How to NOT sink into depression after being screamed at?

[Soulburn]

Hello, all!

 

 

I think there are people who just have a different attitude than I do. My mother and sister are jealous creatures. If I accomplish something, they start screaming at me, guilt tripping me, telling me how easy things are for me and hard for them and...when I say screaming, I really mean SCREAMING.

 

 

I think there are people who let things like this roll off their backs or something and aren't too effected by it. Me, on the other hand, I sink into a deep depression, sometimes for weeks from this. I don't know how not to.

 

 

I used to do drugs when I felt this way. Now, I'm clean 3 years but find myself still falling right into this depressive state. Not sure why I even get depressed, just because my mother and sister are screaming, jealous, angry people.

 

 

When they scream, I automatically shut down 100%. I've been doing my best to just stay away from them but recently went to their house for my fathers birthday (who isn't anything like them) and...the yelling, fighting and anger was almost all I experienced while there. No happy birthday with people having a good time and smiling. My dad wasn't a happy camper exactly either. He's an alcoholic...and puts up with those two. I really wish he wouldn't anymore.

 

 

For people who don't shut down from things like this, why don't you? What is your way of thinking with situations like this?

 

 

I'm open to any and all suggestions, ideas, thoughts, comments...

 

 

I don't want to shut down like this anymore...

[Ronni_W]

If I accomplish something, they start screaming at me, guilt tripping me, telling me how easy things are for me and hard for them... I don't want to shut down like this anymore...

There are six good strategies outlined in the book 'Toxic Criticism' by Eric Maisel. It is listed as in-stock at amazon.com, and perhaps your library has it, as well.

Congrats on your decision to break out of their ineffective pattern of communicating. I hope that you'll find the book helpful.

[EricO54]

Hi, I'm a little new here but if I may offer my advice.

 

Personally, if these family members are causing that much grief and strain for you, I would suggest taking a cooling off period and just limited your exposure to them.

 

I believe once they feel you've been away for too long and begin to feel ignored, you will start seeing a change in their behavior patterns. I think people who scream excessively and pull others down really want attention and may feel empty about themselves. Distancing yourself will allow them to see the effect they have caused upon you and others.

[Taramere]

Hello Soulburn

 

As Ronni_W said, there's some good literature out there on dealing with difficult or downright abusive people. I recall reading "A Woman in Your Own Right: Assertiveness and You, by Anne Dickson, Kate Charlesworth" and finding it very helpful. Also "the dance of Anger" by Harriet Lerner, and if you read up on Transactional Analysis, that's another helpful tool.

 

What most of the literature I've read focuses on is maintaining your own rationality so that you reduce the stimulation that keeps an angry person's fires burning. Often people who allow themselves to flood with anger get genuine enjoyment out of the feeling. My father's like that. Sometimes I dread visiting because he's just such an angry individual. Even if he's not expressing anger towards you, he'll still subject you to his tirades as he leafs through the newspaper to find a story that's particularly infuriating to him. Something to shout and rave about. It's stressful to others, but in his mind it makes him powerful some times and (if he's ranting about something) entertaining.

 

So there are mental tools, which some of these books will describe in detail, about reducing the stimulation/rewards that keep angry people ranting and raving.

 

However, the pitfall of getting very embroiled in "helping" other people to manage their anger is that you can easily find yourself taking responsibility for it. That's somewhere I fall down. In a lot of workplaces, skill in handling difficult people is very much valued - and if you have it, you'll be called upon to use it in all sorts of situations that you're not personally involved in.

 

Which can give you that "I'm good at this" boost of confidence...but on the minus side, it's easy to start feeling that it's your absolute duty to work to return the equilibrium in every volatile situation. And that's something that some of the books perhaps don't pay enough attention to. Feeling "it's my duty to sort this out" is a close cousin of feeling "this is my fault". And the sense of failure if you don't manage to sort it out (which sometimes you won't, if the angry person is invested enough in their own anger to resist your attempts to reduce the tension) isn't pleasant.

 

Your first duty is to your own health. Your mother's and sister's behaviour is abusive. Shouting and screaming at people can have as negative an impact on them as physical violence can. It's hateful, aggressive and can leave you feeling absolutely worthless unless you get an opportunity soon afterwards to talk your feelings through with someone who'll listen.

 

Some people are particularly sensitive to noise, and it's going to have an even worse impact on them. What your depressed feelings are telling you is "this situation is not good for you. You need to get away from it in order to de-stress and protect your self esteem.

 

In a professional situation, I can manage other people's anger without internalising it. In a personal situation, I find that far harder. It often leaves me with that wobbly, vulnerable feeling you probably had after you visited your family. If I'm feeling on par, physically and emotionally, I'll control that and address the other person's anger using some of the mental tools I've learned. It'll often be very effective, but what I then find (and this is the bit that I haven't found addressed adequately in the literature I've read) is that later on - maybe a day, maybe a week, but at some point - I'll start feeling the repercussions of trying to manage someone else's anger.

 

It can get pretty complicated trying to a) manage another person's anger, and b) prevent yourself from developing depressive symptoms because while you're busy meeting someone else's need (ie to be helped in controlling their rage) you're not getting your own emotional needs met.

 

In light of you saying that your dad is an alcoholic, and therefore possibly not in the greatest position to offer you any support when your sister and mother are allowing themselves to explode like this, I think your first priority should be to stay away until (if) they reach a point where they're willing to address this behaviour. I'd also suggest you have a chat with your doctor about your feelings of depression and the things that trigger them.

 

Almost guaranteed that if you tell your family "these unpleasant dramas are causing me too much stress. I'm starting to feel depressed, and I need some time away from you as you're not able or willing to control your own tempers" they'll turn it on you and say that you're being a victim or manipulative. That's how angry people operate. They don't want to take responsibility for their abusive behaviour - so instead they put the responsibility on you to toughen up. Remember, their behaviour is not acceptable, and it's not your responsibility. Don't let them bulldoze you into thinking otherwise. It's perfectly normal for people to have a stressed reaction to abusive, out of control, expressions of anger.

 

Stress and anxiety are major components in depression....so your duty to yourself is to remove yourself from the source. If it were me, I'd be inclined to write a brief, unemotive letter to them explaining the reasons. That way at least they know. If they want to respond in typical angry person "oh for Christ's sake, Stress and depression my backside...blah blah" then that's up to them. You at least have done your bit by letting them know why you don't want to spend time around them and given them an opportunity to address the problem.

 

You're not a punchbag. It's not your role to take this crap, and it's not good for your health to take it. Until they're prepared to acknowledge that this behaviour is wrong, they'll keep subjecting you to it whenever the urge strikes them - and you'll keep paying the price with your health.

[marlena]

Taramere has given you some great advice. I agree that you have to remove yourself from the source for the time being as much as possible. They need to fully understand that you will not be at the receiving end of their aggresion and hostility. Talking to them about this like Taramere said will most likely produce no results so your best option is to just open the door and walk out each and every time they take it into their heads to vent their anger/jealousy/bitterness on you. Just say, "I won't be a part of this" and walk out. You need to assert your point in actions rather than words. Once you are out that door, as hard as it may be, try not to obsess over what's happened. Put it out of your mind as best you can. It is clearly their problem and not yours. Once they realize that this kind of behaviour will no longer wash with you, they just might have to stop. I am sure that at some level they do this because they know it gets to you. Do not give them that satisfaction. What's most important is your own well-being and peace of mind. Guard both. Like the Desiderata says, "Avoid loud and aggressive persons, they are vexations to the spirit." Make that your mantra.

 

On a side note, are they like this with everyone or just with you?

[Taramere]

Like the Desiderata says, "Avoid loud and aggressive persons, they are vexations to the spirit." Make that your mantra.

 

So true. In my city, there's a real drinking culture which means that at all hours of night drunks will roam around screaming their heads off.

 

One time I was away for a couple of days, and came back to find a brick through my bedroom window - lying on the bed (alongside broken glass). It turned out that my next door neighbour had had an altercation with some noisy drunks, and they'd retaliated by throwing bricks at the windows. There are a lot of out of control people going around, and they are indeed vexatious to the spirit....especially when they're stimulating themselves with alcohol, drugs and stress to be even more noisy and aggressive.

 

Mobile phones and the tendency of a lot of people to conduct their private lives noisily in the street or on trains doesn't help. It's getting increasingly difficult to escape from all these overt and loud expressions of fury from people who think the rest of the world should be fascinated and impressed by their rage. It's one of the reasons I really dislike programmes like The Springer Show, that promote this notion of unrestrained anger being a form of entertainment which should be cheered and applauded, rather than the public nuisance it is.

[marlena]

Taramere,

 

So sorry you have to put up with such an obnoxious crowd in your neighbourhood. It is hard to keep your head and heart in peace when surrounded by these types of foolish human beings. I have a strong aversion to loud places and people as well and do my very best to avoid them. Often, at the end of the day, I come home and immerse myself in the blessed stillness of a good book. Silence is indeed golden and a rare commodity in the loud and confusing world we all live in.

 

M

[Soulburn]

Thank you for your responses! They are so well thought out. You guys are incredible!

 

Ronni, I should've expected you to show up first! The book you suggested sounds like a great start to change my way of thinking about this (which in itself has been toxic to me for years).

 

The thing that stood out to me the most is what Taramere said about how they will turn things around and say I should toughen up or (what I hear from them the most) "you're the one with the problem".

 

I misunderstood my father for years. I realize now, after being clean, sober and having my eyes open the past 3 years that he's trying as hard as I did to escape the insanity my mother and sister bring on. My mother and sister pound him to the ground mentally and emotionally with "you're a piece of s**t alcoholic" and I think...he believes them sometimes.

 

Marlena, you asked if they're like this with everyone or just me. EVERYONE.

 

I've never seen either of them suffer any real consequences for this behavior. It's going to happen one day because one or both are going to open their big mouths with the wrong person. So far though, I've seen those two yell and scream at anyone and everyone when they don't like something and nothing has happened. Most of the time, people look at them like they're nuts and go on with their day.

 

Eric, you are so right. They do feel empty about themselves and their lives. They wouldn't understand Ronni's signature -- "They always say that time changes things, but you actually have to change them yourself." ~ Andy Warhol

 

They think that their lives are empty because of bad luck, meanwhile, anyone around them with accomplishments waited until something (or everything they have) magically fell into their laps.

 

Walking away when they behave like this, I think, is great advice, Marlena. If it wasn't my fathers birthday the other day, I would've left. I wanted to so bad but kept thinking about him. I didn't want to let those two ruin another birthday.

 

My mother singlehandedly managed to destroy my fathers brothers birthday years back. Big birthday party at a hall with his co-workers there, his whole family, catered, the whole nine yards. My mother has a problem with dads cousin stewing in her head for months and takes that party as an opportunity to walk up to him and start a fight. The whole hall full of people is disrupted by screaming.

 

My uncle...had recently lost the lower half of his leg due to diabetic complications. I felt so HORRIBLE for him. He was also just trying to get over losing his wife, my aunt, to lung cancer.

 

My mother couldn't have cared less about him. She just cared about her stupid anger.

 

No wonder I spent 15 years drugged out of my mind. The most selfish person I ever met happens to be my own mother.

 

I have to say, I have a habit of attracting friends with no spines. When they see the way my mother and sister are, they immediately back down and look at me, shrugging their shoulders like "what are you gonna do about this?".

 

I've been craving spending time with people who are a bit tougher, have thicker skins and maybe know how to be more stern with people. I've always felt completely alone dealing with this family of mine.

 

Even boyfriends I've had have been afraid of those two and got walked all over by them like rugs.

 

I've totally lost my cool when that has happened in the past and, exactly as Taramere said, they turned it right around. They screamed "what is wrong with you" and "you're the one with the problem" and...I actually believed it.

 

What I should've realized is, unless I think someone is tough enough, stern and sure of themselves enough, I shouldn't expose them to that type of insanity. Not unless they're great at protecting and defending themselves.

 

My current boyfriend, I keep well away from my mother and sister. They'll tear him apart and manipulate the daylights out of him and he wouldn't even realize what happened until months later.

 

I've been with this guy for almost 2 years and I, not surprisingly, sought out a nice guy. In almost 2 years, he met mom and sis twice. Right away they were trying to manipulate me and him both and were walking all over him and he didn't even know it. I got protective right away and haven't had them in the same room (or even same TOWN) ever since.

 

Because I seek out nice people, I do create a bad situation for myself because then I feel completely alone and very defensive with my mother and sister.

 

I'm going to my cousins wedding in September so I have to be around these two again. My boyfriend won't be attending with me. It's enough to defend myself and have my own back against the wall but I can't protect him too.

 

I want to thank you guys so much for your responses. At a time when I feel so alone with this (and now you understand why), these responses have taken a lot of that lonely feeling away. It means more to me than you can imagine!

 

If you have any additional thoughts after this post, I'd love to hear them. I've been too alone with this and it's time to hear other thoughts and ideas.

[Taramere]

Because I seek out nice people, I do create a bad situation for myself because then I feel completely alone and very defensive with my mother and sister.

 

When you say nice, do you mean gentle people who avoid conflict? It's understandable that you'd gravitate towards people like that when you've grown up in a volatile environment that stressed you out so often.

 

I'm going to my cousins wedding in September so I have to be around these two again. My boyfriend won't be attending with me. It's enough to defend myself and have my own back against the wall but I can't protect him too.

 

My God. They sound absolutely hellish to be around. This reminds me of an awful pair of women I had to work with years ago. Absolute bitches - full of cattiness, anger and ill will. Separately, I'd have conversations with them to figure out who they viewed themselves. Mainly because I was so curious about how anyone so vile to be around could find anything about themselves to like.

 

What I found was that both of them prided themselves on being "don't mess with me" confrontational...but were actually extremely emotionally fragile underneath. And that's one of the reasons it's often so difficult to respond to people like that in a confrontation. Firstly, you have to deal with this really unpleasant aggression that your basic instincts are yelling at you could turn into physical aggression - even if in reality there's no likelihood of that happening. Highly stressful.

 

Secondly, you know that they're vulnerable and out of control. They can screech 100 horrible things at you, but if you say one thing back that touches a nerve then you'll get an explosion of emotion, fury and possibly tears. So you know that if you do decide to dish back a bit of what you're getting, you'll have to feel able to follow it right through, and not let yourself be guilt-tripped by the explosion of emotiona nd self pity when it comes.

 

This is where something like Transactional Analysis (I urge you to read up on it - it really can be helpful) and application of physical composure exercises (look up Alexandra Technique) can help you to maintain your own equilibrium and avoid getting drawn into their high drama. When people are in that state of high negative emotion they can become desperate to see others get as unhappy and angry as they feel themselves. Even the playing field out, so to speak. So what you're up against is someone who regards you as an opponent and regards your ability to stay calm as a personal slight.

 

I used to work with teenagers who had challenging behaviour. After months of the softly softly, stay-calm-at-all-costs approach, I found that sometimes the only way to stop a conflct/tantrum in its tracks was for me to give myself permission to blow up back at them. It would create a crisis, and sometimes it resulted in holes being bashed in walls (by them, not me!) and a sense of absolute hysteria about the place. The trouble was, that was what they'd been brought up with. They had no concept of how to handle a conflict other than by losing control - and regarding as the "winner" whoever became the most angry (and frightening in their anger).

 

So, awful as it sounds, I had to tap into the person I was as a teenager (pretty volatile) so that they could see the potential for anger was there. They'd be furious with me for it, and they'd respect me for it. The task then was for me to reflect on my loss of temper, apologise for it (which would generally result in them also being apologetic)...then you could get to the more helpful bit of discussing anger with them, the way in which it can destroy trust and relationships, and how it's possible to be a strong person without being an angry one.

 

That's something the self help books don't advocate, and it's probably not something I should advocate. All I know is that a lot of the best work I did with some of those adolescents didn't start until I'd really blown up at them. Almost as if they didn't feel they could trust me until they'd seen what my anger looked like (and, perhaps, seen that it didn't involve me becoming physically violent or vicious in the things I said to them).

 

Have you ever lost your temper with your mother and sister. What are you like when you become angry? Do you think you'd put yourself at unacceptable risk if you reacted with open anger towards them?

[georgejungle]

Family or not, you don't want people like that in your life.

I don't care if she was my Mom, if she was yelling and a jealous type,

i'd say Adios Mom! Have a nice life being miserable. The Guilt tripping is

really pathetic. It exists in my family and I won't have anything to

do with it.

 

i choose to remove myself from that stuff, those types

of people and just that whole attitude in general, because it's

counter-productive to the person i want to be in life. I want to

be happy, not depressed. So i purposely don't go visit or see certain

members of my family because of this. They may think i'm rude or a bad

Nephew, Grandson, son, etc for not coming around or visiting...But I don't

care. I don't have to put up with their crap just because we're blood. I'm

cordial and nice to them and call them every now and then, but i don't

have to overdue it.

[quankanne]

yep, you can merely walk away (think of them as huge two-year-olds pitching a temper tantrum whenever they start screaming like banshees). YOU assume the role of the adult every time they start acting up. Of course, they're not going to like it, but believe you me, your life will be so much more stress-free.

 

whatever you do, don't feel guilty for not wanting to subject yourself to their abuse – they *need* someone to victimize, but you have every right to not subject yourself to their crap. Use humor to deflate the situation (my favorite? "Bless your heart, not having a good day, are you?" Well, at least down here, the phrase "bless your heart" often indicates you're addressing someone with some level of idiocy!); be firm and blunt when you tell them you're not interested in the crap they're dealing; or, again, just walk away, telling them that when they're ready to communicate in a mature manner, then you'll talk to them.

 

as for your dad ... well, I can see how an initial problem with alcoholism can be compounded by living with harpies like that! If the two of you have a good relationship, just keep reassuring him of your love, and that at some point, the screaming is going to have to stop.

 

meanwhile, keep your dignity about you and don't let them pierce your armor with their behavior. You deserve better than what they're dishing out, and if you keep yourself a bit emotionally aloof (i.e., don't get sucked into their emotional blackhole), you'll do just fine.

 

because as much as you may love your family, it's okay to avoid those who are emotional vampires wanting to prey upon your mental well being, and it's okay to put your foot down when it comes to maintaining your sanity.

[Soulburn]

When you say nice, do you mean gentle people who avoid conflict? It's understandable that you'd gravitate towards people like that when you've grown up in a volatile environment that stressed you out so often.

 

I wouldn't say gentle people as much as...people who kind of scare easily and don't stand up for themselves. Also, not really the protective type but rather people who are hoping to be protected by someone else.

 

Most people I know see me as a very strong person. So, I also attract people who are looking for a strong person to be around who they feel will protect them.

 

I attract the exact opposite type of people that I would love to have around!

 

 

Have you ever lost your temper with your mother and sister. What are you like when you become angry? Do you think you'd put yourself at unacceptable risk if you reacted with open anger towards them?

 

I have, at times. Sometimes I feel not often enough. Most recently was when I visited for dads birthday. I have to admit, something surprising happened! Mom and sis ran in the house (we were outside), shut the door and became as quiet as church mice for about an hour.

 

This is new, it's never happened before. Caught me totally off guard.

 

I've been told that when I'm angry, I'm downright scary to anyone around. I usually have to be pushed very far before I let my anger show but I've noticed I have a tendency the past year or so to put my foot down VERY HARD. That, in itself, must be scary to some people.

 

i choose to remove myself from that stuff, those types of people and just that whole attitude in general, because it's counter-productive to the person i want to be in life. I want to be happy, not depressed.

 

George...I SO understand this. I've been realizing that if I want to become the person I really want to be, I have to stay away from their drama and insanity as much as I can. It's like getting sucked into a black hole for weeks that takes all of my strength, energy, happiness and stability away.

 

Maybe there are some people out there who can be perfectly content and happy in the middle of near deafening screaming, constant fighting and insanity but that's not me. I'm so unhappy in situations like this.

 

They may think i'm rude or a bad Nephew, Grandson, son, etc

 

That's me. The bad daughter, sister and granddaughter...if I don't drop everything in my life to help them. And 24/7, they "NEED" something.

 

I...need some peace.

 

(my favorite? "Bless your heart, not having a good day, are you?" Well, at least down here, the phrase "bless your heart" often indicates you're addressing someone with some level of idiocy!)

 

LOL!! I can't really think of an equivalent to "bless your heart" for where I'm from. That made me laugh, though.

 

as for your dad ... well, I can see how an initial problem with alcoholism can be compounded by living with harpies like that! If the two of you have a good relationship, just keep reassuring him of your love, and that at some point, the screaming is going to have to stop.

 

My dad doesn't really have any family beyond me, mom and sis. I feel so bad. I used to fall for all the things my mother said about how my father is the problem and his alcohol is the problem. My mother is miserable wherever she goes, whoever she's with, it doesn't matter. But, I think my father, in his depression has gone down the same roads I have. Believing he is the problem.

 

because as much as you may love your family, it's okay to avoid those who are emotional vampires wanting to prey upon your mental well being, and it's okay to put your foot down when it comes to maintaining your sanity.

 

I'm finally getting a grip on how to put my foot down for the sake of protecting my own sanity. I'm also getting pretty good at deflecting the emotional vampires from sucking the life out of me. However, feeling like my back is constantly up against a wall with these two and feeling like I have to protect myself from whatever my mother and sister are about to do...isn't a HAPPY situation.

 

I always wonder what's next. Lies? Guilt trips? Screaming? Lying while guilt tripping and screaming?

 

This is normal, everyday life to them. I moved out at 17 and I'm 35 now. This isn't a normal life to me. With the drama I see with them and all their screaming, they never look happy. They look worn out and miserable.

 

I have to say, it's really nice to hear other peoples ideas and opinions on this situation. I do feel a lot less alone. Especially when someone else (George) seems to relate to what I'm saying on a personal level.

[Tormented311]

It may sound weird, but what you need to do is start telling them how you feel when they get like this. Even if your crying and it's threw clinched teeth. Eventually you, stop crying and will walk away less depressed.

 

I would know because I went threw the same thing. I would shut down completely, refusing to say a single word, and the fight would resonate with me for days.

 

What changed was when I moved in with my bf. He'd get mad about something, start yelling, and I wouldn't say a word. It would be a one way argument the second he raised his voice. I was very shy, and depressed, I didn't like the attention being put on me so negatively, I would just clam up.

 

But my bf wanted me to talk to him, and he was persistent. He'd stand there, say what he had to say then wait for me to respond, he'd try to egg me on constantly goading me into saying something, anything. The one thing that finally got me into talking to him was when he started leaving after the fights. I hated that, and when I saw he was about to do it, I'd tell him so, he'd reply back with, "why should I stay your not even talking to me".

 

So eventually threw clinched teeth and lots of tears, I gradually started talking to him when he was like this, now I feel sort of numb to his yelling. I get right back up in his face and yell at him, and trust me it was a very slow process at first but I'm happier about it now, because the situation gets resolved right then and there, we normally work out some sort of compromise and it doesn't linger for days.

 

And it taught me not to get flustered and to think-on-my-feet, something I wasn't able to do all that well before. I'm not the best at it, I still clam up sometimes when it's with someone new, but I'm able to go toe-to-toe with my boyfriend and my family. I'm still working on how to do it at work cause it's so different there, office politics... but that's a whole different story.

 

So once again, my advice, even if it's threw clinched teeth, you need to tell them how your feeling, even if it's a day later when no one is yelling at you, and it's over the phone. Hell, tell them how you don't like it when they yell before you decide to talk with them, and maybe they'll control themselves while you two talk. But you should try.