is when I will have the real problem.. much bigger than my existing one.

 

When you start a long term relationship, you comprimise and grow with eachother , I personally dont think that when you care about soemone you just say "Oh I dont like this persons Vices, gotta check him off my list of the search for Mr.Perfect"

 

You're in denial. Compromising? LOL that's usually about how much you're going to spend on a holiday, not how much elephant tranquiliser you can take in a month!

[2nd-Best]

He's not doing it in front of you though. You purposely went to see what he was up to:

 

 

It's not like he was sat their in front of you cracking off, you went and found it like a mother would do to a 13 year old kid!

 

Once you've got him to stop porn, what's the next thing you're going to change about him?

 

You sound like you've got as much of an addiction as him. It sounds like you have some pretty serious issues!

 

And what would my addiction be exactly?

 

That he downloads porn onto a shared computer of ours, am I not aloud to look at the computer.. its pretty obvious when i go to the address bar and find easygals.com and a slew of other websites there, He broke my trust by telling me that he wouldnt do it out of respect for our relationship and me and then did it anyways... WHILE I WAS HOME! regardless if he was wacking off infront of me or not, its ****ing rude.

 

You're obviously a man, and a misoginestic one at that, or you wouldnt have that horribley idiotic attitude towards it.

 

Me expecting someone to respect me is not changing them, if you read a F**CKING work that I wrote before then you would know that I did NOT tell him that he had to stop , i told him to respect me by not doing it when im around because its disrespectful towards me.

 

You're clearly retarded... and i have not lashed out at one person on this thread but you clearly are in need of soem mental help yourself, and god forbid any woman ever has to put up with your COMMITMENT PHOBIC ASS!!

[CommitmentPhobe]

And what would my addiction be exactly?

Changing your boyfriend

That he downloads porn onto a shared computer of ours, am I not aloud to look at the computer.. its pretty obvious when i go to the address bar and find easygals.com and a slew of other websites there, He broke my trust by telling me that he wouldnt do it out of respect for our relationship and me and then did it anyways... WHILE I WAS HOME! regardless if he was wacking off infront of me or not, its ****ing rude.

You went home and looked up at what he was doing. You said it yourself. I even quoted it for you.

You're obviously a man, and a misoginestic one at that, or you wouldnt have that horribley idiotic attitude towards it.

I don't watch porn, it's boring.

Me expecting someone to respect me is not changing them, if you read a F**CKING work that I wrote before then you would know that I did NOT tell him that he had to stop , i told him to respect me by not doing it when im around because its disrespectful towards me.

And he wasn't he did it when you were at work and in the shower.

You're clearly retarded... and i have not lashed out at one person on this thread but you clearly are in need of soem mental help yourself, and god forbid any woman ever has to put up with your COMMITMENT PHOBIC ASS!!

Not retarded at all, just giving you a straight up reality check. God knows you need one.

[2nd-Best]

Changing your boyfriend

 

You went home and looked up at what he was doing. You said it yourself. I even quoted it for you.

 

I don't watch porn, it's boring.

 

And he wasn't he did it when you were at work and in the shower.

 

Not retarded at all, just giving you a straight up reality check. God knows you need one.

 

 

He did it while he was talking to me on MSN and while i was HOME in the shower, ten ****ing feet away from him!!

 

and so what if i look at the computer, when he does something to break my trust in the beginning i have every right to know what hes doing when we live together and we make an aggreement in the begining of our relationship about this.

 

anyways you're boring me, id rather just not hear from you anymore. bye

[CommitmentPhobe]

He did it while he was talking to me on MSN and while i was HOME in the shower, ten ****ing feet away from him!!

 

and so what if i look at the computer, when he does something to break my trust in the beginning i have every right to know what hes doing when we live together and we make an aggreement in the begining of our relationship about this.

 

anyways you're boring me, id rather just not hear from you anymore. bye

 

And you didn't know until you went and checked his computer. You found out the next day. That's what you wrote.

 

So he wasn't doing it in front of you.

 

If you don't want to know don't check up on him!

[zxcirce]

When you start a long term relationship, you comprimise and grow with eachother , I personally dont think that when you care about soemone you just say "Oh I dont like this persons Vices, gotta check him off my list of the search for Mr.Perfect"

 

Actually, this is exactly what you do if their vices are too big for you to handle and the person you care about isn't ready to change. To stick around just because you care is self-defeating to you and enabling to the person you care about.

[CommitmentPhobe]

Actually, this is exactly what you do if their vices are too big for you to handle and the person you care about isn't ready to change. To stick around just because you care is self-defeating to you and enabling to the person you care about.

 

Oh she doesn't stick around because she cares.

 

She positively gets off on it. She already has one failed marriage behind her for the same reasons, so these types of guys are her vice.

[blair08]

I think some words of advice and a little reality check was just given and that was for the best, and what she might not have wanted to hear, but exactly what she needed to hear.

[Jennifer26]

Your BF has addiction problems, there is no doubt about that.

 

I married a man who didn't have alcohol, or gambling, or drug issues. But he does have a sex addiction. In the beginning even there were red flags, as there are in your case. But I chose to ignore them, I thought too that I could somehow influence him to stop or cut back dramatically.

 

It won't stop, infact as you two are together longer it will probably increase. And not only that, with sex addicts it usually does escalate to going to strip clubs, escorts, and sometimes things even worse.

 

Even counseling won't do much for him, even if he is willing to stop (which he almost guarateed isn't, he's just telling you whatever you want to hear). My husband has been in counseling and discussed all the horrible abuse that happened to him as a child - and you know what effect that has had on his sex addiction? None.

 

The only thing that really works for these addicts are 12-step programs.

 

And you can't negotiate this with him. If he isn't seeking treatment and he has access to porn - it will NEVER stop or even cut down. You will find yourself dealing with this for years and years to come and your self esteem will begin to erode and you'll find you're snooping through his stuff to see if he's looked at porn. Everytime you'll find it, and then you'll remember all of the sex you're not having, and you'll feel angry.

 

I've been going through this for nine years. It doesn't get better.

 

The only thing I've ever done (which I am still learning) that has seemed to make any bit of difference was reading about codependency. I began looking into this not too long ago and have read numerous books, joined a COSA group online and am looking into local COSA meetings in person. I am taking my life back and not worrying about my husband looking at porn. I've started spending a lot more time on me, and I haven't looked at his computer for over a month now.

 

He's noticed, and he's scared ****less.

 

He used to always tell me to "mind my own business" and tell me "you're insecure and have trust issues"

 

As soon as I backed off and started taking better care of me and stopped caring about his porn he's began acting very bizarre.

 

He's even started leaving his laptop out and open (he knows I don't know the password) logged in (he has never done this before, ever!) so that I can check on him. He WANTS me to be codependent.

 

You really should look into codependency, it sounds like you are between your first marriage and this new relationship.

 

It will be the best thing you'll ever do for yourself.

[Rorocher]

These folks are right 2nd best. I know it's not what you want to hear and ok, some of them come across a bit harsh but it's a message board and people tend to speak from personal experiences that are sometimes painful for them. Some women have been battling porn addiction 10-15 years in, you should search on the board and read their stories.

 

You are only 7 months in and you're not even married to the guy, if there is anytime to cut your loses, it is now before you get in too deep. The more you keep at it, the more you will take on these issues as your own and your self worth will surely be affected. You are a young model now or something, in finance, etc. By the time he's done with you, you won't recognize these great attributes about yourself anymore. Let him go get he help he needs, if he wants to get it and when he is healthy, perhaps you can seek him out again.

 

Have you ever heard of Captain Save-a-ho? there are female versions of this. You can't save people from themselves.

[Woggle]

You can't change him so either accept it or leave. Every heterosexual man likes to get off to images of nude women from time to time. It has nothing to do with degredation or misogyny because it is not coming from a place of hatred. You are treating him like a child and when men are treated this way we will rebel.

[Jersey Shortie]

-Men's reproductive strategy is promiscuity. Embrace it.

 

That's fine Cad but don't get into a relationship and then cry wolf. If you are getting in a relationship, it's understood that you want to be monogmous in most cases. It's unfair and weak to get into a relationship and then cry wolf. You make a choice one way or the other. YOu want to be promiscous, that's cool. Just don't drag a woman you claim you care about down with you.

 

 

You can't change him so either accept it or leave. Every heterosexual man likes to get off to images of nude women from time to time. It has nothing to do with degredation or misogyny because it is not coming from a place of hatred. You are treating him like a child and when men are treated this way we will rebel.

 

And he is treating her like she isn't worth very much. And when women are treated this way we will rebel.

 

I have come to learn that porn is the most important thing in most men's lives and they love it over any real woman they have in their life. That's why they defend it over the real woman that has actually been there for him. Porn is rather degrading and misgynistic and maybe that's the way men like to treat women.

[Mr. Lucky]

I have come to learn that porn is the most important thing in most men's lives and they love it over any real woman they have in their life.

I happen to know Jersey that not even you think this over-the-top statement is true ...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Woggle]

Men defend porn so much because we are told we can't look at it. At our core most men do not like authority and being told what to do so when we are told we can't do something it becomes a battle of wills. There is nothing worse than a woman nagging us to death and treating us like we are a child. If women didn't make an issue out it it wouldn't become so important. It's not the porn but our independence that is the issue here.

[soserious1]

If you want a nice clean decent respectful guy get one.

 

Otherwise accept your gambling, elephant tranquilser taking, teenage girl fantasising boyfriend for the person you already chose to be with.

 

People aren't projects, they are people. He likes his porn, his gambling rushes and to get off his head. Leave him to it or leave.

 

 

I agree and I opted to leave, he's free to pursue his chosen lifestyle now totally free from any complaint or problem from me.